Olli Juolevi | #48 | D

[Noble 6]

I thought Juolevi showed really well in his one game against the Wild. In his limited minutes he made some nice passes, defended well and didn't look out of place. Combine that with the good reviews of his practice habits in the bubble and it's looking good. I have him penciled in on the 3rd pairing ahead of Benn:

 

Hughes - ________

Edler - Myers

Juolevi - _________

Benn, Rafferty

 

That's how I see the defense core for next year. We don't know who will be in those two RD spots. It could be any of Tanev, Stetcher, a UFA or an acquisition through trade. But the bottom line is I think we'll finally get to see Juolevi in the show sooner rather than later. 

[Fred65]

55 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Likely ceiling of a 6-8/AHL guy, 26 years old, on an expiring deal.

Sounds more like  Sautner is propping up Juolevi. I remember when Sautner was playing a full time role a couple of years back he looked good. They asked him to be more physical and from what i gather he has, so ......... ?? If Sautner was playing with Juolevi a LHD it means Sautner can play both side because he too is a LHD

Edited September 30, 2020 by Fred65

[-AJ-]

54 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

Sounds more like  Sautner is propping up Juolevi. I remember when Sautner was playing a full time role a couple of years back he looked good. They asked him to be more physical and from what i gather he has, so ......... ?? If Sautner was playing with Juolevi a LHD it means Sautner can play both side because he too is a LHD

There's a chance Sautner is propping up Juolevi, but Sautner has also had a decent amount of NHL experience and while not bad, certainly isn't the next coming of Chris Tanev. As @aGENT pointed out, Sautner is also four years older than Juolevi and is likely already very close to his career peak, whereas at just 22 years of age, Juolevi has some key developmental years still ahead of him and hasn't had a chance to show anything in the NHL yet. Juolevi has also shown a far stronger aptitude for offense than Sautner as well. At the end of the day, the biggest difference is Sautner is four years older and at best a #7 on most NHL teams. Juolevi may be at the same level, but is much more likely to improve given his young age.

[theo5789]

1 hour ago, Fred65 said:

Sounds more like  Sautner is propping up Juolevi. I remember when Sautner was playing a full time role a couple of years back he looked good. They asked him to be more physical and from what i gather he has, so ......... ?? If Sautner was playing with Juolevi a LHD it means Sautner can play both side because he too is a LHD

Sautner is a "veteran" in the AHL. Much like how Tanev was partnered with Hughes, was Tanev propping up Hughes? Sautner was a decent call up and could still be a serviceable Biega type player for us, but the quality in front of him continues to grow and push him down to AHL quality talent for us.

 

I think the thing to gather from that quote you posted earlier is that they are trusting and developing OJ to face the top opposition and has Sautner as a reliable partner. Our RD was thin with Chatfield getting regular call ups during the season and Rafferty wasn't as trusted in defensive assignments.

[Fred65]

18 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

There's a chance Sautner is propping up Juolevi, but Sautner has also had a decent amount of NHL experience and while not bad, certainly isn't the next coming of Chris Tanev. As @aGENT pointed out, Sautner is also four years older than Juolevi and is likely already very close to his career peak, whereas at just 22 years of age, Juolevi has some key developmental years still ahead of him and hasn't had a chance to show anything in the NHL yet. Juolevi has also shown a far stronger aptitude for offense than Sautner as well. At the end of the day, the biggest difference is Sautner is four years older and at best a #7 on most NHL teams. Juolevi may be at the same level, but is much more likely to improve given his young age.

i always believed that you won with your best, it,  as far as I'm aware winning is the entire concept of hockey. At 26 he's hardly an after thought he'll be around for  another 5 years or more. Certainly not a Tanev but at this point maybe better than Juolevi ?? It all get back to earning a spot or being given a spot, just a thought. I thought it was reasonable comment to explore. Personally I believe Benning is anxious to show Juolevi as great pick  

[aGENT]

20 hours ago, Fred65 said:

Sounds more like  Sautner is propping up Juolevi. I remember when Sautner was playing a full time role a couple of years back he looked good. They asked him to be more physical and from what i gather he has, so ......... ?? If Sautner was playing with Juolevi a LHD it means Sautner can play both side because he too is a LHD

I guess Tanev was simply 'propping up' Hughes this year too? 

[Fred65]

4 hours ago, aGENT said:

I guess Tanev was simply 'propping up' Hughes this year too? 

To a certain degree yes, he provided the opportunity for Hughes to use his offensive flair, it worked well. If I'm Sautner I'd be p!***d. Sautner does the grunt work and Juolevi gets the glory .... and the money.

 

For many year there was an element on the forum through thick and thing told us of the the future glory for Virtanen, now it's Juolevi. I hope Juolevi is a future all-star but  the record is not encouraging, and I'd hate to see other propsects overlooked because of politics  

Edited October 1, 2020 by Fred65

[aGENT]

13 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

To a certain degree yes, he provided the opportunity for Hughes to use his offensive flair, it worked well. If I'm Sautner I'd be p!***d. Sautner does the grunt work and Juolevi gets the glory .... and the money

To a certain extent, yes, he did. Just like, to a certain extent, Sautner likely helped stabilize, with a dependable (AHL level), veteran presence, Juolevi.

 

That doesn't mean Hughes' ceiling isn't a whole lot higher than Tanev's... And Juolevi's ceiling, well I'm sure you can follow the bread crumbs...

[theo5789]

42 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

To a certain degree yes, he provided the opportunity for Hughes to use his offensive flair, it worked well. If I'm Sautner I'd be p!***d. Sautner does the grunt work and Juolevi gets the glory .... and the money

If the coaching staff is putting OJ out there against the top opposition, it's unlikely that he's running around like a chicken with it's head cut off while Sautner covers all of the defensive ground. He's clearly seen as being capable of doing so as well, but will have rookie mistakes. If for example, they felt Rafferty could do the same, then they could've partnered Sautner with him instead considering the LD/RD combo. But instead they balanced him out with a strong defensive presence in Brisebois instead, but less likely to face the top opposition still.

 

I think you're simply trying not to give OJ any credit and trying to give every and anyone else that instead. We are glad to have Sautner in the system, but he doesn't project to much more than a 6/7/8/AHL type dman at this point. OJ still has top 4 potential and thus the development will go towards that. They aren't handing OJ any minutes, if you recall, Sautner was one of the first call-ups and then got plastered. OJ has grown his game over the season and had earned a look when he performed very well in the mini training camp leading to the play-in/playoffs. Prior to this OJ was not getting much glory here and was considered a bust by many. OJ is developing with the support of Sautner (and others) and surely he is appreciative of that.

 

In general though, strong defensive players that don't have a ton of offense tend to be overlooked. Tanev had a great season this year, but all the glory (and rightfully so) went to Hughes. It's to the point that many think we should just let Tanev walk (because we need to keep our offensive guy in Toffoli instead) and have the assumption that a Stecher/Rafferty right side would perform just as well (because Rafferty had good AHL offensive numbers, so his offense will make up for the defensive loss?)

[WeneedLumme]

6 hours ago, aGENT said:

To a certain extent, yes, he did. Just like, to a certain extent, Sautner likely helped stabilize, with a dependable (AHL level), veteran presence, Juolevi.

 

That doesn't mean Hughes' ceiling isn't a whole lot higher than Tanev's... And Juolevi's ceiling, well I'm sure you can follow the bread crumbs...

If you are really sure about that, you must have forgotten who you were responding to.

[MrCanuck94]

On 9/30/2020 at 9:33 AM, Fred65 said:

This appeared in the Province recently

"At even strength, Cull and his coaching staff often had Juolevi deployed alongside Ashton Sautner, one of the Comets’ most reliable and rugged blue-liners, facing down the opposition’s top forwards."

So why aren't we talking about Sautner more, politics ? rather than Juolevi

 

For the same reason Zack Macewen is on a NHL roster and not the higher scoring few years older Reid Boucher.

 

One has the ability and tools to translate their skill and play in the NHL and the other does not.

 

Not that difficult of a concept to grasp.

[Fred65]

14 hours ago, MrCanuck94 said:

For the same reason Zack Macewen is on a NHL roster and not the higher scoring few years older Reid Boucher.

 

One has the ability and tools to translate their skill and play in the NHL and the other does not.

 

Not that difficult of a concept to grasp.

As we're talking hyperboles, Cull needed a strong Defensive partner for Juolevi to survive. Sautner of course has played more games in the NHL them Juolevi and during his games in the NHL was a plus player. Not difficult to grasp

[theo5789]

1 hour ago, Fred65 said:

As we're talking hyperboles, Cull needed a strong Defensive partner for Juolevi to survive. Sautner of course has played more games in the NHL them Juolevi and during his games in the NHL was a plus player. Not difficult to grasp

And Quinn Hughes was a -10 this year, 3rd worst on the team, must not be a NHL player.

 

To survive? Give me a break. You keep ignoring the fact that he's out there against the top competition. If he was such a liability, then he wouldn't be out there in that situation at all. Sautner cracked a roster that was near bottom of the league. OJ got into a game that was in the play-in/playoff bound and he earned it.

[Kootenay Gold]

3 hours ago, Fred65 said:

As we're talking hyperboles, Cull needed a strong Defensive partner for Juolevi to survive. Sautner of course has played more games in the NHL them Juolevi and during his games in the NHL was a plus player. Not difficult to grasp

Fred; I think your choice of the word "survive", was a poor one. A better choice would have been "thrive". One of the main functions of the AHL, as you well know; is to develop players for the NHL. Having a defensively reliable partner allows Juolevi the freedom to be a bit more creative in generating offence from the back end without worrying so much about his partner not being good enough to handle an occasional turnover. My understanding of what they want to see from Juolevi is a fluid skating puck moving D man and having Sautner anchoring the defensive side is a plus for both of them as Sautner is more suited as a stay at home shutdown D man

[Fred65]

2 minutes ago, Kootenay Gold said:

Fred; I think your choice of the word "survive", was a poor one. A better choice would have been "thrive". One of the main functions of the AHL, as you well know; is to develop players for the NHL. Having a defensively reliable partner allows Juolevi the freedom to be a bit more creative in generating offence from the back end without worrying so much about his partner not being good enough to handle an occasional turnover. My understanding of what they want to see from Juolevi is a fluid skating puck moving D  and having Sautner anchoring the defensive side is a plus for both of them as Sautner is more suited as a stay at home shutdown D man

Could be. I'd  just like to think politics (  a Benning draft pick ) is earning his way for the right reasons. Any way I can't recall where but there is talk about Juolevi ending up with Arizona, so who knows

[theo5789]

22 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

Could be. I'd  just like to think politics (  a Benning draft pick ) is earning his way for the right reasons. Any way I can't recall where but there is talk about Juolevi ending up with Arizona, so who knows

Because the potential return is OEL who would be in taking up a likely spot of his for a long time which makes him expendable. And the talk is that we want to shed some of our cap as well. You have to pay quality to get quality.

 

It's not like we are dumping him thinking he is a bust as some want to believe.

[MrCanuck94]

11 hours ago, Fred65 said:

As we're talking hyperboles, Cull needed a strong Defensive partner for Juolevi to survive. Sautner of course has played more games in the NHL them Juolevi and during his games in the NHL was a plus player. Not difficult to grasp

Lol.

 

I'm not talking hyperboles, you just don't get it.

Edited October 4, 2020 by MrCanuck94

[Pete M]

On 10/2/2020 at 4:55 PM, MrCanuck94 said:

For the same reason Zack Macewen is on a NHL roster and not the higher scoring few years older Reid Boucher.

 

One has the ability and tools to translate their skill and play in the NHL and the other does not.

 

Not that difficult of a concept to grasp.

too bad for Boucher, wrong time for him, the Canucks were a bad hockey team with and without him.

[Attila Umbrus]

1 hour ago, Pete M said:

too bad for Boucher, wrong time for him, the Canucks were a bad hockey team with and without him.

Boucher in an odd way I compare to Archibald. Both amazing AHL players, but when they have had their chances in the NHL they just can't muster anything. I love them both as I'm a big Utica fan, but it's amazing how a player can look so good there but come up and look like a shell of themselves in the NHL. They are so close yet so far away at the same time. Boucher in the AHL just has that little bit more time and space to make those nice passes or get his wicked shot off...in the NHL those seconds count and he can never get his shot off...he never seems to be able to find those soft spots like he can in the AHL... I've waited and waited for him to do what he does in the AHL at the NHL level, just can't do it. If he was able to find that time and space man we would have had an amazing player there. In utica he played in all situations even on the PK, amazing player to watch. Hope he gets a chance somewhere else to try and prove himself one last time, the guy deserves it.

 

Honestly lots of guys in the AHL fit that bill exactly. And it's always perplexed me how they can't translate it, but I do think it's a mix of time and space, and also confidence.

 

Sorry don't want to hi jack a Joulevi thread...so there I mentioned him lol. 

[Googlie]

Couple of good write ups in Canucks Army on his strengths/weaknesses

 

Negatives:

https://canucksarmy.com/2020/06/16/the-olli-juolevi-files-part-1-the-negatives

 

Positives:

https://canucksarmy.com/2020/06/17/the-olli-juolevi-files-part-2-the-positives