Josh Leivo | #17 | LW/RW

[Phil_314]

1 hour ago, Canuckster86 said:

poor mans Toffoli replacement. If cap stays the same I can't see how we can keep Markstrom, Toffoli both of who will for sure make over 5m each both might want 6m. Then you have Tanev. Hopefully we get a compliance buyout and make some trades to shed some cap. We are turning the corner yet we are stuck in cap hell

He's underrated for sure but still only a depth piece (like a Stempniak or Versteeg back in the day, probably at best a Vrbata) than a first choice top-6 option.  Of course if he's signed for $1.5 - $2 million or so to put up around 30 (40 points if we're lucky and he's consistent) then that's a valuable addition for sure.  Since we traded for Toffoli though, I think (and agree somewhat with these folks) that it would suck to just lose him after 10 games given how well he's gelled, so I hope he re-signs.  If we're bound to lose Toffoli and Tanev though, I would not mind having Josh back just to offset some of that loss of underrated skill.      

[aGENT]

7 hours ago, Canuckster86 said:

poor mans Toffoli replacement. If cap stays the same I can't see howe we can keep Markstrom, Toffoli both of who will for sure make over 5m each both might want 6m. Then you have Tanev. Hopefully we get a compliance buyout and make some trades to shed some cap. We are turning the corner yet we are stuck in cap hell

Depends on what the league decides on addressing covid reduced revenue cap issues and clearing some other salary (trade Roussel, buyout/retain Baer etc) but we can afford all three if we want to.

 

Toffoli is only going to require a few hundred extra K. Same with Tanev. Marky is about $2m. Altogether, that's about a $3m increase +/- (or Roussel's contract).

 

Of course we still also need raises for Virtanen, Gaudette, possibly Stecher. But again that's where things like buying out/retaining on Baer, trading Benn come in. There are ways to make it work.

Edited May 11, 2020 by aGENT

[wildcam]

On May 10, 2020 at 8:03 AM, aGENT said:

Largely agreed.

 

My biggest concern with re-signing Leivo would be roster space (particularly if we retain Toffoli, which I think and hope we do). Winger depth is NOT where we're lacking and if Ferland is healthy too, it's only more crowded.

 

Perhaps that allows us to make the Virtanen/Boeser for a D trade earlier than I envisioned but I dunno, I think we may just do what's right for the player and let him go on to a team with more space.

 

 

I really like Leivo 6'2, 195,  27 soon, depth, gritty and has skill maybe 2 yrs x 1.8 million.

Centre position solid..1. Pettersson - Horvat - Gaudette --- Sutter- Beagle --- Would like to see Big MacEwen transition slowly..

Wing solid -- 1. Miller 2. Taffoli 3.Boeser 3. Pearson 4.Virtanen 5. Ferland  6. Leivo 7.Roussel  8. MacEwen  9.Motte 10.Erickson

Goal solid - 1.Markstrom 2. Demko 3. Dipietro 4. Kielly 5.Silovs 

 

Team finished 8th in league for goals -- 

Trading a winger is depth spot... Possibly Boeser will bring back best return....

Miller 25 -30

Taffoli 30 -35

Pearson 20 - 23

Virtanen - 20 - 25 Goals playing more mins 14-16 mins --- Jake avg 13 mins this season. (.See Jake at 16 mins)

Leivo -  can score 19-23 Goals playing bigger role with more mins

MacEwen 15 -20

Roussel 15

Ferland - Healthy  - 18- 23

Motte - 10

 

Defence weakest position with age :

1. Edler 34  - 2. Hughes -  3. Tanev 30 UFA -  4. Myers 30 - 5. Stetcher 26 - 6. Fantenberg 28 -- 7. Benn 32

Rafferty 25 soon --- Brisebois 22 -- Juolevi  22 -- Rathbone  21  ---Tryamkin 26 - Woo 19 -- Sautner 26 soon

Need a solid NHL calibre # 3 D man very soon, nobody in Utica ready for this role and playing 19 - 21 mins per game very important position..

 

Edited May 11, 2020 by wildcam

[WestCoastDave]

I also like Leivo.  I think his biggest problem is that he seems to be injury prone.  When you check out his career, he misses a lot of games.  If the Nucks could figure out how to keep him healthy over a long period of time, it will help Josh and the team. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by WestCoastDave

[wildcam]

1 hour ago, WestCoastDave said:

I also like Leivo.  I think his biggest problem is that he seems to be injury prone.  When you check out his career, he misses a lot of games.  If the Nucks could figure out how to keep him healthy over a long period of time, it will help Josh and the team. 

I think he was a healthy scratch lots of nights in Toronto, he was young and 13th forward...

I really think Leivo could be a 19 -23 Goal guy plays a great style and good size...

[Junkyard Dog]

Silver-lining with Leivo's injury is that he's gonna be cheaper to sign if we decide to re-sign. He was on pace for a 40-50 point season and would of been guaranteed 3M+ as a UFA.

 

At this point the smartest move for him would be a show me deal. At 26 years of age a 1 year deal can still net him a long term deal afterwards if he proves capable. Whether that be with us is another question.

[Shirotashi]

On 5/10/2020 at 4:04 PM, Canuckster86 said:

poor mans Toffoli replacement. If cap stays the same I can't see howe we can keep Markstrom, Toffoli both of who will for sure make over 5m each both might want 6m. Then you have Tanev. Hopefully we get a compliance buyout and make some trades to shed some cap. We are turning the corner yet we are stuck in cap hell

Uggg I cannot stand Levio. No idea what people see in him, you get a forward thats supposed to score goals, and he scores goals and now hes poor mans Toffoli? He pops in a few goals and everyone wants him to stay on the team and eat up cap space?  He literally has no upside other than his finish. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Shirotashi

[-AJ-]

32 minutes ago, Shirotashi said:

Uggg I cannot stand Levio. No idea what people see in him, you get a forward thats supposed to score goals, and he scores goals and now hes poor mans Toffoli? He pops in a few goals and everyone wants him to stay on the team and eat up cap space?  He literally has no upside other than his finish. 

He doesn't have a high ceiling and he's no Toffoli, but 40-50 point forwards have value. He was on pace for 15 or 16 goals and about 43 points. I think many (myself included) are trying to bring attention to the fact that Leivo's strong season last year (by far the best full one of his career), shouldn't be overlooked just because he was injured. He's not just the 30-point bottom six guy he was in 2018-19 anymore if last year was anything to go off of. He's improved notably and that's something to celebrate.

 

On the Toffoli point, he would no way replace Toffoli, hence the term "poor-mans". If we can't afford Toffoli and his $5-6M or whatever he's asking, we could have a second best option that would be dramatically cheaper in Leivo who, I must reiterate again, isn't as good as Toffoli, is still capable of being a fringe 2nd line forward and might be the more realistic option given cap constraints. Obviously Toffoli would be more ideal, but it might not be realistic.

[peaches5]

Quote

The defenseman has had a series of setbacks since breaking his kneecap during a game against the Minnesota Wild on April 4, 2019. He had surgery days after the injury, then had another procedure a month later after breaking the kneecap again while trying to come back during the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

https://www.nhl.com/news/bruins-miller-third-surgery-on-right-knee/c-316932376

 

Similar injury to Leivo and after a year he still isn't close to returning.

 

 

[Shirotashi]

On 5/15/2020 at 10:17 AM, The 5th Line said:

You're knocking him but at the same time you're pointing out that he pops in goals and than he has upside.. "finish"

 

He's not due for much of a pay raise, he missed most the year.  If anything people should feel bad for the guy, he was buried in Toronto, finally got a chance in Vancouver, did well then got hurt.  He would actually be a great guy to bring back for cheap, he's had my support since day 1.  I'm a big fan

 

A player needs to have more upside then he does to occupy a spot on an NHL team. Especially the slot he would

need to occupy to stay effective. Id like to see a guy like Justin Bailey bumping Levio off the team. Bailey has so much

more  upside than Levio. 

[lmm]

24 minutes ago, Shirotashi said:

 

A player needs to have more upside then he does to occupy a spot on an NHL team. Especially the slot he would

need to occupy to stay effective. Id like to see a guy like Justin Bailey bumping Levio off the team. Bailey has so much

more  upside than Levio. 

what is it you see in  Bailey?

He is bigger, by 2 " and 20# and younger by 2 years

 

but Leivo has out score him .78ppg to .66ppg in the AHL 

and .38ppg to .14 ppg in the NHL

 

Bailey's size and numbers are closer to Tyler Graovac although he is 5 years younger

 

Do you see Bailey having a big break out year?

[MrCanuck94]

33 minutes ago, Shirotashi said:

 

A player needs to have more upside then he does to occupy a spot on an NHL team. Especially the slot he would

need to occupy to stay effective. Id like to see a guy like Justin Bailey bumping Levio off the team. Bailey has so much

more  upside than Levio. 

Leivo probably won't have a spot on our team anymore due to our depth but Bailey does not have more upside than him. However, role wise, Bailey would be a better fit for the fourth line if injuries occur there whereas Leivo is a good filler for the middle six if injuries occur.

[Captain Canuck #12]

1 hour ago, MrCanuck94 said:

Leivo probably won't have a spot on our team anymore due to our depth but Bailey does not have more upside than him. However, role wise, Bailey would be a better fit for the fourth line if injuries occur there whereas Leivo is a good filler for the middle six if injuries occur.

If all forwards are healthy, I'm pretty sure Green would give Leivo one of the last spots in the bottom 6, leaving Motte and MacEwen as the spare forwards (and Eriksson, hopefully, gone).

[Junkyard Dog]

1 hour ago, Captain Canuck #12 said:

If all forwards are healthy, I'm pretty sure Green would give Leivo one of the last spots in the bottom 6, leaving Motte and MacEwen as the spare forwards (and Eriksson, hopefully, gone).

I think Leivo's the odd man out if Toffoli is re-signed. He just isn't better than Motte/Mac in a 4th line role. He could be signed as an extra though.

[Captain Canuck #12]

7 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said:

I think Leivo's the odd man out if Toffoli is re-signed. He just isn't better than Motte/Mac in a 4th line role. He could be signed as an extra though.

If Green is looking for more of an 'energy' 4th line, I'd agree with you.  But if he's looking to move up to more of a skilled 4th line, I think he puts Leivo there.  In reality though, there will likely always be enough injuries to mean that Leivo, Motte and Mac will all have a spot in the lineup (except when they're the ones injured).

[Shirotashi]

12 hours ago, MrCanuck94 said:

Leivo probably won't have a spot on our team anymore due to our depth but Bailey does not have more upside than him. However, role wise, Bailey would be a better fit for the fourth line if injuries occur there whereas Leivo is a good filler for the middle six if injuries occur.

What upside does Leivo have other than hes an ok skater and can finish? Bailey is tougher, faster, meaner idk it just seems he has more spark than Leivo.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Shirotashi

[-AJ-]

26 minutes ago, Shirotashi said:

What upside does Leivo have other than hes an ok skater and can finish? Bailey is tougher, faster, meaner idk it just seems he has more spark than Leivo.

You can't seriously think an AHL player is better than Leivo. Bailey has 65 NHL games and 9 points. He may hit better than Leivo, but I seriously doubt he would come even remotely close to the same level of production unless he had a breakout year. I like Bailey a lot, but you seem to have some weird irrational hate for Leivo that I haven't seen from anyone else. What ever did he do to be demoted below the level of AHL players?

[MrCanuck94]

57 minutes ago, Shirotashi said:

What upside does Leivo have other than hes an ok skater and can finish? Bailey is tougher, faster, meaner idk it just seems he has more spark than Leivo.

It's like saying Reid Boucher has more upside than Tanner Pearson because he has a better wrist shot. If you don't have the whole package at a NHL level, that one asset does not matter when translating your game to the next level. 

27 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

You can't seriously think an AHL player is better than Leivo. Bailey has 65 NHL games and 9 points. He may hit better than Leivo, but I seriously doubt he would come even remotely close to the same level of production unless he had a breakout year. I like Bailey a lot, but you seem to have some weird irrational hate for Leivo that I haven't seen from anyone else. What ever did he do to be demoted below the level of AHL players?

I actually think Bailey can be a solid fourth line player in the NHL sooner than later.

[-AJ-]

9 hours ago, MrCanuck94 said:

It's like saying Reid Boucher has more upside than Tanner Pearson because he has a better wrist shot. If you don't have the whole package at a NHL level, that one asset does not matter when translating your game to the next level. 

I actually think Bailey can be a solid fourth line player in the NHL sooner than later.

I too like Bailey as a future fourth liner. I hesitated somewhat in my response because I realize in isolation it could be taken to show I dislike him when that isn't actually the case.

[EternalCanuckFan]

It's too bad Leivo's still out.  Leivo might not be the fastest player, but Canucks could sure use his size and play style, as well as the added depth he brings to their line-up.

 

Just imagine if the Canucks could roll out:

 

Miller-Pettersson-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Toffoli

Roussel-Sutter/Gaudette-Leivo

Motte-Beagle-Virtanen/MacEwen/Eriksson

 

Wouldn't mind if the Canucks re-signed Leivo this summer but I have a feeling he's going to find a new home.