Rob_Zepp Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 8 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said: Look, is Gagner better than Burrows? Hansen? Is Burmistrov? MDZ better than Tryamkin? No! Gagner might be, well is, more talented. But if his game translated he wold be being signed by a strong playoff team. At least he brings skill to the table! And we're not actually a better team than the one that opened 2016. But last year management overrated where we were at. Over relied on Etem & Virtanen making the team. Making the team better. Unfortunately overrated Jovanovski, Eriksson (so did I). Well, hopefully, that was just injury issues, with Jovo anyways... We could have used this years signings to help get over our atrocious lack of depth last year. The real answer is that Gagner, Burmistrov, MDZ, Wiercioch are at least a heap, no a whole heap, better than the fill posing as players that have passed through lately. Megna, Bartkowski, Weber, Larsen, Skille, Vey, Chaput... I'm happy with these signings. Not sure that is true (the part I bolded). I think that your ownership certainly did and management is required to do that bidding as it now seems a far clearer path has been set as if your ownership has said to your management, "hey, you were right - we will get out of the way and give you xxx seasons to do this your way" as the moves the Canucks have made over the past 4 or 5 months have all pointed in a very consistent direction if taken as a whole. Every move perfect? Of course not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeeBee51 Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 9 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said: Look, is Gagner better than Burrows? Hansen? Is Burmistrov? MDZ better than Tryamkin? No! Gagner might be, well is, more talented. But if his game translated he wold be being signed by a strong playoff team. At least he brings skill to the table! And we're not actually a better team than the one that opened 2016. But last year management overrated where we were at. Over relied on Etem & Virtanen making the team. Making the team better. Unfortunately overrated Jovanovski, Eriksson (so did I). Well, hopefully, that was just injury issues, with Jovo anyways... We could have used this years signings to help get over our atrocious lack of depth last year. The real answer is that Gagner, Burmistrov, MDZ, Wiercioch are at least a heap, no a whole heap, better than the fill posing as players that have passed through lately. Megna, Bartkowski, Weber, Larsen, Skille, Vey, Chaput... I'm happy with these signings. ya lost me on Jovo. Guessing you meant Guddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 3 hours ago, CeeBee51 said: ya lost me on Jovo. Guessing you meant Guddy? lol, yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 4 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: Not sure that is true (the part I bolded). I think that your ownership certainly did and management is required to do that bidding as it now seems a far clearer path has been set as if your ownership has said to your management, "hey, you were right - we will get out of the way and give you xxx seasons to do this your way" as the moves the Canucks have made over the past 4 or 5 months have all pointed in a very consistent direction if taken as a whole. Every move perfect? Of course not. I think its easy to believe Megna & Chaput were not plan A. And if not, what were they planning? Not even plan B, which would have been Skille. It all obviously fell apart, because we had Megna & Chaput... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 51 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said: I think its easy to believe Megna & Chaput were not plan A. And if not, what were they planning? Not even plan B, which would have been Skille. It all obviously fell apart, because we had Megna & Chaput... i don't think there was a coherent plan from ownership until just recently so the likes of Megna, Vey, Skille etc etc. were at best poor placeholders. I sense a massive change in past number of months and perhaps coincidentally the owner went to the draft to perhaps see "ok, you want to do it your way GM, let's see up close what that is you are wanting to do". Not sure but I don't then going over past few seasons over and over is how you make improvements from this point on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 23 hours ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Sometimes it's healthy to go against the grain and think for yourself or even take an indepth look at a few other organizations. Sometimes you see that it's not sunshine and roses here in Vancouver. There are enough things to be critical over. Hopefully you took time out to watch the prospects game last night. To any Canucks fan, it was a definite ray of sunshine and bouquet of pink, if not red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 1 hour ago, Hutton Wink said: Hopefully you took time out to watch the prospects game last night. To any Canucks fan, it was a definite ray of sunshine and bouquet of pink, if not red. Unfortunately i didn't other than a few highlights. it's stampede season in calgary, the next 10 days will be one big blur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 8 minutes ago, ForsbergTheGreat said: Unfortunately i didn't other than a few highlights. it's stampede season in calgary, the next 10 days will be one big blur. Ah, being from Calgary makes a ton of sense! Good luck with that. Enjoy the stampede. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 3 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: i don't think there was a coherent plan from ownership until just recently so the likes of Megna, Vey, Skille etc etc. were at best poor placeholders. I sense a massive change in past number of months and perhaps coincidentally the owner went to the draft to perhaps see "ok, you want to do it your way GM, let's see up close what that is you are wanting to do". Not sure but I don't then going over past few seasons over and over is how you make improvements from this point on. I still think they simply projected spots for Virtanen & Etem last year. And had no backup plan. Ergo Megna & Chaput. The good news is, this year, they seemed to have learned from their mistake. Guys have to win jobs, otherwise there is at least a legit NHLér in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 12 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said: I still think they simply projected spots for Virtanen & Etem last year. And had no backup plan. Ergo Megna & Chaput. The good news is, this year, they seemed to have learned from their mistake. Guys have to win jobs, otherwise there is at least a legit NHLér in place. Who is "they"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 7, 2017 Share Posted July 7, 2017 31 minutes ago, Canuck Surfer said: I still think they simply projected spots for Virtanen & Etem last year. And had no backup plan. Ergo Megna & Chaput. The good news is, this year, they seemed to have learned from their mistake. Guys have to win jobs, otherwise there is at least a legit NHLér in place. We're also starting to see more cap space open up as we've shed more expensive vets, to fill those roles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 9 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said: Who is "they"? Management. JB, Wisebrod, Linden, etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Surfer Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 8 hours ago, J.R. said: We're also starting to see more cap space open up as we've shed more expensive vets, to fill those roles. I've posted elsewhere, pretty sure you have as well > welcome UFA Evander Kane summer 2018! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainLinden16 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 On 7/7/2017 at 11:56 AM, Rob_Zepp said: i don't think there was a coherent plan from ownership until just recently so the likes of Megna, Vey, Skille etc etc. were at best poor placeholders. I sense a massive change in past number of months and perhaps coincidentally the owner went to the draft to perhaps see "ok, you want to do it your way GM, let's see up close what that is you are wanting to do". Not sure but I don't then going over past few seasons over and over is how you make improvements from this point on. why doesn't anybody like Chaput and Skille??? As far as I am concerned they were the best line on the ice for us many times last season. Now that's not a good thing, but they are very solid 4th line guys. Chaput has average at everything except for faceoffs which he is very good at. That's great for a 4th line player. Skills actually was a prototypical 4th line guy with more than a pinch of style. He walked quite a few players last year. He hit. He scored goals. Was reasonable in his own end. He played on the 4th line. If either were an organization draft pick. We would be talking about how cerebral they are and how the average fan just doesn't get it. Like Gaunce... If Gaunce gets faster then he has a higher ceiling than Chaput/Skille, but for my money I would take Skille and Chaput on the 4th line over him 10/10. I like the idea of having 4 scoring lines which would make Chaput a no go unless he were the 13th forward, but Skills would thrive in that setup. Byron Bitz was phenomenal with the Sedin twins. The league is waaaaay to obsessed with youth. Potential is just that sometimes or most of the time. Most young players don't amount to anything. You don't have to give a young player a shot because he is an unknown commodity. If you are better than you are better. If not then not. Megna is another story because he was consistently played above the 4th line, and he doesn't have NHL hands or shot. He could be excellent if he added 20 pounds and maintained his speed. That would be a great player. Fast wrecking ball defensive specialist. That would be awesome. Why don't players just do that more often? A pro athlete can just eat and workout all summer long as he has no other obligations. Some find it more difficult to gain muscle than others, but 5-10.000 calories a day can get anyone bigger combined with a heavy lifting routine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, CaptainLinden16 said: why doesn't anybody like Chaput and Skille??? As far as I am concerned they were the best line on the ice for us many times last season. Now that's not a good thing, but they are very solid 4th line guys. Chaput has average at everything except for faceoffs which he is very good at. That's great for a 4th line player. Skills actually was a prototypical 4th line guy with more than a pinch of style. He walked quite a few players last year. He hit. He scored goals. Was reasonable in his own end. He played on the 4th line. If either were an organization draft pick. We would be talking about how cerebral they are and how the average fan just doesn't get it. Like Gaunce... If Gaunce gets faster then he has a higher ceiling than Chaput/Skille, but for my money I would take Skille and Chaput on the 4th line over him 10/10. I like the idea of having 4 scoring lines which would make Chaput a no go unless he were the 13th forward, but Skills would thrive in that setup. Byron Bitz was phenomenal with the Sedin twins. The league is waaaaay to obsessed with youth. Potential is just that sometimes or most of the time. Most young players don't amount to anything. You don't have to give a young player a shot because he is an unknown commodity. If you are better than you are better. If not then not. Megna is another story because he was consistently played above the 4th line, and he doesn't have NHL hands or shot. He could be excellent if he added 20 pounds and maintained his speed. That would be a great player. Fast wrecking ball defensive specialist. That would be awesome. Why don't players just do that more often? A pro athlete can just eat and workout all summer long as he has no other obligations. Some find it more difficult to gain muscle than others, but 5-10.000 calories a day can get anyone bigger combined with a heavy lifting routine. I like Chaput and you will see I didn't include him and I have said I like him elsewhere and remain confused when people lump him in with Megna. Skille, not impressed - Molino, for example, bit improvement. Megna, disagree with you totally - don't think he is an NHL player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: I like Chaput and you will see I didn't include him and I have said I like him elsewhere and remain confused when people lump him in with Megna. Skille, not impressed - Molino, for example, bit improvement. Megna, disagree with you totally - don't think he is an NHL player. Skille was a consummate pro in his 13th forward role. Zero problems with him last year. That said, we have a ton of guys vying for the 10-13 F spots so he's not particularly required this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainLinden16 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 8 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: I like Chaput and you will see I didn't include him and I have said I like him elsewhere and remain confused when people lump him in with Megna. Skille, not impressed - Molino, for example, bit improvement. Megna, disagree with you totally - don't think he is an NHL player. I didn't say Megna was good. I said he would be good playing a 3/4th line role if he added 20 pounds and hit. That would be a good player. I said he has no hands, no shot, no skill; but he is fast and good defensively. With added size, that's a useful player. You didn't like Skille??? He and Horvat were the only players to do offensive zone laps last year. I am not sure Horvat beat him either with the increased ice time. The guy had some sizzle. Scored some nice goals. Didn't play all that much. I know he isn't going to ever be any better than that, but that being said that's pretty solid for a 4th line guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 7 minutes ago, J.R. said: Skille was a consummate pro in his 13th forward role. Zero problems with him last year. That said, we have a ton of guys vying for the 10-13 F spots so he's not particularly required this year. Don't disagree and nice to see a guy prolong a career but didn't see anything from him that Canucks don't have many better options. Chaput, for example, has much more to offer IMHO than Skille Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainLinden16 Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 10 minutes ago, J.R. said: Skille was a consummate pro in his 13th forward role. Zero problems with him last year. That said, we have a ton of guys vying for the 10-13 F spots so he's not particularly required this year. do we have someone in the bottom six with size that will drive to the net??? Gaunce no...Virtanen hopefully...Chaput no dangle game...We really don't have that in the top 6 either outside of Horvat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, CaptainLinden16 said: I didn't say Megna was good. I said he would be good playing a 3/4th line role if he added 20 pounds and hit. That would be a good player. I said he has no hands, no shot, no skill; but he is fast and good defensively. With added size, that's a useful player. You didn't like Skille??? He and Horvat were the only players to do offensive zone laps last year. I am not sure Horvat beat him either with the increased ice time. The guy had some sizzle. Scored some nice goals. Didn't play all that much. I know he isn't going to ever be any better than that, but that being said that's pretty solid for a 4th line guy. I must have misssd those games. I didn't see him as anything more than filler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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