406in604 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 We get that he's loyal, wants to be a Canuck forever and all that but what if Benning doesn't feel his value is where Edler and his agent do? Edler holds all the power. I think they need to determine by today what the extension is going to look like and if it makes sense, otherwise, you gotta push him to move to a contender and revisit in the off season If he says "I want 7.5 per" and Canucks feel its 6 then there is no deal to be done and Edler walls with no assets gained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonny_Bohonos_14 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 At this point it is what it is. I wouldn't blame Edler for wanting a big payday, as this will likely be his last chance and he's taken discounts in the past. If the talks right now are over where the club values him, see what's out there and see if a deal can be made. Worst case he walks and we use that cap space for stop gaps or maybe a run at Karlsson. The defense needs to be rebuilt regardless of whether Edler stays or goes. Long story short, I'm not worried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanGnome Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 If Edler wants to be a douche, you force a trade. If he won't waive you move on from him and put him in the rear view mirror. Edler is not the caliber of defenseman that can be making those kinds of demands. Compare him to the rest of the league, he's a 3/4 defenceman at most on a solid playoff team. 3/4 D's go for between 4 and 5 and 2-3 years with limited clauses in their contracts. He's simply not good enough, given he has easily reached his peak and is on the decline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
406in604 Posted February 24, 2019 Author Share Posted February 24, 2019 6 minutes ago, VanGnome said: If Edler wants to be a douche, you force a trade. If he won't waive you move on from him and put him in the rear view mirror. Edler is not the caliber of defenseman that can be making those kinds of demands. Compare him to the rest of the league, he's a 3/4 defenceman at most on a solid playoff team. 3/4 D's go for between 4 and 5 and 2-3 years with limited clauses in their contracts. He's simply not good enough, given he has easily reached his peak and is on the decline. What's his value at this point? 5 mill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanGnome Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, 406in604 said: What's his value at this point? 5 mill? Given his injury history and stubbornness of not willing to waive his NTC, I'd say 4.5x2 if he is willing to do a Limited NTC and 4x2 if he wants a full NTC If he wants more than 2 years, let him walk. It's not worth tying up cap space with Petey needing a deal in 2 years, Hughes in the same amount of time (if he signs a contract he automatically burns the 1st year of his ELC) and we're re-upping Boeser this off season. We need room to improve offense via UFA, and if we can deal Tanev for assets at the draft, we can do some UFA D shopping as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40Dangles Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 My guess is his agent is asking $6.5 x 4 with a NTC. A. He's taken discounts in the past B. He's clearly our best dman C. He's had 2 solid years in a row and this year has been stellar at both ends D. He's making 5 right now, which was a discount, so with cap inflation, his production etc, he's easily worth 6-6.5 in the open market. E. Term is going to be the agent pushing for more, and trying to create leverage. Ie less term give us more money F. NTC will also be an issue. Someone will pay him at least $6-6.5 x3 in the open market so that's what we need to expect. Not sure I would do that even without a NTC which he apparently wants My guess is this negotiation is to see if what he and his agent want makes sense and if not, then JB if given good offers will ask him to waive. You can't pay a 32, turning 33 yr old dman who's never been overly mobile $6.5 and give him a NTC- the reality is he has peaked and this is the very best time to trade him, and he's not going to age well. Nucks have to get past this idea of 'he's been here too long and too important'. I love Edler but he's not a Sedin, not Nazzy, hell Lou, Karlsson, even Ray Bourque got traded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canucklehead80 Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 If Edler wants too much $, term or a NMC that would protect him from expansion then let him test the open market. There's no way we should give him a NMC and lose a younger piece to Seattle. I'd be ok with a NTC for a couple years as our younger defence develop. Don't think we should be caving to Edler. He's been a good warrior, but in this new age of the NHL, we've got to be looking toward the future. We can always bring him back if he hasn't signed July 1. If he hasn't found a home in the 1st few days of free agency, then we can bring him back on terms more beneficial to the team, and he can stay in the city he loves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 39 minutes ago, VanGnome said: If Edler wants to be a douche, you force a trade. If he won't waive you move on from him and put him in the rear view mirror. 24 minutes ago, VanGnome said: Given his injury history and stubbornness of not willing to waive his NTC wtf has he done to deserve this kind of talk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanuck Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 This is an interesting situation. You can't just view Edler by his stat-line. JB has said repeatedly that Edler has more value to this organization than just statistics - he set's culture for the team on/off the ice, he's a very important mentor for EP (this can't be understated) and he's the ONLY defenseman with any amount of significant playoff experience in the entire franchise. This is the type of intangible skill-set that JB has overpaid for in the past which worries me somewhat. I'm perfectly okay with an Edler re-signing - it's just the price (not necessarily term) and the possibility of NTC/NMC (which i fully expect Edler to request) which are an issue for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khay Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 10 minutes ago, 40Dangles said: My guess is his agent is asking $6.5 x 4 with a NTC. A. He's taken discounts in the past B. He's clearly our best dman C. He's had 2 solid years in a row and this year has been stellar at both ends D. He's making 5 right now, which was a discount, so with cap inflation, his production etc, he's easily worth 6-6.5 in the open market. E. Term is going to be the agent pushing for more, and trying to create leverage. Ie less term give us more money F. NTC will also be an issue. Someone will pay him at least $6-6.5 x3 in the open market so that's what we need to expect. Not sure I would do that even without a NTC which he apparently wants My guess is this negotiation is to see if what he and his agent want makes sense and if not, then JB if given good offers will ask him to waive. You can't pay a 32, turning 33 yr old dman who's never been overly mobile $6.5 and give him a NTC- the reality is he has peaked and this is the very best time to trade him, and he's not going to age well. Nucks have to get past this idea of 'he's been here too long and too important'. I love Edler but he's not a Sedin, not Nazzy, hell Lou, Karlsson, even Ray Bourque got traded. 7 In my opinion, NTC is worth at least 0.5 mil in discount. If his value in the open market is 6-6.5, then with NTC, he should be getting 5-5-6. 4 years seems fair, although 3 would be ideal from the team perspective. I don't know for sure but if you have NTC, are you eligible to be exposed at the expansion draft? or is that just NMC? If so, NTC is also not a big issue as we can expose him at the expansion draft and protect guys like Hughs (who may need a protection), Juolevi, and one of Hutton or Stecher (whoever sticks). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Sparkle Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 Elders 32, turning 33. We can get, maybe 3-4 solid years out of him, who knows-- health tends to play a bit of a role but this year looks to me that he's finally playing to the potential he's supposed to be at, and has been handling the pressure very well Whether you want to believe it or not, Alex Edler is a leader of this hockey club, and the best overall defenseman on this team, on a team that doesn't have a stellar blue line. At all. Everyone on this board, is guilty of ****ting on the guy through the past couple of years of that Willie era, and you will not convince me otherwise. Just own it. We sing a different tune now that he's been out and the teams struggling with keeping the puck out of the net, moving the damn thing, and confidence We trade him for scoring "assets" okay, then what? There's still that back end problem that gets significantly worse, even with Hughes on the horizon. That guy alone isn't going to immediately replace what an Alex Edler brought to us, and I don't care how stoked you are on these kids coming up. Then we run the risk that he likes it on the other team and chooses not to re-sign here Alex Edler has plenty of hockey left to help the team for a few years and help groom these young kids in the system and will retire a Canuck I don't see him being like **** you guys, you guys jerked me around all these years, I want 6m+. 4.5-5 isn't unreasonable for what the guy brings from what I mentioned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 1 hour ago, 406in604 said: We get that he's loyal, wants to be a Canuck forever and all that but what if Benning doesn't feel his value is where Edler and his agent do? Edler holds all the power. I think they need to determine by today what the extension is going to look like and if it makes sense, otherwise, you gotta push him to move to a contender and revisit in the off season If he says "I want 7.5 per" and Canucks feel its 6 then there is no deal to be done and Edler walls with no assets gained. he does. There's no "pushing" a veteran with a NTC. Its stupid that the idea comes up so often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanGnome Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said: wtf has he done to deserve this kind of talk? First statement: If he asks for incredibly more than he's worth, and will not budge on his demands, it's not worth to box the team into a cap anchor. Douche is a strong word granted, but the sentiment is real. If he doesn't accept a trade then you let him walk. It's a business, not a country club. Second statement: Do you dispute he's had an injury history? Do you dispute that he's openly stated multiple times his unwillingness to waive his NTC when asked by media? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, VanGnome said: First statement: If he asks for incredibly more than he's worth, and will not budge on his demands, it's not worth to box the team into a cap anchor. Douche is a strong word granted, but the sentiment is real. If he doesn't accept a trade then you let him walk. It's a business, not a country club. Second statement: Do you dispute he's had an injury history? Do you dispute that he's openly stated multiple times his unwillingness to waive his NTC when asked by media? you're using words like "douche", get a grip. You can make up whatever scenarios you want to and then get upset over them if thats your thing, fill your boots. many good players have an injury history. he's never said "never" when asked about his NTC. Anther CDC myth that has legs for some reason. He has all the decision making power right now. He's not a "douche" if he uses it, he earned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toni Zamboni Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 team is bad without edler...give him what he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boeserker Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 2 years would be good term, any more than 3 and it will be regrettable. And none of this NTC clause business unless he'll take $4mil/year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck_in_england Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 I'm sure with a day left for trades they will have told Edler what he'll be offered probably even with a bit back and forth with his agent for a final offer. Then he can decide what he wants to do regarding trades, if any offers have even come in, or signing or walking in the summer. That would be good and decent management. I can't see any animosity from either camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 3 yr X 6,000,000 Signing bonus of 3 million in first year so 8/5/5 NTC in first year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 1 hour ago, 406in604 said: We get that he's loyal, wants to be a Canuck forever and all that but what if Benning doesn't feel his value is where Edler and his agent do? Edler holds all the power. I think they need to determine by today what the extension is going to look like and if it makes sense, otherwise, you gotta push him to move to a contender and revisit in the off season If he says "I want 7.5 per" and Canucks feel its 6 then there is no deal to be done and Edler walls with no assets gained. If he wants too much $ or term then this goes just like Ohlund, he walks after a long tenure as a Canuck player. But with JB at the helm, I think he caves and gives in to Edler as he is trying to hold onto his job. JB should step aside as GM, stay as president. I dont know if I trust him if he fails to make any moves this TDL and goes into july 1 with a ton of $. He has yet to make a bold trade to shake up this franchise. Is that not what we need? A new era has started upfront, time for that to happen on D too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithers joe Posted February 24, 2019 Share Posted February 24, 2019 ntc would be alright but not nmc. having to protect eddie in the expansion draft would be brutal. his contract should be front loaded or mostly bonus stressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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