Jump to content
The Official Site of the Vancouver Canucks
Canucks Community

Who Is Making the Decisions in Management?


Byrix

Who Is Making the Decisions in Management?  

88 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, Mike Vanderhoek said:

It's called CANUCKS MANAGEMENT. Who else would be making decisions ??? as per all NHL clubs owners all the way down to the coaches and players have input and provide opinion on decisions involving their teams. It is a major misconception that there are certain teams that have " meddling " by owners. They all have say in all NHL organizations.

 

Not sure why this is so hard to understand or how people think in the Canucks case having owners who care and are involved is such a horrible thing. At the end of the day JB, TL, and WD make the decisions we see re: drafting, roster management and so on. Owners rightfully so can influence certain aspects, always have always will.

 

 

Whatever mike you don't know what you are talking about!! If you owned a business worth hundreds of millions!  You wouldn't have the right to have a say!!  Wait, wot?? Lol. Well said buddy ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see we have a lot of Aquilini damage controllers working early.  

 

You guys should understand the problem isn't the ownership getting themselves involved in the decision making process.  It is their business, they have an amount of money most of us will never see in our lifetime invested into this.  We get it.  It would actually be concerning if they weren't involved.

 

The problem is they are steering the boat into the wrong direction, regardless of how many "management" group members have advised against it.  Gillis, JB, TL... all 2nd in commands have shared the same vision for the Canucks, yet are failing to execute properly due to the conflict of direction ownership wishes to take.  

 

Since 2012, the team has just been trending downwards with really no sign of real future security.  Ownership should have realized their mistake and executed a plan for a full rebuild, however, they are stubbornly dragging this along while continuously delaying the Canucks from becoming an actual contender in the near future.  Everyone but the blind homers can clearly see this isn't working.  

 

Maybe it's time for ownership to be involved in the right plan, and allow JB to carry on a plan that is in the best interest of the Canucks' future.

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

So your statement only confirms about ownership meddling? 

 

Isn't Aquilini, you know, the owner? Why would he not want to have a say and isn't it their call? 

 

As far as 'meddling' goes I haven't seen one single thing ever of actual proof of anything other than a family that spends to the max every year and is trying to bring a cup here. Meddling is goofballs like Harold Ballard or NBA weirdo's. 

 

It might not be 'meddling' they may just not believe in tanking. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

It might not be 'meddling' they may just not believe in tanking

 

This isn't directed towards just you, but just in general, so please don't take it personally.  

 

Only a handful of posters on CDC actually want a "purposeful" tanking.  

Most of us just want this team to run its course and start preparing for the future.  If the team is just bad and can't win, it isn't tanking.  It's just a painfully obvious sign that we need to dwell at the bottom and reap some rewards at the end of the year (and for few years) for sucking in general.  

 

We don't have to sign aging wingers at 6 million, or trade away our draft picks, or hold onto our aging veterans... you know, stupid and forced additional moves just so we can remain at best mediocre year in and year out... which really is what we have been for the past few years, and seems like we will be for the years to come.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

 

Isn't Aquilini, you know, the owner? Why would he not want to have a say and isn't it their call? 

 

As far as 'meddling' goes I haven't seen one single thing ever of actual proof of anything other than a family that spends to the max every year and is trying to bring a cup here. Meddling is goofballs like Harold Ballard or NBA weirdo's. 

 

It might not be 'meddling' they may just not believe in tanking. 

 

And how do you tank anyway with Hank and Dank in the line up that have NMC's and virtually impossible to move even if they allowed it.

It's pretty straight forward, they're rebuilding while still spending to the cap, and hopefully have a competitive product to keep the fans in their seats. When the Sedin's leave by either retiring or somehow being moved at 2018 trade deadline, then management should ice a playoff ready team (not a contender) in 2018-2019.

In the meantime we can enjoy watching the product being developed into a winner come 2-4 years.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, C.Schneider said:

 

This isn't directed towards just you, but just in general, so please don't take it personally.  

 

Only a handful of posters on CDC actually want a "purposeful" tanking.  

Most of us just want this team to run its course and start preparing for the future.  If the team is just bad and can't win, it isn't tanking.  It's just a painfully obvious sign that we need to dwell at the bottom and reap some rewards at the end of the year (and for few years) for sucking in general.  

 

We don't have to sign aging wingers at 6 million, or trade away our draft picks, or hold onto our aging veterans... you know, stupid and forced additional moves just so we can remain at best mediocre year in and year out... which really is what we have been for the past few years, and seems like we will be for the years to come.

 

Its good. 

 

I understand what you're saying, but the mitigating factor is the small number of prospects from the Gillis years. There's really no choice but to field a mix of our vets and the few kids we have - we've actually been exceptionally lucky with Stecher and Tryamkin, and Hutton for that matter. Things could be a lot worse. Plus if Aquaman still believes the Sedin's have something left he may want to give those guys one more shot if he can. 

 

So even if JB had kept some of those 2nd rounders, they'd still be in Utica or college right now anyway. It wouldn't likely make any difference to what's on the ice right now.

 

The only new older guy is Loui, and he is a very good player. We still need guys like that playing with guys like Bo. 

 

But yes that may come at the cost of not picking 1st, so Benning had better pick very very well. 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also think we are witnessing a Catch-22 freefall.

 

Again, go back to September 2nd 2009. Whatever and whomever had the most influence in the decision to sign that contract with Lu is what has led us to where we are today. Ever since that day the team has structurally and corporately been in a tailspin. Yes we enjoyed some short-term success (2009/10 through 2010/11) but the longterm effects have resulted in where we are at now. So as we began to implode organizationally, the owners felt the need to step in with more influence to halt the tailspin. Problem is, the more they interfered, the more severe the tailspin. Fast forward to April 9th 2014...we reach our lowest point of desperation. In classic Edmonton Oilers fashion, the Aquilinis hire one of our favourite sons to be a figurehead president (figurehead in that they fully intend to continue to interfere at a rate that will only further cast this franchise into a deeper tailspin).

 

I swear the Aquilinis couldn't have followed the Oilers model more closely than if they'd actually tried and stated such:

1/ Meddling owner (ie/ Katz)

2/ Ex-player president in a deperate bid to buy fan loyalty (ie/ Lowe)

3/ GM with no experience at the helm (ie/ Lowe AND MacT)

4/ Revolving door of head coaches 'cause, you know, they're really the problem (too many to name)

5/ All that's left to do now to mask over decades of futility is to build a new arena...

 

We are guilty of the 2 biggest corporate errors that destroy companies:

1/ Nepotism - When the owner puts his son or daughter in charge when they have little to no experience and;

2/ Peter Principle - Promoting people to their failure point.

 

1/ Nepotism - I wonder (total speculation) that when the tailspin had reached the terminal velocity point if, in a bid to win back our hearts (and bucks), our eldest Canuck son (Smyl) was approached but had the brains to say NO. Then Francesco moved on to our next beloved Canuck son Kirk and he also said NO. Both of these guys were smart enough (and wise and experienced enough) to read between the lines when they were told "don't worry. Even though you're a rookie president we won't leave you high and dry. We'll be right there by your side (meddling) every step of the way"...ummmm....no thanks. So then it's on to son #3, Trevor. At a mere 44 years of age (and lacking the foresight and wisdom of his 2 older "Canuck" siblings), a doe-eyed young man is offered a king's ransom and handsome title...how could he say no? I wonder if Nazzy was the next "son" on the list had Trevor also said no. Sad sad desperation on the owner's part to attempt to band-aid over the tailspin situation with a popular "son" as a figurehead whilst still pulling the puppet strings behind the scenes.

 

2/ Peter Principle - Jim Benning. JB was a good scout, heck possibly even a good head scout, or director of player personnel. But it's a giant leap from player scout to GM of a multi million dollar corporation. So again, rookie GM who will be prone to making some mistakes..."not to worry Jim, ownership will be right there help guide you (even though we have no experience whatsoever in hockey operations at that level)".

 

If we want recovery from this tailspin 3 things need to happen:

1/ hire an experienced hockey executive as president (and let Trevor learn the job as a VP and eventually take-over)

2/ hire an experienced GM (and let JB learn the job as an ass't GM and eventually take-over)

3/ let those experienced individuals do their job with minimal interference from ownership.

 

Otherwise...well I wonder what they'll name the new arena?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

 

Its good. 

 

I understand what you're saying, but the mitigating factor is the small number of prospects from the Gillis years. There's really no choice but to field a mix of our vets and the few kids we have - we've actually been exceptionally lucky with Stecher and Tryamkin, and Hutton for that matter. Things could be a lot worse. Plus if Aquaman still believes the Sedin's have something left he may want to give those guys one more shot if he can. 

 

So even if JB had kept some of those 2nd rounders, they'd still be in Utica or college right now anyway. It wouldn't likely make any difference to what's on the ice right now.

 

The only new older guy is Loui, and he is a very good player. We still need guys like that playing with guys like Bo. 

 

But yes that may come at the cost of not picking 1st, so Benning had better pick very very well. 

 

 

 

For sure, I'm with you that we don't have much choice but to field a mix of vets and prospects... for the sake of their development, and for the reason that management did not indicate a clear sense of direction over the past years.

 

That is exactly what I mean by those 2nd rounders we could have kept.  They would be developing in Utica or college by now, and we could have had very good young kids in the near future.  However, we are left with nothing to show for.  I do understand not all picks will translate, however, JB has a proven record of successful drafts, and those 2nd rounders are valuable when you have someone like JB. 

 

Bo had success playing with Sven and Virtanen.  They showed sparks this year as well for the short amount of time they were put together.  This is what I mean by just letting its course run naturally.  Just let the kids play if they show promise.  The only reason LE was put with Bo is simply because he couldn't get going with the Sedins, a la infamous Willie D Shuffle.  LE was never signed to play with Bo.  He was signed to play with the Sedins to provide the Canucks with a legitimate top 6 line that would help us squeak into a playoff spot.  

 

As you can see, all of our moves are reactionary, and all tunneled towards a wild card spot.  This really isn't healthy for our hockey team, especially since it hasn't worked for the past 4 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, C.Schneider said:

 

For sure, I'm with you that we don't have much choice but to field a mix of vets and prospects... for the sake of their development, and for the reason that management did not indicate a clear sense of direction over the past years.

 

That is exactly what I mean by those 2nd rounders we could have kept.  They would be developing in Utica or college by now, and we could have had very good young kids in the near future.  However, we are left with nothing to show for.  I do understand not all picks will translate, however, JB has a proven record of successful drafts, and those 2nd rounders are valuable when you have someone like JB. 

 

Bo had success playing with Sven and Virtanen.  They showed sparks this year as well for the short amount of time they were put together.  This is what I mean by just letting its course run naturally.  Just let the kids play if they show promise.  The only reason LE was put with Bo is simply because he couldn't get going with the Sedins, a la infamous Willie D Shuffle.  LE was never signed to play with Bo.  He was signed to play with the Sedins to provide the Canucks with a legitimate top 6 line that would help us squeak into a playoff spot.  

 

As you can see, all of our moves are reactionary, and all tunneled towards a wild card spot.  This really isn't healthy for our hockey team, especially since it hasn't worked for the past 4 years.


I think we're agreeing on a lot of this. On the 2nds, we did get Baer and Guddy as part of those deals, so its not like all of JBs 2nds were totally wasted, could be very far from it. Guddy is a young Bieksa imo. Baer could be a 20 goal guy.... but we're not there yet. 

 

Really I only see 2 picks that were totally "wasted" - the one for Vey and the 4th for Larsen. Larsen was insurance tho, JB didn't know he had Stecher yet, or the Guddy trade, so you could argue that making sure we had 'something' was smart. Imagine if we had none of them... and McCann isn't lighting it up in Florida either. 

 

Things like playing Skille over Jake burns my cookies tho, I'd rather risk missing the playoffs vs. screwing up Jakes development. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only confusing one from JB was Joulevi..we signed Stech Larsen (recently found Tryamkin)  and saw Biega make strides

then why choose another D. Plus a couple young defensemen coming up in the ranks.

 

I thought it was overkill to grab Joulevi. Now we're desperate for scoring and the Tkachuk kid is turning into that net front presence. Makes me want to punch myself in the groin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I make the decisions.

I post them here.  Mngmt deciphers what to do.

 

I see all the contempt towards WD, hot air regarding his systems, and ignorant comments about his health condition - so I say keep Willie.

I see that the fans have an irrational nuthug for 2nd round picks - I tell JB to include a few in deals (but to make sure to get Demko).

I see that some fans want to play pond hockey - I instruct the coaching staff to tighten up systems and play grown up hockey.

I see that some people have an uneducated and pretentious affinity for simplistic 'analytics' - I say acquire players that are under-rated and whose value is more complicated than reductive corsi gazers realize.

I see the fanbase identifies very strongly with a certain player (say Hodgson or Shinkaruk) - they gotta go.

Etc, etc.

 

Why do I do this?

Because I hate all of you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

I make the decisions.

I post them here.  Mngmt deciphers what to do.

 

I see all the contempt towards WD and ignorant comments about his health condition - so I say keep Willie.

I see that the fans have an irrational nuthug for 2nd round picks - I tell JB to include a few in deals.

I see that some fans want to play pond hockey - I instruct the coaching staff to tighten up systems and play grown up hockey.

I see that some people have an uneducated and pretentious affinity for simplistic 'analytics' - I say acquire players whose value is more complicated than corsi gazers realize

Etc, etc.

 

Why do I do this?

Because I hate all of you.

 

what 'health condition"? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, Hairy Kneel said:

The only confusing one from JB was Joulevi..we signed Stech Larsen (recently found Tryamkin)  and saw Biega make strides

then why choose another D. Plus a couple young defensemen coming up in the ranks.

 

I thought it was overkill to grab Joulevi. Now we're desperate for scoring and the Tkachuk kid is turning into that net front presence. Makes me want to punch myself in the groin.

 

My theory on this is Tkachuk tanked his combine interview with JB. I don't think he wanted to be a Canuck and he let JB know it. I have no proof, other than how thrilled Tkachuk was in his draft interview and how he said Cowgary was where he targeted and where he wanted to really be. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There was the rumor that Benning had a trade for Hamhuis with Dallas but it was nixed by Ownership because they wanted more from Gaglardi.

 

The fact that management has to run trades by ownership tells me all i need to know about who makes the decisions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...