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RFA - MacKinnon (Proposal)


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Be objective.

 

Offer sheet a guy for that much and not only do you alienate half the league, you bury your teams future in the process during a time where the cap is entirely flat unless the NHLPA agrees to the contract stipulations which would see it rise to $74 million, something by all accounts they've no interest in doing.

 

Rather take that $ and just throw a contract at Stamkos instead really.  The Avs would match, we don't have our 3rd if I recall and throwing that much money at a kid who while highly touted is looking a shade more like a Tavares lite than a MacDavid thus far and I am not sure we survive the next decade.

 

Not saying McKinnon isn't an amazing player, just for all his hype of being the 1st overall in the best draft since 2003 (for the 3rd time) he hasn't shown much

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2 hours ago, Warhippy said:

Be objective.

 

Offer sheet a guy for that much and not only do you alienate half the league, you bury your teams future in the process during a time where the cap is entirely flat unless the NHLPA agrees to the contract stipulations which would see it rise to $74 million, something by all accounts they've no interest in doing.

 

Rather take that $ and just throw a contract at Stamkos instead really.  The Avs would match, we don't have our 3rd if I recall and throwing that much money at a kid who while highly touted is looking a shade more like a Tavares lite than a MacDavid thus far and I am not sure we survive the next decade.

 

Not saying McKinnon isn't an amazing player, just for all his hype of being the 1st overall in the best draft since 2003 (for the 3rd time) he hasn't shown much

Hipster we agree!  Mac is proving himself to be a winger.  But is Stamkos also better suited to wing?  I'm trying to think of the elite centres who don't pass EXTREMELY well, and I can't up with one.  Mac and Stamkos are better suited as first line wingers but second line centres.  Why spend big money (assets) on that?  

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1 hour ago, J.R. said:

If we were going to go full offer sheet douche-mode, I'd FAR rather go after Gudbranson. At the very least we might be able to force them to move Petrovic instead for a trade.

Anybody, our first for Gudbranson?

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4 minutes ago, J.R. said:

Edler +

Edler would be a more reasonably priced replacement for Campbell on the left side. And they have McCoshen, Matheson as potential replacements for the PMD component?

 

I'm sure Flo would rather the pick...

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5 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Edler would be a more reasonably priced replacement for Campbell on the left side. And they have McCoshen, Matheson as potential replacements for the PMD component?

 

I'm sure Flo would rather the pick...

Could be losing Mitchell too. That's a lot of veteran left D depth gone and they have Ekblad, Gudbranson and Petrovic on the right. That's too many (soon $$$) top 4 D with Gudbranson due a large raise this year and Ekblad/Petrovic next. They can't afford to keep them all long term IMO.

 

FLA is also a fringe contender. They can't afford to set that back with picks, especially with an aging Luongo. 

 

They need to get while the gettin's good.

 

 

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On 12 March, 2016 at 7:41 PM, janisahockeynut said:

We had a lot of things go wrong this year, and if you add a Dman and MacKinnon to our team, along with our 2016 picks and we would be a very close to a top 12 team, with a very good stable that is very close to maturing........

 

 

The Canucks are not a player or 2 away from contending.

 

Things are going to get a lot worse before they get better.

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On 12/03/2016 at 10:36 PM, nuckin_futz said:

I think it's safe to assume we'll be a lottery team next year.

Doubt it.

 

Sedin Sedin Hansen

Baertschi MacKinnon McCannRodin

Gaunce Horvat Virtanen

Burrows Sutter Grenier

 

Edler Tanev

Hamhuis Tryamkin

Hutton Sbisa

Pedan Biega

 

Miller

Markstrom

 

Seems like a playoff team to me. Solid 4 centers, legit top 6, solid goaltending, and a new and bigger looking defence. Tryamkin makes our D that much better, ive seen him and although hes made his mistakes you can really see that potential.

 

PP line 1:

Sedin Sedin MacKinnon

Hutton Tryamkin

 

PP2

Baertschi Horvat Virtanen

Edler Tanev

 

PK1

Burrows Sutter 

Edler Tanev

 

PK2

Gaunce Horvat

Hamhuis Tryamkin

 

Id actually be surprised if we missed the playoffs with this team. If we can get MacKinnon @ 7M id do it in a heart beat, unfortunately it would take more for them not to match. But it is a possibilty to hope for. 

 

Sedin

MacKinnon

Horvat

Sutter

 

Is there a team as built down the middle as strong as this? It would be very nice. Good thread OP!

 

 

 

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The 2017 draft is likely to be a week draft in comparison to 2015 and 2016. However, that being said it is not smart or wise to give away picks for young unproven players, not to mention all that cap hit. Mackinnon is an excellent player and may very well turn out to be a Claude Giroux calibre player, but we also have to remember he likely won't have anyone special to play with in Vancouver for some time, he has that in Colorado and still isn't putting up phenomenal numbers.

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4 hours ago, McHortanen said:

Doubt it.

 

Sedin Sedin Hansen

Baertschi MacKinnon McCann

Gaunce Horvat Virtanen

Burrows Sutter Grenier

 

Edler Tanev

Hamhuis Tryamkin

Hutton Sbisa

Pedan Biega

 

Miller

Markstrom

 

Seems like a playoff team to me. Solid 4 centers, legit top 6, solid goaltending, and a new and bigger looking defence. Tryamkin makes our D that much better, ive seen him and although hes made his mistakes you can really see that potential.

 

Sedin

MacKinnon

Horvat

Sutter

 

Is there a team as built down the middle as strong as this? It would be very nice. Good thread OP!

 

 

 

Even though Henrik is another year older that team does look solid down the middle. Though how wise is it to pay your 4th line center $4.5M or whatever Sutter makes?

 

The rest of the lineup is full of holes and well wishes.

 

Hansen is not a 1st line winger, at best he's a 2nd.

McCann looks lost and physically unable to compete at this level. What he'll become is a total unknown.

Gaunce at 3rd line winger is a crap shoot. Maybe he can do it, maybe he can't. He's proven next to zero at the NHL level.

Virtanen looks physically ready. Hope there's no sophomore slump there as there so often is.

Burrows, well he'd be gone if he made less money. At least he's good in the room.

Grenier is a total unknown at the NHL level.

 

You've got 4 guys in that defensive core without much experience. Injuries to the top 4 could spell disaster if the bottom 4 are relied on for big minutes.

 

Basically you have a team with some decent pieces and little depth. Any injuries like they had this year and seem to every year will expose the depth and doom them.

 

I noticed you had no change at coach. Is Willie D still your guy?

 

IMO You're long on hope and short on reality.

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54 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said:

Even though Henrik is another year older that team does look solid down the middle. Though how wise is it to pay your 4th line center $4.5M or whatever Sutter makes?

 

The rest of the lineup is full of holes and well wishes.

 

Hansen is not a 1st line winger, at best he's a 2nd.

McCann looks lost and physically unable to compete at this level. What he'll become is a total unknown.

Gaunce at 3rd line winger is a crap shoot. Maybe he can do it, maybe he can't. He's proven next to zero at the NHL level.

Virtanen looks physically ready. Hope there's no sophomore slump there as there so often is.

Burrows, well he'd be gone if he made less money. At least he's good in the room.

Grenier is a total unknown at the NHL level.

 

You've got 4 guys in that defensive core without much experience. Injuries to the top 4 could spell disaster if the bottom 4 are relied on for big minutes.

 

Basically you have a team with some decent pieces and little depth. Any injuries like they had this year and seem to every year will expose the depth and doom them.

 

I noticed you had no change at coach. Is Willie D still your guy?

 

IMO You're long on hope and short on reality.

People put too much thought into this 4th line role thing. You need all 4 lines contributing so try not to label it lined 1-4. Instead just look at the lines you have and put them out when needed. The Sutter line will be our go to defensive line. He may play 12 mins a night or he may play 18 mins. Its not like the AV and Torts years where the 4th line gets 5 mins if they're lucky, were a 4 line team.

 

Hansen may not be a top line winger on any other team but he sure as hell looks like one playing with the Sedins. He is the best fit for them so he goes on their line. Or do we keep him off the line because the Sedins are our 1st line and Hansen isnt capable of playing there? Its about building chemistry and comepete in all the lines, not just plugging them where "they belong". Pay them based on performance not based off what line they play on. Thats why "4th line Sutter" will get 4.5M because he is our go to defensive forward and core peice on this team.

 

McCann is 19, he needs to build muscle, not everyone is like Horvat. Jeeze look at how well Virtanen is coming along since WJRs. A season in Utica will do wonders for McCann, he will be a top 6 forward getting the minutes and opportunities that he needs to develop properly.

 

Id like Burrows gone to but not because he sucks, hes just not worth the 4.5M cap hit. I have to say though he does deserve it. What he did for us @ $2M a year earned him this contract. If we trade him, great, if not he is a very good defensive forward which is why he will play with Sutter, they are there for the defensive draws and PKing.

 

Injuries to top 4 dmen on any team can spell disaster so whats your point? If you want I could throw a Karlsson or Doughty in there, but how the hell are we going to get them?????

 

Yes WD is my guy for now. Please explain what he has done wrong? Last season he was a coach of the year candidate who took this team over the 100pt plateau. This year he was giving a team with 5-6 rookies and sophomore players, then you factor in the injuries. So what did you expect? To think we were still in the playoff hunt diring TDL is impressive IMHO. We had 3 games in hand and only 8pts out of the wildcard spot. Also look how hes helped Horvat, Baertschi, Virtanen, and Hutton develop, he is a great coach to develop young players. 

 

Here is an interesting fact for you:

 

This will be the FIRST year WD has missed the playoffs in ANY LEAGUE hes coached. So please give me more thought on why WD is not a good coach, I would love to hear :)

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23 minutes ago, McHortanen said:

People put too much thought into this 4th line role thing. You need all 4 lines contributing so try not to label it lined 1-4. Instead just look at the lines you have and put them out when needed. The Sutter line will be our go to defensive line. He may play 12 mins a night or he may play 18 mins. Its not like the AV and Torts years where the 4th line gets 5 mins if they're lucky, were a 4 line team.

 

Hansen may not be a top line winger on any other team but he sure as hell looks like one playing with the Sedins. He is the best fit for them so he goes on their line. Or do we keep him off the line because the Sedins are our 1st line and Hansen isnt capable of playing there? Its about building chemistry and comepete in all the lines, not just plugging them where "they belong". Pay them based on performance not based off what line they play on. Thats why "4th line Sutter" will get 4.5M because he is our go to defensive forward and core peice on this team.

 

McCann is 19, he needs to build muscle, not everyone is like Horvat. Jeeze look at how well Virtanen is coming along since WJRs. A season in Utica will do wonders for McCann, he will be a top 6 forward getting the minutes and opportunities that he needs to develop properly.

 

Id like Burrows gone to but not because he sucks, hes just not worth the 4.5M cap hit. I have to say though he does deserve it. What he did for us @ $2M a year earned him this contract. If we trade him, great, if not he is a very good defensive forward which is why he will play with Sutter, they are there for the defensive draws and PKing.

 

Injuries to top 4 dmen on any team can spell disaster so whats your point? If you want I could throw a Karlsson or Doughty in there, but how the hell are we going to get them?????

 

Yes WD is my guy for now. Please explain what he has done wrong? Last season he was a coach of the year candidate who took this team over the 100pt plateau. This year he was giving a team with 5-6 rookies and sophomore players, then you factor in the injuries. So what did you expect? To think we were still in the playoff hunt diring TDL is impressive IMHO. We had 3 games in hand and only 8pts out of the wildcard spot. Also look how hes helped Horvat, Baertschi, Virtanen, and Hutton develop, he is a great coach to develop young players. 

 

Here is an interesting fact for you:

 

This will be the FIRST year WD has missed the playoffs in ANY LEAGUE hes coached. So please give me more thought on why WD is not a good coach, I would love to hear :)

How is McCann going to be 2nd line winger on the Canucks when you have him developing in Utica for the whole season?

 

What is my point about injuries to top 4 dmen? I made that perfectly clear. If you're going to make the playoffs you need decent depth. If you think we currently have decent defensive depth you're deluded.

 

Thanks for the interesting fact about Wille D. Here's one for you. I never said he was a bad coach, had done anything wrong or needed to be fired. Nice diatribe though.

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7 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said:

How is McCann going to be 2nd line winger on the Canucks when you have him developing in Utica for the whole season?

 

What is my point about injuries to top 4 dmen? I made that perfectly clear. If you're going to make the playoffs you need decent depth. If you think we currently have decent defensive depth you're deluded.

 

Thanks for the interesting fact about Wille D. Here's one for you. I never said he was a bad coach, had done anything wrong or needed to be fired. Nice diatribe though.

Sorry for not listing a bunch of depth signings we could make for you, its kind of a waste of time tbh.

 

I fixed the McCann thing after replying to your comment, forgot about Rodin and McCann was the next best fit for that scoring line.

 

You never "said" he was a bad coach but you clearly made it a point me not making a coaching change was bad, therefore while not saying those exact words, you insisted he is bad for our team. 

 

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3 minutes ago, McHortanen said:

Sorry for not listing a bunch of depth signings we could make for you, its kind of a waste of time tbh.

 

I fixed the McCann thing after replying to your comment, forgot about Rodin and McCann was the next best fit for that scoring line.

 

You never "said" he was a bad coach but you clearly made it a point me not making a coaching change was bad, therefore while not saying those exact words, you insisted he is bad for our team. 

 

"It's kind of a waste of time." LOL It's kind of important don't you think? If you're making the argument this is a playoff team and has sufficient depth, don't you think you should list the depth signings? You jabber on and on about everything else but listing depth signings is a waste of time. Talk about lazy.

 

As for Rodin. You have a 5'11" guy weighing 180lbs with zero NHL games under his belt coming of a season ending injury as your scoring winger. I am sure he'll have no problem adjusting to the smaller ice surface and will rip it up on our offensive powerhouse team.

 

I never insisted anything about Willie, especially that he is bad for our team as you say I did. Don't manipulate my words to suit your argument it's dishonest.

 

If you think this "I noticed you had no change at coach. Is Willie D still your guy?" is insinuating Willie is a bad coach then I just don't know what to say to you. Other than I see some remedial classes in your future.

 

The major reason this team is in the lottery is they can't score. All you have done to remedy that is minus McCann and replaced him with an unknown NHL commodity in Rodin and signed MacKinnon who is hardly elite. If you honestly think taking MacKinnon out of Colorado's system and plunking him in our's will result in equal or higher production then I will just shake my head and leave it at that.

 

Like i said earlier, long on hope, short on reality.

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52 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said:

"It's kind of a waste of time." LOL It's kind of important don't you think? If you're making the argument this is a playoff team and has sufficient depth, don't you think you should list the depth signings? You jabber on and on about everything else but listing depth signings is a waste of time. Talk about lazy.

 

As for Rodin. You have a 5'11" guy weighing 180lbs with zero NHL games under his belt coming of a season ending injury as your scoring winger. I am sure he'll have no problem adjusting to the smaller ice surface and will rip it up on our offensive powerhouse team.

 

I never insisted anything about Willie, especially that he is bad for our team as you say I did. Don't manipulate my words to suit your argument it's dishonest.

 

If you think this "I noticed you had no change at coach. Is Willie D still your guy?" is insinuating Willie is a bad coach then I just don't know what to say to you. Other than I see some remedial classes in your future.

 

The major reason this team is in the lottery is they can't score. All you have done to remedy that is minus McCann and replaced him with an unknown NHL commodity in Rodin and signed MacKinnon who is hardly elite. If you honestly think taking MacKinnon out of Colorado's system and plunking him in our's will result in equal or higher production then I will just shake my head and leave it at that.

 

Like i said earlier, long on hope, short on reality.

Yes it is important. But I am not Jim Benning so whats so important about me talking about depth signings? 

 

Do you just like to argue? It sure the hell seems like it

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25 minutes ago, McHortanen said:

Yes it is important. But I am not Jim Benning so whats so important about me talking about depth signings? 

 

Do you just like to argue? It sure the hell seems like it

Is there much thought going into what you type? You say you're not Jim Benning and therefore won't/can't talk about depth signings (like everyone else here does) but you can go ahead and insist he should sign MacKinnon. That's some funky logic.

 

There is no argument. You had your say but when I respond and you have no answers you call it arguing. Once again that's some funky logic.

 

I might add you started this by responding to a single sentence I wrote by writing an essay/lecture. So who likes to argue?

 

Your debating tactics leave more that a little to be desired. You are good at avoiding issues and obfuscating. Might I suggest a career in politics?

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