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19 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

Hearing from people in the healthcare community that there are a number of people with the virus who are vaccinated. 

It helps but it's is not the end all be all. Also Moderna is proving to be better at fending off the variants than Pfizer while Astra Zeneca is just flat out useless. 

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On 7/27/2021 at 11:59 PM, gurn said:

Trial balloon number two:

not sure if this is Rex Murphy, continuing to inflate trial balloon number 2 or releasing balloon number 3:

"Rex Murphy: The classy Stephen Harper returns to speak truth to the illiberal left

 

As with many Canadians, I was delighted to see former prime minister Stephen Harper in the news pages and on video last week, after he did an interview with Joe Lonsdale for the “American Optimist” podcast.

 

Unlike so many other leaders, foreign and domestic, Harper has exercised commendable restraint since leaving office. He is not on TV every day. When he was in the job of prime minister, he was in it 100 per cent; when he left, he really left. He most emphatically does not loiter on the fringes of politics, taking pot shots at his successor (think former U.S. presidents Bill Clinton and Barack Obama) or salivating for a return to the spotlight.

 

His many admirers know this as an element of his character. His persona is distinctly non-theatrical. It highlights the wisdom of knowing that there is more to life than shouting at people on Twitter. I would call this the attitude of a serious, intelligent adult.

Yet for his old opponents, Harper seems to loom larger than life. The Liberals, now five years into their own government, cannot get him out of their heads. He serves as something of a demon figure for them, to be hauled out of the shadows and held up as a warning of how bad things could be, if they — the salvational Liberals — had not done the great work of defeating him.

Whenever they get in trouble — and that’s often, even daily lately — they often find a way to somehow blame it on Harper. When they want to damn one of his successors, Andrew Scheer or Erin O’Toole, they call them “Harper-lite.”

Harper has shown class by largely staying out of the public eye — by not becoming the guy everyone turns to when they want someone to take a shot at Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. Yet Trudeau’s animosity towards Harper is so obvious and deep, it almost amounts to a character trait.

As for Trudeau himself, from the very moment he stepped into politics, he has sought to portray Harper, not merely as an ordinary political opponent, but as a figure of menace, a sinister individual with a hidden agenda who’s empty of every virtue we hold dear. Trudeau portrays Harper as a northern Donald Trump — what could be more dreadful? — against whom all Canadians must be continually on guard because — shudder — he’s still lurking.

It’s also interesting, and very telling, that Trudeau’s fascination with his former opponent is the precise inverse of Harper’s. Trudeau can’t let go, while Harper said goodbye, and meant it, long ago.

So when Harper decides to break his silence, it’s worth taking notice. The intelligence and judgment he displayed while governing is very much wanted in these anxious times. The insights and experience of a person who led our country for a decade is not a resource, like Alberta oil, to be left in the ground.

Last week, he commented on Canada’s fiscal outlay during COVID. He said it was “overkill,” and warned that it was “bad macroeconomic policy on an enormous scale.” Seems just. The spending of the last year and a half has been wild, largely unaccounted for, rarely debated in Parliament and done without pattern or rationale, except to buy time or votes for the government. “Overkill” seems like the right word for it. Spending on the scale we have seen will inescapably lead to great problems in the future.

I was even more interested in Harper’s remarks on the current scourge of “woke” culture, the second and more insidious pestilence of our day. Woke culture is close-minded, toxic, self-righteous, punitive and merciless to any who dissent from any of its shallow, angry dogmas. And it is, alas, everywhere.

The woke are intolerant to the extreme. Dissent and you must be cancelled. They ban books. They pile on professors. They go after companies when they smell the slightest taint of non-compliance with their warped views. They are on a perpetual hair-trigger for every perceived or — this is important — manufactured grievance.

They are everywhere — in schools, universities, in business and broadcasting (CBC is woke central). And everywhere they are, they seek to undermine the basics tenets of a free society: free speech, free expression and free thought. For heaven’s sake, they even threaten libraries.

And yet people, the powerful and not-so-powerful, frequently give in to them and their cancel campaigns. They bow to the woke’s insolent pressure; they take a knee. Which is why, when Harper spoke last week, it was important that he spoke as he did: in clear and fully justified, yet dismissive, tones.

There was no equivocation or timidity in his words. He described the modern left as “nihilist” and bent on “ripping everything down.” And he was crystal clear about what this new, angry radicalism could mean: “If it plays out, our societies fail … the adolescent egos of the woke university crowd is not an alternative governing philosophy for any society.”

No taking a knee there. We need more leaders, past and present, to speak clearly and with the force of full conviction on the things that count. They are not plentiful these days, but at least we have one.

National Post

The big issues are far from settled. Sign up for the NP Comment newsletter, NP Platformed.

 
 

 

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On 7/31/2021 at 10:00 AM, Gnarcore said:

It helps but it's is not the end all be all. Also Moderna is proving to be better at fending off the variants than Pfizer while Astra Zeneca is just flat out useless. 

Never said it was. 

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On 7/30/2021 at 2:37 PM, PhillipBlunt said:

Hearing from people in the healthcare community that there are a number of people with the virus who are vaccinated. 

The guy at the market selling dried horse testicles to cure erectile disfunction is not in the healthcare community.

 

Anyways...here: https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/epidemiological-summary-covid-19-cases.html#a9

 

0.5% is a number, I can't fault you there.

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On 7/31/2021 at 1:00 AM, RUPERTKBD said:

Unelectable Dorks.....killer name for a punk band.....

I feel like they would end up being pop punk like simple plan or something.

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10 minutes ago, EOTM said:

The guy at the market selling dried horse testicles to cure erectile disfunction is not in the healthcare community.

 

Anyways...here: https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/epidemiological-summary-covid-19-cases.html#a9

 

0.5% is a number, I can't fault you there.

I know three nurses in the Lower Mainland. You know, actual people on the front lines? 

 

Your ED guy, as useful as he's been for you, doesn't enter into the equation. But I'm sure you're happy to have him on speed dial when you're wilting. 

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11 minutes ago, EOTM said:

I feel like they would end up being pop punk like simple plan or something.

We used to have a board member with the same username. (except he spelled it out, instead of using the acronym) He also had a Christopher Walken avatar....

 

Is that you, by any chance?

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40 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

I know three nurses in the Lower Mainland. You know, actual people on the front lines? 

 

Your ED guy, as useful as he's been for you, doesn't enter into the equation. But I'm sure you're happy to have him on speed dial when you're wilting. 

Hey my wife has never been happier. Yes I know people on the front lines, in fact I work very closely with front line workers but like yours my anecdotal story doesn't matter. What matters are facts and statistics. Factually and statistically the people you know you know are wrong.  That's ok, several of the people I work with have also been wrong about things because they think that something they see or hear must be the statistical norm. That's why I posted the epidemiology reports. By the numbers what you said your friends said is incorrect. Anecdotally the dozen or so people (doctors and nurses) I work with frequently say that that is not the case. 

 

I'm not trying to come off as rude or dismissive just show statistically what you heard was wrong.

Edited by EOTM
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2 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

We used to have a board member with the same username. (except he spelled it out, instead of using the acronym) He also had a Christopher Walken avatar....

 

Is that you, by any chance?

I don't know what you're talking about. I certainly am not EmployeeoftheMonth and I certainly didn't forget my old email and password and couldn't be bothered to put in any effort to fix it. :bigblush:

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1 minute ago, EOTM said:

I don't know what you're talking about. I certainly am not EmployeeoftheMonth and I certainly didn't forget my old email and password and couldn't be bothered to put in any effort to fix it. :bigblush:

Gotcha....the "couldn't be bothered" part tells me all I need to know.

 

"Welcome (back) to the boards. :)

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Just now, RUPERTKBD said:

Gotcha....the "couldn't be bothered" part tells me all I need to know.

 

"Welcome (back) to the boards. :)

Thank you...I think. God damn it have I always been this lazy?

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47 minutes ago, gurn said:

not sure if this is Rex Murphy, continuing to inflate trial balloon number 2 or releasing balloon number 3:

"Rex Murphy: The classy Stephen Harper returns to speak truth to the illiberal left

 

As with many Canadians, I was delighted to see former prime minister Stephen Harper in the news pages and on video last week, after he did an interview with Joe Lonsdale for the “American Optimist” podcast.

 

Unlike so many other leaders, foreign and domestic, Harper has exercised commendable restraint since leaving office. He is not on TV every day. When he was in the job of prime minister, he was in it 100 per cent; when he left, he really left. He most emphatically does not loiter on the fringes of politics, taking pot shots at his successor (think former U.S. presidents Bill Clinton and Barack Obama) or salivating for a return to the spotlight.

 

His many admirers know this as an element of his character. His persona is distinctly non-theatrical. It highlights the wisdom of knowing that there is more to life than shouting at people on Twitter. I would call this the attitude of a serious, intelligent adult.

Yet for his old opponents, Harper seems to loom larger than life. The Liberals, now five years into their own government, cannot get him out of their heads. He serves as something of a demon figure for them, to be hauled out of the shadows and held up as a warning of how bad things could be, if they — the salvational Liberals — had not done the great work of defeating him.

Whenever they get in trouble — and that’s often, even daily lately — they often find a way to somehow blame it on Harper. When they want to damn one of his successors, Andrew Scheer or Erin O’Toole, they call them “Harper-lite.”

Harper has shown class by largely staying out of the public eye — by not becoming the guy everyone turns to when they want someone to take a shot at Prime Minister Justin Trudeau. Yet Trudeau’s animosity towards Harper is so obvious and deep, it almost amounts to a character trait.

As for Trudeau himself, from the very moment he stepped into politics, he has sought to portray Harper, not merely as an ordinary political opponent, but as a figure of menace, a sinister individual with a hidden agenda who’s empty of every virtue we hold dear. Trudeau portrays Harper as a northern Donald Trump — what could be more dreadful? — against whom all Canadians must be continually on guard because — shudder — he’s still lurking.

It’s also interesting, and very telling, that Trudeau’s fascination with his former opponent is the precise inverse of Harper’s. Trudeau can’t let go, while Harper said goodbye, and meant it, long ago.

So when Harper decides to break his silence, it’s worth taking notice. The intelligence and judgment he displayed while governing is very much wanted in these anxious times. The insights and experience of a person who led our country for a decade is not a resource, like Alberta oil, to be left in the ground.

Last week, he commented on Canada’s fiscal outlay during COVID. He said it was “overkill,” and warned that it was “bad macroeconomic policy on an enormous scale.” Seems just. The spending of the last year and a half has been wild, largely unaccounted for, rarely debated in Parliament and done without pattern or rationale, except to buy time or votes for the government. “Overkill” seems like the right word for it. Spending on the scale we have seen will inescapably lead to great problems in the future.

I was even more interested in Harper’s remarks on the current scourge of “woke” culture, the second and more insidious pestilence of our day. Woke culture is close-minded, toxic, self-righteous, punitive and merciless to any who dissent from any of its shallow, angry dogmas. And it is, alas, everywhere.

The woke are intolerant to the extreme. Dissent and you must be cancelled. They ban books. They pile on professors. They go after companies when they smell the slightest taint of non-compliance with their warped views. They are on a perpetual hair-trigger for every perceived or — this is important — manufactured grievance.

They are everywhere — in schools, universities, in business and broadcasting (CBC is woke central). And everywhere they are, they seek to undermine the basics tenets of a free society: free speech, free expression and free thought. For heaven’s sake, they even threaten libraries.

And yet people, the powerful and not-so-powerful, frequently give in to them and their cancel campaigns. They bow to the woke’s insolent pressure; they take a knee. Which is why, when Harper spoke last week, it was important that he spoke as he did: in clear and fully justified, yet dismissive, tones.

There was no equivocation or timidity in his words. He described the modern left as “nihilist” and bent on “ripping everything down.” And he was crystal clear about what this new, angry radicalism could mean: “If it plays out, our societies fail … the adolescent egos of the woke university crowd is not an alternative governing philosophy for any society.”

No taking a knee there. We need more leaders, past and present, to speak clearly and with the force of full conviction on the things that count. They are not plentiful these days, but at least we have one.

National Post

The big issues are far from settled. Sign up for the NP Comment newsletter, NP Platformed.

 
 

 

Ahh Rex, we hardly missed you. 

 

He is right about CBC being woke central tho. But more of Harper and his social con army isn't the appropriate answer to dealing with that. 

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1 minute ago, EOTM said:

Hey my wife has never been happier. Yes I know people on the front lines, in fact I work very closely with front line workers but like yours my anecdotal story doesn't matter. What matters are facts and statistics. Factually and statistically the people you know you know are wrong. That's ok, several of the people I work with have also been wrong about things because they think that something they see or hear must be the statistical norm.

The statistical norm? So you're one of those types that thinks they know better because the follow the stat line instead of actual human experience at a hospital? Good to know. I'll look at stats but I'll also take the word of people who work closely with people who have Covid, because unlike you, I'm not an embittered, pretentious person. I take people's word and experience at face value, realizing that it has merit and means just as much or more than the spreadsheets you pour over. 

1 minute ago, EOTM said:

 

So tell me more about you 3 friends and their...opinions. 

Your approach is so telling of how incapable you are of actually having an adult conversation. Your automatic dismissal of information belies a truly embittered attitude. Sad for you, but it's what it is. 

 

About the people I know, who probably, nay, assuredly have more on the ball than you. One is a program director for emergency and nursing at Coastal Health, who has access to statistics regarding patient admissions, (exciting right!?) due to the nature of her job.

Another teaches, mentors, and runs a Covid specific nursing team at Richmond General hospital.

Another is a tenured nurse at emergency at VGH. 

 

They don't provide opinions, sorry bud. It's called actual valid experience that's informed.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

The statistical norm? So you're one of those types that thinks they know better because the follow the stat line instead of actual human experience at a hospital? Good to know. I'll look at stats but I'll also take the word of people who work closely with people who have Covid, because unlike you, I'm not an embittered, pretentious person. I take people's word and experience at face value, realizing that it has merit and means just as much or more than the spreadsheets you pour over. 

Your approach is so telling of how incapable you are of actually having an adult conversation. Your automatic dismissal of information belies a truly embittered attitude. Sad for you, but it's what it is. 

 

About the people I know, who probably, nay, assuredly have more on the ball than you. One is a program director for emergency and nursing at Coastal Health, who has access to statistics regarding patient admissions, (exciting right!?) due to the nature of her job.

Another teaches, mentors, and runs a Covid specific nursing team at Richmond General hospital.

Another is a tenured nurse at emergency at VGH. 

 

They don't provide opinions, sorry bud. It's called actual valid experience that's informed.

 

 

I don't think I know better. I think that what you said can be disproven with statistics. Taking someone's word at face value is a wonderful thing but that is different than taking it as fact and spreading it around expecting not to be called on it. 

 

So what are your three friends exactly saying? Your comment earlier was pretty vague. Again Phillip statistically across Canada 0.5%. You can passionately argue against that number all you want and you can give out credentials of people you say you know and you can tell us all what you say that they say but it doesn't matter. If you want to have an adult conversation you can't get all up in arms anytime someone presents you with something that does goes along with what you are saying. I'm not the one dismissing information and I'm not the ones who seems bitter Philly. When you comes in guns blazing you have to remember actual bullets are required.

 

Now that that is through Philly you seem very worked up over this; don't be. Stats and facts are stats and facts and as I have been told they don't care about feelings. Based on the stats and facts available right now your 3 friends are providing you with anecdotes. Sorry bud, but those anecdotes just don't matter if your story is even actually true which I have no reason to believe it isn't.

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13 minutes ago, EOTM said:

I don't think I know better. I think that what you said can be disproven with statistics. Taking someone's word at face value is a wonderful thing but that is different than taking it as fact and spreading it around expecting not to be called on it. 

 

So what are your three friends exactly saying? Your comment earlier was pretty vague. Again Phillip statistically across Canada 0.5%. You can passionately argue against that number all you want and you can give out credentials of people you say you know and you can tell us all what you say that they say but it doesn't matter. If you want to have an adult conversation you can't get all up in arms anytime someone presents you with something that does goes along with what you are saying. I'm not the one dismissing information and I'm not the ones who seems bitter Philly. When you comes in guns blazing you have to remember actual bullets are required.

 

Now that that is through Philly you seem very worked up over this; don't be. Stats and facts are stats and facts and as I have been told they don't care about feelings. Based on the stats and facts available right now your 3 friends are providing you with anecdotes. Sorry bud, but those anecdotes just don't matter if your story is even actually true which I have no reason to believe it isn't.

You wish an adult conversation, but deliberately mess with the poster's name? 

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47 minutes ago, EOTM said:

I don't think I know better.

You do though. That's your whole premise on here. 

Quote

I think that what you said can be disproven with statistics. Taking someone's word at face value is a wonderful thing but that is different than taking it as fact and spreading it around expecting not to be called on it. 

Actual professionals have no reason to lie or spread false information. Statistics aren't infallible either as someone has to input each case file into the hospital admissions system. 

Quote

So what are your three friends exactly saying? Your comment earlier was pretty vague.

What I've already posted. What you think of the comment is of little or no importance to me.

Quote

Again Phillip statistically across Canada 0.5%.

That's great. Guess what? One can read those statistics and also listen to what people working in are saying about cases. In fact, that's probably a better option than merely fawning over statistics.

Quote

You can passionately argue against that number all you want and you can give out credentials of people you say you know and you can tell us all what you say that they say but it doesn't matter.

To you. You stay in your spreadsheets and harp endlessly about your numbers. I sure it keeps you feeling safe and secure. I'll choose to listen to people who are actually in the midst of what's occurring at hospitals in BC. I trust their knowledge and experience.

Quote

If you want to have an adult conversation you can't get all up in arms anytime someone presents you with something that does goes along with what you are saying.

I'm more than capable of having adult conversation with people here. The statistical information you're presenting isn't off-putting at all, it's your banally dismissive attitude that is the issue. You've demonstrated that you lack the ability to have a productive conversation plenty of times.  

Quote

I'm not the one dismissing information and I'm not the ones who seems bitter Philly.

Yes you are. You're dismissing what someone else is saying because it's not quantifiable to you. And you're also slipping in very thinly veiled slights. 

Quote

When you comes in guns blazing you have to remember actual bullets are required.

Once again, showing your hand. 

Quote

Now that that is through Philly you seem very worked up over this; don't be.

Not worked up at all. That's your woefully poor read on the situation. I find you and your posts offer very little to the conversation. Just doing you a service to help you realize your shortcomings so you can work on them. I'm a big believer in public service. 

Quote

Stats and facts are stats and facts and as I have been told they don't care about feelings.

Did Ben Shapiro tell you that nugget? Stats and facts are great and interesting, but are not the whole picture. Actual human experience is also valid and worth listening to. That is if your capable of having human interaction.

Quote

Based on the stats and facts available right now your 3 friends are providing you with anecdotes. Sorry bud, but those anecdotes just don't matter if your story is even actually true which I have no reason to believe it isn't.

They don't matter to you. That's the bottom line. You're a stats junkie clearly and think that that line of thinking should permeate how everyone views every situation. The people I know are providing me with valid and actual experiences that are useful to understand and learn from. You keep your head buried in your stats and keep on trying to devalue everything that doesn't resemble that, meanwhile, I'm sure others will glance over your posts and see how little they matter to the conversation at large. 

 

I can already see your next post. 

 

It'll mention how stats are everything. It'll be dismissive and banal. 

Edited by PhillipBlunt
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35 minutes ago, gurn said:

You wish an adult conversation, but deliberately mess with the poster's name? 

It's a hockey message board I just gave him his locker room name.  Truthfully I don't wish for anything, he brought up the adult conversation. 

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24 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

You do though. That's your whole premise on here. 

Actual professionals have no reason to lie or spread false information. Statistics aren't infallible either as someone has to input each case file into the hospital admissions system. 

What I've already posted. What you think of the comment is of little or no importance to me.

That's great. Guess what? One can read those statistics and also listen to what people working in are saying about cases. In fact, that's probably a better option than merely fawning over statistics.

To you. You stay in your spreadsheets and harp endlessly about your numbers. I sure it keeps you feeling safe and secure. I'll choose to listen to people who are actually in the midst of what's occurring at hospitals in BC. I trust their knowledge and experience.

I'm more than capable of having adult conversation with people here. The statistical information you're presenting isn't off-putting at all, it's your banally dismissive attitude that is the issue. You've demonstrated that you lack the ability to have a productive conversation plenty of times.  

Yes you are. You're dismissing what someone else is saying because it's not quantifiable to you. And you're also slipping in very thinly veiled slights. 

Once again, showing your hand. 

Not worked up at all. That's your woefully poor read on the situation. I find you and your posts offer very little to the conversation. Just doing you a service to help you realize your shortcomings so you can work on them. I'm a big believer in public service. 

Did Ben Shapiro tell you that nugget? Stats and facts are great and interesting, but are not the whole picture. Actual human experience is also valid and worth listening to. That is if your capable of having human interaction.

They don't matter to you. That's the bottom line. You're a stats junkie clearly and think that that line of thinking should permeate how everyone views every situation. The people I know are providing me with valid and actual experiences that are useful to understand and learn from. You keep your head buried in your stats and keep on trying to devalue everything that doesn't resemble that, meanwhile, I'm sure others will glance over your posts and see how little they matter to the conversation at large. 

I don't though and it's not my whole premise. Actually professionals also say the opposite which is why anecdotally it doesn't matter. If something can't be backed up then it really has very little meaning.

 

You are right though statistics are not infallible. Having said that statistics and facts don't allow for misinformation or emotionality. Stats tell an entire story not just what one person's experience is. 

 

I will keep my head buried in facts as well as listen to what professionals have to say while you listen to opinions and anecdotes and ignore anything that shows another side than what you want to believe because that's what you have been told.

 

Also I work in mental health so as much as I believe in statistical data I do know it's not the end all and be all. These stats however do show without question that what you heard in the grand scheme is at the very least that the "number of people" is extremely small.

 

Have a good one bud. Maybe dial the agro back a few notches. Maybe I shouldn't have opened with a joke, I apologize if you took it offensively.

Edited by EOTM
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