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Linden and his Position the problem for GMJB


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do we need someone else in management  

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1 minute ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Is Chaput not a competitive guy? 

Looks like whether it was Sutter or Chaput on the roster, the result is a 5th OA pick. 

It doesn’t make a lick of difference what JB tries to do, he gets the same result, 4 years running, and counting.

 

I have some reservations about a reoccurring, moot strategy to remain, “competitive”. I don’t think there is a ton of competition to be one of the worst every year, but they are somewhat tougher. 

That's simply not true. With a healthy Sutter (and Horvat, Tanev, Guddy and Baer) we were a top 3 team in our division earlier this year.

 

The result isn't frankly, supposed to be much different. We're rebuilding.  We're not supposed to finish in the top 3rd.

 

Stay healthy, get some luck = bubble playoff team. Don't stay healthy = high pick. 

 

We probably have another 1-2 years of this coming, so I hope you're prepared :lol:

 

And you're still confusing 'competitive' with winning. Any winning during the rebuild is gravy. The key is to have some semblance of a fighting chance most games and not know you're a lotto team when you show up in October where winning much of anything is already a foregone conclusion and being ok with losing becomes a habit.

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3 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Maybe. Or maybe teams didn't show interest?

Never mind that while that's all well and good, the disconnect may have actually been the desire to win a cup. If I'm hiring management, I'd want to know they'd go to an armpit like EDM for a chance to build a cup team if it required it. Being 'comfortable' in Van is nice and all but it shows me a lack of desire to do what it takes or if not, like you said a lack of interest from other teams.

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On 1/3/2018 at 11:30 PM, Rob_Zepp said:

Hard to read and confusing.   I am trying to figure out if you are concerned about losing Benning due to Linden or if you want Benning gone but don't think the other guys you want (Holland and Armstrong mentioned) would work well with Linden unless he has a new title....do I have it right?    I can figure out you think Linden is an issue and needs to be moved away from hockey decisions.

 

If you saw any of the footage of the 2017 draft you would not have seen Linden anywhere near the table nor part of the discussion prior to picks being made.   What makes you then believe he is more involved in any other decision?   Benning has spoken to media but today, for one example, Benning is in Buffalo and Linden is in Vancouver so if Vancouver media were going to talk to someone it was Linden.

 

Again, not really sure of your point other than you clearly think Linden is not capable of making strong hockey personnel decisions.    Right?

In that case he should look into any openings at the province 

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46 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Maybe. Or maybe teams didn't show interest?

What is so invaluable about Gilman?  I think he is really over-rated around here.  Good question though - why hasn't another NHL franchise taken the opportunity to add Gilman to their management group?   Toronto don't exactly look like cap geniuses - 5.4 million in overage this year from last season....

 

The fact that some players took discounts (and limiting clauses) to enable this franchise during it's window to contend has what to do with the genius of Gilman? 

 

And if we're crediting him as a contract-guru, it remains that his fingerprints would be on what stands to be the costliest contract in the franchise's history - the "my contract sucks" Luongo deal that potentially carries very damaging future consequences for this team.  I don't blame Gillis or Gilman - the NHL did an about-face  on backsliding deals that it approved in the first place - creating a bizarre retroactive recapture penalty that should not stand up.   But I'm also at a loss regarding what Gilman supposedly did during the Gillis tenure that makes him irreplaceable.

 

His recent unsolicited advice to his former employer regarding Gudbranson is just that.    The fact he's making comments like that imo diminished the impression he'd built as a professional.  The public fantasy GMing, essentially nipping at his former employer - seems beneath him.

 

The additional irony for me is that his boss - MIke Gillis - had every intention of acquiring Gudbranson himself - no secrecy about it - he was on the shortlist of players they targeted when they were shopping Hodgson (along with John Carlson, Kassian and a few others).  

What does Gilman really know about Gudbranson's contract negotiations/expectations - making comments like this - " I would be moving him and getting the assets I can.....based that I think his expectations would be upwards of $5-6million."

I'm actually surprised that he's become so hard to take seriously.  I also have to wonder how the optics of something like this helps get him re-employed at the NHL level - not something I'd look favourably upon if I'm another NHL franchise (aside, perhaps, from the Leafs - they might appreciate what he's doing).

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2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

What is it so invaluable about Gilman?  I think he is really over-rated around here.  Good question though - why hasn't another NHL franchise taken the opportunity to add Gilman to their management group?   Toronto don't exactly look like cap geniuses - 5.4 million in overage this year from last season....

There is nothing invaluable about Gilman. He's milk that someone left out on the counter instead of putting back in the fridge.

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

The fact that some players took discounts (and limiting clauses) to enable this franchise during it's window to contend has what to do with the genius of Gilman? 

Genius of Gilman. That sounds like a lotion for dry skin. I'm sure Larry sat there and convinced Kesler, Hamhuis, Bieksa, Burrows and the rest to take less by opening up the books and going all Texas Instruments on their asses.

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

And if we're crediting him as a contract-guru, it remains that his fingerprints would be on what stands to be the costliest contract in the franchise's history - the "my contract sucks" Luongo deal that potentially carries very damaging future consequences for this team.  I don't blame Gillis or Gilman - the NHL did an about-face  on backsliding deals that it approved in the first place - creating a bizarre retroactive recapture penalty that should not stand up.   But I'm also at a loss regarding what Gilman supposedly did during the Gillis tenure that makes him irreplaceable.

That's the thing. When people defend the guy, and state somehow that his love of Vancouver is the reason he isn't still in the game of capology (not a real word), it's horse manure, especially considering Luongo's contract. I'd bargain to say that contract is part of the reason he's working at 1040.

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

His recent unsolicited advice to his former employer regarding Gudbranson is just that.    The fact he's making comments like that imo diminished the impression he'd built as a professional.  The public fantasy GMing, essentially nipping at his former employer - seems beneath him.

Clearly it isn't beneath him now. You walk with a group of people limping, you're gonna start limping too.

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

The additional irony for me is that his boss - MIke Gillis - had every intention of acquiring Gudbranson himself - no secrecy about it - he was on the shortlist of players they targeted when they were shopping Hodgson (along with John Carlson, Kassian and a few others). 

Interesting. That's the first I heard of that.

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

What does Gilman really know about Gudbranson's contract negotiations/expectations - making comments like this - " based that I think his expectations would be upwards of $5-6million."

Clearly Gilman has "people" who are in the know. Eklund, Spector, Crotchturd, and Tanbir. An awesome roster designed to make the shivers up your spine climb. (A reputation point to whomever can provide the song that lyric is from. Enticing, I know.)

2 minutes ago, oldnews said:

I'm actually surprised that he's become so hard to take seriously.  I also have to wonder how the optics of something like this helps get him re-employed at the NHL level - not something I'd look favourably upon if I'm another NHL franchise (aside, perhaps, from the Leafs - they might appreciate what he's doing).

The next time he works in the NHL will be when he dons a sweaty, mascot head and skates out onto the faint strains of Surrender.

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1 minute ago, PhillipBlunt said:

 

Genius of Gilman. That sounds like a lotion for dry skin. I'm sure Larry sat there and convinced Kesler, Hamhuis, Bieksa, Burrows and the rest to take less by opening up the books and going all Texas Instruments on their asses.

 

The next time he works in the NHL will be when he dons a sweaty, mascot head and skates out onto the faint strains of Surrender.

yes, and we can add Jason Garrison to his list of calculated victims lol.

 

the mascot reference reminds me of.....

 

 

 

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I honestly can't believe the results of the poll.  How can anyone who's paid attention to this team over the last 4 years want to keep things the same?  This is one of the worst teams in the NHL and it's because of their incompetent management that has bled value, traded away more draft picks and prospects than the previous regime, blown 2 of the highest draft picks this team has had in decades, and has suffered massive pro scouting failures.

 

Fire Benning, Fire Linden, Fire Weisbrod.  

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1 hour ago, aGENT said:

That's simply not true. With a healthy Sutter (and Horvat, Tanev, Guddy and Baer) we were a top 3 team in our division earlier this year.

 

The result isn't frankly, supposed to be much different. We're rebuilding.  We're not supposed to finish in the top 3rd.

 

Stay healthy, get some luck = bubble playoff team. Don't stay healthy = high pick. 

 

We probably have another 1-2 years of this coming, so I hope you're prepared :lol:

 

And you're still confusing 'competitive' with winning. Any winning during the rebuild is gravy. The key is to have some semblance of a fighting chance most games and not know you're a lotto team when you show up in October where winning much of anything is already a foregone conclusion and being ok with losing becomes a habit.

Except we're not rebuilding.  This is just a veteran team that's poorly constructed and sucks.

 

Rebuilding teams stockpile draft picks and prospects.  Benning so far has traded those away.  How is that ar ebuild?

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3 minutes ago, THINKER said:

Except we're not rebuilding.  This is just a veteran team that's poorly constructed and sucks.

 

Rebuilding teams stockpile draft picks and prospects.  Benning so far has traded those away.  How is that ar ebuild?

So Edmonton is doing the rebuildz the right way?

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5 minutes ago, THINKER said:

Except we're not rebuilding.  This is just a veteran team that's poorly constructed and sucks.

 

Rebuilding teams stockpile draft picks and prospects.  Benning so far has traded those away.  How is that ar ebuild?

Obvious troll is obvious.

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10 minutes ago, THINKER said:

Except we're not rebuilding.  This is just a veteran team that's poorly constructed and sucks.

 

Rebuilding teams stockpile draft picks and prospects.  Benning so far has traded those away.  How is that ar ebuild?

An ebuild? Is that a rebuild on NHL 18?

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8 minutes ago, riffraff said:

So Edmonton is doing the rebuildz the right way?

Edmonton's demise has been due to incompetent management that didn't understand how to build a hockey team, kinda like what we have right now.  

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7 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Obvious troll is obvious.

Not trolling actually.  Just not a Benning Bro.  

 

Just because one does not subscribe to the delusions that Linden and Benning are selling does not make one a troll.

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1 minute ago, THINKER said:

Not trolling actually.  Just not a Benning Bro.  

 

Just because one does not subscribe to the delusions that Linden and Benning are selling does not make one a troll.

Nope. The trolling makes one a troll.

 

513c1c32ea3837d95eb7b8274df0456b1d7603ae

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23 minutes ago, THINKER said:

Edmonton's demise has been due to incompetent management that didn't understand how to build a hockey team, kinda like what we have right now.  

Really?

 

so them having a great chance of not making the playoffs this year is due to blundering management?

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