Rob_Zepp Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share Posted June 7, 2017 4 hours ago, Toews said: While I do not necessarily agree with everything The Guardian says, he is still a fan and as such has a right to voice his opinion. You sir do not get to decide what being a fan actually entails. If someone has invested years into watching this team then they have every right to complain about the team if they choose to. If you have never once complained about the team then congrats you are a beacon of positivity but that does not mean that everyone has to follow your example. The ultimate goal is winning the Cup and that is what every team should be striving to achieve. Also while there are soon to be 31 teams in the NHL, not all are on an equal footing. The Canucks have a decisive advantage over a team like the Coyotes. You might have different expectations but that doesn't make you a better "fan". I agree I don't define what a "fan" is but clearly he is in anguish and cannot be enjoying this at all. Stepping away from the keyboard or finding a new team would seemingly be healthy choices. Of course the ultimate goal is winning the Cup and any fan would love to see their team do that but if all you can do is moan about the team and criticize relentless everything that team does, how on earth can that be enjoyable? If you have expectations in life that are more likely not to be met, at least in the near term, it sure doesn't mean you give up but surely live would be a living hell if you didn't have some intermediate realistic objectives to focus on too. PS - in all my years on the planet and many of them trying to make a living as an athlete, other than hotel check-in clerks and the occasional airline flight attendant, no one has ever call me "sir" so I will consider this quite an honor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share Posted June 7, 2017 8 hours ago, elvis15 said: But then, you never really put yourself out there with some specifics on how that could be possible. All you've said is a lot of generic things to be held to no matter what, when sometimes you have to break the rules for the right deal. If you have some ideas - which is the point of a proposal - then feel free to come back and add them to this thread. Otherwise we've all heard this before. "Out there". Hmmm. OK, draft with all your own picks and try and pry other picks/prospects at deadline if you have the assets to trade. Until you have a strong minor league system, it will be a house of cards to do otherwise. As far as ideas, stop trying to trade 10 point D-men for first round draft picks and instead if you are going to flip an asset like that, focus on a prospect that needs a change of scenery and hit that concept hard. I don't have a specific target as I don't know what is in Canuck's management head right now - it it was up to me, I would look to those teams with clearly deep minor league systems (Nashville, Columbus, Florida and a few others come to mind) and go a diggin'. I would also live with more mistakes than WD did and I would also split your two twins up to centre a second and third line each leaving Horvat to centre the first line and "insert experiment here" on the fourth. Sedins have become too slow and easy to defend in the new defensive zone coverages but both remain elite playmakers and could do wonders for wingers with speed and grit plus some polish. Oh, and give Rodin all the time in the world to make the team this fall. I had the ability to watch him play live in Europe and he is amazing with the puck in tight places and can make something out of nothing like few in the Vancouver system can. Finally, don't trade your draft picks (if you didn't get that already). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 1 minute ago, Rob_Zepp said: I agree I don't define what a "fan" is but clearly he is in anguish and cannot be enjoying this at all. Stepping away from the keyboard or finding a new team would seemingly be healthy choices. Of course the ultimate goal is winning the Cup and any fan would love to see their team do that but if all you can do is moan about the team and criticize relentless everything that team does, how on earth can that be enjoyable? If you have expectations in life that are more likely not to be met, at least in the near term, it sure doesn't mean you give up but surely live would be a living hell if you didn't have some intermediate realistic objectives to focus on too. PS - in all my years on the planet and many of them trying to make a living as an athlete, other than hotel check-in clerks and the occasional airline flight attendant, no one has ever call me "sir" so I will consider this quite an honor. For most people finding a new team is never going to happen. People will watch other teams but no other team winning will give you the same joy as the team you started loving as a kid. This is why teams like the Cleveland Browns still have passionate fans. Your team could end up being an eternal vortex of suck like the Oilers used to be but the nature of fandom is to not give up on your team. As much as it sucks to be a fan of one of those teams there is still the hope that one day things will turn around. And fans stick around due to that hope. You might call it misguided or misplaced but sports fandom is not rational. Ask yourself how difficult would it be for you to abandon the Canucks and go cheer for the Oilers because they have the more talented squad. No doubt there are some that will do just that but I would argue that they weren't Canucks fans to begin with. I am a fan of teams in multiple sports. Complaining about your team is part and parcel of being a fan. Fans can be harsh critics of their teams but ultimately this is due to expectations. Is it fun to do it? No but it's still your right if you have supported the team through thick and thin. Haha I won't say anything to burst your bubble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12-16-FG Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 The only new defensive system that the NHL employ's is the non calls by the referee's. The neutral zone trap has been around since the sixties when i grew up, The difference is , wait for it. Are the players, they are faster and in better shape. Hell I still remember when players came to training camp with a six pack and a cigarette hanging out of their mouth. I to don't like it when a team sends draft picks away for a player, who is on the short end of his career, but it is what it is.As for the Canucks, we all see the formation of thing to come in the teams future, still needs time and patience. I for 1 would like to see what JB can get for Tanev, i believe it will be more than just a first round pick, but thats me. And a GM some where feels the same, and remember a draft pick dosnt mean instant player, potential only. An NHL player is real, has milage and can produce, your prospect hasn't. That's why in this article ARMCHAIR GM, it is what it is, fans giving their two cents worth on what they would like to see or perhaps would do themselves. There is no wrong or right to it and no explanation to the madness. Be kind to each other, it is only fantasy. Like when Toronto fans think they can get Tanev for a box of ore's, or for a fourth line D-man #6 or #7 or a second line AHL player. Funny as that may sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted June 7, 2017 Author Share Posted June 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Toews said: For most people finding a new team is never going to happen. People will watch other teams but no other team winning will give you the same joy as the team you started loving as a kid. This is why teams like the Cleveland Browns still have passionate fans. Your team could end up being an eternal vortex of suck like the Oilers used to be but the nature of fandom is to not give up on your team. As much as it sucks to be a fan of one of those teams there is still the hope that one day things will turn around. And fans stick around due to that hope. You might call it misguided or misplaced but sports fandom is not rational. Ask yourself how difficult would it be for you to abandon the Canucks and go cheer for the Oilers because they have the more talented squad. No doubt there are some that will do just that but I would argue that they weren't Canucks fans to begin with. I am a fan of teams in multiple sports. Complaining about your team is part and parcel of being a fan. Fans can be harsh critics of their teams but ultimately this is due to expectations. Is it fun to do it? No but it's still your right if you have supported the team through thick and thin. Haha I won't say anything to burst your bubble. Nope, bubble fully intact. Complaining is one thing - obsessing and finding NOTHING good is another. Again, each to their own. Vancouver is my third favourite NHL team as their management once upon a time did something kind for me in my life/career. My other two teams have not had a ton of recent success but there is a cup between then (Canes and Panthers if you must know). Growing up I was a huge fan of the Rangers but that faded for some reason once I was playing more seriously. I find two types of negative posters - you seem to be part of a group that is frustrated and wants things to improve. The other group is one that seems they will never be happy no matter what happens and cannot seem to find any joy in following the team. It is that latter group that is hard to understand. Back to the thread - don't trade any picks!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 13 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: Nope, bubble fully intact. Complaining is one thing - obsessing and finding NOTHING good is another. Again, each to their own. Vancouver is my third favourite NHL team as their management once upon a time did something kind for me in my life/career. My other two teams have not had a ton of recent success but there is a cup between then (Canes and Panthers if you must know). Growing up I was a huge fan of the Rangers but that faded for some reason once I was playing more seriously. I find two types of negative posters - you seem to be part of a group that is frustrated and wants things to improve. The other group is one that seems they will never be happy no matter what happens and cannot seem to find any joy in following the team. It is that latter group that is hard to understand. Back to the thread - don't trade any picks!!!!! I suspect there is a 3rd group...fans from other teams that get great joy in seeing the Canucks in the bottom of the NHL. These people are even more pathetic. I'm kind of proud of our team's fans. I haven't seen one single jersey thrown on the ice, or a bag covered head at a game. The worst I ever saw, was those poor kids on the Oilers being booed by a group of fans as they walked single file to their dressing room. That was kind of disturbing. I hope I never see things like that during our team's hard times. The team has, and will continue to provide opportunities to become 'ugly fans' and I hope that Canuck fans refuse to sink to those depths. We are all Canucks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 35 minutes ago, higgyfan said: I suspect there is a 3rd group...fans from other teams that get great joy in seeing the Canucks in the bottom of the NHL. These people are even more pathetic. I'm kind of proud of our team's fans. I haven't seen one single jersey thrown on the ice, or a bag covered head at a game. The worst I ever saw, was those poor kids on the Oilers being booed by a group of fans as they walked single file to their dressing room. That was kind of disturbing. I hope I never see things like that during our team's hard times. The team has, and will continue to provide opportunities to become 'ugly fans' and I hope that Canuck fans refuse to sink to those depths. We are all Canucks! I think it takes a level of frustration above and beyond when you start to see such incidents. I don't blame the Oilers fan that tossed their jersey. I don't think people understand how truly awful it must have been to be an Oilers fan for the past decade, and you are right hopefully we never get to that point. When you are a loyal fan and your team is just unbelievably bad for a long time and there seems to be no end in sight, fans begin to take matters into their own hands. They want to convey their frustrations to the management group and get their voices heard to put pressure on those on top to do something. Its shortsighted, and doesn't accomplish anything but it does get people to pay attention and as fans it can sometimes feel that the people running the organization aren't paying attention at all. As someone that follows European football, I have seen what frustration can do to fans. Tossing a jersey seems rather tame in comparison to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 2 minutes ago, Toews said: I think it takes a level of frustration above and beyond when you start to see such incidents. I don't blame the Oilers fan that tossed their jersey. I don't think people understand how truly awful it must have been to be an Oilers fan for the past decade, and you are right hopefully we never get to that point. When you are a loyal fan and your team is just unbelievably bad for a long time and there seems to be no end in sight, fans begin to take matters into their own hands. They want to convey their frustrations to the management group and get their voices heard to put pressure on those on top to do something. Its shortsighted, and doesn't accomplish anything but it does get people to pay attention and as fans it can sometimes feel that the people running the organization aren't paying attention at all. As someone that follows European football, I have seen what frustration can do to fans. Tossing a jersey seems rather tame in comparison to that. The worst I ever saw, was those poor kids on the Oilers being booed by a group of fans as they walked single file to their dressing room. That was kind of disturbing. Was that a message to the management team as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 Just now, higgyfan said: The worst I ever saw, was those poor kids on the Oilers being booed by a group of fans as they walked single file to their dressing room. That was kind of disturbing. Was that a message to the management team as well? I never did see that but if it happened I would not be surprised. Losing can be toxic. My post was referring to the jersey tossers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
higgyfan Posted June 7, 2017 Share Posted June 7, 2017 11 minutes ago, Toews said: I never did see that but if it happened I would not be surprised. Losing can be toxic. My post was referring to the jersey tossers. http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=oilers+fans+boo+players&&view=detail&mid=8FF8F290CBB8A6D0C5888FF8F290CBB8A6D0C588&rvsmid=0785F0499C747C2C1C8E0785F0499C747C2C1C8E&fsscr=0&FORM=VDQVAP I hope I never see Canucks fans doing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted June 18, 2017 Author Share Posted June 18, 2017 So far, so good. Noise avoided and draft picks intact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted June 26, 2017 Author Share Posted June 26, 2017 Good job Canuck management for noise avoidance and coming out of the draft with some solid additions to your prospect pool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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