[PGT] Anaheim Ducks vs. Vancouver Canucks

[Alexandre]

I don't know if it is because I watched the game after knowing the final score but I thought the players on the whole put up a decent effort. We where just over matched. This is understandable considering the bad goals let in by Nilsson, injuries, and a strong Ducks team. I paid particular attention to the play of the team after the game was out of reach (when the score was 4:0). The team, with the odd exception, put up a good effort till the bitter end.

 

Having said that, I have lost a lot of confidence in Nilsson. Hope he can get his game together.

 

 

[samurai]

3 hours ago, alfstonker said:

In case you weren't there, WD used a system that accommodated 3 AHLers and sometimes as much as 8 rookies 2 with no pro experience due to horrendous injuries and poor recruiting of replacements by JB.

By doing that he successfully built the confidence of our young players, who didn't have to return to the dressing room every night with basketball figures against them.

 

As I have said often enough now, when WD had a team worth a damn he took us to the playoffs with 101 points.

 

This should never be a comparison of coaches, because CDC's memory is too damaged for that. The fact is we need to get behind THIS coach and wait till he has his injured players back in the team.

Gaunce, Dowd, Chaput, Boucher were in the line up.  Not exactly established players. My point is that it doesn’t matter which coach you have the team was and is bad.  However, Green’s systems make for better games.  Willie’s team was boring to watch.

[riffraff]

Cut your hair and get a real job Eriksson. Take the swede oaf goalie tandem with you.

[tyhee]

6 hours ago, VanGnome said:

This simply reinforces that the vet's need to go, Edler especially. Need to find someone to take Eriksson off our hands.

Deadline - Trade: Edler, Gudbranson, Eriksson, Vanek, Gagner, Nilsson
Keep: Tanev, Sutter, bring Sedins back for 1 more year.

Play the youth, let them grow, give them bigger roles and let them grow into those roles. Maybe we get lucky and win the lottery, bound to be our turn. Draft Dahlin, Juolevi makes the team, same with Pettersson and Dahlen.

Hope that Demko is ready to suit up next year.

Baertschi - Horvat - Boeser
Dahlen - Pettersson - Goldobin

Virtanen - Sutter - Granlund

Sedin - Sedin - Gaunce

Pouliot - Tanev
Dahlin - Del Zotto

Juolevi - Stecher

Markstrom
Demko

In 2 years, Demko takes over as starter.

1.  Sedin-Sedin-Gaunce? 

The Sedins have historically thrived with speedy wingers who can get back quickly to cover on defence and get to an retrieve the puck for them while being able to contribute at least a little on offence, Burrows and Hansen being examples.  Gaunce doesn't have great speed, isn't good enough with the puck to help them with their cycle game and is most effective defensively rather than offensively-while the Sedins are more effective in the offensive zone.

 

There are quite a few posters who seem to think Gaunce useless because he's essentially a black hole offensively.  I think he can be somewhat useful so long as he is giving up fewer net goals to the opponents' better offensive players than other players on his team.  That means deploying him in a defensive role against better offensive players. 

 

The twins in their prime were gifted offensively other than speed-wise and were responsible defensively while not being particularly strong defensive forwards.  Their best trait defensively was the ability to control the puck in the offensive zone so that the opponents were a long way from the Canucks' goal and usually didn't have the puck.  In their late NHL years they are weaker defensively and most successful when deployed in the offensive zone.

 

So how does one deploy a line of Sedin-Sedin-Gaunce?  Using them against good offensive players means deploying the Sedins in a way they aren't well suited.  Using them as an offensive line means deploying Gaunce in a manner in which he's particularly ill-suited.  I can see the thought of putting a defender with offensive players in the thought that he'll cover for them, but Gaunce isn't the speedy guy best suited for doing that with the Sedins and would be a detriment to them offensively.  The line wouldn't balance into a good one, it would imo just be useless.

 

On a less important note, Gaunce isn't the best choice of someone to play on his off-wing.  Generally playing off-wing gives some offensive advantage for a sniper while making things a little more difficult defensively.  People may have noticed that Gaunce isn't the epitome of a sniper.

 

2.  The lineup as constructed contains too many offensive-style defencemen who aren't very good defensively.  Essentially, pretty much all of the defencemen other than Tanev need to play with someone like Tanev.   Pouliot and del Zotto need a Tanev type of partner for the pair to be effective. 

 

Del Zotto isn't a guy I think should be paired with Dahlin in Dahlin's rookie year.  Dahlin's great strength is on offence.  He may turn out to be an exception but there's every reason to think he'll need to learn NHL defence.  Playing him with an offensive defenceman risks the pair being blown up nightly and Dahlin not learning defence like he would from a strong-defending veteran.

 

3.  Dahlen-Pettersson-Goldobin?

 

Obviously that line has real offensive skill.  It also puts two rookies with offensive skill who aren't used to the North American style of play with an offensive forward whose weakness so far in his career has been attention to detail defensively.  They'd be an exciting line to watch.  They also might also see the goal light behind Markstrom getting lit on a regular basis.  I can't say that this line won't work because of defensive problems, but counting on two offensive rookies from a wider ice surface with someone who cheats in the defensive zone could be a recipe for many goals against.

 

4.  Imo rushing Demko to the defensive tire fire that the current Canucks are and this proposed lineup would be risks ruining his development and his confidence (which two things are of course connected.)  The plan based on the length of contracts for Markstrom and Nilsson seems to have been to have him be the starter in Utica for two seasons.  This is his first. 

 

I really don't want to see him subjected to being left to fend for himself the way Markstrom and Nilsson are regularly this season.  It risks ruining his confidence, changing the way he plays the game (not in a good way) and leaving him subject to the vocal criticisms of the Vancouver media and fans when it turns out he isn't ready to perform miracles.

 

5.  Obviously there was some optimism in hoping to win the Rasmus Dahlin lottery, but that's nothing compared with the optimism that someone is going to take that Eriksson contract off the Canucks' hands.  Finding someone to take the Gagner contract would be difficult as well.  Yes, it is possible to move any contract-if you're willing to take back something equally bad or give up something with enough positive value.  The Eriksson contract is so bad that you'd have to take taking back a disastrous contract or give up something really good to move it.

 

6.  Of course, both Edler and Eriksson have no move clauses.  That may not be much of an impediment, though, as players will tend to be more open to waiving when the team is poor, as the Canucks of 2015-18 are.  While injuries have played a big part, it must be frustrating and potentially demoralizing to go through a period liike the Canucks' last ten games, with an overtime win and one regular win against 8 losses (1 in OT) which include losses of 5-1, 6-1, 7-1 and 5-0 as well as other losses in which the team gave up 7 and 5 goals.

 

7.  I realize the NHL is trending more towards speed and less towards goons, but toughness and intimidation are still relevant.  That lineup is imo just too soft.

[Tre Mac]

On the bright side: Coilers

 

At least we were suppose to suck.

 

[alfstonker]

1 hour ago, samurai said:

Gaunce, Dowd, Chaput, Boucher were in the line up.  Not exactly established players. My point is that it doesn’t matter which coach you have the team was and is bad.  However, Green’s systems make for better games.  Willie’s team was boring to watch.

Sorry but you still haven't got either the context or the facts right and life's too short.

[Oregon.Duck]

Yaknow what’s funny, Vegas doesn’t have better personnel from a skills perspective than we do. They’re an example of what playing inspired hockey looks like. Gallant is getting 110% out of each player...here Green seems like he can barely coach his way to 50%. 

 

Ugh. Infuriating to watch. 

[alfstonker]

38 minutes ago, tyhee said:

1.  Sedin-Sedin-Gaunce? 

The Sedins have historically thrived with speedy wingers who can get back quickly to cover on defence and get to an retrieve the puck for them while being able to contribute at least a little on offence, Burrows and Hansen being examples.  Gaunce doesn't have great speed, isn't good enough with the puck to help them with their cycle game and is most effective defensively rather than offensively-while the Sedins are more effective in the offensive zone.

 

There are quite a few posters who seem to think Gaunce useless because he's essentially a black hole offensively.  I think he can be somewhat useful so long as he is giving up fewer net goals to the opponents' better offensive players than other players on his team.  That means deploying him in a defensive role against better offensive players. 

 

The twins in their prime were gifted offensively other than speed-wise and were responsible defensively while not being particularly strong defensive forwards.  Their best trait defensively was the ability to control the puck in the offensive zone so that the opponents were a long way from the Canucks' goal and usually didn't have the puck.  In their late NHL years they are weaker defensively and most successful when deployed in the offensive zone.

 

So how does one deploy a line of Sedin-Sedin-Gaunce?  Using them against good offensive players means deploying the Sedins in a way they aren't well suited.  Using them as an offensive line means deploying Gaunce in a manner in which he's particularly ill-suited.  I can see the thought of putting a defender with offensive players in the thought that he'll cover for them, but Gaunce isn't the speedy guy best suited for doing that with the Sedins and would be a detriment to them offensively.  The line wouldn't balance into a good one, it would imo just be useless.

 

On a less important note, Gaunce isn't the best choice of someone to play on his off-wing.  Generally playing off-wing gives some offensive advantage for a sniper while making things a little more difficult defensively.  People may have noticed that Gaunce isn't the epitome of a sniper.

 

2.  The lineup as constructed contains too many offensive-style defencemen who aren't very good defensively.  Essentially, pretty much all of the defencemen other than Tanev need to play with someone like Tanev.   Pouliot and del Zotto need a Tanev type of partner for the pair to be effective. 

 

Del Zotto isn't a guy I think should be paired with Dahlin in Dahlin's rookie year.  Dahlin's great strength is on offence.  He may turn out to be an exception but there's every reason to think he'll need to learn NHL defence.  Playing him with an offensive defenceman risks the pair being blown up nightly and Dahlin not learning defence like he would from a strong-defending veteran.

 

3.  Dahlen-Pettersson-Goldobin?

 

Obviously that line has real offensive skill.  It also puts two rookies with offensive skill who aren't used to the North American style of play with an offensive forward whose weakness so far in his career has been attention to detail defensively.  They'd be an exciting line to watch.  They also might also see the goal light behind Markstrom getting lit on a regular basis.  I can't say that this line won't work because of defensive problems, but counting on two offensive rookies from a wider ice surface with someone who cheats in the defensive zone could be a recipe for many goals against.

 

4.  Imo rushing Demko to the defensive tire fire that the current Canucks are and this proposed lineup would be risks ruining his development and his confidence (which two things are of course connected.)  The plan based on the length of contracts for Markstrom and Nilsson seems to have been to have him be the starter in Utica for two seasons.  This is his first. 

 

I really don't want to see him subjected to being left to fend for himself the way Markstrom and Nilsson are regularly this season.  It risks ruining his confidence, changing the way he plays the game (not in a good way) and leaving him subject to the vocal criticisms of the Vancouver media and fans when it turns out he isn't ready to perform miracles.

 

5.  Obviously there was some optimism in hoping to win the Rasmus Dahlin lottery, but that's nothing compared with the optimism that someone is going to take that Eriksson contract off the Canucks' hands.  Finding someone to take the Gagner contract would be difficult as well.  Yes, it is possible to move any contract-if you're willing to take back something equally bad or give up something with enough positive value.  The Eriksson contract is so bad that you'd have to take taking back a disastrous contract or give up something really good to move it.

 

6.  Of course, both Edler and Eriksson have no move clauses.  That may not be much of an impediment, though, as players will tend to be more open to waiving when the team is poor, as the Canucks of 2015-18 are.  While injuries have played a big part, it must be frustrating and potentially demoralizing to go through a period liike the Canucks' last ten games, with an overtime win and one regular win against 8 losses (1 in OT) which include losses of 5-1, 6-1, 7-1 and 5-0 as well as other losses in which the team gave up 7 and 5 goals.

 

7.  I realize the NHL is trending more towards speed and less towards goons, but toughness and intimidation are still relevant.  That lineup is imo just too soft.

Good post - except if you do some research you will find Gaunce is actually one of our fastest skaters. I agree he doesn't look it and it is not the same when you don't have the puck but go look at his skills times and placings. 

[canuck2288]

Although Travis Green is a world ahead of Twitchy as a coach (so is every coach that ever stood behind a bench) he is definitely just a transition coach for us.

 

decisions like starting Nilsson are head scratchers and a sign of s rookie coach. I look at what Gallant (my first choice of a new coach) has done with a group of castoffs you have to wonder what if.

 

i like what Green has done in such a short time to repair the damage Willie caused and injuries don’t help but I do think we need another guy once our “new” core is solidly in place 

[GritGrinder]

5 hours ago, canuktravella said:

need to be sellers at deadline

need to ask sedins to waive ntc  at tdl or retire next yr  

need to ask eriksson to waive nmc  retain halfhis salary  this is bennings worst move to date.

need to ask edler to waive ntc

need  vanek traded for picks

trade guddy, sutter, tanev, granlund , delzotto and hutton for max value at deadline.

need to trade for team toughness, hitting and  someone to protect boeser and give him little more time space out there. Need a new dcore that isnt soft as kleenex.

Get tryamkin back to van 

 

please win lotto this yr  core of horvat, virtanen, boeser, guadette, tryamkin, petersson , juolevi, dahlen, demko, lind, gaz will be so slick next yr 

Even with a perfect storm of Tryamkin returning and the Canucks winning the lotto it sounds like your 6 or 7 dmen next season would look like this.

 

Pouliot/Stecher

Tryamkin/Dahlin

Juolevi/Chatfield

Brisebois

 

 

And you think this combined with the 5 or 6 rookie forwards under the age of 21 and a rookie goalie are going to be "slick"? That lineup reminds of something the Oilers were icing around 2011.

[canuck2288]

1 hour ago, samurai said:

Gaunce, Dowd, Chaput, Boucher were in the line up.  Not exactly established players. My point is that it doesn’t matter which coach you have the team was and is bad.  However, Green’s systems make for better games.  Willie’s team was boring to watch.

Agree

 

i was hoping elfstroker would leave with Willie but he chooses to stay and live in the past. Players like Chaput, Dowd, Gaunce and Boucher are at best fill ins or marginal 4th line guys. 

 

[Pete M]

9 hours ago, 250Integra said:

Dan Cloutier would play better than a Markstrom and Nilsson right now 

Cloutier has them playing like him...

 

How small can I make myself look in my 6 ft 6in frame....Goalies got to stand up and face the shooter especially when hugging the post...and I'm no goaltender.

[canuck2288]

Just now, Pete M said:

Cloutier has them playing like him...

 

How small can I make myself look in my 6 ft 6in frame....Goalies got to stand up and face the shooter especially when hugging the post...and I'm no goaltender.

I posted the same comment and I am a goaltender 

 

They are showing a lack of confidence by dropping to their knees way too early and exposing the top shelf before the shot, 

 

this is should be simple to identify and fix but Cloutier must be fine with it 

[smithers joe]

ericksson's nmc, ends after this season. then his ntc kicks in. i believe he can choose teams he won't go to.  i believe we owe the sedins the right to go out on their own terms. 

jim has to keep some older players around until the kids are ready for the nhl.  i think jim knows what he is doing. 

[canuck2288]

I know Gaunce works hard but he has zero offensive skill 

 

he needs to be groomed as 4th line shut down guy because that will be his role if, he has one, in the NHL  

[smithers joe]

cdc GM's are marvellous. why doesn't our GM, read this site so he knows how to run this team. he is so short sighted. ain't he got no learnin?

[Phat Fingers]

43 minutes ago, Oregon.Duck said:

Yaknow what’s funny, Vegas doesn’t have better personnel from a skills perspective than we do. They’re an example of what playing inspired hockey looks like. Gallant is getting 110% out of each player...here Green seems like he can barely coach his way to 50%. 

 

Ugh. Infuriating to watch. 

Gotta say that LVK are a way deeper team than we are and have way better goaltending. 

 

Hard to say say it’s just Gallant. Also wanted WD fired and JB to hire Gallant as soon as he was let go by Florida.  Green was my second choice after Gallant. 

 

To me Green is doing well with very shaky and unproven goaltending, a lot of players who are being developed and a few too many long in the tooth to keep up with the play. 

 

If we had a healthy Horvat, Baer and Sutter it would make a big difference. 

 

For anybody comparing WD’s first year to Greens, on phrase should stand out. ‘It’s Miller time’. He is again proving what a difference good goaltending can make. 

 

The ducks &^@#ed up last year by not trading for him prior to the playoffs, they may have gotten past smashville 

[Hairy Kneel]

No more Sedin's please.

Gagner, go away.

Edler so racist on Boeser,why?

Please put Biega up front because hitting.

Play 2 goalies every game. The first goalie only 5 minutes though then play the starter. Tell the first goalie "your only playing 5 minutes STOP EVERYTHING!"

[VanGnome]

25 minutes ago, smithers joe said:

ericksson's nmc, ends after this season. then his ntc kicks in. i believe he can choose teams he won't go to.  i believe we owe the sedins the right to go out on their own terms. 

jim has to keep some older players around until the kids are ready for the nhl.  i think jim knows what he is doing. 

The question is not about keeping some veterans, it's about what veterans to keep. IMO, regardless of the forward direction of this team, Edler and Eriksson do nothing except hinder and hold back this team.

Gudbranson is best moved to a contender looking to shore up their blueline. We sign Carlson in the off season to replace that veteran leadership on the blueline, keep Tanev and Del Zotto, Sutter up front and the Sedins back for one more year. IMO that's all we need and should have for veteran presence.

Vanek is best served to us at the deadline by moving for a future piece/prospect, but we will need to retain significant cap in order to move Eriksson, I only hope that Benning was having a stroke when committing to signing him, because the optics otherwise don't make much sense.
 

[Nucker 67]

2 hours ago, samurai said:

Gaunce, Dowd, Chaput, Boucher were in the line up.  Not exactly established players. My point is that it doesn’t matter which coach you have the team was and is bad.  However, Green’s systems make for better games.  Willie’s team was boring to watch.

I thought those 4 players (Dowd, Gaunce, Chaput and Boucher) stood out and were the most noticeable for their hard work, and that's just sad. Where were the highly paid vets? The Sedins were back to their "pass all day" plan, Eriksson, Vanek and Gagner couldn't do anything and our goaltending is horrendous. Top 5 pick here we come.