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Rollie Melanson not returning


PRIMO88

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2 hours ago, Dazzle said:

That's a fair comment - the stats certainly support this view. On the other hand, the successful Canuck teams with Naslund/Mo/Bert had great offense, but not much defense. Naslund/Bertuzzi weren't particularly good at backchecking. Furthermore, there wasn't a lot of depth. I think all of these reasons contributed to their demise - not just simply goaltending.

 

That being said, it is possible that Cloutier could pass on his tips from him being a goalie to another. Not saying this is a guarantee. This is more speculative and not fact.

 

I don't think it's that scary if he's teaching someone on our team. It's not like he has this ploy to sink future Canuck team goalies. (or Does he?)

 

We'll find out in the next episode of Canucks Hockey!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for agreeing to disagree on some points.

 

I don't think Cloutier is capable of trying to sink future Canuck teams. I just believe there are better options out there, that could positively affect our goaltending.

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Dazzle said:

That's a fair comment - the stats certainly support this view. On the other hand, the successful Canuck teams with Naslund/Mo/Bert had great offense, but not much defense. Naslund/Bertuzzi weren't particularly good at backchecking. Furthermore, there wasn't a lot of depth. I think all of these reasons contributed to their demise - not just simply goaltending.

 

That being said, it is possible that Cloutier could pass on his tips from him being a goalie to another. Not saying this is a guarantee. This is more speculative and not fact.

 

I don't think it's that scary if he's teaching someone on our team. It's not like he has this ploy to sink future Canuck team goalies. (or Does he?)

 

We'll find out in the next episode of Canucks Hockey!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wow thank you.

 

There are only a select few on this board who understands that during the Naslund/Bert years, we had great offence but we had one of the worst defences.  Jovo had zero defensive capabilities but he made it up with his great offensive awareness.  Naslund and Bert floated in the defensive zone.  If people actually watched all the games that Clouts played, he was hung out to dry at least 7/10 times he was scored on (maybe a bit lower percentage but you get my point).  As for Playoffs, not every goalie necessarily succeed.  To be honest, it took Lu around 2-3 season being on the Canucks to finally get past the 1st round.

 

In relation to Butcher stating that a person who has a good winning history will eventually be a good coach because he has a good mentality and knows how to succeed is partially true.  People who were born with talent like Gretzky will never be able to coach because it came so naturally to him, he wouldn't know how to teach it.  Therefore you need to find a person who has success but also worked super hard for it.  It is really hard to find.  It also applies to education.  I was taught Calculus and Corporate Law by two so called "geniuses" but ended up learning more from the tutorials taught by "non-geniuses" because the geniuses were so smart they didn't know how to make us understand how it works as because for them, they don't need to think and already know how to do it.

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12 hours ago, Dazzle said:

That's a fair comment - the stats certainly support this view. On the other hand, the successful Canuck teams with Naslund/Mo/Bert had great offense, but not much defense. Naslund/Bertuzzi weren't particularly good at backchecking. Furthermore, there wasn't a lot of depth. I think all of these reasons contributed to their demise - not just simply goaltending.

 

That being said, it is possible that Cloutier could pass on his tips from him being a goalie to another. Not saying this is a guarantee. This is more speculative and not fact.

 

I don't think it's that scary if he's teaching someone on our team. It's not like he has this ploy to sink future Canuck team goalies. (or Does he?)

 

We'll find out in the next episode of Canucks Hockey!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Weren't the Sedins our depth those years? I wish Luongo was with us in that 02-03 season. 

 

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On ‎14‎/‎04‎/‎2016 at 9:36 PM, Law of Goalies said:

Wow thank you.

 

There are only a select few on this board who understands that during the Naslund/Bert years, we had great offence but we had one of the worst defences.  Jovo had zero defensive capabilities but he made it up with his great offensive awareness.  Naslund and Bert floated in the defensive zone.  If people actually watched all the games that Clouts played, he was hung out to dry at least 7/10 times he was scored on (maybe a bit lower percentage but you get my point).  As for Playoffs, not every goalie necessarily succeed.  To be honest, it took Lu around 2-3 season being on the Canucks to finally get past the 1st round.

 

In relation to Butcher stating that a person who has a good winning history will eventually be a good coach because he has a good mentality and knows how to succeed is partially true.  People who were born with talent like Gretzky will never be able to coach because it came so naturally to him, he wouldn't know how to teach it.  Therefore you need to find a person who has success but also worked super hard for it.  It is really hard to find.  It also applies to education.  I was taught Calculus and Corporate Law by two so called "geniuses" but ended up learning more from the tutorials taught by "non-geniuses" because the geniuses were so smart they didn't know how to make us understand how it works as because for them, they don't need to think and already know how to do it.

Burrows had to work pretty hard

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  • 1 month later...

Looks like Rollie is sticking with the Canucks in a different role.

 

Very excited to see Melanson is sticking with us. Between him and Cloutier our future goalie factory will be full steam ahead!

 

Quote

Canucks name Dan Cloutier goalie coach

…Roland Melanson continues with Canucks as Goaltending Coach, Player Development

Tuesday, 06.14.2016 / 9:58 AM PT / News
Vancouver Canucks
 
 
E-mail

Vancouver, BC – Vancouver Canucks General Manager Jim Benning announced today that Dan Cloutier has been named the team’s goaltending coach. The Canucks also confirmed that Roland Melanson has been named to the position of Goaltending Coach, Player Development.

“Our team and goaltenders have benefited from some of the best coaching in the League and we’re very grateful to continue that tradition with Dan and Rollie in their new roles,” said General Manager Jim Benning. “Dan has been instrumental in the development of our goaltending prospects over the past four seasons and will now work with our NHL team on a daily basis in his new role.”

“We are also very pleased to have Rollie continue to work closely with our talented, young goaltending prospects. His hard work over the past six years contributed significantly to our franchise having some of the best goaltenders in the NHL. With both Dan and Rollie, we’re confident our goaltending will continue to be a position of strength for the future.”

Cloutier joins Head Coach Willie Desjardins and the Canucks coaching staff full time after serving four seasons with Vancouver as Goaltending Consultant, Player Development. In that role, Cloutier worked primarily with AHL, junior, and college prospects in the Canucks system. During Cloutier’s tenure, Canucks prospect Thatcher Demko enjoyed a dominant 2015.16 season with Boston College, earning the 2016 Mike Richter Award as the most outstanding goaltender in NCAA men’s hockey. In the 2014.15 AHL season, Jacob Markstrom finished second overall in goals against average (1.88) and save percentage (.934). Prior to joining the Canucks, Cloutier served as goaltending consultant for the Barrie Colts.

A native of Mont-Laurier, Quebec, Cloutier was a member of the Vancouver Canucks, New York Rangers, Tampa Bay Lightning and Los Angeles Kings over a span of 10 NHL seasons, with a career record of 139-142-33, 15 shutouts and a 2.77 goals against average. In five seasons with the Canucks, Cloutier played in 208 games posting 109-68-23 record, 14 shutouts and a 2.42 goals against average.

In his new role, Melanson will work in a development capacity with prospects in Utica and in the college and junior ranks after six seasons as goaltending coach for the Canucks. Under his guidance, the Canucks enjoyed sustained success in the crease. Melanson’s first season as goaltending coach saw Roberto Luongo and Cory Schneider combine to win the William M. Jennings Trophy with a league-low 2.20 goals against average. Prior to joining the Canucks, Melanson was an Assistant Coach with the Montreal Canadiens from 1997 to 2009, an Assistant Coach and Goaltending Coach for the QMJHL Moncton Wildcats from 1995 to 1997, and a goaltending consultant with the AHL St. John Flames from 1993 to 1995.

The first New Brunswick-born goaltender to play in the NHL, Melanson logged 12 NHL seasons with the New York Islanders, Minnesota North Stars, New York Rangers, Los Angeles Kings, New Jersey Devils and Montreal Canadiens posting a record of 129-106-33 as well as six shutouts. Melanson’s playing career is highlighted by three Stanley Cup championships (1981, 1982 and 1983) as a member of the New York Islanders.

 

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On 3/25/2016 at 3:03 PM, ButcherG said:

Its a lot of maybe when you look at Cloutier turning into a good coach. Same with Smyl, same with Vigneault for that matter. None of these guys have ever won a cup.

 

Yes all of them are great guys, but they have never won. This is the inherent problem I see.

 

If you want to create a winner, go out and get winners. They know what it takes to win.

 

Yes the Gretzky experiment failed in Arizona. He never had the pieces to win anything. Vigneault did in Van and NY, and he will never win. Who is the better coach ultimately? Vigneault because he has won more hockey games, but big woop no cup. At least Gretzky has cups from his playing days.

 

My point is go out and get people who have a pedigree for winning cups. From your scouts, to your coaches to your gm. They should all know what it takes to win. Especially when your franchise has never won in its history.

 

Cloutier could become the greatest goalie coach in history. I just wouldn't bet the farm on it, or anything for that matter.

 

 

 

 

Sather was a pretty good coach.  He also was a checker without a ring.  Go figure.  What about Bowman?

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On 4/13/2016 at 7:13 PM, ButcherG said:

Alright fair enough.

 

I am letting my bias come through, I really really am irked about Cloutier, and the lost chances we had when he played here.

 

I am more upset with Burke for keeping him and failing at stopping the goalie graveyard, and it seems wherever Burke goes the goalie grave yard does too.

 

Cloutier was a respectable player in the regular season, but in the playoffs where the games genuinely matter, he has posted a goalie worst for save percentage.

 

When I look at the careers of Naslund Bertuzzi Morrison Jovo, Ohlund et al, I can only help but wish they had a competent goaltender to let them have a chance at a legacy here in Van. Instead they have no legacy but, "we choked."

 

It is not possible for me to forget how terrible Cloutier was in the playoffs. I guess I cannot let it go, I just can't.

 

My opinion is that I would prefer Cloutier coaching somewhere else. I don't want him touching our players on any level.

 

 

 

 

It definitely looked like bitterness was the source of your opinion.

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59 minutes ago, Deets said:

Looks like Rollie is sticking with the Canucks in a different role.

 

Very excited to see Melanson is sticking with us. Between him and Cloutier our future goalie factory will be full steam ahead!

 

 

We need two goalie coaches?  I suppose one is for long-term development and the other is for day-to-day stuff on the big team?

And, btw, what do goalie coaches do, mostly work on positioning and fitness?  I don't know the position at all -- any ex-goalies out there who can help us?

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3 hours ago, gameburn said:

We need two goalie coaches?  I suppose one is for long-term development and the other is for day-to-day stuff on the big team?

And, btw, what do goalie coaches do, mostly work on positioning and fitness?  I don't know the position at all -- any ex-goalies out there who can help us?

Yea Cloutier will work on the day to day stuff with Markstrom and Miller. Just pointing out little things that might be wrong with their game and help them practice and work out.

 

Melanson will probably be focused on helping develop Demko and Garteig's game in the long term. It's a position where he doesn't need to be there every day. Maybe he comes in once every week or so just to practice, talk things over, and give any pointers.

 

Glad we were able to keep him though, he would be hard to replace. I remember when we lost Ian Clarke, Luongo was not happy. His game seemed to suffer a bit without him until we got Melanson. So goalie coaches obviously do have value to goalies.

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1 minute ago, DeNiro said:

Yea Cloutier will work on the day to day stuff with Markstrom and Miller. Just pointing out little things that might be wrong with their game and help them practice and work out.

 

Melanson will probably be focused on helping develop Demko and Garteig's game in the long term. It's a position where he doesn't need to be there every day. Maybe he comes in once every week or so just to practice, talk things over, and give any pointers.

 

Glad we were able to keep him though, he would be hard to replace. I remember when we lost Ian Clarke, Luongo was not happy. His game seemed to suffer a bit without him until we got Melanson. So goalie coaches obviously do have value to goalies.

Interesting, thanks. 

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On 14/04/2016 at 6:36 AM, Law of Goalies said:

Wow thank you.

 

There are only a select few on this board who understands that during the Naslund/Bert years, we had great offence but we had one of the worst defences.  Jovo had zero defensive capabilities but he made it up with his great offensive awareness.  Naslund and Bert floated in the defensive zone.  If people actually watched all the games that Clouts played, he was hung out to dry at least 7/10 times he was scored on (maybe a bit lower percentage but you get my point).  As for Playoffs, not every goalie necessarily succeed.  To be honest, it took Lu around 2-3 season being on the Canucks to finally get past the 1st round.

 

In relation to Butcher stating that a person who has a good winning history will eventually be a good coach because he has a good mentality and knows how to succeed is partially true.  People who were born with talent like Gretzky will never be able to coach because it came so naturally to him, he wouldn't know how to teach it.  Therefore you need to find a person who has success but also worked super hard for it.  It is really hard to find.  It also applies to education.  I was taught Calculus and Corporate Law by two so called "geniuses" but ended up learning more from the tutorials taught by "non-geniuses" because the geniuses were so smart they didn't know how to make us understand how it works as because for them, they don't need to think and already know how to do it.

Luongo Took us to the 2nd round his first year here. And was one of 2 or 3 players that showed up against the ducks

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