Viper007 Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 51 minutes ago, TheGuardian_ said: You are correct, I am wrong, I missed that (forgot actually) but since he hasn't. Hasn't EP and AG played in the same game this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyHatnDart Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 I think the thing to remember about the trading of the two 2nd rounders for Vey and Baer was that at the time, they were looking to shore up some missing players in that age group (as @CanadianRugby mentioned) because they were “re-tooling” not going for a full rebuild. We can debate whether that was the right move or not at the time all we like.. but that was obviously what Aquilini was wanting, another playoffs, and that mantra was mentioned many times at that point. I understand the moves at the time, and while Vey didn’t work out (so many off the ice issues I’m not surprised) Baer has turned out to be a very good trade, and I can’t see how that’s debatable. While it’s easy to look back and criticize, we have the luxury now of hindsight. There’s been a few questionable transactions made, of course. You’re rarely going to hit a home run with every draft, signing, trade, etc... but it looks like with the addition of Pettersson, and a pretty decent crop of young players and more in the pipeline, the team is trending back upwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan since 82 Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 On 1/27/2019 at 7:21 PM, NewbieCanuckFan said: Jet Woo will be the tough one. Too young for the AHL so it's the NHL or back to juniors (does he really have anything more to learn there?). I have been wondering if one of the European pro leagues could be an option for guys like this? Guys who need tougher and more mature competition, but are too young for the AHL. I honestly don't know if it would work or not but... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewbieCanuckFan Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 2 minutes ago, Fan since 82 said: I have been wondering if one of the European pro leagues could be an option for guys like this? Guys who need tougher and more mature competition, but are too young for the AHL. I honestly don't know if it would work or not but... Yeah I was kind of thinking about that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman64 Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 On 1/23/2019 at 6:22 PM, King Heffy said: Maybe Benning's trying to keep some pressure off of OJ given how brutal our media can be. Manage expectations so if he hits his ceiling it's a pleasant surprise rather than let Botchford and co. crucify the kid when he makes the team and experiences some growing pains. Botchford is a joke... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 On 1/27/2019 at 9:05 PM, CanadianRugby said: To you guys arguing that it was good to trade 2nd round picks away while rebuilding... The reason you state: - 2nd round picks don't usually amount to much Yet, with our 2nd round picks Benning has drafted Woo, Lind, Gadjovich, and Demko. Pretty good. I'd rather have 3 more guys like that for when this team gets good rather than Baer, Vey or Gudbranson. The other reason used was: Canucks needed to get some 20something players to fill the age gap so the team wouldn't suck and ruin our prospects like Edmonton. Well, this team still ended up awful. It didn't ruin our prospects. Rebuilds are done through the draft and tanking worked for the Canucks even though they had bad luck in the lottery. 100% of our impact players for the rebuild have been added through the draft, unless foundational Sutter is an impact player in your eyes. Also, if it wasn't for icing god awful teams (on purpose or by accident) we wouldn't have Pettersson, OJ, Hughes or Virtanen. Baer was definitely better value than a 2nd. Vey was plagued by some.off ice stuff, but would it would be reasonable to say that we should have kept that pick. As for Guddy. We have a big hole on defence and he didn't fix things. Been mixed since he got here. Hard to say what he is worth until he re signs or is moved. I do believe that he hasn't been paired well during his time here. You cannot have him carrying Pouliot and expect results. But give him a skilled partner and Guddy can be the physical guy and I think that would be a decent pairing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 20 hours ago, Viper007 said: Hasn't EP and AG played in the same game this year? Injury caused and only because they had to bury Gagne because EP made the team. AG didn't make the team by beating out any existing roster player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Phat Fingers said: Baer was definitely better value than a 2nd. Vey was plagued by some.off ice stuff, but would it would be reasonable to say that we should have kept that pick. As for Guddy. We have a big hole on defence and he didn't fix things. Been mixed since he got here. Hard to say what he is worth until he re signs or is moved. I do believe that he hasn't been paired well during his time here. You cannot have him carrying Pouliot and expect results. But give him a skilled partner and Guddy can be the physical guy and I think that would be a decent pairing. Says you. I think he's been good when healthy and adds an element no one else can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballisticsports. Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Phat Fingers said: Baer was definitely better value than a 2nd.Vey was plagued by some.off ice stuff, but would it would be reasonable to say that we should have kept that pick. As for Guddy. We have a big hole on defence and he didn't fix things. Been mixed since he got here. Hard to say what he is worth until he re signs or is moved. I do believe that he hasn't been paired well during his time here. You cannot have him carrying Pouliot and expect results. But give him a skilled partner and Guddy can be the physical guy and I think that would be a decent pairing. Yes, I find it odd that if they believed in who they draft, why would they spend a 2nd round draft pick on someone elses 4th round pick in Vey , who had not proven himself in the NHL Are you thinking Hughes may be good with Guddy ? That would mean having Guddy on the top line eventually Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 16 hours ago, GreyHatnDart said: I think the thing to remember about the trading of the two 2nd rounders for Vey and Baer was that at the time, they were looking to shore up some missing players in that age group (as @CanadianRugby mentioned) because they were “re-tooling” not going for a full rebuild. We can debate whether that was the right move or not at the time all we like.. but that was obviously what Aquilini was wanting, another playoffs, and that mantra was mentioned many times at that point. I understand the moves at the time, and while Vey didn’t work out (so many off the ice issues I’m not surprised) Baer has turned out to be a very good trade, and I can’t see how that’s debatable. While it’s easy to look back and criticize, we have the luxury now of hindsight. There’s been a few questionable transactions made, of course. You’re rarely going to hit a home run with every draft, signing, trade, etc... but it looks like with the addition of Pettersson, and a pretty decent crop of young players and more in the pipeline, the team is trending back upwards. I can't imagine anyone complaining about spending a 2bd on Baer, who is a core player on the team. That's solid value for a 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGuardian_ Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 12 hours ago, Fan since 82 said: I have been wondering if one of the European pro leagues could be an option for guys like this? Guys who need tougher and more mature competition, but are too young for the AHL. I honestly don't know if it would work or not but... 12 hours ago, NewbieCanuckFan said: Yeah I was kind of thinking about that too. I wonder if Aquilini buys or invests in a Euro team as a secondary farm club? I guess they use all the Euro teams as farms clubs already though. If there is a CBA labour stoppage having a team that could take 5 players to be together could be a boost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyHatnDart Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 3 hours ago, stawns said: I can't imagine anyone complaining about spending a 2bd on Baer, who is a core player on the team. That's solid value for a 2nd. Evidently, CanadianRugby believes that a rebuilding team shouldn’t trade 2nd rounders, regardless of the return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 On 1/27/2019 at 8:05 PM, CanadianRugby said: To you guys arguing that it was good to trade 2nd round picks away while rebuilding... The reason you state: - 2nd round picks don't usually amount to much Yet, with our 2nd round picks Benning has drafted Woo, Lind, Gadjovich, and Demko. Pretty good. I'd rather have 3 more guys like that for when this team gets good rather than Baer, Vey or Gudbranson. The other reason used was: Canucks needed to get some 20something players to fill the age gap so the team wouldn't suck and ruin our prospects like Edmonton. Well, this team still ended up awful. It didn't ruin our prospects. Rebuilds are done through the draft and tanking worked for the Canucks even though they had bad luck in the lottery. 100% of our impact players for the rebuild have been added through the draft, unless foundational Sutter is an impact player in your eyes. Also, if it wasn't for icing god awful teams (on purpose or by accident) we wouldn't have Pettersson, OJ, Hughes or Virtanen. I think you missed the point. I’d say we drafted two third liners instead, they made the cut early and helped us move up in the standings we wouldn’t have drafted either Pettersson or Hughes. Let’s say Gillis wasn’t tired, he managed to somehow convince everybody to jump ship and instead we have McDavid and Mathews. Whoops I’m in the Gaurdians wet dream, which is completely out of the realm of reality. Everything that’s happened to date has got us here right now with Boeser and Pettersson, even Horvat. Things weren’t supposed to be this bright this soon, one year after the Sedins retired and a bounce up in the standings thanks mostly to Markstrom finally finding his game and Pettersson’s timely scoring. Even Boeser is avoiding a sophomore slump on his coattails, and the entire team is to a certain degree too. You dont have to be a pragmatist to be happy about the outcome, it is what it is, yes 2nd round picks are important, Benning is minus one of those picks so far, and has Bear to show for it so it’s at least a wash. Who was available if he kept his pick? Anyone, let’s say he picked the best guy left...wonder who it is. Bet his name is not PETTERSSON. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 9 hours ago, ba;;isticsports said: Yes, I find it odd that if they believed in who they draft, why would they spend a 2nd round draft pick on someone elses 4th round pick in Vey , who had not proven himself in the NHL Are you thinking Hughes may be good with Guddy ? That would mean having Guddy on the top line eventually Guddy check some of the boxes I have for being a partner for Hughes. RHD, mobile, physical and a stay at home guy. If he could develop a slapper to the yo some of Hughes setups then it would be pretty good. Hughes has the mobility to cover off Guddy and Guddy as the physicality to protect Hughes. Plus it would push Botxhford off and prove what kind of moron he is. Given our current roster, Guddy would be Hughes partner. Guddy can be good when used with the right partner. He does have a presence and I dont think he fights much cause he scares the &^@# out most players on a given night. Would a guy like Parayko be a better option, hell yes, but what would it cost. I don't think Hughes should be with another small shifty d man 5v5. Woo will be there in 2-3 years, Rathbone, maybe. I would love to find a Cal Foote put there and I would be happy to move a roster player to get him. Tanev or Edler for Foote? Add a 2nd or 3rd and I am good. TB might want to join the arms race in the east. Edler has to be at the top of the rental market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 10 hours ago, stawns said: Says you. I think he's been good when healthy and adds an element no one else can. I am a Guddy fan, but he didn't fix our defence. He could be a part of the fix if he gets the right partner. If Stecher played the left side, I think they would be good together. I like Guddy with Hughes when he makes the jump. Guddy's value to the average fan has yet to be discovered but I think Hughes could get him there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballisticsports. Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Phat Fingers said: Guddy check some of the boxes I have for being a partner for Hughes. RHD, mobile, physical and a stay at home guy. If he could develop a slapper to the yo some of Hughes setups then it would be pretty good. Hughes has the mobility to cover off Guddy and Guddy as the physicality to protect Hughes. Plus it would push Botxhford off and prove what kind of moron he is. Given our current roster, Guddy would be Hughes partner. Guddy can be good when used with the right partner. He does have a presence and I dont think he fights much cause he scares the &^@# out most players on a given night. Would a guy like Parayko be a better option, hell yes, but what would it cost. I don't think Hughes should be with another small shifty d man 5v5. Woo will be there in 2-3 years, Rathbone, maybe. I would love to find a Cal Foote put there and I would be happy to move a roster player to get him. Tanev or Edler for Foote? Add a 2nd or 3rd and I am good. TB might want to join the arms race in the east. Edler has to be at the top of the rental market. After the last game when the refs so EASILY ejected our 2 players (Guddy) was one of them, I don't think the Canucks are going to be Allowed ANY push back, even when they are not the instigators (Canucks seem damned if they don't do anything, with non-calls, then damned if they do anything) they just can't win with the refs in those situations As for the 2nd highlight , I recall that same game a much smaller 20 yr old Russian didn't have a problem running Guddy into the boards, that got him ejected (The kid got a double whammy on Guddy) I was upset that in a, blow out , Tanev held his hand instead of a punch to the Rookies face, I guess there mind was on their holidays, instead of each others responsibility to each other and the team, and no one wanted to be potentially sore on those days off it looked like to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 9 hours ago, GreyHatnDart said: Evidently, CanadianRugby believes that a rebuilding team shouldn’t trade 2nd rounders, regardless of the return. About these 2nd rounders I think it matters when...….I see what Benning was doing and why...….. I do however think it was WD that wanted Vey Benning just went for it for his new coach...….I do not agree with that one either But 1 second liner out of every 2 - 2nds.....I would take that It is just JB record with his picks looks so good.....I hate waste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman64 Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 16 hours ago, Phat Fingers said: Baer was definitely better value than a 2nd. Vey was plagued by some.off ice stuff, but would it would be reasonable to say that we should have kept that pick. As for Guddy. We have a big hole on defence and he didn't fix things. Been mixed since he got here. Hard to say what he is worth until he re signs or is moved. I do believe that he hasn't been paired well during his time here. You cannot have him carrying Pouliot and expect results. But give him a skilled partner and Guddy can be the physical guy and I think that would be a decent pairing. I like Guddy and for one reason only (size) and i wish we had him to put out against Buffy when we lost to the hawks who we would have probably beat had we had a guy that could move big buff out of in front of luongo when they moved him to forward and he could just stand in front of the crease and no one on our D could move him... that was painful but Guds might have been able to do that. Might have won the cup that year, possibly the same with boston. Same as our lack of a big tough skilled first line player that can fight, haunts us but if we get Tryamkin back then Guds is expendable. Just because pundits say the game ia trending skill over toughness but the best teams have a good mix of both so it may be trending that way but it will take awhile to see how far the trend goes before settling on a balance but having a butter soft team ruined it come playoff time, at least Benning has gone after some grit and hopefully some extra talented grit can come our way for a change to play with brock and petey to compliment them and protect them if necessary. One can dream... sigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugby Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 On 1/29/2019 at 2:10 PM, IBatch said: I think you missed the point. I’d say we drafted two third liners instead, they made the cut early and helped us move up in the standings we wouldn’t have drafted either Pettersson or Hughes. Let’s say Gillis wasn’t tired, he managed to somehow convince everybody to jump ship and instead we have McDavid and Mathews. Whoops I’m in the Gaurdians wet dream, which is completely out of the realm of reality. Everything that’s happened to date has got us here right now with Boeser and Pettersson, even Horvat. Things weren’t supposed to be this bright this soon, one year after the Sedins retired and a bounce up in the standings thanks mostly to Markstrom finally finding his game and Pettersson’s timely scoring. Even Boeser is avoiding a sophomore slump on his coattails, and the entire team is to a certain degree too. You dont have to be a pragmatist to be happy about the outcome, it is what it is, yes 2nd round picks are important, Benning is minus one of those picks so far, and has Bear to show for it so it’s at least a wash. Who was available if he kept his pick? Anyone, let’s say he picked the best guy left...wonder who it is. Bet his name is not PETTERSSON. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeneedLumme Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Those posters who talk about how terrible it was for JB to trade a 2nd rounder for a 4th rounder (Vey) are being completely ridiculous. Once a draft pick has been exercised, it is no longer a draft pick, it is a player/prospect. Where he was drafted was irrelevant. If anyone doesn't believe that, then they must be ecstatic over the Guddy acquisition, since he was a 3rd overall pick, something that would cost a huge number of 2nd round picks, if any number of 2nd round picks would be enough to acquire a 3rd overall pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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