wallstreetamigo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 16 minutes ago, chilliwiggins said: oilers gave nothing Benning gave up GUSTAV FORSLING , who I'm sure 29 teams would love to have in their system. This is fair in hindsight. I personally don't think the strategy of trading for not quite ready waiver eligible projects like Vey, Baertschi, Clendening, Etem, etc. can reasonably be expected to work out every time. It has its risks. With how the other three on that list have been developing for us after basically being cast off by other organizations I would say the strategy has been more a success than a failure for Benning though overall. Forsling, Jensen (waiver eligible himself next year and not in our plans), two 2nd round picks, and a 6th round pick for Clendening (used to get Sutter), Etem, Vey, and Baertschi. Any GM or team would be thrilled with that trade imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Screw Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Would Clendenning beat out any of our current NHL D-men? Not so sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Screw said: Would Clendenning beat out any of our current NHL D-men? Not so sure. He would be yet another bottom pairing/depth dman who needs a specific role to be most effective. He would not have been a terrible pickup but largely more of the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timberz21 Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 16 minutes ago, chilliwiggins said: oilers gave nothing Benning gave up GUSTAV FORSLING , who I'm sure 29 teams would love to have in their system and I would say that don't look good on Bennings resume. the same 29 teams who passed him in the first 4-5 rounds of his draft year? You act like Forsling is going to be a top pairing defenseman in the NHL. This year, two former 1st rounder were basically given away. Gormley (waivers) and Tinordi (traded for the mighty John Scott). I'll be surprise if we ever see Forsling in the NHL, or at most he'll be a 6th defenseman and PP specialist. We have to stop giving All-star tag to ALL of our prospect. No wonder everyone is so disappointed with our prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackcanuck Posted January 27, 2016 Author Share Posted January 27, 2016 As pathetic and unbelieveable as this sounds, The Coilers actually have a worse defence than we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spitfire_Spiky Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, timberz21 said: the same 29 teams who passed him in the first 4-5 rounds of his draft year? You act like Forsling is going to be a top pairing defenseman in the NHL. This year, two former 1st rounder were basically given away. Gormley (waivers) and Tinordi (traded for the mighty John Scott). I'll be surprise if we ever see Forsling in the NHL, or at most he'll be a 6th defenseman and PP specialist. We have to stop giving All-star tag to ALL of our prospect. No wonder everyone is so disappointed with our prospects. You missed Hodgson on that list of first rounders given away, he went unclaimed on wavers also. Did we lose out on the Forsling trade... probably but at the time we needed an extra defensemen that could play in the NHL and that was Clendening at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 1 minute ago, chilliwiggins said: saying VEY, ETEM , CLENDENING and BAERTSCHI in the same sentence as SUCCESS is an overstatement. SV is the only one on that list that is showing promise.in maintaining a position on this team. if vey didn't have any conections to staff he would be long gone. If he can clear waivers like he has , it says that all other teams would agree. Etem is already showing signs that the book on him is correct. Vey is miscast in the lineup and has only shown to be serviceable as an injury reserve on a poor team. As for Benning his job is to house a team that can win , which translates to ticket and merchandise sales, and might as well add to overall team value, all of which are in serious decline, so a passing grade he has not even close to earned and Aquilini reading his November 2015 issue of FORBES magazine can attest to that. I disagree with a few of your assertions. I think Vey has grown a lot as a useful and versatile option in our lineup. I was not a fan of him or the opportunity he was gift wrapped last year but he has been an effective player for us this year. Maybe he will never be more than a depth option but there is no guarantee that the pick used to get him would have fared any better and certainly would not likely be in our lineup this year and last. Time value of money argument applies to these guys vs what we have up for them. Etem would have to fall off a cliff in terms of his play to be a worse lineup option than Jensen. Again, he may never become more than a bottom 6 guy but Jensen is not exactly a sure thing either and Etem has other useful attributes if he cannot translate to an offensive top 6 option. Baertschi is looking like a keeper for sure. Its ts more about leveraging assets than anything. What Benning gave up for these players would not be in our lineup for years if ever. All 4 of the guys on the list played on our team to arguing degrees of success. It's already a win. Now if only Benning could be as good at trading our vets hen he should be lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 1 minute ago, chilliwiggins said: tinordi has had several concussions and would be considered high risk. in fact he was knocked out so hard by andre pedan he was going into seizures on the ice. we don't have a single allstar prospect. the cupboards are empty demko might turn into something but of all players goaliesare the least predictable. Forsling had an excellent showing in the WJC, and Chicagos drafting and picking of players has shown to be the best overall, so I would have a tendancy to trust their current management over ares as their record indicates. I personally did not like Forsling for Clendening at the time. It certainly looks worse now with the advantage of hindsight. But the strategy of trading less developed prospects and picks for specific age players is a pretty clear one that Benning follows. Chicago go and teams like them are good drafting teams but the real difference historically between them and teams like Vancouver has been development of their prospects and integrating them into their NHL team and putting them in the position to be successful. We are getting better at this than we have been for many years which is a good sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 1 minute ago, chilliwiggins said: I totally disagree with you on vancouvers current development of our prospects. McCann and Virtanen were gifted roster spots to aid in the spin management put on season ticket holders. these 2 kids should be at the junior level still, honing their skills around the net, not only that but maturing from an adolescent to a man surrounded by the kids of the same age. Does jake even shave????? do you know what I mean??? its not just maturing your hockey, its maturing into an adult which you cant discount as many persons who were forced into growing up to soon have had a long list of negative affects. No way should they be here. this is poor development that only serves management not the kids. I don't disagree that the motives of management (sometimes short term even) always play a large role in how players are developed. I don't see how another year of junior for either of them is going to be more useful than NHL experience though nor do I think either has shown that they do not belong to the degree you are suggesting. Would both have benefitted from a year with Green in Utica this year? I am sure they would have. But that wasn't an option and junior for another year is not an earth shattering development opportunity for either of them at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timberz21 Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 41 minutes ago, chilliwiggins said: tinordi has had several concussions and would be considered high risk. in fact he was knocked out so hard by andre pedan he was going into seizures on the ice. we don't have a single allstar prospect. the cupboards are empty demko might turn into something but of all players goaliesare the least predictable. Forsling had an excellent showing in the WJC, and Chicagos drafting and picking of players has shown to be the best overall, so I would have a tendancy to trust their current management over ours as their record indicates. Chicago drafted, Kane, Toews, Seabrook, Keith years ago (btw Bowman is collecting all the credit while a lot should go to Tallon) and have been riding that wave since then. Then they signed Hossa, traded for Sharp, Ladd, Versteeg, Leddy. When I look at their latest picks it's nothing exceptionnal...Schmaltz, Hartman, Teravainen, Danualt, Clendening!, Olsen. Chicago is there because of two exceptional top 5 draft and a couple of very good ones under the old regime....that's the bottom line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 At least we have Sutter to show for it. I sure would like that 2nd round pick for Vey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tre Mac Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Early nomination for the Mike Ricci Award for Unconceivable Beauty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliboy Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Claimed by Oilers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 1 minute ago, aliboy said: Claimed by Oilers. They can play Clendenning with Justin Schultz! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apollo Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 It's a no brainer to claim him. Or can we just have our Forsling back plz? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aladeen Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 On 26/01/2016 at 10:57 AM, Shift-4 said: Yeah, I remember when Shawn Belle was going to be a monster in the NHL too. By this logic we should never draft or try to get prospects at all because no matter how good they look out side of the NHL you just never know. So we should trade picks/prospects for established NHL players only? Of course being great in Juniors doesn't always translate to the NHL but what else do you have to gauge taking a chance on a player. Even you would have to admit that Forsling looks a lot more promising than 95% of 5th round picks taken. Its all about his trajectory moving toward playing in the NHL. Belle was taken 30th overall I believe, his trajectory moving toward the NHL started sky high and sank downwards, the opposite is true for Forsling (So Far) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Clendening improves the Oilers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falcon45ca Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 On January 26, 2016 at 0:07 PM, Aladeen said: Ok then you could say he was wrong in forcing a playoff push with the roster he had. It's never wrong to make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeanBeef Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 Chicago>Vancouver>Pittsburgh>Anaheim>Edmonton in just under a year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aladeen Posted January 27, 2016 Share Posted January 27, 2016 2 minutes ago, falcon45ca said: It's never wrong to make the playoffs. No but it's wrong to sell off young prospects to do so when there is almost zero chance of making any noise in the playoffs. Look I agree the team should always be striving to do the best that they can possibly do. But we need to be offloading vets (Hopefully this is finally the year we do so) and trying to make the playoffs + with who is left in our roster afterwards. Believe me I would love to see us offload vets this season and see our young players step up and go on a Cinderella tear this post season. I hope that you can agree that the worst thing we could do right now is offload picks/prospects to try to eek into the playoffs. If you think we should be selling the farm to acquire rental players I don't think there is much point in discussing anything with you. But I don't believe anyone could possibly feel that way at this stage of the rebuild/retool, so I will assume that is not what you believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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