German Jewish leaders: We are no longer safe here | Putin says Jews are welcome in Russia

[CBH1926]

7 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Not sure where you're getting my claims of jews/travellers getting singled out.

 

Maybe try reading from the beginning.

 

Here's a fun graph including crime stats in germany period 2011/2012

 

https://www.osac.gov/Pages/ContentReportDetails.aspx?cid=15601

 

Funny that, over 136k violent crimes...not sure what point you're trying to make but if there's 136k violent bodily crimes committed in Germany.  ALL people in germany, not travelers, religious individuals refugees or any one specific denomination of gender/religion/orientation

 

THAT is the point I am trying to make.  To claim they are less safe or feel less safe than the average person in germany is a joke.  They are at no more risk than anyone else.

We are talking about hate crime not general crime, so I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

it appears according to statistics that the Jews are more targeted based on their ethnicity comparing to Muslims, foreigners, gays etc.

You being robbed because some guy needs your wallet, is different then you being targeted based on your ethnicity.

 

 

 

[RRypien37]

Germany is completely over run. RIP.

Eastern European countries are the only ones that won't let this happen. They aren't f*cking around. 

[Warhippy]

21 minutes ago, CBH1926 said:

We are talking about hate crime not general crime, so I am not sure what point you are trying to make.

it appears according to statistics that the Jews are more targeted based on their ethnicity comparing to Muslims, foreigners, gays etc.

You being robbed because some guy needs your wallet, is different then you being targeted based on your ethnicity.

 

 

 

No see that's splitting hairs my man.

 

What makes a crime of hate?  Someone has their wallet stolen, they are beaten kinda badly, broken nose etc.  Is it more of a crime based on somebodies religious beliefs or ethnicity?

 

No.  No it isn't.  The end result is your wallet is stolen and your nose is broken either way.  As well, it is very hard to tell a Christian from a Jew from a Catholic from an atheist when you get right down to it unless you ask them direct questions about their faith

 

My point in my previous comment is that they are in no more danger than anyone else in Germany and the numbers more than prove that.  To claim otherwise like this person is doing is a shade dramatic

[GLASSJAW]

Just now, Warhippy said:

No see that's splitting hairs my man.

 

What makes a crime of hate?  Someone has their wallet stolen, they are beaten kinda badly, broken nose etc.  Is it more of a crime based on somebodies religious beliefs or ethnicity?

 

No.  No it isn't.  The end result is your wallet is stolen and your nose is broken either way.  As well, it is very hard to tell a Christian from a Jew from a Catholic from an atheist when you get right down to it unless you ask them direct questions about their faith

 

what is wrong with you?

he provided links that suggest you're wrong, and instead of reading them, acknowledging your misunderstanding (or whatever this display is), you double down on a totally ridiculous idea that that everyone is wrong--except you--because they are not comparing the crimes to "normal" crimes? because... how could someone tell a jew from an atheist!

so, when someone throws a molotov cocktail at a synagogue it's just a coincidence? when an orthodox jew is punched in the face... it's just a random burst of violence? when there's a pro-Israel function and when someone yells something about a gas chamber... it's... just a coincidence?

do you know what an orthodox jew dresses like? are you aware that jews often have, you know, jewish names? are you aware that jews often attend jewish functions? are you aware at all of how easy it is to identify a jewish business if you really want to find one?

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/is-it-time-for-the-jews-to-leave-europe/386279/

according to the Atlantic, 51% of hate crimes committed in France and the UK are against Jews - a remarkable coincidence, I'd say!

whether or not anti-semitism is on the rise is one issue (see below), but to say someone is exaggerating their fear, or worse, shouldn't be afraid, because of YOUR ridiculous interpretation of statistics is kinda weird.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-28853221

[GLASSJAW]

triple post

[GLASSJAW]

lag

[CBH1926]

12 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

No see that's splitting hairs my man.

 

What makes a crime of hate?  Someone has their wallet stolen, they are beaten kinda badly, broken nose etc.  Is it more of a crime based on somebodies religious beliefs or ethnicity?

 

No.  No it isn't.  The end result is your wallet is stolen and your nose is broken either way.  As well, it is very hard to tell a Christian from a Jew from a Catholic from an atheist when you get right down to it unless you ask them direct questions about their faith

 

My point in my previous comment is that they are in no more danger than anyone else in Germany and the numbers more than prove that.  To claim otherwise like this person is doing is a shade dramatic

Crime is motivated by opportunity, need, addiction and yes sometimes hate as well.

if someone targets synagogue, Jewish deli or a jewish person just because they are Jews, based on the current law thats called hate crime.

i agree that sometimes you can't tell who is who based on looks alone.

 

Right after September 11th Sikh person was murdered in Arizona, he was mistaken for a Muslim.

Killer was given the death penalty and, I think it got commuted to life in prison later on.

When Robert Byrd was brutally murderd in Texas, his killers got the death penalty as well.

 

i see what you are saying that any crime can be motivated by just pure hate, I think that has merit.

i can speak about Europe since I lived there for several decades, antisemitism is on the rise across the board.

One thing that neo nazis, kkk, jihadist, right wing militia groups etc. have in common, is intense hatred of Jews.

 

 

 

[CBH1926]

12 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

No see that's splitting hairs my man.

 

What makes a crime of hate?  Someone has their wallet stolen, they are beaten kinda badly, broken nose etc.  Is it more of a crime based on somebodies religious beliefs or ethnicity?

 

No.  No it isn't.  The end result is your wallet is stolen and your nose is broken either way.  As well, it is very hard to tell a Christian from a Jew from a Catholic from an atheist when you get right down to it unless you ask them direct questions about their faith

 

My point in my previous comment is that they are in no more danger than anyone else in Germany and the numbers more than prove that.  To claim otherwise like this person is doing is a shade dramatic

Crime is motivated by opportunity, need, addiction and yes sometimes hate as well.

if someone targets synagogue, Jewish deli or a jewish person just because they are Jews, based on the current law thats called hate crime.

i agree that sometimes you can't tell who is who based on looks alone.

 

Right after September 11th Sikh person was murdered in Arizona, he was mistaken for a Muslim.

Killer was given the death penalty and, I think it got commuted to life in prison later on.

When Robert Byrd was brutally murderd in Texas, his killers got the death penalty as well.

 

i see what you are saying that any crime can be motivated by just pure hate, I think that has merit.

i can speak about Europe since I lived there for several decades, antisemitism is on the rise across the board.

One thing that neo nazis, kkk, jihadist, right wing militia groups etc. have in common, is intense hatred of Jews.

 

 

 

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, CBH1926 said:

Crime is motivated by opportunity, need, addiction and yes sometimes hate as well.

if someone targets synagogue, Jewish deli or a jewish person just because they are Jews, based on the current law thats called hate crime.

i agree that sometimes you can't tell who is who based on looks alone.

 

Right after September 11th Sikh person was murdered in Arizona, he was mistaken for a Muslim.

Killer was given the death penalty and, I think it got commuted to life in prison later on.

When Robert Byrd was brutally murderd in Texas, his killers got the death penalty as well.

 

i see what you are saying that any crime can be motivated by just pure hate, I think that has merit.

i can speak about Europe since I lived there for several decades, antisemitism is on the rise across the board.

One thing that neo nazis, kkk, jihadist, right wing militia groups etc. have in common, is intense hatred of Jews.

 

 

 

Why is there this hatred of Jewish people?  I don't understand hating period, but why single out the Jewish people, over some other group? 

[CBH1926]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Why is there this hatred of Jewish people?  I don't understand hating period, but why single out the Jewish people, over some other group? 

To answer that question I think we would need a whole lot of time. 

 

[Kragar]

4 hours ago, Warhippy said:

I will question this statement though in the story

We no longer feel safe here?  Seriously?

What about the tens of millions of others in Germany who might have an issue but not outlet...kind of a pity me and self involved outlook  imo

As well, I don't really recall much in the way of the average starving true refugee being an Israel hating person let alone one being truly anti semetic.  Smacks of attention seeking.  Because truly, they are in no more danger now than they were 6 months ago, and in no more danger than the average German citizen.

But yes my initial comment was VERY sarcastic, it just makes me laugh that people need to be offended so frequently that it gets missed how obvious it really is

Given how Arabs have treated Israel in the last 70 years, and the general history between Muslims and Jews, I think there is some cause for Jews to be more afraid than the average German resident.  Remember, it was one day after the formation of the state of Israel before Arab countries invaded.  Since fundamentalist followers of Islam take the harshest views against non-Muslims, and poverty helps to breed fundamentalist support, there could still be cause for concern.

And, I don't see how your graph linked above helps any.  There isn't enough info here one way or the other.  First off, there are no demographics regarding victim or criminal.  All it says was the number of attacks for a given category.  Unless you could show that there is no significant differences in crime rates between Muslims and Jews in Germany, the chart doesn't add any value to the conversation.

However, the following quote was taken from that same link (bolding, underlining are my emphasis):

Quote

Additionally, continued government reporting reiterates the growing concern for the expanding international and indigenous radical Islamist presence within Germany’s borders. Interior Ministry officials estimate that there over 1,000 residents who can be described as Islamist extremists, some of whom attended terror training camps in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

With Germany allowing increasing numbers of Muslims to enter the country, whether as refugees or not, I think it is a valid concern that at least some of the newcomers will become radicalized.  And as we know all too often, it doesn't take too many radicals to kill a larger number of people.  San Bernardino a few weeks ago.  Pakistan earlier today.

You may well be right about being attention seeking.  Maybe them, maybe the journalist interviewing them.  But I'm more inclined to believe the fears are real, even if the average refugee hasn't given any cause for concern.

[Cowardrobertford]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Why is there this hatred of Jewish people?  I don't understand hating period, but why single out the Jewish people, over some other group? 

Good question Alf, i read somewhere that the Jews and the blacks are the groups that have suffered the most in human history.

Egyptian slavery, Christian persecution or Jewish persecution by the Roman empire, and the holocausts

 

[Electro Rock]

3 hours ago, Alflives said:

Why is there this hatred of Jewish people?  I don't understand hating period, but why single out the Jewish people, over some other group? 

Because the Zionist/globalist elite subset of Jews are indeed responsible for a vast amount of suffering.

The Bolshevik Revolution for example, which ultimately killed tens of millions of people, was funded and perpetrated by Jews. 

They are also behind the current "refugee" crisis and many other destabilizing actions (Black Lives Matter, Maidan, Occupy Wall Street) George Soros is a good example of this.

Then, when there's a backlash, it's the regular Jews who suffer, not the incredibly powerful elite.

Oh I'm part Jewish BTW, so don't even go there!

[GLASSJAW]

2 hours ago, Electro Rock said:

Because the Zionist/globalist elite subset of Jews are indeed responsible for a vast amount of suffering.

The Bolshevik Revolution for example, which ultimately killed tens of millions of people, was funded and perpetrated by Jews. 

They are also behind the current "refugee" crisis and many other destabilizing actions (Black Lives Matter, Maidan, Occupy Wall Street) George Soros is a good example of this.

Then, when there's a backlash, it's the regular Jews who suffer, not the incredibly powerful elite.

Oh I'm part Jewish BTW, so don't even go there!

certainly a contentious set of arguments - but you're not alone in believing this stuff.

some artists certainly agree with you. let's admire their work.

 

[Electro Rock]

Come on now, Putin himself has said that most of the Bolsheviks were Jewish, is he some kind of Nazi?

http://www.timesofisrael.com/putin-first-soviet-government-was-mostly-jewish/

[Hugor Hill]

First Arabs. Now Jews. 

See how fast this spreads?

German nationalism is creeping back in.

[nucklehead]

19 hours ago, Warhippy said:

If only the world had gotten together at some point and appropriated a country just for those of Jewish heritage that they could go too.

 

If only

Swell idea. Sorta like we do for our aboriginals. Neat.

[taxi]

14 hours ago, Warhippy said:

No see that's splitting hairs my man.

 

What makes a crime of hate?  Someone has their wallet stolen, they are beaten kinda badly, broken nose etc.  Is it more of a crime based on somebodies religious beliefs or ethnicity?

 

No.  No it isn't.  The end result is your wallet is stolen and your nose is broken either way.  As well, it is very hard to tell a Christian from a Jew from a Catholic from an atheist when you get right down to it unless you ask them direct questions about their faith

 

My point in my previous comment is that they are in no more danger than anyone else in Germany and the numbers more than prove that.  To claim otherwise like this person is doing is a shade dramatic

Please just stop.

A hate crime has a significant effect beyond the physical act of the crime itself. For example, if someone were to burn some wood on my lawn, I'd say "WTF I don't like that" and report it as vandalism. If someone were to burn a cross on a black family's lawn, it would create an entirely different issue.

The fact that people are targeting Jews across Europe with these hate crimes is a very serious issue. Doing things like opening fire with automatic weapons in Jewish supermarkets and community centres is far from a trivial matter. 

[taxi]

10 hours ago, Electro Rock said:

Because the Zionist/globalist elite subset of Jews are indeed responsible for a vast amount of suffering.

The Bolshevik Revolution for example, which ultimately killed tens of millions of people, was funded and perpetrated by Jews. 

They are also behind the current "refugee" crisis and many other destabilizing actions (Black Lives Matter, Maidan, Occupy Wall Street) George Soros is a good example of this.

Then, when there's a backlash, it's the regular Jews who suffer, not the incredibly powerful elite.

Oh I'm part Jewish BTW, so don't even go there!

The Bolsheviks were an extreme far left anti-capitalist party. It's a common anti-semetic strategy to single out Jews in a party and then blame "the Jews" for all the misdeeds of the party. The fact you would lump groups like "Black Lives Matter" and "Occupy Wall Street" in with some kind of global capitalist elite is quite bizarre. Essentially you're saying that Jews are responsible for both the left and right and all conflict. In reality, Black Lives Matter is a spontaneous, and largely social media based, movement created in response to police brutality against black Americans.

Do you honestly believe that Jews are going around whispering in peoples' ears and forcing them to tweet about race based police brutality? Don't you think its just more likely that this is a natural response to historical injustices against black Americans.

[Alflives]

10 hours ago, Electro Rock said:

Because the Zionist/globalist elite subset of Jews are indeed responsible for a vast amount of suffering.

The Bolshevik Revolution for example, which ultimately killed tens of millions of people, was funded and perpetrated by Jews. 

They are also behind the current "refugee" crisis and many other destabilizing actions (Black Lives Matter, Maidan, Occupy Wall Street) George Soros is a good example of this.

Then, when there's a backlash, it's the regular Jews who suffer, not the incredibly powerful elite.

Oh I'm part Jewish BTW, so don't even go there!

I'm not going anywhere, as far as I know.  Unless Mrs. Alf has a trip planned, and is waiting to inform me.

I appreciate your honest opinion.  I'm trying to understand this (seemingly across all cultures and political ideologies) common hatred for the Jewish people..