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What's happening with this team? The new core is learning to win by themselves


*Buzzsaw*

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1 minute ago, smokes said:

Our PP has no triggerman. The Sedins have always been set up first, they can only play with what they have. And again reading comprehension. When did I even say anything about AV? I said Willie. And why is it me blaming coaching when I say Willie is not leading but you yourself contradicting yourself by saying Willie has no guts is not?

 

So what is wrong with ol' Willie?? Our team has been in most games but cant finish. Is that the coaches fault or him playing the twins too much on chances in scoring ops like the PP or offensive zone faceoffs? This while letting our leading point getter Bo suffer on D-zone chances? Is this a coaching issue or the fact that some certain "vets" have control over scoring opportunities? Torts could not change this, Av could not, and neither Wilie D. The only chance for this to change is by the Twins retiring because they are useless without a PP point threat or 2 centers like Manny or Kess.

 

There is a reason Kess chose to leave this team, he knew what was going on. 

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Just now, EdgarM said:

 

Your not helping your cause by stating that the Twins need help and cannot do it themselves. Bo on the other hand does not need any "Help" from anyone as I have seen him skate in and split the D and score on his own. Why do the Sedins not participate in shootouts again? Sorry had to throw that plug in there. ::D

as I said, they are set up guys. 

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1 minute ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

So what is wrong with ol' Willie?? Our team has been in most games but cant finish. Is that the coaches fault or him playing the twins too much on chances in scoring ops like the PP or offensive zone faceoffs? This while letting our leading point getter Bo suffer on D-zone chances? Is this a coaching issue or the fact that some certain "vets" have control over scoring opportunities? Torts could not change this, Av could not, and neither Wilie D. The only chance for this to change is by the Twins retiring because they are useless without a PP point threat or 2 centers like Manny or Kess.

 

There is a reason Kess chose to leave this team, he knew what was going on. 

It's not the twins fault either. They don't have the players to score.  Also if the coach is reluctant to start Bo on the offensive zone more, then that's on the coach not the twins. Hence players vs coach. Kess chose to leave the Canucks because the fans suck. Nothing more nothing less.

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Just now, smokes said:

It's not the twins fault either. They don't have the players to score.  Also if the coach is reluctant to start Bo on the offensive zone more, then that's on the coach not the twins. Hence players vs coach. Kess chose to leave the Canucks because the fans suck. Nothing more nothing less.

 

I am actually damn sure they had the players for them to score, In fact Kess scored 41 with most of his goals on the PP because he has the skill to actually one time the puck like Ovie. Now we have Sutter trying to one time, but sorry to say he lacks the skill to get a good shot off... Stetch would be good if we could put him at the right side and one time the puck but instead he is at the point on a diamond formation where because we have no net front presence most of his shots are easily seen by the goalie.

 

Try again, and once again watch the 2012 final Bruins vs Hawks and watch how Toews on a bad Hamstring outduelled Chara in front of the net. That is toughness, unlike this crap where Kess chose to be with the Ducks rather than with the Twins. 

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6 minutes ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

I think we all know that Linden scored 2 goals in game 7 on broken ribs yet the twins while healthy barely mustered some shots on net. But lets celebrate their Art Ross titles while we watch Bure score vs Calgary and then stick up for himself vs Churla. Talk about toughness, the Twins had none and will never will as long as they are leading our team. Heck Bo is a better Captain on ice and in games than Henrik. Flame me away and then watch how Iginla led a horrid Flames team to a game 7 while fighting, scoring and being a true leader. You think players on our team would go to die for a Cap like what we have? Just ask Toews how that would work out. 

 

I am about done with this argument, Twins have never stuck up for their teammates, let alone each other as evidenced by the Kadri cheapshot where Hansen took the initiative rather than his own brother. 

 

Enough is enough and it is time for a change. Time for a real Canadian to take the reigns, rather than some soft Swedish players who could not even stick up for each other. 

 

The only reason we made it to the SCF is because Kess, a true warrior, led us past the Preds based on some godly 2-way play. Bieksa off the stantion? where were the twins? congratulating the opposing team??? 

Some tough talk about the Twins and fair enough. I always wondered what careers they would have had with a little more Forsberg in their DNA. Two issues for me. 1) Canucks are a rebuilding org. The Twins playing 22 TOI is not in the best interests of prospect development. The future is not with the Twins. 2) Twins careers have been built around puck possession. At 36 fans have to realize that their physical capabilities will slide. Their ability to play the game still works in regular season but playoff d-cores can deal with their game. Meanwhile the NHL is getting bigger, faster and better coached. Any fan who does not realize that opposing teams have focused on physical play against the Twins and the team have to review film.

 

A vet player who should get some kudos is Alex Burrows. If I had to pick a single player to mentor my young players it would be Burrows or Hanson. I have always said that Burrows enhanced the Twins game more than vice versa.   

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2 minutes ago, smokes said:

You try and get rocked in the head by Duncan Keith and see how much ability you can retain. Some players can't even make it back to the NHL with a hit like that.

 

So did his Bro stick up for him????? Hello there is a reason why opponents take cheapshots at the twins, because they know for damn sure there will not be ANY retribution. GL with your argument, I can tell you have never played a tough sport like hockey in your life. Stick to accounting. 

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4 minutes ago, smokes said:

It's not the twins fault either. They don't have the players to score.  Also if the coach is reluctant to start Bo on the offensive zone more, then that's on the coach not the twins. Hence players vs coach. Kess chose to leave the Canucks because the fans suck. Nothing more nothing less.

Not so sure he left because the fans suck...

He didn't want to hang around waiting for a new team to be built. He could see his chance for a SC with Canucks had gone, and thought the chance was still there with Anaheim + Sunshine on the beach in you latter years, would be a lot better for his ego...

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1 minute ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

I am actually damn sure they had the players for them to score, In fact Kess scored 41 with most of his goals on the PP because he has the skill to actually one time the puck like Ovie. Now we have Sutter trying to one time, but sorry to say he lacks the skill to get a good shot off... Stetch would be good if we could put him at the right side and one time the puck but instead he is at the point on a diamond formation where because we have no net front presence most of his shots are easily seen by the goalie.

 

Try again, and once again watch the 2012 final Bruins vs Hawks and watch how Toews on a bad Hamstring outduelled Chara in front of the net. That is toughness, unlike this crap where Kess chose to be with the Ducks rather than with the Twins. 

Kesler couldn't even lace up Ovie's skates. Shame on you for even putting Kesler's name next to Ovie. Kesler had one 41 goal fluke season. He's never passed 30 in any of his NHL seasons before or after that fluke season. Kess didn't choose Anaheim over the twins, he chose Anaheim over the fans. If the coach was smart, he would try to develop Tryamkin's shot and use that on the first pairing but we all know he's not smart enough to try that.

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2 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

Some tough talk about the Twins and fair enough. I always wondered what careers they would have had with a little more Forsberg in their DNA. Two issues for me. 1) Canucks are a rebuilding org. The Twins playing 22 TOI is not in the best interests of prospect development. The future is not with the Twins. 2) Twins careers have been built around puck possession. At 36 fans have to realize that their physical capabilities will slide. Their ability to play the game still works in regular season but playoff d-cores can deal with their game. Meanwhile the NHL is getting bigger, faster and better coached. Any fan who does not realize that opposing teams have focused on physical play against the Twins and the team have to review film.

 

A vet player who should get some kudos is Alex Burrows. If I had to pick a single player to mentor my young players it would be Burrows or Hanson. I have always said that Burrows enhanced the Twins game more than vice versa.   

 

I completely agree my friend. As of right now, Burr and even Hammer and Juice have most likely provided more leadership than the Twins ever have. Heck, why was Luongo named Cap ahead of the Twins? A frickin goalie named Cap? An absolute embarrassment. 

 

I love the Twins and their offensive capabilities, but when it matters they have been invisible. 

 

Maybe another Naslund, have their numbers raise into the rafters but I will always view players like Iggy and Linden supreme leaders unlike the twins who fail to even stick up for their own teammates and it shows in every game we watch. Just ask McCann why he had to put up with BS from Getzlaf, yet nobody had the guff to stick up for him?? I guess that is why we are paying Dorsett 2.5 to act like an enforcer. 

 

This is not hockey but rather some cowardice. 

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4 minutes ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

So did his Bro stick up for him????? Hello there is a reason why opponents take cheapshots at the twins, because they know for damn sure there will not be ANY retribution. GL with your argument, I can tell you have never played a tough sport like hockey in your life. Stick to accounting. 

Hockey is a team sport, so his teammates should have stuck up for him. As a fan I would not want to watch a second Sedin risk injury to go after Keith.  And getting cheapshot in the head affects players it's called science. You can ask players like Paul Kariya or Eric Lindros they'll tell you all about it. If you don't know that then I can tell that you've never played a tough sport with intelligence and probably got rocked in the head a few times yourself. 

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8 hours ago, *Buzzsaw* said:

But now the team has evolved to the point that if Horvat and Baertschi have a good game, the Canucks stand a good chance of winning.

 

The team is becoming offensively balanced again... which hasn't been the case since Kesler's line was capable of winning games on its own.

 

If the trend continues, it is going to make it a lot more difficult for other teams to match lines against the Canucks.  ;)

 

Yup they are showing signs that they are capable of it, but what I like about the Sedin's is they've been openly challenging Bo et al to step up and take the 1st line from them. Its healthy competition and thats good.

 

Benning did some good things yesterday locking up Hutton for 3 years on a good bridge deal, and signalling the intent to want Bo long term. Ray Ferraro was p!ssy about it on 1040, but he's wrong. Its a signal to everyone that they are committed to the youth movement and everyone including the fan base needed to hear that. If they lock up Bo sooner than later, trust me the losses this year will be easier to take because its all moving towards the next stage which I think begins in about 2 seasons with the addition of Boeser and maybe a lucky 1st round F pick in the next draft. 

 

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9 minutes ago, smokes said:

Kesler couldn't even lace up Ovie's skates. Shame on you for even putting Kesler's name next to Ovie. Kesler had one 41 goal fluke season. He's never passed 30 in any of his NHL seasons before or after that fluke season. Kess didn't choose Anaheim over the twins, he chose Anaheim over the fans. If the coach was smart, he would try to develop Tryamkin's shot and use that on the first pairing but we all know he's not smart enough to try that.

 

Wow ,  I guess you must not watch hockey. Did you see last season with Kess on the Ducks, he was their BEST player by far, winning draws, scoring, big hits, give me a break bud, you do not watch much hockey, in fact I doubt you have even played. If you have actually played, you would know that Kes was the driving force behind the 2011 team, if not go back and watch the series vs Nashville. 

 

What a joke to state that his 41 were a fluke, I consider your hockey knowledge to be that of a 12 year old. 

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19 minutes ago, cbdoubleu said:

It's not about this year.

 

Sedins are under contract for another season, so there's no rush to do anything. I'd like the Sedins to sign a 2 year deal at the end of their contract and play whatever role they are able to. Having veteran guys like the Sedins around until Bo is 24 is nothing but a positive. Henrik Sedin wasn't captain at age 22.

 

This whole core is at least 3 years away from being in those prime years. Cutting the Sedins now isn't going to make good players better faster at this point. I'd rather have the kids playing so well on 2nd and 3rd lines that we're having the discussion about how they could be top line players, rather than be in a situation where you have to hope they can handle a role they should have to handle.

 

That is 3 years beyond this season. I don't see it. Ericksson, Hanson, maybe Burrows are younger and quite frankly do not need the sheltering of ozone starts that have to start going to the younger offensive players. The Twins have never shown a strong ability in the d-zone. Ideally I would hope that Benning crafts a deal that sends the Twins to a serious CUP contender for their last shot at a CUP.

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2 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

 

I think the vets can learn from the kids too. Things like hunger, drive, and enthusiasm about playing hockey.

 

I have been praying for a player like Bo to come along since Linden was traded away. Although the 2011 SC final was OK it did not compare to the all out "WAR" in 94'. Regular season stats are OK but this city needs a Stanley Cup and it will only come from players such as Bo and Kess who are willing to pay the price come playoff time.

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The Sedins still command the prime ice because of respect alone (not to mention other things).

They control the room because of respect alone.

 

For the new core to develop, the Sedins will have to take a back seat (at times). The new core to learn must be put in pressure situations including third periods when they have the lead.

There were many games last year where the Canucks had the lead going into the third, WD shortened the bench by benching the young guys and playing the vets more, only to lose the game. It was painful to watch. The young guys did not benefit by watching the collapse. In fact, I would argue, it was a bad example for the young guys to watch.

 

Many games the Sedins have made bad decisions, behind the back passes which were intercepted for odd man rushes and scoring chances for the other team. Their back check and defensive zone play, some games, is very poor. The new core see this happen without any accountability because the Sedins command respect despite their play on the ice.

 

The Sedins will always command respect from the coaches, management and players. This is why the true rebuild will not occur until the Sedins retire or take a back seat to the new core, which will never happen.

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3 minutes ago, Pete M said:

The Sedins still command the prime ice because of respect alone (not to mention other things).

They control the room because of respect alone.

 

For the new core to develop, the Sedins will have to take a back seat (at times). The new core to learn must be put in pressure situations including third periods when they have the lead.

There were many games last year where the Canucks had the lead going into the third, WD shortened the bench by benching the young guys and playing the vets more, only to lose the game. It was painful to watch. The young guys did not benefit by watching the collapse. In fact, I would argue, it was a bad example for the young guys to watch.

 

Many games the Sedins have made bad decisions, behind the back passes which were intercepted for odd man rushes and scoring chances for the other team. Their back check and defensive zone play, some games, is very poor. The new core see this happen without any accountability because the Sedins command respect despite their play on the ice.

 

The Sedins will always command respect from the coaches, management and players. This is why the true rebuild will not occur until the Sedins retire or take a back seat to the new core, which will never happen.

I think it was the Arizona game where WD closed the game out with the Tryamkin-Sbisa pairing. Sure the game was in hand but they are doing more PK'ing all the time. What really bugs me is when the Twins are out in the last 2 minutes of a tight game when the Canucks are winning.

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2 minutes ago, SaintPatrick33 said:

 

Wow ,  I guess you must not watch hockey. Did you see last season with Kess on the Ducks, he was their BEST player by far, winning draws, scoring, big hits, give me a break bud, you do not watch much hockey, in fact I doubt you have even played. If you have actually played, you would know that Kes was the driving force behind the 2011 team, if not go back and watch the series vs Nashville. 

 

What a joke to state that his 41 were a fluke, I consider your hockey knowledge to be that of a 12 year old. 

umm no, Burrows, Bieksa, and the Sedins did just as much. No Bieksa the Canucks wouldn't get past the Sharks. Henrik had 22 points, Daniel had 20 and Kesler had 19. Kesler played one good series against Nashville but was invisible in the others. Don't just pick and choose your history, you gotta see it as a whole.

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