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Arizona-Van (Proposal)


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D. Strome + 2017 1st (7 OA)

for

Tanev + 2018 1st(unprotected) + Demko + Van's 2017 3rd (69th OA) + J. Subban

 

Why Arizona does this:

 

With Keller already playing in Arizona and Strome is dispensable (not that he is not very good), They also get Demko and a unprotected 2018 1st, that should be a top 5, but in any case this with the addition of Tanev completes their rebuild, they use the Canucks 2018 1st to pick another top end dman in a much stronger draft......

 

Why Vancouver does this:

 

Not only getting us our 1st line center.....we also get 2 picks in the top 10 of the 2017 draft.. Our team, although young starts to look competitive in the future......

 

We draft

Van's 2017 (5 OA).........Makar/Liljegren*/Heiskanen                (Liljegren played sick all year...got to cut him some slack- Mono)

Arz;s 2017 (7 OA)..........Glass/Tippett/

Van's 2017 (33 OA)........Oettinger

 

Canucks 2019-2020 Roster

Goldobin/Strome/Tippett/Boeser

Baertschi/Horvat/Boeser/Glass

Granlund/Dalhen/Eriksson

Molino/Gaudette/Virtanen

 

Joulevi/Liljegren

Hutton/Stecher

Brisebois/Gundbranson

Pedan/McEneny

 

Markstrom

Oettinger

 

Yes it hurts, but its very competitive...this does not include any picks that might develop in the mean time, nor our 2019 1st round pick, that should be very high. And only has 1 UFA in Eriksson, so this allows us plenty of room $ for UFA signings, and experience

 

Hey, I try!

 

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Just now, janisahockeynut said:

LOL....why?

 

1) I don't think Strome is very good. Should not give up anything significant for him at all.

 

2) We shouldn't be going all in on acquiring assets this draft. We should do it for either of the next 2 drafts (I would prefer next year).

 

3) We shouldn't give up our 1st in 2018 under any normal circumstances, let alone leaving it unprotected. The only way we should even consider using it in a trade should be for someone like MacKinnon and even then it's iffy depending on where we land. 

 

4) We shouldn't give up Demko for anything less than what I said in #3. A potential star goalie is worth too much to our team. A goalie is by far the single most important player on a team and en elite goalie can carry weaker team's farther than they should go. 

 

5) This year, given our lottery luck, should be about adding depth to our organization. We shouldn't give up that much organizational depth in any normal circumstance. 

 

6) Arizona is likely going to start Keller on the wing at the NHL level and he might not even be a center for them moving forward. Still a very good player, just not down the middle. 

 

7) I don't think Tippet should even be in consideration for us. We have Boeser on RW with Virtanen and Goldobin being able to play either. He doesn't have the ability to create offense and is not dynamic. I also think Makar is a bit too risky for us. We already have a very similar player in Stetcher that has already proven he can play at the NHL level as opposed to the AJHL. 

 

8) That future forward group, assuming all your trades/picks happen, does not have a good mix of size, speed and skill. 

 

9) I think Oettinger would be a great pickup for us, but there is close to 0% chance he is ready for a backup role in as little as 2 years. Not even Demko was/is.

 

So yeah, no.

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That's a HARD NO!

 

Before you ask why - Demko and the '18 first is,  imo,  way more value alone than what we'd be receiving.   Demko has the potential to be elite and next year's first could be a borderline generational player.   

 

Perspective people,  perspective. 

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20 minutes ago, Horvat is a Boss said:

 

1) I don't think Strome is very good. Should not give up anything significant for him at all.

    Well, I am not sure why you think he is not very good.....score just about 2 points a game in junior....he is 6'3", he'll probably weigh in at about 205 when mature.

    Scored 10 points in 7 games at the U-20's. But that is junior so I don't know

2) We shouldn't be going all in on acquiring assets this draft. We should do it for either of the next 2 drafts (I would prefer next year).

     I will not argue that point, only to say, I was trying to speed up the process

3) We shouldn't give up our 1st in 2018 under any normal circumstances, let alone leaving it unprotected. The only way we should even consider using it in a trade should be for someone like MacKinnon and even then it's iffy depending on where we land. 

     I don't think you get McKinnon for a early pick alone.....least not yet

4) We shouldn't give up Demko for anything less than what I said in #3. A potential star goalie is worth too much to our team. A goalie is by far the single most important player on a team and en elite goalie can carry weaker team's farther than they should go. 

     "Potential" and not ranked the highest not in the NHL.....But I love him too

5) This year, given our lottery luck, should be about adding depth to our organization. We shouldn't give up that much organizational depth in any normal circumstance. 

      Well, I think 2 top ten's is a lot of Organizational depth....just saying

6) Arizona is likely going to start Keller on the wing at the NHL level and he might not even be a center for them moving forward. Still a very good player, just not down the middle. 

    Don't think Keller will be on the wing...he's too light....but one never knows

7) I don't think Tippet should even be in consideration for us. We have Boeser on RW with Virtanen and Goldobin being able to play either. He doesn't have the ability to create offense and is not dynamic. I also think Makar is a bit too risky for us. We already have a very similar player in Stetcher that has already proven he can play at the NHL level as opposed to the AJHL. 

     Tippett is a scoring machine...clutch...he has other faults, scoring isn't one of them......we need scoring right? Virtanen has not proven himself anywhere yet, although     he is a fast and hits well...the rest remains to be seen. I love Goldobin, he is unpredictable in the offensive zone, but he plays both wings, so I would keep him on the left side. Makar, I am not sure about, but he is good, but I would rather go with Liljegren, then Heiskanen, but Makar has been scouted extensively and is thought to be top ten in most scouting opinions......

8) That future forward group, assuming all your trades/picks happen, does not have a good mix of size, speed and skill. 

You don't draft for size....I would have thought Jake would have proved that to you?

9) I think Oettinger would be a great pickup for us, but there is close to 0% chance he is ready for a backup role in as little as 2 years. Not even Demko was/is.

Well a decent UFA back up would work while waiting

 

So yeah, no.

But sincerly thanks for answering me back...don't profess to be right...just what I was thinking, as I try to forget tonight

 

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24 minutes ago, Fanuck said:

That's a HARD NO!

 

Before you ask why - Demko and the '18 first is,  imo,  way more value alone than what we'd be receiving.   Demko has the potential to be elite and next year's first could be a borderline generational player.   

 

Perspective people,  perspective. 

You guys would know better, but we entered this lottery with the 2nd best odds....we are drafting at #5......Strome "is/was" a number 3 overall in a strong draft

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A lot of people will give a hard no because we're not completely fleecing the other team as in the majority of the proposals on here.

 

I think the value is fair and close to what would be asked by Arizona. I don't know what I would add to be honest but I wouldnt want to give up next years 1st.

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7 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

D. Strome + 2017 1st (7 OA)

for

Tanev + 2018 1st(unprotected) + Demko + Van's 2017 3rd (69th OA) + J. Subban

 

Interesting idea, probably the amount of worth required to get someone like Strome and such a high pick, but I think we give too much, especially considering Demko might be a future top goaltender and the 2018 1st rounder may be a top-3 pick.

 

TO VAN: Strome + 2017 1st round pick (7th overall) + 5th round pick (to even up numbers a bit only)

TO ARI: Tanev + Gaudette + 2nd round pick 2017 + Virtanen + 3rd round pick in 2018

 

Simple broken down, Strome is a bit overrated but still putting up monster numbers. Use Tanev to upgrade someone like Gaudette into Strome with the help of 3rd rounder in 2018.

 

7th overall in 2017 for Virtanen (former 6th overall) + a 2nd round pick for his drop in value. Seems fair if not a bit over-kill.

 

1 - Draft Heiskanen and Tippett in 2017.

2 - Draft BPA in 2018 

3 - 2019-2020 roster:

 

Dahlen - Strome - Tippett

Baertschi - Horvat - Boeser

Granlund - Sutter - Goldobin

UFA - Gaunce - UFA

 

Heiskanen - Stecher

Juolevi - Gudbranson

Hutton - Sbisa

Subban

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Demko taken today would likely be a first rounder.

Tanev   taken today would likely be a first rounder.

Our first next year is conceivably a top 5 overall with the possibility of being 1st overall. 

 

So you essentially want to give up 3 firsts,  a third,  and a prospect for Strome and a first?

 

Hard No! 

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@janisahockeynut I want to apologize. I didn't have to be so condescending when I offered my thoughts on your proposal. I guess it was an extension of my disappointment with the lottery.  We're all here to talk hockey and I shouldn't have acted like that. 

 

Now, that doesn't mean I agree with you now :P. I don't think Strome will translate very well to the NHL due to his lack of skating ability and his attitude. His skating hasn't improved very much, if at all, since he was drafted. At the WJC, it was easy to see that he tried to make the plays that made himself look the best, at least to me. 

 

The point that we should only give up our 2018 first for someone like MacKinnon was me trying to hammer home that trading that pick won't happen because Colorado wouldn't do that. 

 

If you are going to take points away from Demko by saying he only has "potential," then what does that mean for Strome? He certainly isn't a #1C in the NHL, but he has the potential to be. 

 

I don't think 2 top 10 picks in a weak draft year really bolsters our organizational depth when you trade away other pieces. Depth is more than just 2 players (in this case, new players). Think about Pittsburgh. They had Crosby and Malkin, but couldn't do anything for a stretch because they didn't have enough depth. That is a condensed version of what I'm trying to convery. If you can spread that ideology out to an entire organization, we would be in better shape, especially given that we won't get a Crosby or Malkin in this draft. 

 

Why would you be too light for the winger position? If anything, center is the forward position that would preferably have some size. 

 

I just really don't think Tippet is who we should be going after. I'm torn on Liljegren, but he could be something good. 

 

I'm not saying we have to draft for size, just that the way that forward group is assembled is too soft. I'm not saying we need to go full Bruins, but we need some pushback. Out of 12 forwards, I'm only confident in 2 holding their own in all situations physically (Horvat and Virtanen). 

 

I understand the overall concept of what your trying to do, speed up the rebuild, but I think it would end up causing more harm than good. Thanks for your ideas though!

 

P.S. In the future, if you reply outside the quote box then I can quote you back. Right now it comes up blank when I try to quote your post that was replying to me earlier, unless this computer has got me again :lol:

 

 

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