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[Trade] Canucks trade Jared McCann, 2nd-round pick, 4th-round pick to Panthers for Erik Gudbranson, 5th-round pick


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2 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/florida-panthers/erik-gudbranson-trade-proves-canucks-are-misguided/

 

As much as I love the idea of trading a prospect for a solid top-4 defenceman, the article bleeds truth. We need to use analytics more and start stepping away from this old school mentality of toughness wins hockey games and playoff games. Look at these playoffs - skill has completely predominated in the playoffs. Grit and toughness is nothing nowadays.

 

We need more puck movers on defence and more elite top end talent up front. Instead we're growing shutdown defencemen and two-way centers. That would have been fantastic for the 2007 playoffs or earlier but now the playoff games are won and lost by star centers/wingers, puck moving stud defencemen and lucky young goalies.

I disagree and so does Florida's writer:

http://www.litterboxcats.com/2016/5/27/11789054/erik-gudbranson-a-look-back-at-a-player-i-will-miss?utm_campaign=litterboxcats&utm_content=article%3Atop&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

 

From the Panthers writer;
This season, Gudbranson appeared to truly turn the corner, but he has never been liked, or perhaps understood, by the advanced statistics community. Simply put, his point totals are not worth discussing, and his possession numbers have always been negative. But to those watching for the little things this season, some points did become readily apparent.

Gudbranson only started 41% of his shifts in the offensive zone, and averaged 20 minutes of ice time per game. He dished out 150 hits and 73 blocked shots this season, and was only able to get off 73 shots. By contrast, Ekblad took 182 shots while averaging 21 minutes in ice time per night, but with a 55% offensive zone start rate. Its hard to put up possession numbers when every time you move a puck up in transition to offense you are swapped out. It was rare to see Gudbranson in the offensive zone. Instead, it was always him duking it out with the opponents top line and once transition began, he changed for a more offensive D-man.

But the trust was there. Gallant paired Gudbranson and Campbell roughly midway through last season, and Campbell flourished with the rough defender as a partner. They covered each other's weaknesses well. In this year's playoffs, Erik led all Panthers D-men in time on ice, at almost 27 minutes per night, and he started 71% of his shifts in the D-zone. By midway through the 1st round series, Gudbranson and Kulikov were the go-to D-pair for crucial moments against the Islanders.

 

Gudbranson's style suits the West a lot better than the East as well.

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1 hour ago, Boddy604 said:

The only thing I wonder about Lucic is if he does come to Vancouver, does Miller then request a trade? Miller is gone after this season anyways but it'd definitely create some dressing room drama I would think.

Who cares about Miller.  If he has a problem with it.  So long old man.   He isn't coming back the next year. We aren't winning this year.   Who needs him. We can always sign a cheap filler 

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3 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/florida-panthers/erik-gudbranson-trade-proves-canucks-are-misguided/

 

As much as I love the idea of trading a prospect for a solid top-4 defenceman, the article bleeds truth. We need to use analytics more and start stepping away from this old school mentality of toughness wins hockey games and playoff games. Look at these playoffs - skill has completely predominated in the playoffs. Grit and toughness is nothing nowadays.

 

We need more puck movers on defence and more elite top end talent up front. Instead we're growing shutdown defencemen and two-way centers. That would have been fantastic for the 2007 playoffs or earlier but now the playoff games are won and lost by star centers/wingers, puck moving stud defencemen and lucky young goalies.

neither they, nor you, have any idea what you're talking about.

 

pathetic attempt to prop that crap up as 'analytics'.

 

if you want a decent source regarding the Panthers - someone that actually has a clue - look at litterboxcats (edit - I see sampy has already helped you with this).

 

but thanks for coming out.

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1 hour ago, sampy said:

I disagree and so does Florida's writer:

http://www.litterboxcats.com/2016/5/27/11789054/erik-gudbranson-a-look-back-at-a-player-i-will-miss?utm_campaign=litterboxcats&utm_content=article%3Atop&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

 

From the Panthers writer;
This season, Gudbranson appeared to truly turn the corner, but he has never been liked, or perhaps understood, by the advanced statistics community. Simply put, his point totals are not worth discussing, and his possession numbers have always been negative. But to those watching for the little things this season, some points did become readily apparent.

Gudbranson only started 41% of his shifts in the offensive zone, and averaged 20 minutes of ice time per game. He dished out 150 hits and 73 blocked shots this season, and was only able to get off 73 shots. By contrast, Ekblad took 182 shots while averaging 21 minutes in ice time per night, but with a 55% offensive zone start rate. Its hard to put up possession numbers when every time you move a puck up in transition to offense you are swapped out. It was rare to see Gudbranson in the offensive zone. Instead, it was always him duking it out with the opponents top line and once transition began, he changed for a more offensive D-man.

But the trust was there. Gallant paired Gudbranson and Campbell roughly midway through last season, and Campbell flourished with the rough defender as a partner. They covered each other's weaknesses well. In this year's playoffs, Erik led all Panthers D-men in time on ice, at almost 27 minutes per night, and he started 71% of his shifts in the D-zone. By midway through the 1st round series, Gudbranson and Kulikov were the go-to D-pair for crucial moments against the Islanders.

 

Gudbranson's style suits the West a lot better than the East as well.

Good read, thanks for posting

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3 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/florida-panthers/erik-gudbranson-trade-proves-canucks-are-misguided/

 

As much as I love the idea of trading a prospect for a solid top-4 defenceman, the article bleeds truth. We need to use analytics more and start stepping away from this old school mentality of toughness wins hockey games and playoff games. Look at these playoffs - skill has completely predominated in the playoffs. Grit and toughness is nothing nowadays.

 

We need more puck movers on defence and more elite top end talent up front. Instead we're growing shutdown defencemen and two-way centers. That would have been fantastic for the 2007 playoffs or earlier but now the playoff games are won and lost by star centers/wingers, puck moving stud defencemen and lucky young goalies.

Hahaha.   You are clueless.  

Are you sure you haven't been watching the NBA playoffs?   

These games are rough as ever. 

 

 

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15 hours ago, Boddy604 said:

Lucic puts up 50+ every single year while also being a huge intimidation factor. Who cares if he gets suspended from time to time. After the Sedins, the next best forward for the Canucks was Horvat.

With 40 points.

Hate him all you want. He'd make the Canucks better.

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15 hours ago, Boddy604 said:

Lucic puts up 50+ every single year while also being a huge intimidation factor. Who cares if he gets suspended from time to time. After the Sedins, the next best forward for the Canucks was Horvat.

With 40 points.

Hate him all you want. He'd make the Canucks better.

Hate him?

 

Hardly

 

I'd hate that $6.75 million + contract he'd be bringing along at term.

 

There's a lucic thread for a reason, go to it.

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4 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/florida-panthers/erik-gudbranson-trade-proves-canucks-are-misguided/

 

As much as I love the idea of trading a prospect for a solid top-4 defenceman, the article bleeds truth. We need to use analytics more and start stepping away from this old school mentality of toughness wins hockey games and playoff games. Look at these playoffs - skill has completely predominated in the playoffs. Grit and toughness is nothing nowadays.

 

We need more puck movers on defence and more elite top end talent up front. Instead we're growing shutdown defencemen and two-way centers. That would have been fantastic for the 2007 playoffs or earlier but now the playoff games are won and lost by star centers/wingers, puck moving stud defencemen and lucky young goalies.

Absolutely we need high end skill. Upfront and on D. But not at the expense of physicality and match up mitigating / dominating options. This is not a contest of one, skill or toughess needing to be more prominent than the other. But striking the balance where you have either physical or speed and skill match ups to deploy. Some your opponent cannot handle.  And to be positioned to throwback what they have. You need both.

 

Your right in that we still do need a PMD. Who is wicked with the puck on his stick from our back end. But we have candidates for that in Stecher, Larsen & Subban to join Hutton. Who is starting to provide some of this. These are not blue chip guaranteed to be successful guys. We need more to step forward. Or break out. The ones we have are of a size they need to be sheltered from getting exposed to physical match ups. These guys need to be playing with guys like Gudbranson, who can clear the crease because they can not. 

 

Gudbranson is a great piece of the puzzle.  So we can concentrate on developing / sourcing the skill we also need on the blue line.

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2 hours ago, sampy said:

I disagree and so does Florida's writer:

http://www.litterboxcats.com/2016/5/27/11789054/erik-gudbranson-a-look-back-at-a-player-i-will-miss?utm_campaign=litterboxcats&utm_content=article%3Atop&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

 

From the Panthers writer;
This season, Gudbranson appeared to truly turn the corner, but he has never been liked, or perhaps understood, by the advanced statistics community. Simply put, his point totals are not worth discussing, and his possession numbers have always been negative. But to those watching for the little things this season, some points did become readily apparent.

Gudbranson only started 41% of his shifts in the offensive zone, and averaged 20 minutes of ice time per game. He dished out 150 hits and 73 blocked shots this season, and was only able to get off 73 shots. By contrast, Ekblad took 182 shots while averaging 21 minutes in ice time per night, but with a 55% offensive zone start rate. Its hard to put up possession numbers when every time you move a puck up in transition to offense you are swapped out. It was rare to see Gudbranson in the offensive zone. Instead, it was always him duking it out with the opponents top line and once transition began, he changed for a more offensive D-man.

But the trust was there. Gallant paired Gudbranson and Campbell roughly midway through last season, and Campbell flourished with the rough defender as a partner. They covered each other's weaknesses well. In this year's playoffs, Erik led all Panthers D-men in time on ice, at almost 27 minutes per night, and he started 71% of his shifts in the D-zone. By midway through the 1st round series, Gudbranson and Kulikov were the go-to D-pair for crucial moments against the Islanders.

 

Gudbranson's style suits the West a lot better than the East as well.

Great read. Thanks for sharing :)

Can it just be the beginning of October already!!!

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4 hours ago, terrible.dee said:

How exactly did he "lose it" with Vey? I don't recall Barchi being all that much better, just that Vey was the designated whipping boy and Sven wasn't,

 

With McCann gone, guess what? THE VEY STAYS!

 

And this season he's going to show the Bo-boy haters how to get 50 pts in the NHL

He lost with Vey because Vey sucks. plain and simple. 

 

Of course he stays, you think someone is going to trade for him? Why would anyone want to bring in a marignal player with all those off ice issues?

 

Another reason he lost the Vey trade is because JB didn't do his homework. It's been reported on 1040 that Canucks didn't know about Vey family's legal issues. You don't do you homework you fail. simple as that. 

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3 hours ago, Boddy604 said:

The only thing I wonder about Lucic is if he does come to Vancouver, does Miller then request a trade? Miller is gone after this season anyways but it'd definitely create some dressing room drama I would think.

What will happen is this.  In game 1 with lucic in our lineup someone bumps miller. Milan goes and beats the snot out of the guy

They become friends 

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5 hours ago, terrible.dee said:

Huh?

 

Are we watching the same thing? The playoffs have been physically brutal this year, everyone has been hitting everything that moves,

 

Guys like Kane disappeared in a hurry, I would say meanness rules the playoffs more than ever

???

 

7 points in 7 games is "disappearing in a hurry?"

 

Skill is still needed badly. The Hawks didn't lose, in 7 games no less, due to players like Panarin and Kane not stepping up. Those skilled players did their part.

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5 hours ago, terrible.dee said:

How exactly did he "lose it" with Vey? I don't recall Barchi being all that much better, just that Vey was the designated whipping boy and Sven wasn't,

 

With McCann gone, guess what? THE VEY STAYS!

 

And this season he's going to show the Bo-boy haters how to get 50 pts in the NHL

Designated whipping boy? As soon as a player is focused on by a coach or coaching staff he's turns into a whipping boy? Why can't people accept Vey just didn't get it done? He's soft to play against and gives up the puck far too often. Does that make a player a whipping boy or a player just struggling to take the next step?

Regardless Vey has not been good enough to stick. In reality he's got to come to camp and make big strides and make the players around him better. In Vey's defense the guy has a lot of distractions in his personal life that he has had little control of yet had to be primary during last season. I for one was very hard on Vey and maybe would have let up a little knowing what he's been dealing with off the ice. 

That said, his on ice performance still has to improve in more than one area. 

JB and Co. want to get bigger and I believe that transition will continue with Vey fighting for spots. By having the mantra of getting bigger and meaner as a group Vey will most likely have more competition before training camp starts. 

Vey might stay but he might well be headed back to the minors if JB adds more competition, which I think he will.

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5 hours ago, terrible.dee said:

Ohlund was no Konstantinov but made a decision later in his career, oddly enough, to start fighting,

 

I believe it was due to the fall out from his sometimes devastating hits, 

 

Hitting is a skill as much as it is a sign of aggressiveness, there are plenty of aggressive tough guys in the league who couldn't hit their way out of a paper bag, and at this point I don't know whether that's a skill Gudbranson posses,

 

Ohlund on the other hand had the Stevens-like instinct, modern day examples would be Emilin or Kronwall, guys who could see where people were going to be in 2 seconds and seemly without effort, be the magically appearing brick-wall they ran into.

 

It really is a skill, and I hope GB possesses it, a sure sign that someone DOESN'T have it is when you see them chasing people for hits, running around and getting a little piece of the guy as he skates away, those "Hits" are counted in the stats but they are meaningless, and more often than not put your own team at a disadvantage. 

 

I think Ohlund was the last monster hitter to play for this team, 

 

OH! BTW did you guys know Ohlund is still "officially" a member of the lightning? and is still required to go to all the home games?

Before their run was over, at every home game, Matty was there somewhere in the cheap seats

Good post, and I didn't know that about Ohlund, but Raffi Torres was on the team after Mattias left. He didn't know how to hit without crossing the line sometimes (most times?), but he crushed people nonetheless.

 

Doesn't mean I liked him more than Ohlund though, I didn't.

 

 

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For those debating on what it takes to win a cup these days, I firmly believe there is no one formula for constructing a team to winning it all, as we have seen both big, physical teams in the Bruins and Kings win in recent years and the smaller, more skill oriented team in the Hawks and Penguins win. If the Sharks win this year, they are kind of a hybrid of the two. I believe Benning will eventually achieve his goal of constructing a club which he thinks is suitable to winning in today's NHL and I think he is doing a decent job at it so far. The Canucks are lacking many pieces as we all know, but improving the size and physicality of the club is a good start as this team has been too small and too weak for too long. 

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3 minutes ago, Pickly said:

For those debating on what it takes to win a cup these days, I firmly believe there is no one formula for constructing a team to winning it all, as we have seen both big, physical teams in the Bruins and Kings win in recent years and the smaller, more skill oriented team in the Hawks and Penguins win. If the Sharks win this year, they are kind of a hybrid of the two. I believe Benning will eventually achieve his goal of constructing a club which he thinks is suitable to winning in today's NHL and I think he is doing a decent job at it so far. The Canucks are lacking many pieces as we all know, but improving the size and physicality of the club is a good start as this team has been too small and too weak for too long. 

I think the Sharks would be considered both big and physical.  They have a lot of huge guys, who play in straight lines.  Even their smaller guys play that straight line game.  I'm cheering for the Penguins though.  I hate the Sharks - I heard they have a rat and a weasel, who both kind of smell.  :lol:

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  • -Vintage Canuck- changed the title to [Trade] Canucks trade Jared McCann, 2nd-round pick, 4th-round pick to Panthers for Erik Gudbranson, 5th-round pick

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