[PGT] Jets @ Canucks

[D.B Cooper]

Where are all the Sbisa haters now? 

SbeastMode

[Canuck Surfer]

8 hours ago, Jayinblack said:

IMHO I think most here need to relax a bit with the expansion draft.  We are going to lose 1 player, just like every other team.  The important thing is really the quality of that player.  My hope is that JB is mitigating the loss by exposing the positional player that works best for us to be the more attractive player to Las Vegas. 

Right now our fwd exposure appears to be Baer or Granlund quality.  Our D appears to be Sbisa quality.   The smart thing to do (in our position of NOT being in the playoffs) would be to maximize our assets by a) realizing that dmen are simply more valuable letting Biega get enough games in to qualify for expansion c) trade a D man by the TDL.This would seem counter productive because we'd be more likely to then lose an exposed fwd (Baer/Granny).  But fwds of that caliber are simpley more accessible/extendible. 

 

We are in a position this year to take advantage of where other teams stand with regards to the expansion draft.  In the grand scheme of things we are simply NOT going to lose a valuable player relative to who other teams lose.  JB has a great opportunity now to take advantage of that.

 

In simple thinking you are dead right. D are harder to get and keep!

 

The problem is that we only get Sbisa for this year and next.  That is all he is contracted for. Then he is UFA. And he would be mad to let that opportunity pass? But we still control the long term destiny of Baer & Granlund.  And Gudbranson for that matter who we would also expose. If we wanted to save Luca?

 

Sorry > my vote does not save Luca.  It makes him a trade candidate?  And if he is not moved the next top pairing guy for the Knights...

[Googlie]

In what order do Vegas pick? Each team must lose 1 player, but if they start with the SC champ and finish with #30, and we are bottom 3rd, then they might (by the time they come to us) be picking to fill out their farm team rather than looking for a top 4 defenseman.  That would suggest we lose a cheaper, younger, fringe player than a stud.

[Rick Blight]

3 minutes ago, Googlie said:

In what order do Vegas pick? Each team must lose 1 player, but if they start with the SC champ and finish with #30, and we are bottom 3rd, then they might (by the time they come to us) be picking to fill out their farm team rather than looking for a top 4 defenseman.  That would suggest we lose a cheaper, younger, fringe player than a stud.

There is no order.

The 30 NHL Clubs must submit their Protection List by 5:00 P.M. ET on Saturday, June 17, 2017. The Las Vegas team must submit their Expansion Draft Selections by 5:00 P.M. ET on June 20 and the announcement of their selections will be released on made on June 21. 

[Crabcakes]

4 minutes ago, Googlie said:

In what order do Vegas pick? Each team must lose 1 player, but if they start with the SC champ and finish with #30, and we are bottom 3rd, then they might (by the time they come to us) be picking to fill out their farm team rather than looking for a top 4 defenseman.  That would suggest we lose a cheaper, younger, fringe player than a stud.

They're going to take the best player they can with each pick.  They'll also be filling needs more with their last few picks.

[Googlie]

Aha - so essentially Vegas looks at a list of some 100 to 300 players and picks a team with 1/2 dozen extras that will form the nucleus of their farm team.

 

So if we expose Sbisa (among others we must expose), and Vegas thinks he's one of the top 6 or 7 defensemen available, then he's gone (or Baertschi, if a forward is needed, etc)

[Rick Blight]

1 minute ago, Googlie said:

Aha - so essentially Vegas looks at a list of some 100 to 300 players and picks a team with 1/2 dozen extras that will form the nucleus of their farm team.

 

So if we expose Sbisa (among others we must expose), and Vegas thinks he's one of the top 6 or 7 defensemen available, then he's gone (or Baertschi, if a forward is needed, etc)

You might want to check out the attached link. Vegas must pick at minimum, 3 goalies, 9 d-men and 14 forwards and salaries must meet 70% or more of this year's cap.

https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-expansion-draft-rules/c-281010592

[appleboy]

1 hour ago, alfstonker said:

 

- just like JB promised he would.

I think that is the most important point of all. Even his contract looks like a deal right now. Benning seen something in him and the coaching is starting to get it out of him. Maybe Lidster is the key for our defense. He is replacing Rick Bowness nicely.

Sbisa has looked better all year. He has now played just over 400 games and it is not unusual for defense man to take 200 plus games to find their way. That goes for players like Hutton , Stecher and Tryamkin. Guddy is still very young and who knows what his sealing is.

 

Now if this team is still in the playoff hunt then there is little chance that they move anyone. If they lose Sbisa in the expansion draft fans will be all up in arms.  Benning just can't win no matter what he does.

[cbdoubleu]

Nice to see us making Rogers Arena a tougher place for the visitors to play in. 10-5-2 looks pretty good.

 

Anyone else willing to admit that this year's team has improved a lot since the start of the season? Give Willie D a little credit for that? Give Benning a little credit for some of his roster decisions that were questioned?

 

The losing streak might have cost us any real shot at the playoffs and with a young team playing minutes they're not quite ready for, we'll probably suffer another one, but this has been for the most part a fun team to watch (the semi blue collar middle of the pack in every way possible with a group of good guys that just like to play is a classic Canuck type of team), and they show up and compete against any team (haven't lost a game by more than 2 goals all month).

 

Now, let's go in to The Peg and leave with 2 more points.

[73 Percent]

3 minutes ago, cbdoubleu said:

Nice to see us making Rogers Arena a tougher place for the visitors to play in. 10-5-2 looks pretty good.

 

Anyone else willing to admit that this year's team has improved a lot since the start of the season? Give Willie D a little credit for that? Give Benning a little credit for some of his roster decisions that were questioned?

 

The losing streak might have cost us any real shot at the playoffs and with a young team playing minutes they're not quite ready for, we'll probably suffer another one, but this has been for the most part a fun team to watch (the semi blue collar middle of the pack in every way possible with a group of good guys that just like to play is a classic Canuck type of team), and they show up and compete against any team (haven't lost a game by more than 2 goals all month).

 

Now, let's go in to The Peg and leave with 2 more points.

It's nice to see a positive post around here.

[Vinny in Vancouver]

5 hours ago, Eastcoast meets Westcoast said:

Sbisa is outplaying Edler so far, has a better contract and is 5-6 years younger. If this trend continues to the TDL, Edler could be on the block and waive his NTC vs being exposed for the expansion draft. Biega will get his games in that will have the Canucks offer up one defender with a min amount of NHL experience. 

 

Sbisa is making a case to be protected, good on him.  It will make things interesting this year at the TDL.  

If my understanding is correct (and I could very well be wrong), we are allowed to protect only 3 D-men and:

• we are required to protect players with NMC or NTC (Edler and Tanev have NTC although Tanev's doesn't kick-in until this summer)
• players who have been in the league 2 years or less are automatically protected (Hutton, Tryamkin, Stecher) and do not count in that 3 D-men limit
• we need to expose a D-men who is under contract and has played in 40 or more games the prior season or 70 games combined in this season and the previous one

Isn't Edler holding all the cards due to his NTC since he can't be traded and he can't be exposed?

Basically, the Canucks are down to deciding to protect one of the following 3:

• Sbisa
• Gudbranson
• Biega

Now, if the Canucks really like both Sbisa and Gudbranson, they could try to trade Tanev for a forward or goaltender (not likely) but then they will need to protect that forward if the forward has been in the league more than 2 years, it would result in another tough decision as they would end up needing to expose 2 of: Hansen, Baertschi, Granlund.

Imho, with the Canucks' D-men depth, the most likely outcome would be that either one of the 2 get traded for a young prospect or draft pick or they just get exposed in the expansion draft.

[johngould21]

6 minutes ago, cbdoubleu said:

Nice to see us making Rogers Arena a tougher place for the visitors to play in. 10-5-2 looks pretty good.

 

Anyone else willing to admit that this year's team has improved a lot since the start of the season? Give Willie D a little credit for that? Give Benning a little credit for some of his roster decisions that were questioned?

 

The losing streak might have cost us any real shot at the playoffs and with a young team playing minutes they're not quite ready for, we'll probably suffer another one, but this has been for the most part a fun team to watch (the semi blue collar middle of the pack in every way possible with a group of good guys that just like to play is a classic Canuck type of team), and they show up and compete against any team (haven't lost a game by more than 2 goals all month).

 

Now, let's go in to The Peg and leave with 2 more points.

The next game is here, schedule again, has me scratching my old head.

[Tre Mac]

46 minutes ago, drummerboy said:

Where are all the Sbisa haters now? 

SbeastMode

Right here

[Darius]

9 minutes ago, vinny_in_vancouver said:

If my understanding is correct (and I could very well be wrong), we are allowed to protect only 3 D-men and:

• we are required to protect players with NMC or NTC (Edler and Tanev have NTC although Tanev's doesn't kick-in until this summer)
• players who have been in the league 2 years or less are automatically protected (Hutton, Tryamkin, Stecher) and do not count in that 3 D-men limit
• we need to expose a D-men who is under contract and has played in 40 or more games the prior season or 70 games combined in this season and the previous one

Isn't Edler holding all the cards due to his NTC since he can't be traded and he can't be exposed?

Basically, the Canucks are down to deciding to protect one of the following 3:

• Sbisa
• Gudbranson
• Biega

Now, if the Canucks really like both Sbisa and Gudbranson, they could try to trade Tanev for a forward or goaltender (not likely) but then they will need to protect that forward if the forward has been in the league more than 2 years, it would result in another tough decision as they would end up needing to expose 2 of: Hansen, Baertschi, Granlund.

Imho, with the Canucks' D-men depth, the most likely outcome would be that either one of the 2 get traded for a young prospect or draft pick or they just get exposed in the expansion draft.

 

I think exposing Baertschi would be a big mistake. It is perfectly reasonable at this point to start thinking he might get 50 points this season. Thats practically top line material.  How many guys do the Canucks have that can get 45-55 points aside from the Sedins?  Bo maybe?   He leads the team in terms of points per 60 minutes.  They have been struggling for years to find young top 6 forwards, they are watching one develop right now,  I sure hope they find a way to keep him - unless he goes against the grain of what he has done for the first part of this season and latter part of last season and collapses.

 

I doubt JB trades or exposes Gudbranson - hes JB's boy, a guy he talked up all off season and a guy he gave up McCann + other assets for.  

 

Dont know what the solution is but in the grand scheme of things I suppose its a good problem to have....

 

 

 

[Rick Blight]

10 minutes ago, vinny_in_vancouver said:

If my understanding is correct (and I could very well be wrong), we are allowed to protect only 3 D-men and:

• we are required to protect players with NMC or NTC (Edler and Tanev have NTC although Tanev's doesn't kick-in until this summer)
• players who have been in the league 2 years or less are automatically protected (Hutton, Tryamkin, Stecher) and do not count in that 3 D-men limit
• we need to expose a D-men who is under contract and has played in 40 or more games the prior season or 70 games combined in this season and the previous one

Isn't Edler holding all the cards due to his NTC since he can't be traded and he can't be exposed?

Basically, the Canucks are down to deciding to protect one of the following 3:

• Sbisa
• Gudbranson
• Biega

Now, if the Canucks really like both Sbisa and Gudbranson, they could try to trade Tanev for a forward or goaltender (not likely) but then they will need to protect that forward if the forward has been in the league more than 2 years, it would result in another tough decision as they would end up needing to expose 2 of: Hansen, Baertschi, Granlund.

Imho, with the Canucks' D-men depth, the most likely outcome would be that either one of the 2 get traded for a young prospect or draft pick or they just get exposed in the expansion draft.

Players with NTC's can be exposed for the draft. NMC's must be protected.

[Derp...]

Sbisa is making a case to be protected though. I do think if the Canucks are considering exposing him, he would be a good option to trade to a contender who needs a D to expose. They could probably get a second and third for Sbisa from a middle of the pack team, or even a late first from a contender.

 

That would allow them to protect their top 3, plus the 3 exempt, while picking up a couple good picks. 

 

Don't know if it would happen, but Sbisa is gaining trade value.

[Vinny in Vancouver]

4 minutes ago, Rick Blight said:

Players with NTC's can be exposed for the draft. NMC's must be protected.

That's the part where I was really unsure of. Earlier this summer, there were quite a few articles saying that NTC's need to be protected:

http://www.ctvnews.ca/sports/nhl-expansion-who-can-las-vegas-take-from-your-favourite-team-1.2958631

But now, from some articles I've read, I haven't seen that mentioned any more.

 

[Rick Blight]

39 minutes ago, Googlie said:

Aha - so essentially Vegas looks at a list of some 100 to 300 players and picks a team with 1/2 dozen extras that will form the nucleus of their farm team.

 

So if we expose Sbisa (among others we must expose), and Vegas thinks he's one of the top 6 or 7 defensemen available, then he's gone (or Baertschi, if a forward is needed, etc)

You make an interesting point about stocking their farm system. They presumably will want to draft some players that will not require waivers to be sent down to the minors and that may influence their draft selections. They also get a 2 day head start on other teams for signing UFA's that may make their NHL roster so they may want to take a number of players that are waiver ineligible. Otherwise, a number of the players they draft will be back on waivers and going back to their original teams or any other team making a claim?

[messier's_elbow]

14 minutes ago, Derp... said:

Sbisa is making a case to be protected though. I do think if the Canucks are considering exposing him, he would be a good option to trade to a contender who needs a D to expose. They could probably get a second and third for Sbisa from a middle of the pack team, or even a late first from a contender.

 

That would allow them to protect their top 3, plus the 3 exempt, while picking up a couple good picks. 

 

Don't know if it would happen, but Sbisa is gaining trade value.

We can't lose him for nothing, even if we just get a 3rd back... if we lose him to vegas right when he's showing signs he's a top 4.... that would be frustrating.

[CeeBee51]

Just now, messier's_elbow said:

We can't lose him for nothing, even if we just get a 3rd back... if we lose him to vegas right when he's showing signs he's a top 4.... that would be frustrating.

We have to lose somebody for nothing. Most teams stand to lose a better player than we do.