Alflives Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 Loved the satire in the original Robo Cop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 5 hours ago, CBH1926 said: Chinese are trying to build more nuclear weapons as a deterrent to the U.S. Same reason why Russians have doomsday nuclear weapons that contain so many war heads or mobile nuclear weapons. Russians have always lacked ability to track potential launches that the U.S has. They are concerned with undetected strike so they have spread their weapons across the uninhabited areas. Russians and Chinese know where nuclear silos for minuteman are located. On the other hand Ohio class subs are all over the place. The West keeps underestimating Russia's ability to not just keep but sometimes get ahead of them. https://www.9news.com.au/world/russia-trials-biggest-nuclear-submarine-built-in-thirty-years-secret-weapons/3d4e5cc3-d184-494a-b187-29465131e036 https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-northern-fleet-new-class-of-subs-worry-us-navy-2021-6 And while the Chinese are second rate players ATM I don't believe it will take them long to catch up. https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2021/04/revealed-chinas-new-super-submarine-dwarfs-typhoon-class/ And as I have pointed out numbers don't really matter. If one nation uses more than 100 nuclear warheads on another the effect on them and the rest of us makes the use of them world ending as we know it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgom Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 10 hours ago, Ilunga said: I clicked on your link and nothing came up so I am not clear what deals and agreements you are referencing. As for the US being a rogue nation which by your inverted commas you seem to be questioning let me elucidate you on the meaning of the words rogue nation " a state that does not respect other states in its international actions". Between 1946 and 2000 the US interfered in 81 foreign elections as opposed to the Russians who interfered in 36. Since its inception there are only 3 countries on this planet the US has not invaded. https://www.wearethemighty.com/articles/these-are-the-only-3-countries-america-hasnt-invaded/ While many of these have had moral justification many have not. Then there is Blackwater I suggest you read that book about America private Army that's acts both outside and within its own borders. Then there are the " cointelpro" operations run by the American government against its own citizens. Here are some books you can read to inform yourself more on the subject. Derailing Democracy by David McGowan. Cointelpro papers by Ward Churchill and Jim Vander Wall Blackwater by Jeremy Scahill Rogue States The Rule of Force in World Affairs by Noam Chomsky The leading Rogue State The US and Human rights by Judith R Blau David l Brunsma Alberto Moncada Catherine Zimmer. This particular book illustrates how the US has declined to join most other UN nations in treaties addressing inadequate housing,poverty children's rights,health care,racial discrimination,and migrant workers. For decades the US has refused to ratify widely accepted agreements on many human rights. When you have finished reading those I can give you another dozen books to read on this subject. Don't worry buddy, I know how &^@#ed up the US has been in the past. But when talking about nukes, the US and even Russia have been disarming or at least were until the mid 2010's and they managed to decimate both of the countries' active warhead count. Wanna know which country always refuses to do so? The one massing silos right now. China never &^@#ing reduces their stockpile, they keep making it bigger. I don't think the US having a bunch of nukes leftover from the cold war is really such a big issue when they are actively reducing. Of course, the difference in quantity is still there, but we really have no clue how many nukes China actually has, and when the plan was everyone decrease your stockpile until we're not in a "everyone is dead if something pops off" level of nuclear weapons, why are you blaming the US for China stockpiling more? The US was disarming, or at least they were, why would they now when their biggest adversary is massing them? Why wouldn't Japan become a nuclear power with this sort of activity next door? The US can be a $&!# show of imperialism and warmongering, but they have a 70 year record of having nukes and not using them and have been reducing their stockpile for over 30 years along with Russia. China is under mining the worlds efforts in this. Edited July 4, 2021 by Kurgom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 31 minutes ago, Ilunga said: The West keeps underestimating Russia's ability to not just keep but sometimes get ahead of them. https://www.9news.com.au/world/russia-trials-biggest-nuclear-submarine-built-in-thirty-years-secret-weapons/3d4e5cc3-d184-494a-b187-29465131e036 https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-northern-fleet-new-class-of-subs-worry-us-navy-2021-6 And while the Chinese are second rate players ATM I don't believe it will take them long to catch up. https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2021/04/revealed-chinas-new-super-submarine-dwarfs-typhoon-class/ And as I have pointed out numbers don't really matter. If one nation uses more than 100 nuclear warheads on another the effect on them and the rest of us makes the use of them world ending as we know it. I’m hopeful the people (government leaders) with control over nukes live such extravagant lives they will never risk losing what they have by using those weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 25 minutes ago, Kurgom said: Why wouldn't Japan become a nuclear power with this sort of activity next door? Japan, more than any nation on earth understands what nuclear bombs do. If they choose not to be a nuclear power, who are we to criticise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 5 minutes ago, Kurgom said: Don't worry buddy, I know how &^@#ed up the US has been in the past. But when talking about nukes, the US and even Russia have been disarming or at least were until the mid 2010's and they managed to decimate both of the countries' active warhead count. Wanna know which country always refuses to do so? The one massing silos right now. China never &^@#ing reduces their stockpile, they keep making it bigger. I don't think the US having a bunch of nukes leftover from the cold war is really such a big issue when they are actively reducing. Of course, the difference in quantity is still there, but we really have no clue how many nukes China actually has, and when the plan was everyone decrease your stockpile until we're not in a "everyone is dead if something pops off" level of nuclear weapons, why are you blaming the US for China stockpiling more? The US was disarming, or at least they were, why would they now when their biggest adversary is massing them? Why wouldn't Japan become a nuclear power with this sort of activity next door? The US can be a $&!# show of imperialism and warmongering, but they have a 70 year record of having nukes and not using them and have been reducing their stockpile for over 30 years along with Russia. China is under mining the worlds efforts in this. Both Russia and the US have increased their stockpiles in the last year according to a Swedish think-tank. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2021/06/14/russia-us-boosted-nuclear-arsenals-in-2020-amid-global-decrease-think-tank-a74205 And what would you do if you were China in regards to Obama's pivot to Asia policy in regards to its military component ? Military bases ringing China from Japan,South Korea,The Phillipines to name a few. Imagine if China had military bases as close to the US as the US had to China,it's no wonder they are pushing back in the south China sea. All the nations that have nuclear weapons have a history of not using them while in possession of them. There is only one nation that has used the precursor to the nuclear bomb,the atomic bomb and that is the United States. Interestingly when one research's weapons of mass destruction,the first documented use of them was in America by British officers who distributed blankets infected with smallpox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, gurn said: Japan, more than any nation on earth understands what nuclear bombs do. If they choose not to be a nuclear power, who are we to criticise? Atomic Bombs . I know I am nitpicking however nuclear bombs are hundreds sometimes thousands of times more destructive than atomic bombs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 24 minutes ago, Alflives said: I’m hopeful the people (government leaders) with control over nukes live such extravagant lives they will never risk losing what they have by using those weapons. It's not the government leaders you have to worry about Alf it's the War mongering first strike believing military leaders that scare me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 1 minute ago, Ilunga said: It's not the government leaders you have to worry about Alf it's the War mongering first strike believing military leaders that scare me. Good point. Is there a weapon man has invented that he hasn’t used? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgom Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 27 minutes ago, gurn said: Japan, more than any nation on earth understands what nuclear bombs do. If they choose not to be a nuclear power, who are we to criticise? They haven't chosen not to be a nuclear power, they basically aren't allowed to because of the US. But that is seriously changing with how aggressive China is being and NK. They have the capability and it will take weeks for them to start producing ICMBs. Soon, the "helicopter carrier" they have will be full of f-16s and their subs will have nukes because China is stockpiling. It's actually one of the hottest topics in Japanese politics right now, the "we don't have an army but actually do" song and dance is going to come to an end and Japan will be free to nuke up because China is trying to just take over everything in the region. That's the problem, the world WAS disarming. China wasn't stockpiling even if they refused to disarm. Until great leader Xi decided he wanted to become a fascist military dictatorship. Now Japan, the country that was nuked, wants to build &^@#ing nukes. 24 minutes ago, Ilunga said: And what would you do if you were China in regards to Obama's pivot to Asia policy in regards to its military component ? Military bases ringing China from Japan,South Korea,The Phillipines to name a few. The US has always had nukes and military bases there. These aren't new. The only change is China's attitude. The US has been so cordial with China it's crazy, $&!#loads of aid and letting them do whatever to Tibet, letting them strong arm Taiwan away from being in the UN. This is repaid by China massing nuclear weapons? The US was never, ever going to invade China. But China acts like it was under constant threat of invasion and building more nukes is the only thing that will stop it. The reality is China is the aggressor here, SEA and East Asia were relatively peaceful under American policing. Now that China wants everyone to bend to them, America pivots to protect its allies, and they're the bad guys so China HAD to build WMDs en masse? Yeah okay. Edited July 4, 2021 by Kurgom 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 12 minutes ago, Alflives said: Good point. Is there a weapon man has invented that he hasn’t used? Hydrogen and Nuclear weapons have never been used in combat Alf. A retired US army Captain,Eric May claims the US used neutron weapons in Baghdad They qualify as weapons of mass destruction. Maybe they felt they had to use the weapons they claimed were there in the first place as a pretext for their illegal invasion of that country. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, Ilunga said: Hydrogen and Nuclear weapons have never been used in combat Alf. A retired US army Captain,Eric May claims the US used neutron weapons in Baghdad They qualify as weapons of mass destruction. Maybe they felt they had to use the weapons they claimed were there in the first place as a pretext for their illegal invasion of that country. A fairly smart person said: "I know not with what weapons World WarIII will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones". A. Einstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Kurgom said: They haven't chosen not to be a nuclear power, they basically aren't allowed to because of the US. But that is seriously changing with how aggressive China is being and NK. They have the capability and it will take weeks for them to start producing ICMBs. Soon, the "helicopter carrier" they have will be full of f-16s and their subs will have nukes because China is stockpiling. It's actually one of the hottest topics in Japanese politics right now, the "we don't have an army but actually do" song and dance is going to come to an end and Japan will be free to nuke up because China is trying to just take over everything in the region. That's the problem, the world WAS disarming. China wasn't stockpiling even if they refused to disarm. Until great leader Xi decided he wanted to become a fascist military dictatorship. Now Japan, the country that was nuked, wants to build &^@#ing nukes. The US has always had nukes and military bases there. These aren't new. The only change is China's attitude. The US has been so cordial with China it's crazy, $&!#loads of aid and letting them do whatever to Tibet, letting them strong arm Taiwan away from being in the UN. This is repaid by China massing nuclear weapons? The US was never, ever going to invade China. But China acts like it was under constant threat of invasion and building more nukes is the only thing that will stop it. The reality is China is the aggressor here, SEA and East Asia were relatively peaceful under American policing. Now that China wants everyone to bend to them, America pivots to protect its allies, and they're the bad guys so China HAD to build WMDs en masse? Yeah okay. You obviously have not researched Obama's pivot to Asia and how it both politically and militarily threatened China https://thediplomat.com/2017/01/the-pivot-to-asia-was-obamas-biggest-mistake/ You just don't seem to get it I will repeat it for the third time,if a nation uses more than 100 nukes against another nation we are all @#$#@#. China has around 250 America has 6185 And who says China is massing nuclear weapons ? It was me that posted the article about China building what looks like sites for silos as @CBH1926 pointed outthat could be a strategy to defend against the United states submarine fleet. So what the facts actually are is that the nation who since WW2 has #_@#$$ with more nations than any other and has the most nuclear warheads on the planet is to be trusted ? Who knows which country they will go looking for weapons of mass destruction in and then use them on that populace. Edited July 4, 2021 by Ilunga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgom Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Ilunga said: You obviously have not researched Obama's pivot to Asia and how it both politically and militarily threatened China https://thediplomat.com/2017/01/the-pivot-to-asia-was-obamas-biggest-mistake/ You just don't seem to get it I will repeat it for the third time,if a nation uses more than 100 nukes against another nation we are all @#$#@#. China has around 250 America has 6185 And who says China is massing nuclear weapons ? It was me that posted the article about China building what looks like sites for silos as @CBH1926 pointed outthat could be a strategy to defend against the United states submarine fleet. So what the facts actually are is that the nation who since WW2 has #_@#$$ with more nations than any other and has the most nuclear warheads on the planet is to be trusted ? Who knows which country they will go looking for weapons of mass destruction in and then use them on that populace. Really surprised they're even sending wuamo to the off topic section of a hockey forum. They need to "defend" against a threat that doesn't exist. The US was never, ever going to invade China, there was no way for them to do so first of all, and there was no reason since China supercharged the US economy by becoming its factory. I will once again bring up the absolutely cordial relationship the US has had with China until Xi, billions in aid, letting them take over Tibet freely, letting them push Taiwan around. It's no lie to say the US had better relations with China than Russia until recently. Why is the US suddenly China's biggest enemy and a huge threat? You can keep deflecting to the US but Canadians will continue to see what China is doing. China has 250 now supposedly, and are building more. The US has 1/10th of their cold war peak. Tell me why is the US bad here again? China is not building nukes to defend itself. It wants enough that no one will be able to stop them when they exert their will over places like Arunachal Pradesh and eventually Bhutan, Japan, Korea, Nepal. Edited July 4, 2021 by Kurgom 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 I reside in australia, I am a flower farmer of caucasian descent who identifies as a human being-agnostic humanist. I did not even know what wuamo was until you used the word and then I looked it up. Amazing now days if someone disagrees with what one has to say you literally play the trump card and claim fake news. I have been studying geopolitics for over 40 years and love to discuss it,I have even started a topic on the subject. I am not deflecting I am pointing out who has been the aggressor in the world and who has actually used weapons of mass destruction and that is the United States of America. You stated those bases that the US has ringing China have always been there however you have not answered my question which was what would the US do if China had bases as close to the US as the US does to China Again who says China is building nukes ? Building sites is different from building weapons I deal in facts and what has actually happened. To this point in our history out of China and the US it is the US that continually interferes in other nations elections, illegally invades them and actually has used weapons of mass destruction on others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Kurgom said: Really surprised they're even sending wuamo to the off topic section of a hockey forum. They need to "defend" against a threat that doesn't exist. The US was never, ever going to invade China, there was no way for them to do so first of all, and there was no reason since China supercharged the US economy by becoming its factory. I will once again bring up the absolutely cordial relationship the US has had with China until Xi, billions in aid, letting them take over Tibet freely, letting them push Taiwan around. It's no lie to say the US had better relations with China than Russia recently. Why is the US suddenly China's biggest enemy and a huge threat? You can keep deflecting to the US but Canadians will continue to see what China is doing. China has 250 now supposedly, and are building more. The US has 1/10th of their cold war peak. Tell me why is the US bad here again? China is not building nukes to defend itself. It wants enough that no one will be able to stop them when they exert their will over places like Arunachal Pradesh and eventually Bhutan, Japan, Korea, Nepal. 35 minutes ago, Kurgom said: Really surprised they're even sending wuamo to the off topic section of a hockey forum. They need to "defend" against a threat that doesn't exist. The US was never, ever going to invade China, there was no way for them to do so first of all, and there was no reason since China supercharged the US economy by becoming its factory. I will once again bring up the absolutely cordial relationship the US has had with China until Xi, billions in aid, letting them take over Tibet freely, letting them push Taiwan around. It's no lie to say the US had better relations with China than Russia recently. Why is the US suddenly China's biggest enemy and a huge threat? You can keep deflecting to the US but Canadians will continue to see what China is doing. China has 250 now supposedly, and are building more. The US has 1/10th of their cold war peak. Tell me why is the US bad here again? China is not building nukes to defend itself. It wants enough that no one will be able to stop them when they exert their will over places like Arunachal Pradesh and eventually Bhutan, Japan, Korea, Nepal. 35 minutes ago, Kurgom said: Really surprised they're even sending wuamo to the off topic section of a hockey forum. They need to "defend" against a threat that doesn't exist. The US was never, ever going to invade China, there was no way for them to do so first of all, and there was no reason since China supercharged the US economy by becoming its factory. I will once again bring up the absolutely cordial relationship the US has had with China until Xi, billions in aid, letting them take over Tibet freely, letting them push Taiwan around. It's no lie to say the US had better relations with China than Russia recently. Why is the US suddenly China's biggest enemy and a huge threat? You can keep deflecting to the US but Canadians will continue to see what China is doing. China has 250 now supposedly, and are building more. The US has 1/10th of their cold war peak. Tell me why is the US bad here again? China is not building nukes to defend itself. It wants enough that no one will be able to stop them when they exert their will over places like Arunachal Pradesh and eventually Bhutan, Japan, Korea, Nepal. Woops messed up trying to quote your post. Refer to the post above. Edited July 4, 2021 by Ilunga 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Okay, all these allusions to ‘WUAMO’ peaked my curiosity. Goggle search and ..That gave me a ‘Depends’ changing laugh 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 1 minute ago, Alflives said: Okay, all these allusions to ‘WUAMO’ peaked my curiosity. Goggle search and ..That gave me a ‘Depends’ changing laugh It's getting so hard to have a civil discussion with someone who does not agree with your point of view. Accused of being part of the propaganda machine of the CCP,freaking hilarious. 2 days ago I was shovelling $#@$ We don't always agree but you carry yourself with dignity and treat others with respect Alf Good on you my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgom Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Ilunga said: To this point in our history out of China and the US it is the US that continually interferes in other nations elections, illegally invades them and actually has used weapons of mass destruction on others. China has illegally invaded Tibet so I don't know why you act like the country is some saint. It's a psycho dictatorship that is proud of murdering its own people in "revolutions." Right now the US has been muzzled by its own population, who in China will stop the Chinese from invading Taiwan? Your obsession with the US in unhealthy. There is no way to defend China constructing massive fields of nuclear silos. "But the US" doesn't change anything. Especially when the US has such an inability to force China to do anything at all. If this was a small country you might have a point, for example Iran can justifiably say the US/Israel is the reason they want nukes. China? China has no defensive reasoning for making silos that exist to force the US to play tic tac toe we're all &^@#ing dead with MAD around their land grabs. This will just make Japan arm themselves. They already had nukes, no one was going to invade them. Now they want enough to survive and retaliate in a mass exchange like Russia can, so the US and anyone who doesn't like what China does can't do anything when they say "yeah Korea was always China." KIND OF LIKE WHAT RUSSIA IS DOING TO UKRAINE. When a country has that much nuclear power, their word is law, like the US. Why are you OK with even more tyrannical garbage getting more power over the planet? Because China will be #1 instead of big bad murica? Edited July 4, 2021 by Kurgom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilunga Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 Just now, Kurgom said: China has illegally invaded Tibet so I don't know why you act like the country is some saint. It's a psycho dictatorship that is proud of murdering its own people in "revolutions." Right now the US has been muzzled by its own population, who in China will stop the Chinese from invading Taiwan? Your obsession with the US in unhealthy. There is no way to defend China constructing massive "But the US" doesn't change anything. Especially when the US has such an inability to force China to do anything at all. If this was a small country you might have a point, for example Iran can justifiably say the US/Israel is the reason they want nukes. China? China has no defensive reasoning for making silos that exist to force the US to play tic tac toe we're all &^@#ing dead with MAD around their land grabs. In our discussion have I stated China was/is saintly ? No I have condemned both China and Ping himself for his actions in regards to Hong Kong ,Taiwan and more importantly the Uighurs on this forum. My obsession with the the dominant nation in the world since WW2 and the negative impact that nation has had in so many others is unhealthy ? We are discussing Geopolitics and no one nation has had a bigger impact on them in the last 70 years. You bring up Iran There is another country the US has continually $#@$"$ with since the 1950's. Right up until trump trashing the nuclear deal which has a knock on effect to others countries in the region. Glad you brought up MAD I continually do What can one say about a species whose strategy for survival has the acronym MAD and that is in actuality mutual assured destruction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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