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[Disscussion] Is Tanev Now In Play?

TheGuardian_

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TheGuardian_ Canucks Second-Line

TheGuardian_

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Well, they trade for a meaner, less skilled version of Tanev. The trade off between the two is one plays more of a "contain" style of defence, the other is more like "reach out and touch" contact defence.

 

After the World's, Tanev may now be overvalued.

 

Tanev is a very good defenceman, the point totals between the two are similar, neither is going to run the offence.

Tanev's very reasonable salary and cap number AND enhanced stats make him maybe one of the top defensive dmen in the league.

 

I would think that there are 20+ teams that would like to have Tanev.

 

Tryamkin looked very good and ready for a top 4 spot so is this trade so the team will ultimately upgrade the scoring by moving Tanev?

 

IMHO, Tanev may be the best trade asset the Canucks could afford to lose without crippling the team.

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OptionalPants Abbotsford Prospect

OptionalPants

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11 minutes ago, TheGuardian_ said:

 

 

IMHO, Tanev may be the best trade asset the Canucks could afford to lose without crippling the team.

Tanev is the only d-man they could move that would absolutely cripple the team. Edler is too inconsistent, Gudbranson has never played top 2 minutes and struggled just as a 4th defenceman on Florida, Hutton is still developing. There is absolutely no one on the team that could possibly replace Tanev if he was traded. However, if Benning actually wanted to do a rebuild, now would definitely be the ideal time to trade away Tanev in order to get a maximum return.

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Rick Blight Canucks Third-Line

Rick Blight

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1 minute ago, J.R. said:

They've already been replaced by trading for Gudbranson.

I view Gudbranson as a replacement for a RHD such as Weber. Hamhuis could potentially be the LHD replacement for Edler/Sbisa if management is not comfortable with the depth on that side going in to training camp. But I understand what you are saying....

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aGENT Canucks Hall-of-Famer

aGENT

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11 minutes ago, Rick Blight said:

I view Gudbranson as a replacement for a RHD such as Weber. Hamhuis could potentially be the LHD replacement for Edler/Sbisa if management is not comfortable with the depth on that side going in to training camp. But I understand what you are saying....

It's about roles, not left or right. 

 

By all means it's FANTASTIC that he also helps balance out our L/R imbalance but the key is what role he can play in our top 4. 

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tyhee Canucks Rookie

tyhee

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1 hour ago, TheGuardian_ said:

Well, they trade for a meaner, less skilled version of Tanev.  ...

No, they didn't.  Other than starting most of the time in the defensive zone and not scoring much, there is next to no similarity between the games of Tanev and Gudbranson.  Perhaps it isn't a surprise that two players who contribute so little offensively start most of the time in the defensive zone. 

 

One plays a game that suppresses shots and goals by the opposition.  The other doesn't.  Gudbranson's stats for suppressing goals, shots and shot attempts are poor.   Tanev is a shutdown defenceman, Gudbrandson most decidedly is not.  Check some stats from stats.hockeyanalysis.com for 2015-16.

 

Gudbranson:  GA60 2.06, 7th on the defence of the Panthers, who were a good team.

                       Shots Against per 60 min 31.45, 9th among 10 d-men on the Panthers.

                       Fenwick Against per 60 (unblocked shot attempts) 43.61, 7th on the Panthers

                       Corsi (shot attempts) per 60 54.41, 9th on the Panthers defence.

 

Tanev:           GA60 2.18, worse than Gudbranson but 3rd on the Canucks as they were as a team allowing far more goals.

                      Tanev's GA60TelTM was a good -.22.

                      Shots against per 60 min 25.12, best on the Canucks.

                      Fenwick (unblocked shot attempts) against per 60:  35.13, best on the Canucks

                     Corsi (shot attempts) Against per 60: 50.81, best on the Canucks.

 

One of them is a shutdown defenceman.  The other isn't.

 

That's isn't to say that Gudbranson doesn't bring something to the table.  He does.  He just should not in any manner be confused with Chris Tanev.  (It should be pointed out that Gudbranson's regular season stats this season were worse than they've been the couple of seasons before that and he's probably a better player than the 2015-16 stats indicate.  Nevertheless, he's a long way from being Chris Tanev quality defensively.)

 

J.R. has suggested Edler or Sbisa could be in .  To concentrate on one of those possibilities, Sbisa doesn't have a ntc and could well be relegated to 3rd pair duty now.  Even on the third pairing there are other guys who can provide physicality and probably play at a similar level-Tryamkin, for example, who can play either side comfortably.  As things stand at present I could easily see a defensive group of Edler-Tanev; Hutton-Gudbranson, Tryamkin-Biega or Larsen with Pedan as the 8th d-man.  If Benning were to bring back Hamhuis then there's even more quality on the depth chart that can play in the top 4-a defensive alighment of Edler-Tanev; Hamhuis-Gudbranson; Hutton-Tryamkin (or some other set of pairings for those 6) with Biega, Larsen and Pedan in reserve looks adequate to me despite the shortage of an all-star quality player at the top end.   The problem would be offence and that isn't Sbisa's strength.

 

Further, with Sbisa having had a better (although shortened) year and certainly better stats than he has in the past, his value may be relatively high right now.  A year ago I thought is salary was an impediment to moving him but his play and stats this past season might entice another GM to give up some value for him.

 

 

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Alflives Canucks Hall-of-Famer

Alflives

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6 minutes ago, tyhee said:

No, they didn't.  Other than starting most of the time in the defensive zone and not scoring much, there is next to no similarity between the games of Tanev and Gudbranson.  Perhaps it isn't a surprise that two players who contribute so little offensively start most of the time in the defensive zone. 

 

One plays a game that suppresses shots and goals by the opposition.  The other doesn't.  Gudbranson's stats for suppressing goals, shots and shot attempts are poor.   Tanev is a shutdown defenceman, Gudbrandson most decidedly is not.  Check some stats from stats.hockeyanalysis.com for 2015-16.

 

Gudbranson:  GA60 2.06, 7th on the defence of the Panthers, who were a good team.

                       Shots Against per 60 min 31.45, 9th among 10 d-men on the Panthers.

                       Fenwick Against per 60 (unblocked shot attempts) 43.61, 7th on the Panthers

                       Corsi (shot attempts) per 60 54.41, 9th on the Panthers defence.

 

Tanev:           GA60 2.18, worse than Gudbranson but 3rd on the Canucks as they were as a team allowing far more goals.

                      Tanev's GA60TelTM was a good -.22.

                      Shots against per 60 min 25.12, best on the Canucks.

                      Fenwick (unblocked shot attempts) against per 60:  35.13, best on the Canucks

                     Corsi (shot attempts) Against per 60: 50.81, best on the Canucks.

 

One of them is a shutdown defenceman.  The other isn't.

 

That's isn't to say that Gudbranson doesn't bring something to the table.  He does.  He just should not in any manner be confused with Chris Tanev.  (It should be pointed out that Gudbranson's regular season stats this season were worse than they've been the couple of seasons before that and he's probably a better player than the 2015-16 stats indicate.  Nevertheless, he's a long way from being Chris Tanev quality defensively.)

 

J.R. has suggested Edler or Sbisa could be in .  To concentrate on one of those possibilities, Sbisa doesn't have a ntc and could well be relegated to 3rd pair duty now.  Even on the third pairing there are other guys who can provide physicality and probably play at a similar level-Tryamkin, for example, who can play either side comfortably.  As things stand at present I could easily see a defensive group of Edler-Tanev; Hutton-Gudbranson, Tryamkin-Biega or Larsen with Pedan as the 8th d-man.  If Benning were to bring back Hamhuis then there's even more quality on the depth chart that can play in the top 4-a defensive alighment of Edler-Tanev; Hamhuis-Gudbranson; Hutton-Tryamkin (or some other set of pairings for those 6) with Biega, Larsen and Pedan in reserve looks adequate to me despite the shortage of an all-star quality player at the top end.   The problem would be offence and that isn't Sbisa's strength.

 

Further, with Sbisa having had a shortened but better year (and certainly better stats) than he has in the past, his value may be relatively high right now.  A year ago I thought is salary was the next thing to a no-trade-clause, but his play and stats this past season might entice another GM to give up some value for him.

 

 

Why is JB saying publicly that Gudbrandson is a shut down guy?  

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TheGuardian_ Canucks Second-Line

TheGuardian_

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My thought behind mentioning Tanev is the team is not going to trade a Sbisa for an O'Reilly, or Kadri?

 

There are not very many GM's out there that will trade their cow for magic beans. Meaning, if the team wants a top scoring young forward they will have to trade "apples for apples".

 

Now any dman as solid as Tanev is worth more one to one than all but the "super star" class of forward.

 

Edler, Edler, Edler, he is in the second year of a NTC, has had a few injuries in the last couple of years. Just had a kid. Forget that ship, it's sailed.

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Warhippy Canucks Hall-of-Famer

Warhippy

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23 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Why is JB saying publicly that Gudbrandson is a shut down guy?  

Why did JB publicly say that McCaan was so soil, a future top 6 guy?

 

Why did GM X tell everyone coach Y was safe then fire him

 

Why did GM X tell player Y that he had his vote of confidence then trade him

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Alflives Canucks Hall-of-Famer

Alflives

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Just now, Warhippy said:

Why did JB publicly say that McCaan was so soil, a future top 6 guy?

 

Why did GM X tell everyone coach Y was safe then fire him

 

Why did GM X tell player Y that he had his vote of confidence then trade him

It's political spin?

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