Bure_Pavel Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 2 hours ago, Jaku said: Err, the consensus among a lot of scouts is that Nolan is going to be more than likely a very good 2nd line center who has the chance to evolve into a journeyman first liner. He's a long way from a franchise center man. Nolan was born on September 19th 1998 so he missed the 2016 draft by four days and if he was in the draft he would have been in that 5-10 range. He's a good player, no doubt, but he's not a player you'd put a franchise tag on. Going after Timothy Liljegren may be the best option draft day regardless of if the Canucks pick first overall or second. A dynamic d-man with great vision, awesome offensive instincts, great agility, and a crazy good skater. Who's up for the idea of this kid and Juolevi running the powerplay in the next few years? Why not consider that? There is no true, clear cut number 1 Center in the draft, but there is a d-man who is projected to be a big time point producing d-man. Nolan would be a good pick, I will never not say that. But is he the number 1 guy Vancouver needs? I'm going to say not likely. Those same scouts 10 out of 10 of them said they would take Nolan Patrick over Liljegren. It not like we are all good on centers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goat James Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 7 hours ago, Beary Sweet said: I consider Patrick a McDavid type player. This is a player that we desperately need. I consider Jannik Hansen a Lemieux type player. This doesn't mean that he is. Nolan Patrick is by many scouts considered one of the weakest potential first overall picks this decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Building Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I agree with @Jaku @DontMessMe and @elvis15 regarding the selection of another defenceman if it looks like Patrick isn't a consensus franchise player (should we find ourselves in that position). They tend to take so much longer than forwards to contribute anyways so let's grab another one to develop alongside Juolevi. @Chip Kelly I wouldn't be overly concerned about the height and weight of a 15 year old whippersnapper quite yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timberz21 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Guys stop arguing about whether Nolan Patrick is a franchise C or not....we won't win the lottery. Instead start arguing who we will pick between 2 and 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 4 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said: Those same scouts 10 out of 10 of them said they would take Nolan Patrick over Liljegren. It not like we are all good on centers. In a draft where they say the consensus center is an elite 2nd line player but the consensus d is comparable to norris finalists you take the defenceman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beary Sweet Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 5 hours ago, The Game said: I consider Jannik Hansen a Lemieux type player. This doesn't mean that he is. Nolan Patrick is by many scouts considered one of the weakest potential first overall picks this decade. Yeah but who would you take though in terms of the teams needs: the next Getzlaf or the next EK 65... This team already has enough depth in the defensive end and adding Liljegren would just create a logjam. That's why I'm saying Patrick all the way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 2 hours ago, Warhippy said: In a draft where they say the consensus center is an elite 2nd line player but the consensus d is comparable to norris finalists you take the defenceman Does that really mean much? Patrick has been compared to Toews. I still don't think it makes sense to put a cap on the potential of an 18 year old. I have seen people say that he could be Patrik Stefan but Liljegren could just as easily be the next David Rundblad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 12 minutes ago, Beary Sweet said: Yeah but who would you take though in terms of the teams needs: the next Getzlaf or the next EK 65... This team already has enough depth in the defensive end and adding Liljegren would just create a logjam. That's why I'm saying Patrick all the way I would take Karlsson over Getzlaf every day of the week regardless of team needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 26 minutes ago, Toews said: Does that really mean much? Patrick has been compared to Toews. I still don't think it makes sense to put a cap on the potential of an 18 year old. I have seen people say that he could be Patrik Stefan but Liljegren could just as easily be the next David Rundblad. Horvat was compared to toews too But every analyst agrees he's going to be a minimum top 4 dman. Take the defencemen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
250Integra Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 McDavid is a generational talent whereas Matthews has Superstar potential IMO. It would be like comparing Crosby to Stamkos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 9 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said: Craig Button is pretty high on Nolan Patrick. He thinks he will be a franchise center: "All the capabilities to be the No. 1 centre teams can build around. Has an ease to his play, both physically and mentally, that he combines with excellent skill to impact the game in every situation. Franchise centres contribute individually, but what separates them is their ability to make everybody around them and the team better." "Nolan's style of play is similar to that of fellow Manitoban Jonathan Toews. He's skilled, smart and capable of playing and making a difference in all situations of the game. Like Toews, he does it without much flash, but brings significant determination and reliability every time he steps on the ice. " http://www.tsn.ca/mckenzie-s-pre-season-ranking-the-nolan-patrick-draft-1.567410 Quote ... Former Wheat King head coach and general manager Kelly McCrimmon ... fervently believes Patrick has what it takes to be a No. 1 centre in the NHL. While some of the scouts surveyed by TSN do not discount Patrick evolving into that role, the consensus view is Patrick is projected more as a second-line NHL centre and doesn't have the same “wow” factor as McDavid, Eichel and Matthews. "He's going to be a good, maybe very good, NHL player," one scout said, "but he isn't a dynamic player. His skating isn't bad but he's not dynamic like those others [McDavid, Eichel and Matthews]." ... Patrick's birthday is Sept. 19, so he was just four days off being eligible for last season's draft. Had he been available last June, where would he slot amongst the best players of a very strong draft class, like Matthews, Patrik Laine, Jesse Puljujarvi and Pierre-Luc Dubois, among others? The consensus amongst scouts surveyed by TSN is that Patrick wouldn't have displaced any of the top four picks in last year's draft. Depending on the scout, they retroactively rank Patrick anywhere between No. 5 and 10, based on his 2015-16 season. "That's not a knock on Nolan," a scout added. "Last year's top guys were really exceptional." ... We're not saying he's bad, but there's certainly a fair amount of opinion that he's not exceptional. That's what you want with a 1st overall pick, not a guy you might have picked instead of Juolevi this past draft. But on the subject of Button, Button thinks Liljegren is very good as well, pointing out comparisons to Doughty. There could well be a lot of competition for the consensus 1st overall this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 2 hours ago, Beary Sweet said: Yeah but who would you take though in terms of the teams needs: the next Getzlaf or the next EK 65... This team already has enough depth in the defensive end and adding Liljegren would just create a logjam. That's why I'm saying Patrick all the way Not yet it wouldn't. We'd have lots of time to move other defencemen as needed to make space since he wouldn't likely start in the NHL right away. We may have some good top 4/6 depth and potential among our prospects, but our #1/2 D choices are still limited. Obviously our #1 C choices are pretty limited as well, but is Patrick good enough to bank on being that guy with a 1st overall pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 41 minutes ago, elvis15 said: http://www.tsn.ca/mckenzie-s-pre-season-ranking-the-nolan-patrick-draft-1.567410 We're not saying he's bad, but there's certainly a fair amount of opinion that he's not exceptional. That's what you want with a 1st overall pick, not a guy you might have picked instead of Juolevi this past draft. But on the subject of Button, Button thinks Liljegren is very good as well, pointing out comparisons to Doughty. There could well be a lot of competition for the consensus 1st overall this year. If we're looking tat 2-3 years to the entrance of Juolevi/Liljegren should we pick him than no. There is no logjam. in 3 years I believe Tanev would be the only one under contract if he's still here. It's wide open. I don't have any qualms either way, but if it's between the two I take the D man and let it play out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 9 hours ago, elvis15 said: http://www.tsn.ca/mckenzie-s-pre-season-ranking-the-nolan-patrick-draft-1.567410 We're not saying he's bad, but there's certainly a fair amount of opinion that he's not exceptional. That's what you want with a 1st overall pick, not a guy you might have picked instead of Juolevi this past draft. But on the subject of Button, Button thinks Liljegren is very good as well, pointing out comparisons to Doughty. There could well be a lot of competition for the consensus 1st overall this year. All im saying is that I am yet to see even a single ranking or scout that doesnt have nolan patrick going first overall, not one. Yet people are saying we should pick a Timothy first overall. I could see the reasoning if we were not in the need for a center, but we clearly are in the worst way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvis15 Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 4 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said: All im saying is that I am yet to see even a single ranking or scout that doesnt have nolan patrick going first overall, not one. Yet people are saying we should pick a Timothy first overall. I could see the reasoning if we were not in the need for a center, but we clearly are in the worst way. There can be many reasons for that, one being centers are valued more highly in general. That doesn't make the defencemen referenced lesser prospects. Goalies are often ranked even lower, even if they could be a significant prospect. It's mostly just the way drafts are ranked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 On 2016-11-06 at 11:56 PM, Jaku said: Err, the consensus among a lot of scouts is that Nolan is going to be more than likely a very good 2nd line center who has the chance to evolve into a journeyman first liner. He's a long way from a franchise center man. Nolan was born on September 19th 1998 so he missed the 2016 draft by four days and if he was in the draft he would have been in that 5-10 range. He's a good player, no doubt, but he's not a player you'd put a franchise tag on. Going after Timothy Liljegren may be the best option draft day regardless of if the Canucks pick first overall or second. A dynamic d-man with great vision, awesome offensive instincts, great agility, and a crazy good skater. Who's up for the idea of this kid and Juolevi running the powerplay in the next few years? Why not consider that? There is no true, clear cut number 1 Center in the draft, but there is a d-man who is projected to be a big time point producing d-man. Nolan would be a good pick, I will never not say that. But is he the number 1 guy Vancouver needs? I'm going to say not likely. This. I was never really that high on Patrick to begin with, so Liljegren all the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 benning will have them all scouted and researched. nolin right now is the consenses first pick but that may change by the season's end. BPA is the best way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dura_mater Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 On 08/11/2016 at 3:09 PM, Bure_Pavel said: All im saying is that I am yet to see even a single ranking or scout that doesnt have nolan patrick going first overall, not one. Yet people are saying we should pick a Timothy first overall. I could see the reasoning if we were not in the need for a center, but we clearly are in the worst way. So then why not trade the 1st overall (assuming we get it) let that team draft Patrick and we take the stud D man? There is not log jam as others have pointed out he'll be 2-3 years away. Juolevi and the selected D man will have zero impact on our team next year, we'll probably finish low again and have a shot at potentially a better number one centre. Not a bad way to go about a rebuild (build from D/Goalie out as they take longer to develop). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFromHome Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 I don't believe to the two players in the title are on equal footing. Similar to saying the next Crosby/McDavid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 Rasmus Dahlin http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/swedish-youngster-dahlin-turns-heads-first-wjc-game/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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