TheGuardian_ Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I skipped through some threads and still see talk about tanking. IMO tanking is something good teams do once they realize they aren't making the post season and then "do what is best for the franchise" to get the best young player they can. Looking at the Canuck's division and the western conference, what 6 teams will finish below the Canucks in the standings? How about the entire league? Next season's draft is more about players that can't help this team for 2 to 3 years, it is deep in defence men, there re no "super stars" out there. There might be some "all stars" though, but not the same number as the last four years the Nucks should have "tanked". Many posters here will reply that they think the Canucks will make the playoffs next year and that they don't care what anyone thinks, that none on the boards can possibly be as smart as the management team. They will ignore the other teams the club has to play and put huge emphasis on a game by game result or effort. Watch the playoffs, how many of our "Jane's" could out play some of those "Tarzan's" out there, is this team close to being ready? Forget the talk about tanking, this team's goal for the next 5 to 6 years will be trying to make the playoffs let alone getting past round one. This team will be selecting pretty much around where they are now for awhile. UNLESS, management has some cojones and does some RFA sheets on team's that can't match trades or makes very bold trades. No need to tank, they're there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Tanking is..............probably the most beaten to death subject on these boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Building Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 3 minutes ago, oldnews said: Tanking is..............probably the most beaten to death subject on these boards. And how is it done in May? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 I find it very hard to believe that Babcock coached his team to last place in the league. IMO, that is tanking. He even warned the fans at the beginning of the season to be prepared for the worst. Almost like he knew "the plan". Or, is Babcock even that good a coach? Has he benefited from years of coaching great Red Wings and Team Canada teams? Not sure EDM tanked, they're just incompetent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aircool Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 21 minutes ago, TheGuardian_ said: I skipped through some threads and still see talk about tanking. IMO tanking is something good teams do once they realize they aren't making the post season and then "do what is best for the franchise" to get the best young player they can. Looking at the Canuck's division and the western conference, what 6 teams will finish below the Canucks in the standings? How about the entire league? Next season's draft is more about players that can't help this team for 2 to 3 years, it is deep in defence men, there re no "super stars" out there. There might be some "all stars" though, but not the same number as the last four years the Nucks should have "tanked". Many posters here will reply that they think the Canucks will make the playoffs next year and that they don't care what anyone thinks, that none on the boards can possibly be as smart as the management team. They will ignore the other teams the club has to play and put huge emphasis on a game by game result or effort. Watch the playoffs, how many of our "Jane's" could out play some of those "Tarzan's" out there, is this team close to being ready? Forget the talk about tanking, this team's goal for the next 5 to 6 years will be trying to make the playoffs let alone getting past round one. This team will be selecting pretty much around where they are now for awhile. UNLESS, management has some cojones and does some RFA sheets on team's that can't match trades or makes very bold trades. No need to tank, they're there. I think most people would define tanking roughly as "intentionally not making improvements to your NHL team or making your NHL team worse for the sake of a better draft choice". Or something like that. While at the same time excluding instances where this occurs for the sake of asset management. It probably needs to be a somewhat unnecessary transaction, in the sense that you could have done it a year later or something. Just to nitpick your words a little, but I will promise you, there are people on this board who are SMARTER than people in Canucks Management. I'd put a lot of money down on that. But there is a difference between being smart, and having knowledge and experience. Professionals in any field aren't inherently smarter than people who are amateurs in that field, I mean billions of people are "professionals". The result of being a professional in a field, or at least a good one, is that you know things about your field that amateurs haven't put the time in to learn, and in the case of hockey they do things like extensive scouting/analytics that gives them further knowledge (that amateurs don't have) that they are more capable to utilize than an amateur... I know you probably realize this, but I get a little sick and tired of people saying to others on these forums, "Do you really think you are smarter than JB?"... I mean, he doesn't really seem THAT smart, he may be... we don't know him well, and aren't around him a lot. It's entirely possible that I could be smarter than JB, but I'd still rather have him running the Canucks... That doesn't mean that if I had a differing opinion to him that I'd be wrong. (This applies to a lot of people on this forum obviously...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tre Mac Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 34 minutes ago, Green Building said: And how is it done in May? Hightanking can be done in May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 59 minutes ago, TheGuardian_ said: Watch the playoffs, how many of our "Jane's" could out play some of those "Tarzan's" out there, is this team close to being ready? Wouldn't Batman and Robin be more appropriate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 1 hour ago, TheGuardian_ said: UNLESS, management has some cojones and does some RFA sheets on team's that can't match trades or makes very bold trades. No need to tank, they're there. I would like to see Benning do this with Seth Jones and Columbus. As you say, next years draft is considered to be a weak one, so if we gave up a 1st round pick as compensation who cares? Jones is worth it. He's got all the tools to be 1D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Building Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 16 minutes ago, Bob Long said: I would like to see Benning do this with Seth Jones and Columbus. As you say, next years draft is considered to be a weak one, so if we gave up a 1st round pick as compensation who cares? Jones is worth it. He's got all the tools to be 1D. I'm assuming you meant 1st round pick "in addition to further picks"? If the offer sheet amount is only enough for a 1st round pick to be the compensation then CBJ easily matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You Mad Bro? Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fateless Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Not really sure I understand the point of this thread. You title suggests a discussion on what the definition of tanking is, but your post just starts talking about how we failed at tanking and finishes saying we don't need to tank because we already tanked. Tanking is going beyond the natural course of things and intentionally making strategic decisions that will increase the chances of a team losing. Teams lose all the time, look at Edmonton for an example - they don't tank every year, they just lose a lot. There were a few games this year that I believed the Canucks were trying to tank (putting in players that didn't deserve ice-time over players that did, poor line combinations, etc), but some games we just lost because we were the worse team. With that said, what is the merit in discussing tanking at this point? We're going into the draft with an excellent pick and next year the team will look to gain experience and aim for the playoffs. This team is done tanking, they have enough pieces that they can develop a winning team in the future and fill any gaps they have via trades and free agency. This year was our one shot to "tank" as previously defined simply due to the strength of the this draft - we got 5th which will (hopefully) net us a future first liner or top pairing D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salacious Crumb Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 1 hour ago, oldnews said: Tanking is..............probably the most beaten to death subject on these boards. I see your Tanking and go all in on Asset Management. Good grief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuporbust Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Does first reply always get popular votes? I think so :| tanking means a team stops trying to win to get the best possible odds of drafting first. Ok, now that we established that , what are we talking about ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsMillerTime Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 Leafs tank. Sabres tanked in 2015. Canucks tank. Oilers seem like they tank but probably try not to. Arizona tanked 2015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Luxury Yacht Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 "Tanking" is a management tool to ice a team that is inferior to the mean, in order to improve their chance at a better draft pick. Buffalo tanked for Eichel. Toronto tanked last season. The Canucks didn't tank, here's why. We did not sell off our aging talent for picks. We would have been far more ready at the TDL if we were tanking. We will be a middling team for a few years, and I'm OK with that, as long as we are moving in the right direction....which I believe we are. Some will agree, some will disagree. I'll wait and see how our youth progress under the tutelage of the Sedins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 58 minutes ago, Green Building said: I'm assuming you meant 1st round pick "in addition to further picks"? If the offer sheet amount is only enough for a 1st round pick to be the compensation then CBJ easily matches. I was thinking in the 5.4 mil 1st and 3rd range. 5.4 to 7.3 is a 1st, 2nd and 3rd. If Benning did assess him as a true #1D though I think that might be worth it as well, if he's got the potential to be a Doughty-like player. Columbus is going to have somewhere between 3.5 to 5.5 mil in cap space depending on where the final cap numbers land later this year, so theoretically they can't match a big enough offer, but of course they can and then have to dump a contract. But who? and all GMs will have the knives out so they won't get anything in return for that player, not anything close to 3 picks. Personally if the draft is that weak then I'd like to see Benning go for it. He can recover some of the picks moving Edler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appleboy Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 They will have a chance to make the playoffs as long as the twins can play at a high level. Then look out. Unless they can replace them with UFA's we won't need to try and tank. I hope they draft Dubois or Brown. Brown has some risk but could bring huge reward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Building Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 7 minutes ago, Bob Long said: I was thinking in the 5.4 mil 1st and 3rd range. 5.4 to 7.3 is a 1st, 2nd and 3rd. If Benning did assess him as a true #1D though I think that might be worth it as well, if he's got the potential to be a Doughty-like player. Columbus is going to have somewhere between 3.5 to 5.5 mil in cap space depending on where the final cap numbers land later this year, so theoretically they can't match a big enough offer, but of course they can and then have to dump a contract. But who? and all GMs will have the knives out so they won't get anything in return for that player, not anything close to 3 picks. Personally if the draft is that weak then I'd like to see Benning go for it. He can recover some of the picks moving Edler. If JB hits a few dingers at the draft this year then losing a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd next year could be easier to swallow. I think it would take something freakish for us to finish bottom 5 again so I wouldn't be too worried about gifting a lottery pick CBJ's way. Let's say we offer 7.3. All they'd have to do is let Rene Bourque walk and they'd be able to match, if they were okay with shelling that kind of money out for whatever term JB applied to it. Or they could let him go, and we'd be stuck with a 7.3 million dollar question mark for several years in addition to moving the picks. If JB likes Jones then I'd like to see him kick the tires on a trade first if for nothing more than whatever he's signed for after arriving here would be more reflective of his current worth. I'm not sold on Jones one way or the other so from my perspective that's a lot of picks and cap to give up for an unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Sparkle Posted May 25, 2016 Share Posted May 25, 2016 tanking is when when you have a heavily armoured character to draw attention away from other enemies to protect your team. tanks normally depend on having high vitality and defense, and having buffs that increase their HP and defense and/or lowering the the enemies attack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted May 25, 2016 Share Posted May 25, 2016 Just now, Twilight Sparkle said: tanking is when when you have a heavily armoured character to draw attention away from other enemies to protect your team. tanks normally depend on having high vitality and defense, and having buffs that increase their HP and defense and/or lowering the the enemies attack I have ABDOLUTELY no clue what this means, but it sound fantastic. Plus for the cute unicorn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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