VIC_CITY Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 I was reading an article today on The Province's website: http://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/canucks-9-to-5-the-season-is-here-the-season-is-here) It shows a couple of tweets from James Mirtle @myrtle, One being the 20 youngest players in the NHL and another showing the 20 oldest. The one thing that stood out to me is that Roberto Luongo is the NHL's oldest goaltender (and 12th oldest player) at 37.527 years old. Another interesting note that James Mirtle made (although unrelated to this post) is that there are currently only 28 players league wide over 35 years of age. Very interesting and also very telling of the direction that the league is going. But it got me thinking, man...that cap recapture penalty could come back and bite us VERY soon. So let's break it down: 2017-18 $3,583,333.33 2018-19 $4,127,333.33 2019-20 $4,333,333.33 2020-21 $4,333,333.33 Yikes! So if Luongo does retire early, what's the likelihood of us having to actually pay that penalty? Part of me thinks maybe the NHL will realize that this rule is absolutely ridiculous and it will be waived, but then there's the other side of me that thinks Bettman has no interest in helping our franchise out as it does not serve his agenda. What do you guys think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Soldier Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 I'm not overly concerned as the Canucks are not the only team facing such a penalty. (see: Blackhawks with Hossa) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuxfanabroad Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 More concerned about things like possible nuclear war. But if Lu retires early, I'll likely hide under a school desk, wail & sniffle... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 Lou won't retire until he's top 5 in almost all goalie categories which...well he's actually close too being top 5 for all so 3-5 more years is far from out of the question Seriously, check those stats out and the company he is in. For never having won a vezina or cup... http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/records/nhl-goalies-all-time-wins-leaders.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldoescobar Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 Oh you better believe the NHL will hand it to the Canucks no question about it. They could have let it slide originally as it was a legal contract under the CBA at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 2 minutes ago, Ronaldoescobar said: Oh you better believe the NHL will hand it to the Canucks no question about it. They could have let it slide originally as it was a legal contract under the CBA at the time. The CBA is also a legal contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBackup Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 I don't expect Bettman to let it slide, but if the Canucks are hit with the recapture penalty, after all the crap the league has let go, (Devils with Kovalchuk, Kings with Richards, etc) the Canucks getting retroactively hammered by a rule that wasn't in place when the contract was signed will probably be the last straw in me caring about the league. Its a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 It's not like Florida has a young stud goalie like Schneider coming in to take over the crease any time soon. And even if they do draft a stud goalie, it will likely be at least 4-5 years before they were ready to challenge him. I don't see Florida having any interest of dumping him, so really it's up to him how long he wants to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putgolzin Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 8 minutes ago, Ronaldoescobar said: Oh you better believe the NHL will hand it to the Canucks no question about it. They could have let it slide originally as it was a legal contract under the CBA at the time. I will still never understand how we just got hammered for doing things that were legal. I can't start to fathom why Gillis (or someone!) didn't stand up and fight against it. That was Gillis' failing for me, that was where the bungling of our goalies happened. Unfairly sucked all value out of one of history's best goaltenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 9 minutes ago, Baggins said: The CBA is also a legal contract. They enforced it for Mike Richards. Isn't it also the recapture penalty one of the reasons why Buffalo (Ehrhoff) and the Rangers (Brad Richards) used their compliance buyout. They knew they wouldn't be able to trade them as it increases the penalty. Nashville might have an argument - it was an offer sheet and in fact they could have had Weber at a 14M cap hit (which was Weber's salary over those 4 years) and still be under the cap. They weren't trying to get an advantage unlike the other teams. Blackhawks, Kings, Red Wings would not have the roster they had when they won the Cup without that trick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Luxury Yacht Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 20 minutes ago, Baggins said: The CBA is also a legal contract. Correct me of I'm wrong, but Lu's contract was within the legal boundaries of the CBA at the time of signing. Why does the legality of the CBA come into question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 30 minutes ago, VIC_CITY said: I was reading an article today on The Province's website: http://theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/canucks-9-to-5-the-season-is-here-the-season-is-here) It shows a couple of tweets from James Mirtle @myrtle, One being the 20 youngest players in the NHL and another showing the 20 oldest. The one thing that stood out to me is that Roberto Luongo is the NHL's oldest goaltender (and 12th oldest player) at 37.527 years old. Another interesting note that James Mirtle made (although unrelated to this post) is that there are currently only 28 players league wide over 35 years of age. Very interesting and also very telling of the direction that the league is going. But it got me thinking, man...that cap recapture penalty could come back and bite us VERY soon. So let's break it down: 2017-18 $3,583,333.33 2018-19 $4,127,333.33 2019-20 $4,333,333.33 2020-21 $4,333,333.33 Yikes! So if Luongo does retire early, what's the likelihood of us having to actually pay that penalty? Part of me thinks maybe the NHL will realize that this rule is absolutely ridiculous and it will be waived, but then there's the other side of me that thinks Bettman has no interest in helping our franchise out as it does not serve his agenda. What do you guys think? These numbers don't seem right. If he retires in summer 2017 the penalty for the Canucks is 1.8M x 5 years 2018 - 2.35M x 4 years 2019 - 3M x 3 years 2020 - 4.3M x 2 years 2021 - 7.9M x 1 year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIC_CITY Posted October 12, 2016 Author Share Posted October 12, 2016 We would end up paying more in cap recapture penalties than we would if we were to buy him out. It just doesn't make any sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raymond Luxury Yacht Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 13 minutes ago, mll said: They enforced it for Mike Richards. Isn't it also the recapture penalty one of the reasons why Buffalo (Ehrhoff) and the Rangers (Brad Richards) used their compliance buyout. They knew they wouldn't be able to trade them as it increases the penalty. Nashville might have an argument - it was an offer sheet and in fact they could have had Weber at a 14M cap hit (which was Weber's salary over those 4 years) and still be under the cap. They weren't trying to get an advantage unlike the other teams. Blackhawks, Kings, Red Wings would not have the roster they had when they won the Cup without that trick. You are definitely right. It was a loophole. When they closed it, IMO, it should have done nothing to previously signed contracts. Oh well, I doubt Lu retired early regardless. There is a lot of money on the table for him and he is still a great goalie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIC_CITY Posted October 12, 2016 Author Share Posted October 12, 2016 2 minutes ago, mll said: These numbers don't seem right. If he retires in summer 2017 the penalty for the Canucks is 1.8M x 5 years 2018 - 2.35M x 4 years 2019 - 3M x 3 years 2020 - 4.3M x 2 years 2021 - 7.9M x 1 year I got the numbers from an old Canucks Army article: http://canucksarmy.com/2013/7/13/musings-on-ilya-kovalchuks-recapture-penalty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 1 minute ago, VIC_CITY said: We would end up paying more in cap recapture penalties than we would if we were to buy him out. It just doesn't make any sense. The idea of the recapture penalty is to penalise the team for having had a lower cap hit for the years where he was a Canuck. It's the difference between total salary paid and cap hit with that difference spread over the years between early retirement and the end of the contract (2022). His calculation is a bit more complicated because there's a 15% salary retention but that's the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 6 minutes ago, VIC_CITY said: I got the numbers from an old Canucks Army article: http://canucksarmy.com/2013/7/13/musings-on-ilya-kovalchuks-recapture-penalty They are wrong/no longer accurate though because it was before the trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drive-By Body Pierce Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 At first glimpse, it is scary... VERY scary. But I think Luo is not only the caliber of goaltender to go the distance, but also one to have pride to want to go that distance, a la Martin Brodeur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 When the Devils circumvented the cap with Kovalchuks contract the penalty was losing a first round pick in one of the following 3 years. They waited till the 3rd year and bettmangave it back (gave them pick number 30) If he retires and we have to pay the full penalty I think I might be done for good. Although the couldn't we just trade for him back and put him on LTIR or something Ala pronger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sygvard Posted October 12, 2016 Share Posted October 12, 2016 Have you guys ever looked at the possible recapture on Shea Weber's contract? It is absolutely insane. If he retired at the correct year (his age 40 year), Nashville would be on the hook for a penalty of over TWENTY FOUR MILLION against the cap. In a single year. It would vanish the next year. But would be sufficient to force them to get rid of... pretty much anyone making a real salary on the entire team, if the league didn't waive it. I think the league will go out of it's way to make sure the penalties don't actually happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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