Has the Western World Lost Moderate/Centrist Politics?

[Rob_Zepp]

Noticing more and more the radicalization of pretty much every societal issue by the extreme and right and left wing political agendas.   You are either "one of them" or you are "one of us" with no ability to embrace a bit from both and then ask for compromise on other items.    The extreme left want nothing to do with individual accountability, want environmental programs void of scientific reason, open borders, economic policies that remove all incentives and instead distribute all wealth equally and so forth.   The extreme right don't believe in privilege by birth, believe people in bad situations (health or economic) are their by choice (laziness typically cited) and think government's role in society should be kept to maintaining infrastructure/military.

 

Where is the there room anymore for people who simply want:

• fiscal responsibility by government that doesn't mortgage the future for the present
• fair taxation that has sufficient incentives to promote success/innovation (e.g. keeping options taxed lower) but is void of excessive loopholes to benefit the very few (offshore shelters)
• taking care of those who cannot take of themselves but having a hard line on those who simply "expect" a living from society
• health care that has access to all who need it but can also accommodate a parallel process for those who wish to pay more (and that doesn't take away from the societal access system)
• environmental management that balances human activities, science and avoids extreme agendas - and avoids NIMBY policies/politicis
• balanced economy with removal of the hypocrisy of society demanding one thing and then making that thing impossible to deliver - e.g. don't embrace the concept of "Walmart" if you want fair wages in countries where kids make shoes for you
• has immigration/refugee programs that are fair, transparent and predictable 
• a judicial system that treats crimes that harm society with commensurate sentencing and is both colour and economically blind

 

The list is clearly longer but more and more, depending up on the audience, people who strive for things like those noted above are either noted as "right wing" by people on the left or "liberal/left" by people on the right.    

 

The US seemingly desperately needs a third party now that one has been hijacked by the loonies at the extreme right but the leftards seemingly have the other party well in hand.  Canada is a curious case as the furthest "Right" party is probably what the Democrats in the US used to be and the Liberals in Canada have taken over the left agenda - leaving the NDP where exactly is hard to know.   Germany doesn't have anyone in the middle.   

 

Is there room?   I think someone offering the above would be a massive problem for the extremists at both ends and would lead to long-term, stable majority governments.

[logic]

The extreme right has been created by the radical left, every day I thank god Killary didn't win

 

Look at the massive conservative wave taking place all over the world, people are sick and tired of this PC society BS. Where if you disagree you're labelled a bigot, nazi, racist, islamaphobe ect ect

 

The Only reason the most of the media media is anti Trump is because they're all owned by Liberals/Democrats..

 

Its okay to be Hollywood pedophile but not to support trump these days lmao

Edited July 30, 2018 by logic

[LordCanuck]

7 minutes ago, logic said:

The extreme right has been created by the radical left, every day I thank god Killary didn't win

 

Look at the massive conservative wave taking place all over the world, people are sick and tired of this PC society BS. Where if you disagree you're labelled a bigot, nazi, racist, islamaphobe ect ect

 

The Only reason the most of the media media is anti Trump is because they're all owned by Liberals/Democrats..

 

Its okay to be Hollywood pedophile but not to support trump these days lmao

the extreme right was created way back in bush's days and went into overdrive during obama. Theyve always existed in some form. wow ok i dont know why i even quoted u, ur a special snowflake.

[Russ]

For most people it seems to be so hard on one side or the other.  Each group basically wants to force the other group to believe what they believe and if you don't your labeled ridiculous things.  Social media has really brought this to the for front, where groups can hide behind computers and hate on people of either side and then it has created a rage where when the 2 sides somehow meet in the streets all hell seems to break loose for whatever reason.  I find myself as fairly centered still, theres lots of things on the left I like with some tweaks and theres lots of things on the right I like with some tweaks.  Theres also many many things on both sides I hate and think are radical thinking and moronic statements. 

[logic]

 

11 minutes ago, LordCanuck said:

the extreme right was created way back in bush's days and went into overdrive during obama. Theyve always existed in some form. wow ok i dont know why i even quoted u, ur a special snowflake.

Lol can't even form a rebuttal without throwing in an insult.

 

You're right the extreme right has always existed as a minority.

 

Since 2012 to now which I like to call the Social justice era,  the radical left has been trying to take over culture, in terms of what is acceptable for hollywood stars, the media, politicians, everyday people to think and say, and if you don't agree you're labelled. A lot of people don't agree with that and therefore and forced into joining the otherside, even if they are more centrist at heart, like myself.

Edited July 30, 2018 by logic

[LordCanuck]

Just now, logic said:

 

Lol can't even form a rebuttal without throwing in an insult.

nah, theres no point, u went off the deep end after ur first sentence

[logic]

3 minutes ago, LordCanuck said:

nah, theres no point, u went off the deep end after ur first sentence

It would be easy to debunk what I said then.

not enough people are willing to discuss differing views.

[Rob_Zepp]

9 minutes ago, Russ said:

For most people it seems to be so hard on one side or the other.  Each group basically wants to force the other group to believe what they believe and if you don't your labeled ridiculous things.  Social media has really brought this to the for front, where groups can hide behind computers and hate on people of either side and then it has created a rage where when the 2 sides somehow meet in the streets all hell seems to break loose for whatever reason.  I find myself as fairly centered still, theres lots of things on the left I like with some tweaks and theres lots of things on the right I like with some tweaks.  Theres also many many things on both sides I hate and think are radical thinking and moronic statements. 

@Russ - well said!!!

[Nuxfanabroad]

Options were never really given. It was all a facade, unfortunately. Society was set up to benefit the richest(especially corporations).

 

Our living standards, on a wider scale, were mostly maintained by bombing brown people for cheap oil. George Carlin rants(from about early 90's, onwards) were a closer depiction of what western societies had been reduced to, than any private citizen might acknowledge, or entitled politician admit .

 

People & society(individual AND group) were far more interesting back in the 70's..which is my own earliest memories.

 

We created a today of all style & no substance.

[logic]

I think a big problem is people are forced into the viewing of other peoples lives due to social media, wether it be their neighbours, friends, athletes, ect it means people are more connected than ever which makes it harder for people just to focus on themselves and their own problems.

Constantly comparing and seeing others do better can cause some people to be envious and want to bring them down in order to justify themselves, where as before people were only concerned with their own surroundings.

[Sygvard]

I love how the first two responses to this thread were someone on each side reinforcing the vitriol and raging at each other. It took exactly one post each to bring in the words pedophile and snowflake respectively. 

 

It couldn't have reinforced his point better if he tried. @Rob_Zepp you sure those aren't both extra accounts of yours? 

[DrJockitch]

I feel like it is extreme views on both sides by people that rarely understand the issues.

Hard to even define what centrist is anymore.  Used to be that the general population sat in the middle or just left of it. 

With social media now delivering the news the tribal nature of things is just increasing.  People seek out the news they want to here and won't listen to a dissenting opinion.

Ultimately though it is not the right controlling things or the left, it is the elite political donor class that controls the democratic world.  Most of the issues people rally around are cover to hide the increasing disparity in the world.

Oh and the media is not owned by liberals/democrats it is owned by the wealthy who are plastic to whoever will increase their profits.  They pander more to the left because that is generally where the population sits.  Outrage sells and Trump is outrageous.

To say it is okay to be a Hollywood pedophile is okay ignores all recent history and no, having sexual assaults in Hollywood does not justify having a habitual sexual assaulter as president.

[Nuxfanabroad]

3 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:

I feel like it is extreme views on both sides by people that rarely understand the issues.

Hard to even define what centrist is anymore.  Used to be that the general population sat in the middle or just left of it. 

With social media now delivering the news the tribal nature of things is just increasing.  People seek out the news they want to here and won't listen to a dissenting opinion.

Ultimately though it is not the right controlling things or the left, it is the elite political donor class that controls the democratic world.  Most of the issues people rally around are cover to hide the increasing disparity in the world.

Oh and the media is not owned by liberals/democrats it is owned by the wealthy who are plastic to whoever will increase their profits.  They pander more to the left because that is generally where the population sits.  Outrage sells and Trump is outrageous.

To say it is okay to be a Hollywood pedophile is okay ignores all recent history and no, having sexual assaults in Hollywood does not justify having a habitual sexual assaulter as president.

Feels like TPTB at top of the pyramid want society to be a great number of divided factions, at each other's throats for one reason, or another.

 

This divisiveness has a point & purpose. Entities like MSM just fanning the flames.

[-DLC-]

46 minutes ago, logic said:

The Only reason the most of the media media is anti Trump is because they're all owned by Liberals/Democrats..

 

I actually think it's more to do with Trump's words and actions, that are those of a narcissistic, out of control, racist, sexist, bigoted, lying bully.   The media is simply reacting to that like the rest of the world...in shock and horror. 

Without turning this into another Trump dump, I think politics have become a mud sling and campaigns come out of the gates with "us against them".  Rather than focus on positive changes and contributions that can be offered, it's taking down the opposition.  It then just carries on post election.  Or at least has this time around....

There are serious divides in the world and it's important to have leaders who bridge the gaps and bring people together, not push them further apart.  That serves no one in the end.

[logic]

7 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:

I feel like it is extreme views on both sides by people that rarely understand the issues.

Hard to even define what centrist is anymore.  Used to be that the general population sat in the middle or just left of it. 

With social media now delivering the news the tribal nature of things is just increasing.  People seek out the news they want to here and won't listen to a dissenting opinion.

Ultimately though it is not the right controlling things or the left, it is the elite political donor class that controls the democratic world.  Most of the issues people rally around are cover to hide the increasing disparity in the world.

Oh and the media is not owned by liberals/democrats it is owned by the wealthy who are plastic to whoever will increase their profits.  They pander more to the left because that is generally where the population sits.  Outrage sells and Trump is outrageous.

To say it is okay to be a Hollywood pedophile is okay ignores all recent history and no, having sexual assaults in Hollywood does not justify having a habitual sexual assaulter as president.

You're right I shouldn't say they are liberals, but they are using liberals/democrats to push their agenda of dividing people any way possible.

A strong, united America hurts the globalists immensely which is why there is this crazy war on Trump, and the goal of turning the American people against on another is taking place. I do not agree with a lot of the things Trump says or does but the witch hunt against him is unbelievable, I've never seen so much propaganda everywhere you look.

[logic]

1 minute ago, debluvscanucks said:

I actually think it's more to do with Trump's words and actions, that are those of a narcissistic, out of control, racist, sexist, bigoted liar.   The media is simply reacting to it like the rest of the world...in shock and horror. 

If he's so racist why is black unemployment its lowest since 1972, hispanic tied for its lowest ever?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-04/black-and-hispanic-unemployment-in-america-reach-record-lows

 

Woman unemployment lowest in 18 years 

https://www.concordmonitor.com/Kanye-West-and-Trump-17129316

 

First president to openly come into office supporting gay marriage.

If he is so sexist and racist wouldn't he be making it harder for these people to get jobs

[-DLC-]

4 minutes ago, logic said:

which is why there is this crazy war on Trump, and the goal of turning the American people against on another is taking place. I do not agree with a lot of the things Trump says or does but the witch hunt against him is unbelievable, I've never seen so much propaganda everywhere you look.

He's leading that charge though.  He's constantly pointing fingers, on the attack and is focused on defending himself.  He can change that....quit making it about himself.  But his ego likely gets in the way of that happening.  This isn't "his" deal, it's a country's.  He's making questionable BFF's and serving an agenda that's more of a popularity contest than anything.  Nope, I don't feel he's a victim in this...he's creating it.

[logic]

13 minutes ago, Nuxfanabroad said:

Feels like TPTB at top of the pyramid want society to be a great number of divided factions, at each other's throats for one reason, or another.

 

This divisiveness has a point & purpose. Entities like MSM just fanning the flames.

United people are harder to control, especially a nation with 50% of the worlds guns

[-DLC-]

1 minute ago, logic said:

United people are harder to control, especially a nation with 50% of the worlds guns

[Ghostsof1915]

2 minutes ago, logic said:

United people are harder to control, especially a nation with 50% of the worlds guns

So might means right is what your saying?