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[Proposal] 10th overall + ???? for Jacob Trouba?


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On 4/11/2019 at 9:31 AM, 73 Percent said:

I like this idea. Jets may sign myers if trouba walks. 

 

10th+ virtanen+ sautner

 

Trouba+ copp

The tenth and Tanev gets it done IMO.  

 

Then sign a RHD depth player.  Trouba, Stecher, Schenn Biega Trymakin (hoping) and Woo.  Plus Bris can play RD too   

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1 hour ago, Grape said:

Me neither. I'm just saying the value I think it'll take to get him 

You may be right but I’m with both of you that it’s a no go.  Once you put a name to the 10th it looks even worse:

 

Boldy and Joulevi for Trouba.  Me no likey.

 

I think the 10th alone for that type of player is something to consider but it may not get it done.

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11 minutes ago, Kobayashi Maru said:

You may be right but I’m with both of you that it’s a no go.  Once you put a name to the 10th it looks even worse:

 

Boldy and Joulevi for Trouba.  Me no likey.

 

I think the 10th alone for that type of player is something to consider but it may not get it done.

People are over rating the value of the 10th overall pick. Go back and look at the last 40 or so 10th picks.  There’s one superstar (Selanne). Some solid NHlers, and a lot of busts. Yes. There’s the potential of getting a very good player. But it’s not as high a chance as people like to think

 

10th Overall NHL Draft Picks
Year Player Pos. Drafted From  Drafted By 
2013 Valeri Nichushkin  W Chelyabinsk (RUS) Dallas Stars
2012 Slater Koekkoek D Peterborough (OHL) Tampa Bay Lightning
2011 Jonas Brodin D Farjestad (Swe) Minnesota Wild
2010 Dylan McIlrath D Moose Jaw (WHL) New York Rangers
2009 Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson LW Timra (Swe) Edmonton Oilers
2008 Cody Hodgson C Brampton Vancouver Canucks
2007 Keaton Ellerby D Kamloops (WHL) Florida Panthers
2006 Michael Frolik RW Kladno (Cze) Florida Panthers
2005 Luc Bourdon D Val-d'Or Foreurs (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
2004 Boris Valabik D Kitchener Rangers (OHL) Atlanta Thrashers
2003 Andrei Kostitsyn LW/RW CSKA Moscow (Russia) Montreal Canadiens
2002 Eric Nystrom LW U. of Michigan (NCAA) Calgary Flames
2001 Dan Blackburn G Kootenay Ice (WHL) New York Rangers
2000 Mikhail Yakubov C Tolyatti-2 Chicago Blackhawks
1999 Branislav Mezei D Belleville Bulls (OHL) New York Islanders
1998 Nikolai Antropov C Torpedo UST-Kamengorsk (Russia) Toronto Maple Leafs
1997 Brad Ference D Spokane Chiefs (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1996 Lance Ward D Red Deer Rebels (WHL) New Jersey Devils
1995 Radek Dvorak RW Ceske Budejovice HC (Czech) Florida Panthers
1994 Nolan Baumgartner D Kamloops Blazers (WHL) Washington Capitals
1993 Jocelyn Thibault G Sherbrooke Faucons (QMJHL) Quebuc Nordiques
1992 Andrei Nazarov LW Moscow Dynamo (Russia) San Jose Sharks
1991 Martin Lapointe RW Laval Titan (QMJHL) Detroit Red Wings
1990 Drake Berehowsky D Kingston Frontenacs (OHL) Toronto Maple Leafs
1989 Bobby Holik C Dukla Jihlava (Czech) Hartford Whalers
1988 Teemu Selanne RW Jokerit Helsinki (FNL) Winnipeg Jets
1987 Jayson More D New Westminster Bruins (WHL) New York Rangers
1986 Jocelyn Lemieux LW Laval Titan (QMJHL) St. Louis Blues
1985 Dan Gratton C Oshawa Generals (OHL) Los Angeles Kings
1984 J.J. Daigneault D Longueuil Chevaliers (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
1983 Normand Lacombe RW U. of New Hampshire (NCAA) Buffalo Sabres
1981 Garth Butcher D Regina Pats (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1980 Jim Fox F Ottawa 67's (OHA) Los Angeles Kings

 

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2 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

People are over rating the value of the 10th overall pick. Go back and look at the last 40 or so 10th picks.  There’s one superstar (Selanne). Some solid NHlers, and a lot of busts. Yes. There’s the potential of getting a very good player. But it’s not as high a chance as people like to think

 

10th Overall NHL Draft Picks
Year Player Pos. Drafted From  Drafted By 
2013 Valeri Nichushkin  W Chelyabinsk (RUS) Dallas Stars
2012 Slater Koekkoek D Peterborough (OHL) Tampa Bay Lightning
2011 Jonas Brodin D Farjestad (Swe) Minnesota Wild
2010 Dylan McIlrath D Moose Jaw (WHL) New York Rangers
2009 Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson LW Timra (Swe) Edmonton Oilers
2008 Cody Hodgson C Brampton Vancouver Canucks
2007 Keaton Ellerby D Kamloops (WHL) Florida Panthers
2006 Michael Frolik RW Kladno (Cze) Florida Panthers
2005 Luc Bourdon D Val-d'Or Foreurs (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
2004 Boris Valabik D Kitchener Rangers (OHL) Atlanta Thrashers
2003 Andrei Kostitsyn LW/RW CSKA Moscow (Russia) Montreal Canadiens
2002 Eric Nystrom LW U. of Michigan (NCAA) Calgary Flames
2001 Dan Blackburn G Kootenay Ice (WHL) New York Rangers
2000 Mikhail Yakubov C Tolyatti-2 Chicago Blackhawks
1999 Branislav Mezei D Belleville Bulls (OHL) New York Islanders
1998 Nikolai Antropov C Torpedo UST-Kamengorsk (Russia) Toronto Maple Leafs
1997 Brad Ference D Spokane Chiefs (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1996 Lance Ward D Red Deer Rebels (WHL) New Jersey Devils
1995 Radek Dvorak RW Ceske Budejovice HC (Czech) Florida Panthers
1994 Nolan Baumgartner D Kamloops Blazers (WHL) Washington Capitals
1993 Jocelyn Thibault G Sherbrooke Faucons (QMJHL) Quebuc Nordiques
1992 Andrei Nazarov LW Moscow Dynamo (Russia) San Jose Sharks
1991 Martin Lapointe RW Laval Titan (QMJHL) Detroit Red Wings
1990 Drake Berehowsky D Kingston Frontenacs (OHL) Toronto Maple Leafs
1989 Bobby Holik C Dukla Jihlava (Czech) Hartford Whalers
1988 Teemu Selanne RW Jokerit Helsinki (FNL) Winnipeg Jets
1987 Jayson More D New Westminster Bruins (WHL) New York Rangers
1986 Jocelyn Lemieux LW Laval Titan (QMJHL) St. Louis Blues
1985 Dan Gratton C Oshawa Generals (OHL) Los Angeles Kings
1984 J.J. Daigneault D Longueuil Chevaliers (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
1983 Normand Lacombe RW U. of New Hampshire (NCAA) Buffalo Sabres
1981 Garth Butcher D Regina Pats (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1980 Jim Fox F Ottawa 67's (OHA) Los Angeles Kings

 

Agreed and I would take the sure thing if offered (My vote would still be for Ristolainen) because he is a fairly sure thing that meets a big need.

 

i think the value of a pick also fluctuates by time of year.  Leading towards the draft it goes up.  Some other poster mentioned that the #1 pick just before the draft will be higher value than Jack Hughes after the draft.  I tend to agree.

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19 minutes ago, Kobayashi Maru said:

That is also a sad list at 10.  Does 10 happen to be one of the unluckiest draft spots?  Wonder what 9 or 11 looks like as a comparison.

Understandably leaves out the last 5 drafts but Rantanen was drafted at 10. Jost, Bouchard, Tippett and Ritchie don't exactly make that list look any better though. Lol.

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38 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

People are over rating the value of the 10th overall pick. Go back and look at the last 40 or so 10th picks.  There’s one superstar (Selanne). Some solid NHlers, and a lot of busts. Yes. There’s the potential of getting a very good player. But it’s not as high a chance as people like to think

 

10th Overall NHL Draft Picks
Year Player Pos. Drafted From  Drafted By 
2013 Valeri Nichushkin  W Chelyabinsk (RUS) Dallas Stars
2012 Slater Koekkoek D Peterborough (OHL) Tampa Bay Lightning
2011 Jonas Brodin D Farjestad (Swe) Minnesota Wild
2010 Dylan McIlrath D Moose Jaw (WHL) New York Rangers
2009 Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson LW Timra (Swe) Edmonton Oilers
2008 Cody Hodgson C Brampton Vancouver Canucks
2007 Keaton Ellerby D Kamloops (WHL) Florida Panthers
2006 Michael Frolik RW Kladno (Cze) Florida Panthers
2005 Luc Bourdon D Val-d'Or Foreurs (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
2004 Boris Valabik D Kitchener Rangers (OHL) Atlanta Thrashers
2003 Andrei Kostitsyn LW/RW CSKA Moscow (Russia) Montreal Canadiens
2002 Eric Nystrom LW U. of Michigan (NCAA) Calgary Flames
2001 Dan Blackburn G Kootenay Ice (WHL) New York Rangers
2000 Mikhail Yakubov C Tolyatti-2 Chicago Blackhawks
1999 Branislav Mezei D Belleville Bulls (OHL) New York Islanders
1998 Nikolai Antropov C Torpedo UST-Kamengorsk (Russia) Toronto Maple Leafs
1997 Brad Ference D Spokane Chiefs (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1996 Lance Ward D Red Deer Rebels (WHL) New Jersey Devils
1995 Radek Dvorak RW Ceske Budejovice HC (Czech) Florida Panthers
1994 Nolan Baumgartner D Kamloops Blazers (WHL) Washington Capitals
1993 Jocelyn Thibault G Sherbrooke Faucons (QMJHL) Quebuc Nordiques
1992 Andrei Nazarov LW Moscow Dynamo (Russia) San Jose Sharks
1991 Martin Lapointe RW Laval Titan (QMJHL) Detroit Red Wings
1990 Drake Berehowsky D Kingston Frontenacs (OHL) Toronto Maple Leafs
1989 Bobby Holik C Dukla Jihlava (Czech) Hartford Whalers
1988 Teemu Selanne RW Jokerit Helsinki (FNL) Winnipeg Jets
1987 Jayson More D New Westminster Bruins (WHL) New York Rangers
1986 Jocelyn Lemieux LW Laval Titan (QMJHL) St. Louis Blues
1985 Dan Gratton C Oshawa Generals (OHL) Los Angeles Kings
1984 J.J. Daigneault D Longueuil Chevaliers (QMJHL) Vancouver Canucks
1983 Normand Lacombe RW U. of New Hampshire (NCAA) Buffalo Sabres
1981 Garth Butcher D Regina Pats (WHL) Vancouver Canucks
1980 Jim Fox F Ottawa 67's (OHA) Los Angeles Kings

 

this is a completely false analysis

there is nothing at all to suggest that there is something meaningful to this particular draft position

and that this somehow carries forward from year to year (tell us all please what it is that is carrying forward???)

this is all nonsense and a most superficial way to assess what has happened

it is a misunderstanding about how stats and trends in fact work meaningfully

(do you really think a team will trade out of the #10 slot to a lower slot in belief that the lower slot has more value based on this historical data?? because that is what is being suggested)

 

it all comes down to who is doing the drafting

brock at 23rd defies the history of the 23 draft slot in the 1st round

jb can do a lot with the 10th slot.. more then most

it is a valuable slot to this team

i think it can produce a very high end to elite player

history has no impact on this potential outcome

 

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10 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

this is a completely false analysis

there is nothing at all to suggest that there is something meaningful to this particular draft position

and that this somehow carries forward from year to year (tell us all please what it is that is carrying forward???)

this is all nonsense and a most superficial way to assess what has happened

it is a misunderstanding about how stats and trends in fact work meaningfully

(do you really think a team will trade out of the #10 slot to a lower slot in belief that the lower slot has more value based on this historical data?? because that is what is being suggested)

 

it all comes down to who is doing the drafting

brock at 23rd defies the history of the 23 draft slot in the 1st round

jb can do a lot with the 10th slot.. more then most

it is a valuable slot to this team

i think it can produce a very high end to elite player

history has no impact on this potential outcome

 

I said there’s still a chance of getting a very good player with the 10th pick. The difference is the players available at that point are less the “sure thing” variety and more the “project” variety.  

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Yeah, instead of the Jets trading Trouba (a 50 point defenseman) to a team like Philadelphia, where they could target someone like Ghost + in return, I’m sure they’d prefer a 10th overall pick and a B prospect. 

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6 minutes ago, Monty said:

Yeah, instead of the Jets trading Trouba (a 50 point defenseman) to a team like Philadelphia, where they could target someone like Ghost + in return, I’m sure they’d prefer a 10th overall pick and a B prospect. 

I see you're being sarcastic.  I thought the whole idea was based on the Jets being against the cap, and needing to move out a guy like Trouba to save cap space?  Or is it more that Trouba is not going to sign long term with the Jets?  If it's a cap issue, then I do see the Jets wanting a high pick, and (not b level) top prospect, so they save money.

If it's about Trouba not signing, then clearly trading for another top D of similar age makes way more sense.  

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Trouba’s Cap hit is going to be insane. Looking at what OLiver Ekman Larsson sighted for in AZ,  I’d bet Trouba comes in north of 8 million. Jets might almost be better off re-signing Myers for 7 million and trading trouba for a massive haul

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11 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I see you're being sarcastic.  I thought the whole idea was based on the Jets being against the cap, and needing to move out a guy like Trouba to save cap space?  Or is it more that Trouba is not going to sign long term with the Jets?  If it's a cap issue, then I do see the Jets wanting a high pick, and (not b level) top prospect, so they save money.

If it's about Trouba not signing, then clearly trading for another top D of similar age makes way more sense.  

Alf I made this for you before you went missing.  Its the right aspect ratio 250x250 for an avatar, if you want it, its yours.

 

AlfExplode.gif.848265987c6cdcd6e13a2770ac19ef15.gif

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9 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

trading trouba for a massive haul

Definitely.

 

10 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

Jets might almost be better off re-signing Myers for 7 million

No, they’ll let some other team make that mistake.

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1 minute ago, Monty said:

Definitely.

 

No, they’ll let some other team make that mistake.

So they’re just going to let both of them go? The only other RD they have is joe morrow (who is also rfa at the end of the year). 

 

Jets would go from having one one of the best D-cores in the league to middle of the pack at best. Especially if Byfuglien has another injury riddled season like this year.

 

They’d have to trade trouba for another top 2 defensemen to stay an elite team, which is easier said the done. Who could they target?

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9 minutes ago, The_Rocket said:

So they’re just going to let both of them go? The only other RD they have is joe morrow (who is also rfa at the end of the year). 

 

Jets would go from having one one of the best D-cores in the league to middle of the pack at best. Especially if Byfuglien has another injury riddled season like this year.

 

They’d have to trade trouba for another top 2 defensemen to stay an elite team, which is easier said the done. Who could they target?

They need a LHD. There’s been speculation for a while that Philly would be the perfect trading partner for them. Philly has Ghost, Provorov, and Sanheim on the left side, and their best RHD is Gudas, who’s a pending UFA. Makes sense not their part.

 

As for Winnipeg, they are really high on Jonathan Kovacevic (just finished college and signed) and Dylan Samberg (just won his second straight college National championship). Kovacevic is a natural RHD, whereas Samberg has played both sides in the past.

 

Long story short, Trouba won’t extend in Winnipeg, so they’ll get a haul for him. And the last thing they need is tie up a ridiculous amount of money into Tyler “Mistake Central” Myers.

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