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[Report] Insider claims team has borrowed $300m from the NHL, relocation imminent


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2 minutes ago, Kragar said:

 

Hidden in the sarcasm is a fair point, though.  IIRC, QC is even more French than Montreal, and it can be a big change for some people to deal with the new language barrier.  Does anyone know whether QC schools teach any classes in English (aside from English, of course)?  That could be a huge deal for kids who are partway through schooling and have no exposure to French.  I suppose there are probably private schools that teach all classes in English if there aren't any public schools that would.  I dunno... I haven't heard the experiences of non-francophone players going to MTL and how their families fare.  Maybe it works out just fine.

 

FWIW,  Wisniewski is the only NMC on the team.  Jordan Staal and Hainsey have some level of NTC, as well.

Oui.. . Dey eight da hinglish dere heh! Hinglish school, it sticky wit da pepsi bomb, you know, we chrow dem. Hawhawhaw. Oui!

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Holy Scheisse, I can't tell if any of these figures overlap, but from reading various reports & rumours Karmanos owes:

 

-$300 mill to the NHL

-$100 mill to his sons' trust fund

-$22 mill to his minority stake investors.

 

....and yet somehow through all that the guy is trying to sell a majority stake of the team whle still functionally being in charge.

 

The NHL sure knows how to pick 'em

 

So I guess the Carolina -> QC rumours that started a few months ago were legit and they were trying to keep things quiet, but the sons' lawsuit that was filed a week or so ago was the final straw. Wouldn't be surprised to see this move quickly.

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Carolina will relocate to Quebec.

 

Vegas will get an expansion team placing them in the Pacific.

 

And another expansion team will happen in the West. If they are placed in the Pacific, I can see Arizona moving to the Central.

 

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1 hour ago, The Bookie said:

Holy Scheisse, I can't tell if any of these figures overlap, but from reading various reports & rumours Karmanos owes:

 

-$300 mill to the NHL

-$100 mill to his sons' trust fund

-$22 mill to his minority stake investors.

 

....and yet somehow through all that the guy is trying to sell a majority stake of the team whle still functionally being in charge.

 

The NHL sure knows how to pick 'em

 

So I guess the Carolina -> QC rumours that started a few months ago were legit and they were trying to keep things quiet, but the sons' lawsuit that was filed a week or so ago was the final straw. Wouldn't be surprised to see this move quickly.

The guy sounds like the classic business slime.  Not to be trusted!  God.  He stole from his own children!  Betman should force the guy to sell 100% of his team.  Why do we keep hearing crap about the NHL that makes the league look lower level?  Does it really deserve to be included with NFL, MLB, and NBA as one of the big four North American leagues any more?  

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41 minutes ago, Alflives said:

The guy sounds like the classic business slime.  Not to be trusted!  God.  He stole from his own children!  Betman should force the guy to sell 100% of his team.  Why do we keep hearing crap about the NHL that makes the league look lower level?  Does it really deserve to be included with NFL, MLB, and NBA as one of the big four North American leagues any more?  

Contrast all that with their treatment of Balsillie, when he vainly tried to get into their nasty, small-minded, elite coterie. Lucky for him,(now appears) the bloke didn't know the secret handshake.

 

They would re-sculpt all the dunes in Arizona's desert by hand, if it meant blocking a decent business-person from inclusion.

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This is what I've been saying for the last two months :-) (check the thread Carolina moving to Quebec). 

 

I live in Quebec city and the mood is a bit crazy in town this week. People are getting a bit anxious. Some people are pretty mad at the NHL over the news that we won't get an expansion team, others are sure we're getting the Hurricanes. My opinion is the NHL can't ignore a partner paying them 120 millions per year through TVA Sports... We'll get a team one way or the other. Maybe not this year but it will come.

 

Can't wait to see my Nordiques crush the Habs again. That will be fun!!!! It's been too long.

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14 hours ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

When two mtn ranges catch fire, you've got to start divvying the choppers & fire-fighters. Hopefully there's a big body of water nearby. Hope the Desert & toilet-swirls are the first 2 of more US dominoes. Tired of their half-empty dump-bldgs, that only start to fill when they start to win.

 

& goodness, them pine beetles have turned everything brown & dead. They look/act like Buttman!  :^)

I hope you condemn vancouver just as harshly in 3 or 4 years if they haven't improved much, because they'll be lucky to put 14000 butts in the seats just like the late 90s. 

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6 hours ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Contrast all that with their treatment of Balsillie, when he vainly tried to get into their nasty, small-minded, elite coterie. Lucky for him,(now appears) the bloke didn't know the secret handshake.

 

They would re-sculpt all the dunes in Arizona's desert by hand, if it meant blocking a decent business-person from inclusion.

I hope you're not counting balsillie as a "decent business-person". if he had succeeded in bulldozing his own back door entrance to the nhl ownership club, whatever team he got his hands on would have already been sold and most likely relocated again. because his company failed and his networth dropped from multibillionaire to couple-hundred-millionaire. 

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8 hours ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Contrast all that with their treatment of Balsillie, when he vainly tried to get into their nasty, small-minded, elite coterie. Lucky for him,(now appears) the bloke didn't know the secret handshake.

 

They would re-sculpt all the dunes in Arizona's desert by hand, if it meant blocking a decent business-person from inclusion.

Yup.  It's a Gong show of old boys playing with toys many of them can't afford.  I wonder if it's a house of cards, one storm, and it all comes down?

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16 hours ago, ForsbergTheGreat said:

"Under Bettman, the NHL has seen rapid growth of league revenues, from $400 million when he was hired to over $3.0 billion." I would say he's handling the business side just fine. 

 

 

And how is that in relation to the other 3 major sports in North America?  Has the NHL gained any ground versus Baseball, Basketball, or Football?  My Grandmas house has increased from $220k to $1.4mil over that time does that mean she is a cunning investor with immaculate home improvement skills?  No. 

 

Fact is even with the 'magical' run of Stanley Cup winners in Dallas, Anaheim, Tampa Bay, and Carolina the league is still struggling to fill seats in those arenas.  And let's re-visit 'The Big Shot' documentary where Bettman sold a franchise to a con artist with a fax machine.  The fact that Bettman wasn't thrown out of the league as soon as that happened reinstates my opinion that this league is in fact run by morons.  It's cheaper to go to a panther game than it is to park your car at a Canucks game yet where does some of the Canucks revenue go to?  Struggling American teams like the Panthers.  It's this artificial demand that leads the masses to believe tripe like 'increased revenue.'  I bet Sportsnet wishes it could back out of that TV deal now.

 

 

 

 

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Have to agree with most of what has been stated on here for sure, especially the "falsified" revenue records (as Tre Mac pointed out above). This corporate trick has been played out thousands of times (mainly to boost market values and get CEO's/CFO's their multi million dollar bonuses)...I should try it next time I go for a mortgage...it goes like this:

I make 100K / yr. I then turn around and pay my wife 50K / yr to take care of the house. Therefore my gross income is 150K / yr (my 100 + my wife's 50). Some of the teams receive transfer funds from the wealthy teams, therefore the revenue is counted twice. Don't think for a second that the league is doing nearly as well as they report.

As for moving Carolina to PQ: I'd be a bit disappointed as I enjoy games there when I visit (last Canucks game I saw live was in Raleigh...paid about $130 for 2 centre-ice 1st balcony tickets + premier parking...we walked 50ft to the main entrance). Same as Phoenix...cheap cheap cheap to go to a game there. But then again, I guess it's part of the same problem. And for the kids of the players making the move? Yes, there are plenty of English private schools...but the bigger issue for the players will be the crazy tax increase. When we lived in Virginia we paid about 12K / yr less taxes versus living in Alberta...and Alberta is supposed to be a cheap tax province! Can't imagine how much a player will lose paying taxes to PQ!

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47 minutes ago, ABNuck said:

Have to agree with most of what has been stated on here for sure, especially the "falsified" revenue records (as Tre Mac pointed out above). This corporate trick has been played out thousands of times (mainly to boost market values and get CEO's/CFO's their multi million dollar bonuses)...I should try it next time I go for a mortgage...it goes like this:

I make 100K / yr. I then turn around and pay my wife 50K / yr to take care of the house. Therefore my gross income is 150K / yr (my 100 + my wife's 50). Some of the teams receive transfer funds from the wealthy teams, therefore the revenue is counted twice. Don't think for a second that the league is doing nearly as well as they report.

As for moving Carolina to PQ: I'd be a bit disappointed as I enjoy games there when I visit (last Canucks game I saw live was in Raleigh...paid about $130 for 2 centre-ice 1st balcony tickets + premier parking...we walked 50ft to the main entrance). Same as Phoenix...cheap cheap cheap to go to a game there. But then again, I guess it's part of the same problem. And for the kids of the players making the move? Yes, there are plenty of English private schools...but the bigger issue for the players will be the crazy tax increase. When we lived in Virginia we paid about 12K / yr less taxes versus living in Alberta...and Alberta is supposed to be a cheap tax province! Can't imagine how much a player will lose paying taxes to PQ!

But they can make more by doing publicity. Subban is in a Boston Pizza commercial on TV in Quebec. Gallagher has a burger and Petry a poutine named after them in McDonald. Don't think they are doing it for peanuts so I don't buy the high taxes argument.


http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/p-k-subban-boston-pizza-french-montreal-canadiens-delivery-attention-louis-morissette-commercial-ad/

 

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3 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

And how is that in relation to the other 3 major sports in North America?  Has the NHL gained any ground versus Baseball, Basketball, or Football?  My Grandmas house has increased from $220k to $1.4mil over that time does that mean she is a cunning investor with immaculate home improvement skills?  No. 

 

Fact is even with the 'magical' run of Stanley Cup winners in Dallas, Anaheim, Tampa Bay, and Carolina the league is still struggling to fill seats in those arenas.  And let's re-visit 'The Big Shot' documentary where Bettman sold a franchise to a con artist with a fax machine.  The fact that Bettman wasn't thrown out of the league as soon as that happened reinstates my opinion that this league is in fact run by morons.  It's cheaper to go to a panther game than it is to park your car at a Canucks game yet where does some of the Canucks revenue go to?  Struggling American teams like the Panthers.  It's this artificial demand that leads the masses to believe tripe like 'increased revenue.'  I bet Sportsnet wishes it could back out of that TV deal now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

No offence but you sound like someone who’s got nothing better to do than complain.  Every time facebook makes an update it’s the “I’m done using this site blah blah blah”. Or after the lockout is was “I’ll never watch another NHL game” only for ratings to sky rocket since.

 

Whether you want to believe Bettman has grown the game or not is your right to do so, but it’s also based on your personal opinion that goes against all the facts.

 

Bettman has brought the league a ton of exposure, He’s doubled television ratings moving from ABC and EPSN to singing major deal with OLN and NBC Universal.  It’s been nothing be a complete success in making those moves.  The NHL is also taking full advantage of new marketing vehicles (YouTube, instagram, live streamed games, updated website with game highlights).  He’s also marketed big events to give hockey even more exposure, Winter classics’s, NHL awards and now the World Cup and even updates to the allstar games.  All these things help non fans discover the sport of hockey and new fans create growth and growth equals higher revenues. 

 

Winning creates revenue.   Vancouver goes from one of the longest sellout streaks (while winning) to being unable to fill seat in it’s first poor season in 5 years.  Maybe Vancouver isn’t a hockey market? Just imagine what the stands would look like if we have a string of oilers type years.  For a hockey market, Vancouver isn’t even in the top 5 for revenue. In fact 7 of the top 10 teams are American teams and all three Californian teams (who people said would never be a hockey market) are ahead of two Canadian teams….who would have thought that 20 years ago. 

 

NHL wants growth.  Not a redistribution of funds.  Putting another team in TO doesn’t create growth, it doesn’t attract new fans, it just moves money from one fan base to another.  The problem is people get so caught up on ticket sales when TV revenue plays a major importance.  TV revenue comes from advertisements, advertisements value comes from the amount of people that are watching.  Canada has a population of 30 million, US has 330 million.  People in Canada already are watching hockey, there’s not a lot of room for NHL growth.  A Canadian market can stabilize a poor franchise, but it doesn’t bring in growth.  Growth is what makes a business go from 400 million revenue to 3 billion. 

 

Meanwhile Ticket sales will fluctuate depending on the success of a team (even in a Canadian market), Ticket sales will fluctuate depending on a Canadian $ (it wasn’t that long ago Vancouver and Calgary were on the brink of moving).  And TV revenues...well TV revenues get locked in for 12 years.

 

Think of a franchise like McDonalds, not every location is going to work and sometimes spots get shut down, but that doesn't mean you don't stop looking for new opportunities.  If all these change haters had it there way, we'd still have only 6 eastern teams and a ton of talent would go elsewhere and the NHL would fail to draw in the best player. 

 

New locations take time to work and time to settle into a market.  It takes a new generation to be brought up into hockey.  Demko grew up watching the Kings,  Gostisbehere grew up watching the Panthers, This year we have Matthews grew up watching Briere in Phoenix, Chychrun who grew up in florida, and Tkachuk also born in Arizona.  These are all players born in non-traditional hockey markets with a  trong possibility of only one or two Canadian born players being selection in the top 10 in the 2016 draft.  Expanding the markets doesn’t just help grow revenues, it also helps grow the talent. 

 

So complain all you want about how you feel he’s watering down the sport or running a terrible business, but the financials show that he’s down a pretty decent job.  The majority of the fans think the sport of hockey is as exciting as ever and the NHL could care less if they lose Tre Mac as a fan because of an expansion team.  Odds are you’ll still watch (while complaining) and the leauge will gain even more "new" fans from the new market.

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On 6/8/2016 at 3:06 PM, DeltaSwede said:

I don't care if they have won a cup or not, move that team out of there, while you're at it move Arizona too.

 

Not really into this whole expansion talk either it would just water down the talent of the league and that's not good for anyone other than fringe NHL players.

 

Moving Carolina to Vegas, although no guarantees of success, would atleast balance the freaking conferences. HOW ARE THERE UNEVEN CONFERENCES TO BEGIN WITH!? (had to put it in caps because it's so ridiculous)

 

NHL... jesus christ man, it's simple. Hockey shouldn't be a gimmick. Why do we have uneven conferences? why is the world cup a thing with U-23 teams and team europe? Why can't we just be? Why does it always have to be some twisted awkward way of conducting business? 

I agree with your first 2 paragraphs but I do not see the problem with uneven conferences.

What does it matter?

The NHL had 21 teams at one point and 27, what is the big deal with even conferences?

There are more teams in the East, the travel is farther in the West.

The teams in the East sleep in their own beds more often than the teams in the West.

 

Of all the things wrong with the NHL, and I think there are plenty, uneven conferences is of very low importance.

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On 6/9/2016 at 10:34 AM, ForsbergTheGreat said:

 

 

So complain all you want about how you feel he’s watering down the sport or running a terrible business, but the financials show that he’s down a pretty decent job.  The majority of the fans think the sport of hockey is as exciting as ever and the NHL could care less if they lose Tre Mac as a fan because of an expansion team.  Odds are you’ll still watch (while complaining) and the leauge will gain even more "new" fans from the new market.

You make some great points too FTG- it's fairly easy to get caught up in the minutiae of what we don't like about the game but overall Bettman could leave tomorrow knowing he's held up his end of the bargain admirably. But Tre Mac does have a point to make about non traditional markets- you said yourself that even McDonalds closes the occasional franchise, in what reality has propping up Phoenix been a good reality ? I hardly think it's been worth it just to spawn Austin Matthews. I think the point that many miss when discussing Bettman and his potential legacy though is that he's merely the face of the ownership groups- he's not the one pulling the strings or making the decisions to move or keep franchises. And for those of us old enough to remember, he's not anti-Canadian either, he started the revenue sharing plan started in the late 90's to assist small market Canadian teams who were struggling (one of which of course being Vancouver).  

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