Should the Canucks ask Subban to switch to the wing immediately??

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

In junior there's Brisebois, he did get the invite at least to the team Canada tryouts. Or Olson. 

Yeah...neither of those guys have Subban's offensive skills. They may very well become decent 2 way 7/8 guys (same with McEneny), Brisebois maybe even a 4-6 guy but that's not the same role.

[JM_]

14 minutes ago, J.R. said:

Yeah...neither of those guys have Subban's offensive skills. They may very well become decent 2 way 7/8 guys (same with McEneny), Brisebois maybe even a 4-6 guy but that's not the same role.

Yah but after watching Larsen last night I don't think we need more "offensive" D with poor D skills. No, our D scoring of the future is going to have to come from OJ and Stecher moving forward. Maybe Tryamkin a little bit. 

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, S'all Good Man said:

Yah but after watching Larsen last night I don't think we need more "offensive" D with poor D skills. No, our D scoring of the future is going to have to come from OJ and Stecher moving forward. Maybe Tryamkin a little bit. 

 

1 hour ago, J.R. said:

 

We're still going to need a 7/8, 'spare' offensive D in a couple years. And if the stars align and he actually learns how to play passable D in his own end and against men, he could actually be a better player than Stetcher in a few years as he has a higher offensive ceiling.

 

That's a big if though.

 

[Drakrami]

2 hours ago, Matt_T83 said:

There was a recent forum post by Hortankin about how the future is brighter than a lot of people see, which I agree with now. Especially with the emergence of Troy Stetcher and Nikita Tryamkin on defense, we look set for years to come. I'm not sure if Alex Edler will re-sign with us or not (I hope does), but even without him we have: Tanev, Tryamkin, Hutton, Stetcher, Gudbranson, and Juolevi coming up. All of those guys will be in the NHL and heading towards/at their primes in 3-4 years. I just don't see room for Subban to earn a regular spot in that group.

 

But it's clear the kid has some serious skills and scoring touch. I honestly see him as a player much like Johnny Gaudreau. It doesn't make sense trying to improve his play at defense when the fundamental problem is size, which he can't change.

 

I would argue he could make the Canucks as a 3rd line winger within 2 years, maybe even next season. And he would be an extremely versatile forward. Unlike most young wingers, he would probably start off defensively sound. And he has tons of powerplay experience -- he could immediately step in and quarterback the 2nd PP unit from the blue line. 

 

To me I just see him as so much more valuable being a 3rd line winger, rather than a 4th pairing depth defenseman. 

 

 

Why force a kid with potential to change his position? Either have him in your plans or trade him, win/win. 

[canuckledraggin]

1 hour ago, J.R. said:

Yeah...neither of those guys have Subban's offensive skills. They may very well become decent 2 way 7/8 guys (same with McEneny), Brisebois maybe even a 4-6 guy but that's not the same role.

I watched a couple of Islanders games recently and I can tell you that Brisebois runs that team when he's on the ice. His skating is extremely smooth and he reads the play well. He looks like a carbon copy of Juolevi.

[aGENT]

13 minutes ago, canuckledraggin said:

I watched a couple of Islanders games recently and I can tell you that Brisebois runs that team when he's on the ice. His skating is extremely smooth and he reads the play well. He looks like a carbon copy of Juolevi.

Yeah, he looks very promising. I don't think he has Juolevi's ultimate ceiling but he could very well become a solid 2nd pair D if he reaches his ceiling.

[UticaHockey]

I get tired of hearing Comets fans that keep suggesting moving Subban to a wing.  Jordan Subban's biggest obstacle that he has to overcome to make it to the NHL is the fact that he is 5'9" and about a buck eighty.  That isn't going to change if he plays defense, wing, center or goalie for that matter.  Jordan loves to rush the puck end to end but that is not where most of his scoring comes from.  He is most effective at the blueline on the power play in the 1-3-1 like someone previously mentioned.  he walks the line extremely well and can get the puck on net.  Defensively he struggles and still needs more time to develop in the AHL.  If he can become less of a liability during 5 on 5 play then he will get his shot in the NHL.

 

He is a perimeter player and moving him to forward would likely not have the effect that most posters asking for that change think will happen.  He is just too small to accomplish anything around the net as a forward and wouldn't be very good on the forecheck either IMHO.

 

Jordan's main problem is very evident in this picture.  Andy Zilich our radio guy next to him is not in skates and is not all that tall.

 

[Drakrami]

12 minutes ago, UticaHockey said:

I get tired of hearing Comets fans that keep suggesting moving Subban to a wing.  Jordan Subban's biggest obstacle that he has to overcome to kake it to the NHL is the fact that he is 5'9" and about a buck eighty.  That isn't going to change if he plays defense, wing, center or goalie for that matter.  Jordan loves to rush the puck end to end but that is not where most of his scoring comes from.  He is most effective at the blueline on the power play in the 1-3-1 like someone previously mentioned.  he walks the line extremely well and can get the puck on net.  Defensively he struggles and still needs more time to develop in the AHL.  If he can become less of a liability during 5 on 5 play then he will get his shot in the NHL.

 

He is a perimeter player and moving him to forward would likely not have the effect that most posters asking for that change think will happen.  He is just too small to accomplish anything around the net as a forward and wouldn't be very good on the forecheck either IMHO.

 

Jordan's main problem is very evident in this picture.  Andy Zilich our radio guy next to him is not in skates and is not all that tall.

 

Tory Krug should retire asap then, let alone playing 20+ minutes a night for Boston. (Along with Barrie, Campbell, Spurgeon, etc...) This argument that short players arent NHL capable on here is beyond ridiculous. 

[UticaHockey]

8 minutes ago, Drakrami said:

Tory Krug should retire asap then, let alone playing 20+ minutes a night for Boston. (Along with Barrie, Campbell, Spurgeon, etc...) This argument that short players arent NHL capable on here is beyond ridiculous. 

Its not impossible but it makes it more difficult and switching him to a wing doesn't solve the problem. 

[D.B Cooper]

27 minutes ago, Drakrami said:

Tory Krug should retire asap then, let alone playing 20+ minutes a night for Boston. (Along with Barrie, Campbell, Spurgeon, etc...) This argument that short players arent NHL capable on here is beyond ridiculous. 

Your argument is ridiculous.  

He isn't Krug or Barrie. 

He is a shrimpish Subban who refuses to play D. 

His size isn't his main issue.   It is his lack of size between the ears. 

The guy doesn't think the game like a defenseman. At all.  He is a hotdogger that refuses to play position.  

[Fakename70]

On 2017-02-03 at 1:20 PM, drummerboy said:

Your argument is ridiculous.  

He isn't Krug or Barrie. 

He is a shrimpish Subban who refuses to play D. 

His size isn't his main issue.   It is his lack of size between the ears. 

The guy doesn't think the game like a defenseman. At all.  He is a hotdogger that refuses to play position.  

You sure? Ben Hutton is a converted LW. You honestly believe he's any good as an NHL "defenceman"? I don't hear too many people complaining about his attention to detail more at the offensive end than in his own zone. And, as an offencive defenceman, not once have I ever heard/read CDC'rs complaining he  "doesn't think the game like a defenceman. At all. He is a hotdogger that refuses to play position."

Going to be funny remembering comments like yours when Subban is traded (or lost to expansion, if eligible) and finally cracks an NHL roster from training camp after being recognised for being the unique talent that he is. 

[Gomez'sSlapshot]

On 2/3/2017 at 9:25 AM, Matt_T83 said:

There was a recent forum post by Hortankin about how the future is brighter than a lot of people see, which I agree with now. Especially with the emergence of Troy Stetcher and Nikita Tryamkin on defense, we look set for years to come. I'm not sure if Alex Edler will re-sign with us or not (I hope does), but even without him we have: Tanev, Tryamkin, Hutton, Stetcher, Gudbranson, and Juolevi coming up. All of those guys will be in the NHL and heading towards/at their primes in 3-4 years. I just don't see room for Subban to earn a regular spot in that group.

 

But it's clear the kid has some serious skills and scoring touch. I honestly see him as a player much like Johnny Gaudreau. It doesn't make sense trying to improve his play at defense when the fundamental problem is size, which he can't change.

 

I would argue he could make the Canucks as a 3rd line winger within 2 years, maybe even next season. And he would be an extremely versatile forward. Unlike most young wingers, he would probably start off defensively sound. And he has tons of powerplay experience -- he could immediately step in and quarterback the 2nd PP unit from the blue line. 

 

To me I just see him as so much more valuable being a 3rd line winger, rather than a 4th pairing depth defenseman. 

 

 

I really don't.  Forward and D are so different  - there's a reason that you hardly ever see this.  Besides, Utica needs a PP QB.

[Gomez'sSlapshot]

On 2/3/2017 at 9:33 AM, Bur14Kes17 said:

I think that's a discussion we could have after the Canucks management and Willie actually give him a fair shake in the NHL but not before then. If Subban could replicate his AHL point totals and game into the NHL, I'd be more then happy with that. But I certainly wouldn't be the guy to tell him he needs to play a different position before I gave him the chance to show me what he could do. 

Jim.. Willie... I hope you read this

I hope you know that they won't.  Seriously. 

[Gomez'sSlapshot]

On 2/11/2017 at 5:15 PM, Fakename70 said:

You sure? Ben Hutton is a converted LW. You honestly believe he's any good as an NHL "defenceman"? I don't hear too many people complaining about his attention to detail more at the offensive end than in his own zone. And, as an offencive defenceman, not once have I ever heard/read CDC'rs complaining he  "doesn't think the game like a defenceman. At all. He is a hotdogger that refuses to play position."

Going to be funny remembering comments like yours when Subban is traded (or lost to expansion, if eligible) and finally cracks an NHL roster from training camp after being recognised for being the unique talent that he is. 

Are you serious?  That's your argument?  Hutton plays good D because he learned it in a great hockey program for several years, therefore Subban isn't a hotdogger?  They're both Canuck property, they're both somewhat offense-oriented, therefore they're the same?

 

Did I miss something?

[Fakename70]

On 2017-02-03 at 11:18 AM, Drakrami said:

Why force a kid with potential to change his position? Either have him in your plans or trade him, win/win. 

Ben Hutton

[Fakename70]

8 minutes ago, Gomez'sSlapshot said:

Are you serious?  That's your argument?  Hutton plays good D because he learned it in a great hockey program for several years, therefore Subban isn't a hotdogger?  They're both Canuck property, they're both somewhat offense-oriented, therefore they're the same?

 

Did I miss something?

Yeah, you missed something. Nowhere have I ever implied, privately nor publicly, that "Hutton plays good D". 

And, is Jordan a "hotdogger"? Or, just more instinctive and effective on offence? And, as offensive defencemen I don't think they're quite "the same" at all. 

[Salmonberries]

They should have made the switch out of junior last year a la Scott Walker imo.

[tas]

i'm sorry, but when did being absolutely abysmal defensively and being completely unable to win a puck battle become tolerated traits of a bottom 6 nhl winger?

 

moving subban to wing wouldn't shelter his weaknesses, it would make them even more glaring. 

[Ghostsof1915]

On 2017-02-03 at 0:59 PM, UticaHockey said:

Its not impossible but it makes it more difficult and switching him to a wing doesn't solve the problem. 

Gaudreau - 5'9" 157 lbs. That's right, 159 lbs. Left Wing.

Patrick Kane- 5'11" 177 lbs. Right Wing

 

All are wingers, with none of the defenders responsibilities, and are just there to score and make plays. Care to elaborate how switching him to wing doesn't solve the problem? Jordan Subban- 5'9" 178 lbs Defence.

My observation of Subban's skill set, is defence is an issue with him. So lets turn his liabilities into a strength. He can work on being a 2 way player on wing. And best of all could be a utility guy being able to play wing and d. I'm sorry, it looks like to me it solves the problem. And makes it more likely he can play in the NHL. 

 

 

http://howtohockey.com/the-role-of-a-winger-in-hockey/

[UticaHockey]

52 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Gaudreau - 5'9" 157 lbs. That's right, 159 lbs. Left Wing.

Patrick Kane- 5'11" 177 lbs. Right Wing

 

All are wingers, with none of the defenders responsibilities, and are just there to score and make plays. Care to elaborate how switching him to wing doesn't solve the problem? Jordan Subban- 5'9" 178 lbs Defence.

My observation of Subban's skill set, is defence is an issue with him. So lets turn his liabilities into a strength. He can work on being a 2 way player on wing. And best of all could be a utility guy being able to play wing and d. I'm sorry, it looks like to me it solves the problem. And makes it more likely he can play in the NHL. 

 

 

http://howtohockey.com/the-role-of-a-winger-in-hockey/

You are comparing a #1 overall draft pick and a Hobbie Baker award winner to support your argument.  Yes there are always exceptions where 5'9" players that are truly exceptional become NHL stars. But the AHL is full of small high scoring forwards that have never been able to produce in the NHL. And to take it a step further the ECHL has even more high scoring small forwards that have not been able to put up numbers in the AHL.  

 

Size does matter and the odds of Jordan Subban changing positions and becoming a successful NHL forward are extremely low and in my opinion much lower than him making it as a defenseman his natural position.