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USA Politics/Election Thread: Joe Biden, Donald Trump, Democrats, Republicans, et al.


DonLever

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2 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

Right but we also don't know if a vaccine will come in that time like honestly I think we all have to Fast Track that

already being done, there's a vaccine trial underway in Seattle right now and apparently there are now 20 groups working on a vaccine (https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/20/who-officials-say-at-least-20-coronavirus-vaccines-are-in-development-in-global-race-for-cure.html). WHO is running a large clinical trial using existing drugs in 10 countries, with early results expected in 2 weeks (https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/18/who-to-launch-multinational-trial-to-jumpstart-search-for-coronavirus-drugs/). 

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1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

already being done, there's a vaccine trial underway in Seattle right now and apparently there are now 20 groups working on a vaccine (https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/20/who-officials-say-at-least-20-coronavirus-vaccines-are-in-development-in-global-race-for-cure.html). WHO is running a large clinical trial using existing drugs in 10 countries, with early results expected in 2 weeks (https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/18/who-to-launch-multinational-trial-to-jumpstart-search-for-coronavirus-drugs/). 

Thank you I hadn't heard this. I heard there was a group of scientist in Saskatchewan that were working on a vaccine?

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1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said:

Thank you I hadn't heard this. I heard there was a group of scientist in Saskatchewan that were working on a vaccine?

yup, SK is one of them.

 

I'm more excited about the combination of chloroquine+antibiotics that seems to have had the biggest impact so far. Very small study in France showed drastic reductions in virus load after just 5 days. It has to be conducted on a bigger scale, which it is, but given that its based on existing approved drugs and works quickly, we should know very soon if that combination works. If it does, that will make the situation in-hospital far far easier to deal with and take the edge of this thing. 

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1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

yup, SK is one of them.

 

I'm more excited about the combination of chloroquine+antibiotics that seems to have had the biggest impact so far. Very small study in France showed drastic reductions in virus load after just 5 days. It has to be conducted on a bigger scale, which it is, but given that its based on existing approved drugs and works quickly, we should know very soon if that combination works. If it does, that will make the situation in-hospital far far easier to deal with and take the edge of this thing. 

If you are talking about the malaria drug us doctors are not agreeing with Trump just saying

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Just now, Ryan Strome said:

If you are talking about the malaria drug us doctors are not agreeing with Trump just saying

Trump overplayed it but it is one of the drugs being tested. You have to be very careful with chloroquine, you can easily kill someone with it if you get the dosage wrong. 

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1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Trump overplayed it but it is one of the drugs being tested. You have to be very careful with chloroquine, you can easily kill someone with it if you get the dosage wrong. 

But it isn't a cure that's what I think a lot of people are misunderstanding. At least from what I've read but I know you are an intelligent person so if you want to fill me in on some more I'm all ears.

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1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said:

But it isn't a cure that's what I think a lot of people are misunderstanding. At least from what I've read but I know you are an intelligent person so if you want to fill me in on some more I'm all ears.

no its a treatment thats reduced the viral load in a small number of patients - here's the background. IF it can be replicated on a large scale it would be very helpful. But its not the kind of thing that you would want people trying to do outside of a hospital.

 

Chloroquine for COVID-19: Cutting Through the Hype

President Donald Trump has touted the drug as a treatment but scientists still don’t know for sure that it is effective in patients. A number of clinical trials aim to find out.

Chris Baraniuk 
Mar 20, 2020
2.5K

ABOVE: © ISTOCK.COM, OLLAWEILA

On March 16, SpaceX founder Elon Musk tweeted that the anti-malaria drug chloroquine was “maybe worth considering” as a treatment for COVID-19. He got 13,000 retweets. By March 19, President Donald Trump was touting chloroquine at a press conference. He even announced that the Food and Drug Administration had fast-tracked its approval for COVID-19. The FDA denied that this was the case a short time later.

While some of the hype has been fuelled by a document generated outside the scientific literature, chloroquine’s potential in treating COVID-19 is gaining traction in the medical community. 

The drug has a long track record in medicine, having been used since the 1940s as an antimalarial. The modern drug is made from the bark of the Cinchona plant, which was taken as an herbal remedy by indigenous Peruvians four centuries ago to treat fever. And there are some early indications it could work against SARS-CoV-2 infections.

There’s often a huge gap between how it works in the lab cells and how it works in the body.

—Jeremy Rossman, University of Kent

For instance, a study in France published on March 20 in the International Journal of Antimicrobial Agentsdescribed the treatment of 42 patients hospitalized with COVID-19, 26 of whom received a version of chloroquine called hydroxychloroquine and 16 of whom received routine care. Of the 20 patients who took the antimalarial and completed the study, six also received azithromycin, an antibiotic. All six of these patients were free of SARS-CoV-2 by the fifth day post-treatment, while seven of 14 patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone were negative for the virus, and two of 16 control patients were no longer infected.

Small-scale experiments in which chloroquine has been given to COVID-19 patients in China and Australiahave also shown encouraging results as far as shortening the course of the disease.

Larger clinical trials will be necessary to determine how effective the drug is. Researchers at the University of Minnesota have embarked on a study including 1,500 people to probe the drug’s effectiveness further in preventing the development of COVID-19 after people are exposed to SARS-CoV-2. The results could be available in a matter of weeks, Jakub Tolar, the dean of the University of Minnesota Medical School and vice president for clinical affairs, tells Reuters, and might indicate whether it’s worth launching a larger trial.

A small trial of 1,500 people would be a pragmatic step towards verifying the drug’s efficacy, says Jeremy Rossman, a virologist at the University of Kent, who praises the approach. 

A number of other chloroquine experiments on humans are in the works. According to clinicaltrials.gov, researchers at the University of Oxford plan to give it as a prophylactic to 10,000 health care workers and others at high risk of contracting SARS-CoV-2. In Norway, doctors expect to begin administering the drug to hospitalized patients. And in Thailand, clinicians are preparing for a clinical trial comparing various combinations of antivirals, including chloroquine.

Chloroquine’s mechanism of action

If chloroquine is shown to be effective against SARS-CoV-2, it will not be via the same mechanism by which the drug functions as an antimalarial. That’s because malaria is caused not by a virus but by a microparasite of the Plasmodium genus. Chloroquine makes it toxic for the parasite to digest its host’s hemoglobin. 

Chloroquine might have entirely different effects against a virus, such as, for example, disrupting the virus’s ability to enter a cell. 

See “Are We Headed for a New Era of Malaria Drug Resistance?

Nabil Seidah, a molecular biologist at the Montreal Clinical Research Institute (IRCM), and colleagues examined chloroquine’s effect on SARS-CoV back in 2005. Seidah is currently experimenting with drugs including chloroquine as potential SARS-CoV-2 treatments and using material sent to him by pharmaceutical firms.

His 2005 study reported “strong antiviral effects” in animal cells in vitro. Seidah tells The Scientist that the mechanism by which chloroquine disrupts infection by a coronavirus remains unclear.

Chloroquine can raise the pH of endosomes, vesicles inside cells that are hijacked as points of entry by viruses. Endosomes have a slightly acidic pH, which helps facilitate this process. Seidah explains that chloroquine can raise endosomic pH slightly, which prevents fusion and stops the virus from entering the cell. Seidah says chloroquine may also block enzymes involved in the fusion between the virus and lung cells or stymie the viral replication process. 

Whatever the mechanism, Seidah says, it’s likely a combination of drugs of some kind that will, ultimately, be needed to treat COVID-19.

“Chloroquine alone will not solve the problem,” he says.

Rossman says he would expect chloroquine to inhibit SARS-CoV-2 in the lab, based on what is known about its ability to raise endosomic pH. “But there’s often a huge gap between how it works in the lab cells and how it works in the body,” he says.

The drug is potentially dangerous when used at high doses or for prolonged periods. It can cause permanent blindness and even death. Rossman and Seidah agree that larger clinical trials are a must before chloroquine is considered safe and effective as a treatment for COVID-19. 

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3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

no its a treatment thats reduced the viral load in a small number of patients - here's the background. IF it can be replicated on a large scale it would be very helpful. But its not the kind of thing that you would want people trying to do outside of a hospital.

 

Chloroquine for COVID-19: Cutting Through the Hype

President Donald Trump has touted the drug as a treatment but scientists still don’t know for sure that it is effective in patients. A number of clinical trials aim to find out.

Chris Baraniuk 
Mar 20, 2020
2.5K

ABOVE: © ISTOCK.COM, OLLAWEILA

On March 16, SpaceX founder Elon Musk tweeted that the anti-malaria drug chloroquine was “maybe worth considering” as a treatment for COVID-19. He got 13,000 retweets. By March 19, President Donald Trump was touting chloroquine at a press conference. He even announced that the Food and Drug Administration had fast-tracked its approval for COVID-19. The FDA denied that this was the case a short time later.

While some of the hype has been fuelled by a document generated outside the scientific literature, chloroquine’s potential in treating COVID-19 is gaining traction in the medical community. 

The drug has a long track record in medicine, having been used since the 1940s as an antimalarial. The modern drug is made from the bark of the Cinchona plant, which was taken as an herbal remedy by indigenous Peruvians four centuries ago to treat fever. And there are some early indications it could work against SARS-CoV-2 infections.

There’s often a huge gap between how it works in the lab cells and how it works in the body.

—Jeremy Rossman, University of Kent

For instance, a study in France published on March 20 in the International Journal of Antimicrobial Agentsdescribed the treatment of 42 patients hospitalized with COVID-19, 26 of whom received a version of chloroquine called hydroxychloroquine and 16 of whom received routine care. Of the 20 patients who took the antimalarial and completed the study, six also received azithromycin, an antibiotic. All six of these patients were free of SARS-CoV-2 by the fifth day post-treatment, while seven of 14 patients who took hydroxychloroquine alone were negative for the virus, and two of 16 control patients were no longer infected.

Small-scale experiments in which chloroquine has been given to COVID-19 patients in China and Australiahave also shown encouraging results as far as shortening the course of the disease.

Larger clinical trials will be necessary to determine how effective the drug is. Researchers at the University of Minnesota have embarked on a study including 1,500 people to probe the drug’s effectiveness further in preventing the development of COVID-19 after people are exposed to SARS-CoV-2. The results could be available in a matter of weeks, Jakub Tolar, the dean of the University of Minnesota Medical School and vice president for clinical affairs, tells Reuters, and might indicate whether it’s worth launching a larger trial.

A small trial of 1,500 people would be a pragmatic step towards verifying the drug’s efficacy, says Jeremy Rossman, a virologist at the University of Kent, who praises the approach. 

A number of other chloroquine experiments on humans are in the works. According to clinicaltrials.gov, researchers at the University of Oxford plan to give it as a prophylactic to 10,000 health care workers and others at high risk of contracting SARS-CoV-2. In Norway, doctors expect to begin administering the drug to hospitalized patients. And in Thailand, clinicians are preparing for a clinical trial comparing various combinations of antivirals, including chloroquine.

Chloroquine’s mechanism of action

If chloroquine is shown to be effective against SARS-CoV-2, it will not be via the same mechanism by which the drug functions as an antimalarial. That’s because malaria is caused not by a virus but by a microparasite of the Plasmodium genus. Chloroquine makes it toxic for the parasite to digest its host’s hemoglobin. 

Chloroquine might have entirely different effects against a virus, such as, for example, disrupting the virus’s ability to enter a cell. 

See “Are We Headed for a New Era of Malaria Drug Resistance?

Nabil Seidah, a molecular biologist at the Montreal Clinical Research Institute (IRCM), and colleagues examined chloroquine’s effect on SARS-CoV back in 2005. Seidah is currently experimenting with drugs including chloroquine as potential SARS-CoV-2 treatments and using material sent to him by pharmaceutical firms.

His 2005 study reported “strong antiviral effects” in animal cells in vitro. Seidah tells The Scientist that the mechanism by which chloroquine disrupts infection by a coronavirus remains unclear.

Chloroquine can raise the pH of endosomes, vesicles inside cells that are hijacked as points of entry by viruses. Endosomes have a slightly acidic pH, which helps facilitate this process. Seidah explains that chloroquine can raise endosomic pH slightly, which prevents fusion and stops the virus from entering the cell. Seidah says chloroquine may also block enzymes involved in the fusion between the virus and lung cells or stymie the viral replication process. 

Whatever the mechanism, Seidah says, it’s likely a combination of drugs of some kind that will, ultimately, be needed to treat COVID-19.

“Chloroquine alone will not solve the problem,” he says.

Rossman says he would expect chloroquine to inhibit SARS-CoV-2 in the lab, based on what is known about its ability to raise endosomic pH. “But there’s often a huge gap between how it works in the lab cells and how it works in the body,” he says.

The drug is potentially dangerous when used at high doses or for prolonged periods. It can cause permanent blindness and even death. Rossman and Seidah agree that larger clinical trials are a must before chloroquine is considered safe and effective as a treatment for COVID-19. 

So yeah it's a treatment not a cure I'm not sure if it is even a treatment. Do we know what this time?

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1 hour ago, Ryan Strome said:

So yeah it's a treatment not a cure I'm not sure if it is even a treatment. Do we know what this time?

its definitely treatment potential, if you can knock down the virus load then you can cut into the number of severe cases, that would be a huge help. 

 

Its unfortunately that Trump had to talk about it, now people aren't sure about what to think. #trumpeffect 

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2 hours ago, Ryan Strome said:

Well then Superboy I guess what you're saying is just as useless this is the problem with left-wing lunatics like you you always think you are right.

thank you for your thoughtful and detailed response

regarding the situation in nyc

many will benefit from your knowledge and understanding

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2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

its definitely treatment potential, if you can knock down the virus load then you can cut into the number of severe cases, that would be a huge help. 

 

Its unfortunately that Trump had to talk about it, now people aren't sure about what to think. #trumpeffect 

if this has any real value

i'm sure we will hear about it as soon as that in confirmed

just refer to reliable sources

and avoid misinformation emanating from the house of whiteness down south

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6 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

if this has any real value

i'm sure we will hear about it as soon as that in confirmed

just refer to reliable sources

and avoid misinformation emanating from the house of whiteness down south

exactly. I wasn't even thinking about Trump when discussing the WHO studies, thankfully it has nothing to do with that idiot. 

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4 hours ago, Ryan Strome said:

I'm honestly starting to think so

Starting?  I felt was obvious since he started running. If you watch interviews of his from the 80s and 90s he's actually a decent and measured speaker. He's drastically changed and I just don't mean when firing up the dimwits that compose much of his base. 

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On 3/19/2020 at 8:19 AM, Toews said:

Later on Hannity angrily confronted accusations that he had crawled all the way up Trump's rump. "Ask Mike (Pence), he is there all the time. He will tell you I haven't been anywhere near it." 

 

Ha! I was in there trying to get Newt Gingrich to sign his recent book about the Great Donald J Trump. Saw Hannity there, but Pence must have stepped out for some air. B)

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On 3/20/2020 at 8:03 AM, I.Am.Ironman said:

Saw this in the depths of a yahoo comment thread about the stock markets actually. Day by day quotes from President Orange re Covid 19. I put it into spoilers for space... and I have no way to cross reference them, it is from some guy on the internet but I do recognize some of the quotes. It's interesting to see how his message has changed from January

  Reveal hidden contents

Trump's claims on COVID-19:
1/20: "I know more about viruses than anyone."

1/22: "We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. It’s going to be just fine."

2/02: "We pretty much shut it down coming in from China."

2/10: "The virus that we’re talking about having to do, a lot of people think that goes away in April, with the heat, as the heat comes in, typically that will go away in April."

2/24: "The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA... Stock Market starting to look very good to me!"

02/25: "CDC and my Administration are doing a GREAT job of handling Coronavirus."

02/25: "I think that's a problem that’s going to go away. They have studied it. They know very much. In fact, we’re very close to a vaccine."

02/26: "The 15 [cases in the US] within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero."

02/26: "We're going very substantially down, not up."

02/27: "One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear."

02/28: "We're ordering a lot of supplies. We're ordering a lot of, uh, elements that frankly we wouldn't be ordering unless it was something like this. But we're ordering a lot of different elements of medical."

02/28: "Coronavirus... And this is their new hoax."

03/02: "Nobody knew of the number of US flu deaths."

03/02: "You take a solid flu vaccine, you don't think that could have an impact, or much of an impact, on corona?"

03/02: "A lot of things are happening, a lot of very exciting things are happening and they’re happening very rapidly."

03/04: "If we have thousands or hundreds of thousands of people that get better just by, you know, sitting around and even going to work — some of them go to work, but they get better."

03/05: "I NEVER said people that are feeling sick should go to work."

03/05: "The United States... has, as of now, only 129 cases... and 11 deaths. We are working very hard to keep these numbers as low as possible!"

03/06: "I think we’re doing a really good job in this country at keeping it down... a tremendous job at keeping it down."

03/06: "Anybody right now, and yesterday, anybody that needs a test gets a test. They’re there. And the tests are beautiful.... The tests are all perfect like the letter was perfect. The transcription was perfect. Right? This was not as perfect as that but pretty good."

03/06: "I like this stuff. I really get it. People are surprised that I understand it... Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president."

03/06: "I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship that wasn't our fault."

03/07: "No, I’m not concerned at all. No, I’m not."

03/08: "We have a perfectly coordinated and fine tuned plan at the White House for our attack on CoronaVirus."

03/09: "This blindsided the world."

03/13: "I don't know the gentleman that we're talking about, I have no idea who he is," responding to if he'll get tested after being photographed with people who tested positive for COVID-19.

03/13: "National emergency, two big words."

03/13: "No I don’t take responsibility for that at all."

03/16: "Respirators, ventilators, all of the equipment — try getting it yourselves."

03/17: "I felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic."

03/17: "I've always viewed it as very serious. There was no difference yesterday from days before. I feel the tone is similar."

03/18: "I always treated the Chinese Virus very seriously, and have done a very good job from the beginning, including my very early decision to close the ‘borders’ from China - against the wishes of almost all."

 

It’s called LEADERSHIP:bigblush:

More like coming across a serious car crash. You know that you shouldn’t slow down and gawk..... but you just can’t help yourself.

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  • -SN- changed the title to USA Politics/Election Thread
  • DonLever changed the title to USA Politics/Election Thread: Joe Biden, Donald Trump, Democrats, Republicans, et al.

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