5nothincanucksohno Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 12 minutes ago, the_impersonator13 said: I understand what Ray is saying but did finishing 3rd last and 2nd last the past 2 years pan out in the draft lottery??? Exactly, I don't put much faith in what Ray says anymore - he clearly views the tank as the best option but the league has changed (and not just the draft). There is clearly a plan to support the youth on the NHL team, build depth and allow the prospects to mature properly in the AHL. Everyone references the Blue Jackets, To, and Edm - and it is true that they have now turned things around but it took them over a decade in each case. They had different paths but the clear trend is all three failed when it came to drafting and prospect development (i.e. didn't add youth, drafted poorly, or rushed prospects into the NHL - Canucks are avoiding all three). You think he would have a better grasp given all the horrible teams he played on. In a nineteen year career he only played 10 or more playoff games three times in a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 7 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said: Canucks don't have someone in NHL head office with Maple Leaf tattoo on behind - that is the difference and that would make his point at same time. Oh god. Please can we stop with the conspiracy theories? ....unless it's the one that Colin Campbell & his ref's did a job on us in the finals. Then I'm on board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claiborne55 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, Jiggs50 said: 3 years? Whyy... Should of been a 1 or 2 yr deal Because no one wants to come to Vancouver..ask Demers... we are only getting players that want a payday. We aren't winning for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 8 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said: I'm for progession and team building not tanking, move up to the high-mid 20's-top 15-20-top 15-10-top 10-top 5 and Contender. I'm for winning a Stanley Cup and don't care how we do it, but it seems like drafting in the top 2 is pretty important (Kings, Hawks, Penguins). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beary Sweet Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 How can you not like this signing... broke out this past year with the Jackets. Torts depended on him usually to produce when the CBJ didn't have much going. Gagner is also still very young and at 27, he is in his prime and he will have every opportunity to develop into the best player he can be. If he builds off the year he just had, he will be a steal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, Jiggs50 said: 3 years? Whyy... Should of been a 1 or 2 yr deal 2 years = 3 years = OK then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiggs50 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 1 minute ago, Claiborne55 said: Because no one wants to come to Vancouver..ask Demers... we are only getting players that want a payday. We aren't winning for a long time. Give him 4 mill per then. But not 3 years. Ugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.K. Chesterton Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 This is a good signing. I'm quite impressed with Benning's signings today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5nothincanucksohno Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 3 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: I see what you're saying but the Leafs went from last to a 95 point season. I'm not arguing that's what Vancouver should be trying but I'm just sayin.. You're right that most teams have gradual improvements. If Vancouver improves from 29th to 23rd because Boeser, Goldobin, and Juolevi light it up.. that's great! I think that's the point Ray was making is that when you're a terrible team, you should improve (slowly or quickly) through your draft picks (like the Leafs, who were led by their youngsters). Vancouver is AGAIN trying to improve in the standings by bringing in vets instead of concentrating on a top pick and acquiring a bunch of draft picks. I thought Benning had learned his lesson but I was wrong. Going into this FA period I was hoping we'd add size & toughness, we already have a team of smallish soft players. There is still no reason why that can't happen...signing short term, low dollar free agents just allows them to come up when ready. All young guys (minus McDavid, etc.) are better off spending at least 1 or 2 years in the AHL. These signings allow for this but at the same time don't prevent the Canucks from calling up prospects when they are ready or when injuries strike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HomeBrew Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Gagner is basically a Hansen/Burrows replacement with more offensive skill currently. He will play the skill game as we allow our rookies to learn the 200ft defensive side of the game that Hansen and Burrows brought to the team. I like the signing and hopefully we can flip him for a pick later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5nothincanucksohno Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 8 minutes ago, combover said: I'm on board but the guys with keeping the youth away from benning "rebuild". But there has to be a light an opportunity for the guys that have been there for two plus years. Even if it just a rotation in give them a taste of what there working for. Call up to sit in the press box while lesser players continue to get the call isn't an incentive to work harder or show any kind of loyalty to the organization. Agree, needs to be incentive for the prospects. The good thing is that these signings aren't prohibitive - shorter term, low AAV. There will be injuries so the young guys will get chances to prove themselves at the NHL level - plus it will be less pressure and more reps in the AHL while waiting for call up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluralsight Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 This is probably the only signing of the day that I don't agree with, simply because of the term. I would have been fine giving Gagner $4M for two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 6 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: I see what you're saying but the Leafs went from last to a 95 point season. I'm not arguing that's what Vancouver should be trying but I'm just sayin.. You're right that most teams have gradual improvements. If Vancouver improves from 29th to 23rd because Boeser, Goldobin, and Juolevi light it up.. that's great! I think that's the point Ray was making is that when you're a terrible team, you should improve (slowly or quickly) through your draft picks (like the Leafs, who were led by their youngsters). Vancouver is AGAIN trying to improve in the standings by bringing in vets instead of concentrating on a top pick and acquiring a bunch of draft picks. I thought Benning had learned his lesson but I was wrong. Going into this FA period I was hoping we'd add size & toughness, we already have a team of smallish soft players. Leafs or Oilers argument is not valid unless you get 1OA generational etc. Take away McDavid and Matthews and this conversation isn't the same at all. I think Ray (and you?) are seeing something I am not. Vancouver wants to develop its young players in an professional environment and that includes being competitive though not necessarily winning more than losing. They didn't seemingly go after any long-term, high end free agents but wanted to field a true NHL team over the next few years and allow spots for the prospects that truly deserve a shot versus are thrust into action before they are ready. Like all successful teams, Vancouver will need to develop a strong farm system and have an AHL team that would be good enough to win some NHL games - and they are not there yet. I don't disagree on wanting some size but I don't agree with you at all that the Canucks are a soft team. A few posters call some of the players soft and the stats don't back that up at all. Soft are players that will not go into tough areas, will not block shots and will not take a hit. Soft players exist in the NHL but are increasingly few and far between. If you have ever played higher end (professional) hockey, you will know that there are VERY few soft players at that level and they typically don't last long, I also note when you look at height/weight averages for Van in compare to other teams they are not in the bottom - so again, where is the perception coming from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 2 minutes ago, 5nothincanucksohno said: There is still no reason why that can't happen...signing short term, low dollar free agents just allows them to come up when ready. All young guys (minus McDavid, etc.) are better off spending at least 1 or 2 years in the AHL. These signings allow for this but at the same time don't prevent the Canucks from calling up prospects when they are ready or when injuries strike. I wanted low dollar free agents, Gagne is not that. I wanted big forwards & D so there is some physicality and protection for those young guys coming up. You figure some of them will make the team this year and we have a tiny soft team for them to play on and we just signed a couple more soft guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Zepp Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 11 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: Oh god. Please can we stop with the conspiracy theories? ....unless it's the one that Colin Campbell & his ref's did a job on us in the finals. Then I'm on board. You need to learn sarcasm. Not sure what nationality or age you are but in my world, it is a skill learned in high school. If you believe for a minute I think the NHL gave Toronto the FOA pick and would purposely deny Vancouver the same ..... sigh. I always assume when making responses on such a board that the readers are also mature, have a sense of humour and take a broad view of perspectives. Every once in a while I am given pause by a post like yours. Then again, perhaps you are not being serious? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 He scored 50 pts playing 14 minutes a night with Hartnell and Sedlak. Whiners gonna whine though - and Ray as usual is into happy hour at 9 am. I might have preferred Bouma (who can blame him for taking the opportunity in Chicago) for our bottom six and left the upside to the young guys, but this team does have a pair of 36 yr old top 6, so you don't always get exactly the players you want, but the Canucks could certainly have done worse than Gagner and Burmistrov as depth additions. 3 million for a 50 pt player that managed that with 3rd line minutes....why am I not surprised that the usual gaggle of mopers is out in usual form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck73_3 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 15 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: I'm for winning a Stanley Cup and don't care how we do it, but it seems like drafting in the top 2 is pretty important (Kings, Hawks, Penguins). Well NJ finished 25th and picked first overall so finishing in the mid 20's isn't bad anymore. These moves let the kids develop while still keeping us in the top 5 at best top 10 at worst. With Benning's ability to find gems I'm not worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 6 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said: I wanted low dollar free agents, Gagne is not that. I wanted big forwards & D so there is some physicality and protection for those young guys coming up. You figure some of them will make the team this year and we have a tiny soft team for them to play on and we just signed a couple more soft guys. Why are you worried about us finishing higher in the standings if we're a butter soft, tiny team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 You add Nilsson, Del Zotto, Wiercioch (and Burmistrov?) - and the team is still sitting with ballpark 10 million of cap space. Sign Horvat and they still have a mittfull to work with for flexibility - and 14 million expiring next year..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobi Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Any ntc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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