Jack Rathbone | #3 | D

[R3aL]

1 hour ago, Devron44 said:

Pretty cool these days when fans are discussing who’s going to be the 6th defencemen Rathbone or Joulevi.

This franchise has come a long ways in the last few years 

TRUE

 

Arguing about 4th line RW and bottom pairing D haha this is a great thing.

[filthycanuck]

13 hours ago, Quantum said:

I predict that Juolevi will be waived. Rathbone will be the Bottom LD and Brad Hunt will be an extra.

 

Juolevi is a disappointment and wasn't very good last season. We need to stop hoping he'll be this defensive dynamo just because he was picked #5 overall. You can't just keep him around because of his "draft pedigree". Good teams don't do this. Bad teams do.

 

Rathbone was by and far the most pleasant surprise last season and I don't see a reason why he shouldn't make this team. If Rathbone starts to struggle midway through the season, good news, he can be sent down but until that point -- I want the best defensemen in the lineup and not the ones that need to be waiver protected vs not. I believe Rathbone is capable of doing the things we thought Juolevi was gonna do.

 

Competition is gonna be furious this training camp. I really believe Brady Keeper, Brad Hunt, Oli Juolevi, Brad Hunt, Luke Schenn, and Kyle Burroughs are all gonna fight for the Last 3 spots on the defensive core (I expect Luke Schenn to be a shoein for the extra RD spot). It'll be interesting to see who makes it.

Were you even watching the games? When Hamonic went down, Juolevi had a stretch of games where he was good, even very good some nights Coach said so as well, so for you to say he was a disappointment last season is assenine. What did you think? Did you think he was going to look like Cale Makar?. Juolevi had a few rough games but he defintely took a step forward.

 

 

[Locke Lamora]

9 hours ago, RetroCanuck said:

Disagree, I though Juolevi looked good during his time in the NHL. Rathbone has the skills but needs to hone his game.

 

Im predicting Juolevi will surprise a lot of people this year

Come on man, OJ hasn’t looked “good” in his NHL stint thus far. Last year, in the few games he played sure, he looked slightly better than his previously disappointing appearances. Rathbone is poised to completely leap over him this year.

 

We have been waiting for Juolevi to “surprise” us for how many years now?

 

 

[Alflives]

24 minutes ago, Locke Lamora said:

Come on man, OJ hasn’t looked “good” in his NHL stint thus far. Last year, in the few games he played sure, he looked slightly better than his previously disappointing appearances. Rathbone is poised to completely leap over him this year.

 

We have been waiting for Juolevi to “surprise” us for how many years now?

 

 

Here’s a crazy thought.  Considering how good Bone is, does he make Hughes an extremely valuable tradable asset?  

[Nucker 67]

9 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Here’s a crazy thought.  Considering how good Bone is, does he make Hughes an extremely valuable tradable asset?  

Scandalous!

 

but I see what you mean, VAN could get a huge haul in a Hughes trade. How good will Rathbone be though? Could Rathbone be the player they end up trading? (once his rep skyrockets)  It would be a bit scary trading Hughes, I could see him burning us every game he plays against us. 

[Phat Fingers]

On 8/9/2021 at 11:02 AM, Alflives said:

Love Liverpool!  Our summer place was in West Dublin.  Best beaches in Canada are down that way.  

Water is way nicer in St. George’s bay and the northumberland straight. 

 

Shallow and sheltered bays with some gorgeous beaches.  I like my water bathtubs warm.  

[48MPHSlapShot]

2 hours ago, Alflives said:

Here’s a crazy thought.  Considering how good Bone is, does he make Hughes an extremely valuable tradable asset?  

If Rathbone can provide, let's say 75% of the offense Hughes can while playing a better defensive game, I would say Hughes becomes a very tradable asset.

[NorthWestNuck]

From the eye test alone last year, I don’t think that either Jack or Ollie were good enough to claim a serious advantage over the other. Both played well for rookies.

I think this seasons camp will be the deciding factor. Being as good won’t win the camp for Jack, as he can be moved down without waivers, so for him to win a spot on the club he will have to be better by Ollie by a significant amount.

[Gawdzukes]

10 hours ago, Locke Lamora said:

Come on man, OJ hasn’t looked “good” in his NHL stint thus far. Last year, in the few games he played sure, he looked slightly better than his previously disappointing appearances. Rathbone is poised to completely leap over him this year.

 

We have been waiting for Juolevi to “surprise” us for how many years now?

 

 

LOL he didn't even play in the NHL before last year, shows what you know. 

Edited August 12, 2021 by Gawdzukes

[Phat Fingers]

750k.  
 

OJ has his shot and choose to not seek one dollar more than the minimum wage.  
 

he is in a situation where he will have to fail at to loose.  
 

it’s all up to him and his contract shows that.  
 

good.  
 

motivation isn’t lost on OJ. 
 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by Phat Fingers

[tas]

23 hours ago, Locke Lamora said:

Come on man, OJ hasn’t looked “good” in his NHL stint thus far. Last year, in the few games he played sure, he looked slightly better than his previously disappointing appearances. Rathbone is poised to completely leap over him this year.

 

We have been waiting for Juolevi to “surprise” us for how many years now?

 

 

which previously disappointing appearances do you mean?

[Dats hockey]

47 minutes ago, tas said:

which previously disappointing appearances do you mean?

Front row seats to him rehabbing?

[J.I.A.H.N]

22 hours ago, NorthWestNuck said:

From the eye test alone last year, I don’t think that either Jack or Ollie were good enough to claim a serious advantage over the other. Both played well for rookies.

I think this seasons camp will be the deciding factor. Being as good won’t win the camp for Jack, as he can be moved down without waivers, so for him to win a spot on the club he will have to be better by Ollie by a significant amount.

I was going to roast you for your comments, but then I actually read it, and I agree.  I think Rathbones problem is getting enough actual time in to show coach Green and JB, how good he is. IMO, he is a better all around Dman than Hughes, but  with such a short sample size, it is not enough to unseat anyone. So, I think there is alot of work to do.

 

As for Rathbone and Juolevi, IMO, they are completely different Dmen, with completely different skill sets, and really are not in competition with each other than there is only one spot, as the poster above stated, Rathbone really has to outshine Juolevi, just because of Rathbones ability to be sent down to Abby.

 

This year is pivotal, for our future left side. May the best men win! 

 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

I do not want to get off of the Rathbone discussion, but i am seeing how some people do not understand how injuries can stall a players development. I does not necessarily destroy it, but it does disrupt the ELC years. But in saying that, many players come into the league later than year 2 or 3, and make a substantial impact. Look back how Detroit developed their players back in their hay day, and there was no rush. In Juoleviis case, his injuries, simply did not allow for him to play.

 

But, imo, in the short sample size, he looked to be a very intelligent, and capable young Dman, not all defensemen step into the league, get full time minutes and dominate, like Maker and Fox. The old rule of thumb was it took 4 years, to become a full time solid Dman, I still think that apples in some instances. Look at Ryan Pulock, who took 4 years in the AHL before becoming a full time NHL Dman.

 

People have to stop being so impatient. If he played well in his short stint, they he simply played well in his short stint. Check! Onto the next year of development.....that's it!

 

Give Juolevi some time! This is the NHL you know!

 

Now, back to the regularly scheduled Rathbone talk!

 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by janisahockeynut

[Fred65]

A couple of points. The Detroit hay days were during the no Cap era. So teams with an owner like Illich family simple out bid other teams for players, and the draft picks, well they were consigned to the AHL with no intention of bringing them in ( except exceptional cases) They could simply affored to leave youngsters to the farm team.

 

Secondly the length of the ELC was based on how long does it take to develop a youngster and the owners agreed to three year ( ELC ) Juolevi has just completed his  3 year and did not show adequate improvement even when he was healthy. He did not produce positive stats, a negative player throughout his NA pro career, that is not an accident. You must not dream in alternative to the facts and truth. Every Canuck fans want him to enjoy success but you must follow what's presented by the player ( who ever that might be)

[J.I.A.H.N]

28 minutes ago, Fred65 said:

A couple of points. The Detroit hay days were during the no Cap era. So teams with an owner like Illich family simple out bid other teams for players, and the draft picks, well they were consigned to the AHL with no intention of bringing them in ( except exceptional cases) They could simply affored to leave youngsters to the farm team.

 

Secondly the length of the ELC was based on how long does it take to develop a youngster and the owners agreed to three year ( ELC ) Juolevi has just completed his  3 year and did not show adequate improvement even when he was healthy. He did not produce positive stats, a negative player throughout his NA pro career, that is not an accident. You must not dream in alternative to the facts and truth. Every Canuck fans want him to enjoy success but you must follow what's presented by the player ( who ever that might be)

First off Fred

 

Waivers still existed, and those players on Detroits farm team would have been picked up after their ELCès, if  good enough

So you are wrong on why they did not get brought  up.........they simply took longer to develop

 

Second of all, you simply ignored the Ryan Pulock example, of which there are plenty of......

 

And thirdly, were you watching reruns of Juolevi's 1st year ? I mean, I don't think he was an all-star, but he showed well in a limited viewing last year.

 

Sorry buddy, I think you are wrong! Although you are entitled to be that way if you want.

[48MPHSlapShot]

So if this is the Juolevi thread, does that make the actual Juolevi thread the Rathbone thread?

[Fred65]

32 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

First off Fred

 

Waivers still existed, and those players on Detroits farm team would have been picked up after their ELCès, if  good enough

So you are wrong on why they did not get brought  up.........they simply took longer to develop

 

Second of all, you simply ignored the Ryan Pulock example, of which there are plenty of......

 

And thirdly, were you watching reruns of Juolevi's 1st year ? I mean, I don't think he was an all-star, but he showed well in a limited viewing last year.

 

Sorry buddy, I think you are wrong! Although you are entitled to be that way if you want.

I understand there's a large portion of the fan base expect great things from OJ. I hope they're right! I don't see it, he doesn't pass the eye test for me and apprently Vcr management. There is no Vcr rush to tie this player up long term, They offered the very lowest salary they could ( not a good sign IMO ) as they seem to recognize flaws  in his game. While Hughes is negoiating a multi million $ contract OJ is offered the least possible for as short a period possible, surely, surely that tells you that management assesmment is closer to my view than to the numerous fans who for some unknown reason expect greatness. The salary is a yard stick to measure his value .... Hughes  very high ... OJ .... not so much. I viewed Virtanen exactly the same and until recently many were members of Jake Virtanen for Prime Minister brigade who fought vigoursly to support Jake ... and his selection justification in the draft. Ditto OJ. Don't take offence It's just my opinion.

 

PS. out of interest when was the first ELC ad ded to the CBA. Years ago they had the old "Junior" system I think "C" form existed until 1969 but have difficulty detrmining when the first ELC was added to the CBA, any one have ideas ???

Edited August 12, 2021 by Fred65

[Phat Fingers]

5 hours ago, Fred65 said:

A couple of points. The Detroit hay days were during the no Cap era. So teams with an owner like Illich family simple out bid other teams for players, and the draft picks, well they were consigned to the AHL with no intention of bringing them in ( except exceptional cases) They could simply affored to leave youngsters to the farm team.

 

Secondly the length of the ELC was based on how long does it take to develop a youngster and the owners agreed to three year ( ELC ) Juolevi has just completed his  3 year and did not show adequate improvement even when he was healthy. He did not produce positive stats, a negative player throughout his NA pro career, that is not an accident. You must not dream in alternative to the facts and truth. Every Canuck fans want him to enjoy success but you must follow what's presented by the player ( who ever that might be)

Fred, 

 

you have never been a fan of OJ, never mind the injuries are why he his development took longer.  
 

You are also talking about plus minus as positive and negative stats. In hockey you have to be specific about what stats your using. 
 

but if it’s plus minus.  You over rely on it especially with young developing defence men.  IMO.  

[Fred65]

4 hours ago, Phat Fingers said:

Fred, 

 

you have never been a fan of OJ, never mind the injuries are why he his development took longer.  
 

You are also talking about plus minus as positive and negative stats. In hockey you have to be specific about what stats your using. 
 

but if it’s plus minus.  You over rely on it especially with young developing defence men.  IMO.  

No I haven't been a fan of OJ apart from the obvious, 200 games as a Pro and not a lot to show from it. To my way of thinking  you can't keep over looking the obvious. I think he has some flaws in his skating and the more I watched the more I realize he just doesn't IMO process the game quick enough. Sports and hockey in particular is very competitive. I would have ghought the flaw with his skating could be remedied with a good summer but processing the game it is what it is