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[Discussion] Would you be fine with Panarin or nothing this free agency?


[poll] Would you be fine with Panarin or nothing this free agency?  

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With Panarin, I'm kind of on the fence and would be fine if we did or didn't sign him. If he truly wanted to come here though and would actually take a small discount to do so, that could be really interesting. It's certainly possible too given our team is up and coming and likely intriguing for a number of free agents.

 

The problem I see is that the rumours suggest Panarin and Bobrovsky are moving together to whatever team is willing to sign them both, although that would also give us a top goalie (while potentially causing issues with who goes in net, albeit not necessarily a bad problem to have there). Big thing would be cap space and signing our top players obviously, but that's mostly an issue in a couple of years time.

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Panarin of course, but ladies and gents.. our defense though!  We can not go through another summer without a change back there.  Honestly we need one B+ d man at the very least, and ship a couple out.  I don't care if that is via trade or we try FA, but this CAN NOT be the same blue line for the 2019-20 season.

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26 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

Yes.

 

 

Weird as it is, I'd be okay with all in on Panarin or sitting pat with what we have.

well, I don't think the idea is weird :P it makes a lot of sense to me to just keep developing, or trading and if we can't land a true impact player just stay the course. No more middlin' players. 

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20 minutes ago, Type R said:

Panarin of course, but ladies and gents.. our defense though!  We can not go through another summer without a change back there.  Honestly we need one B+ d man at the very least, and ship a couple out.  I don't care if that is via trade or we try FA, but this CAN NOT be the same blue line for the 2019-20 season.

I really think the opportunity there is in a trade with one of the 5 or 6 very cap crunched teams. We can retain on Sutter or Tanev and get a solid RFA back. 

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1 hour ago, Mathew Barzal said:

 

This is ridiculous, what do you even mean by that? By any logical measure, Tampa Bay destroyed the league this year. It's not their fault the playoffs are a different animal.

And you have succinctly made my point for me.

 

The playoffs ARE a different animal, and Tampa Bay has now got the record for 'most disappointing team in NHL history' for their playoff disappearing act.

 

Winning the presidents' trophy is not winning. Aside from some fans of that team, nobody remembers the Prez trophy winner unless they do something like lose disappointingly in the first round against the 8th seed (like us vs the Kings, or Tampa this year).

 

Anything less than the Stanley Cup is 'not winning'. That should be the end goal. How we get there is always going to be the measure of debate, but building for anything other than that goal is a waste of time.

 

Squeaking into the playoffs and winning the Cup is vastly superior to blowing the league away and not.

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4 minutes ago, brownky said:

And you have succinctly made my point for me.

 

The playoffs ARE a different animal, and Tampa Bay has now got the record for 'most disappointing team in NHL history' for their playoff disappearing act.

 

Winning the presidents' trophy is not winning. Aside from some fans of that team, nobody remembers the Prez trophy winner unless they do something like lose disappointingly in the first round against the 8th seed (like us vs the Kings, or Tampa this year).

  

Anything less than the Stanley Cup is 'not winning'. That should be the end goal. How we get there is always going to be the measure of debate, but building for anything other than that goal is a waste of time.

  

Squeaking into the playoffs and winning the Cup is vastly superior to blowing the league away and not.

So what did Tampa do wrong? What if Boeser and Pettersson end up being playoff equivalents to Stamkos and Kucherov?

 

Where would Benning have failed to account for that while he 'builds' this team?

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Panarin and Karlsson are obviously the dream signings, but it’s still a pretty decent FA class outside of them. I’d be very interested in Lee, Duchene, Nelson, Skinner etc., if we can’t get Panarin. 

Edited by Pears
typo
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1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

well, I don't think the idea is weird :P it makes a lot of sense to me to just keep developing, or trading and if we can't land a true impact player just stay the course. No more middlin' players. 

I think the strategy of stacking up low to middling players into a jogjam, in order to see what breaks loose, worked very well in parsing out Motte from the pack last season.  Inexpensive, young, and driven.  He is a hell of an outer core piece moving forward. We need to keep bringing in the Spooners, the Leivos, the Pearsons (another great but not cheap pickup) and letting them battle it out in preseason.  Its harder to do this on D, but I still want to see it.  You will find a few gems once all the chaff is gone.  The over payment and term on these middlings that is the sticking point. And so far, Jim has done a pretty good job at keeping these test projects to 1 and 2 seasons.  This being said, I want to see some of our farm depth make up these jogs in the jam, and less recovery projects.  Its time to see if Lind, Gadjovich, MacEwen (probably already has made the team imo), Chatfield, have what it takes.

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1 minute ago, xereau said:

I think the strategy of stacking up low to middling players into a jogjam, in order to see what breaks loose, worked very well in parsing out Motte from the pack last season.  Inexpensive, young, and driven.  He is a hell of an outer core piece moving forward. We need to keep bringing in the Spooners, the Leivos, the Pearsons (another great but not cheap pickup) and letting them battle it out in preseason.  Its harder to do this on D, but I still want to see it.  You will find a few gems once all the chaff is gone.  The over payment and term on these middlings that is the sticking point. And so far, Jim has done a pretty good job at keeping these test projects to 1 and 2 seasons.  This being said, I want to see some of our farm depth make up these jogs in the jam, and less recovery projects.  Its time to see if Lind, Gadjovich, MacEwen (probably already has made the team imo), Chatfield, have what it takes.

I can understand that, we've had a couple of solid players come out of that competition. But no game changers. If we're able to pick some up in trades, maybe waivers, etc. sure OK. But I feel its time to use free agency for much bigger impact. 

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1 hour ago, Pears said:

Panarin and Karlsson are obviously the dream signings, but it’s still a pretty decent FA class outside of them. I’d be very interested in Lee, Duchene, Nelson, Skinner etc., if we can’t get Panarin. 

Definitely be all in for Nelson

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5 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

that ankle worries me... how long can he really play? 

Cobra Kai sensei (Jeremy Jacobs) to Rat Marchand:  1) Strike First....2) Strike Hard....3) No Mercy

Cobra Kai:  Sweep the leg...

 

Cobra Kai:  You have a problem with that?  No mercy!

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Stones a decent comparable tho, very similar production: https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/frozenpool_compare.php?players[]=4256&players[]=2898&period=2018-2019%3AR%3A99

 

Stone brings a physical element Panarin doesn't, but damn Panarin is creative and for a small player unafraid of the net. 

Nice work Jimmy.

 

I voted Panarin all in.  Because, and I have posted elsewhere, there is no player who brings such dynamic, elite, speed, elite agility and puck skills. Puck skills including both passing and shooting. Which is rare. But its the speed, the agility which is my focus.

 

These are similar skills to Quinn Hughes. And therein lies the rationale. It could double down on something exciting we already have building. Potentially make us unstoppable. The speed, the ability to play up tempo. A stretch pass option. Which would open a currently clogged middle for both Pettersson & Hughes to haul the puck up on a secondary break. That type of elite speed & puck skills could immediately make Quinn Hughes substantially more dangerous.

 

These are similar skills & speed, although I classify the Alien as evasive with his balance & movement versus agile, as Pettersson.  Panarin has puck skills like Boeser, close to his shot. But even better passing, so also great play making skills like Pettersson. Pettersson & Boeser also offering lethal shots, this could be the top line in the NHL. Triple down if there is such a thing?

 

 

 

Now, I am not actually of the belief we should not go for other players if we cannot get Panarin? I do believe he should be the single primary target, our first option, the first player we look at. I also would like Karlsson? But I perceive Panarin will command $9.5 or $10 mill, Karlsson $12. Karlsson more an injury risk, a higher payday. At cost & risk, Panarin the #1 target. The clear target, the guy who can help the Canucks more than any other player IMO.

 

Karlsson, maybe #2?

 

I have options I am keen to pursue if unsuccessful.  They all involve speed! I'm interested in Eberle! I'd pay decent quid, but recall he did not score 80 points with McDavid? With Tavares? Barzal…  But, does offer us that stretch pass, a pretty good passer and 60 points? I'm more interested in Jeff Skinner. Same logic, elevated his game with Eichel more than Eberle. Has speed! Would his passing help Boeser? Petey would get lots of assists. Skinner would cost more than Eberle. Eberle a western Canadian kid, more likely to come?I wish Zucarello was a LW not right? He's older, but faster than either of the two above. Maybe even up with Panarin, albeit not as good. He also played for AV, and played puck pressure defence like Burrows and Hansen used to. His speed was a weapon offensively & defensively, improved the whole team who went to a cup final. And would be less expensive than Eberle or Skinner. Does pass & score pretty well. Might actually become Horvats winger, which would not be a bad thing? And his speed a weapon! He is a left, Zuccarello could also be a LW for Petey?  He is my #2 target, hoping he might also escape the huge dollars and term.

 

Leivo Horvat Zuccarello  >> 2knd line?

 

3 years at $5.6 million for Zucarello?   

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Mathew Barzal said:

So what did Tampa do wrong? What if Boeser and Pettersson end up being playoff equivalents to Stamkos and Kucherov?

 

Where would Benning have failed to account for that while he 'builds' this team?

Honestly, it's the middle six that matter most in the postseason. Can your 2nd tier and bottom guys carry the load in a DIFFERENT way to the rest of your team?

 

The balance is the key. Tampa is a very talented offensive team, but they lacked the 'garbage goal' guys in front, the hustle and (sigh) "meat and potatoes" guys (I hate that term). For example, Ovechkin and Backstrom had all the success in the regular season for year after year, to be disappointed in the playoffs. Why? They lacked the balancing element. They had less talent last year than previous years, yet won it all, handily over Vegas. Wilson for Ovechkin and Backstrom was a balancing element, The defence was hard and net-clearing. Jay Beagle handling the majority of the defensive load for that team, shutting down the other teams' stars while still generating chances on their own. They had offense, defence and goaltending, all balanced. Pittsburgh had the same in its cup years. 

 

There's a reason Benning went and got Beagle and Rousell. Tampa had no pushback, nothing for the garbage areas of the ice. Kucherov started pouting and got himself suspended because he was finally facing some adversity. I hope Boeser does better. Schaller was supposed to be another guy like that, but he hasn't worked out thus far barring 5-6 games.

 

If you want an example of "Playoff Hockey", watch the Jackets vs Bruins series. If the team can't play that game, then they will not succeed.

 

Boeser's style doesn't really scream playoffs to me anyway. He's the guy you count on to get you there, not the guy you count on when you're in. Simply because it's easy to  notice in particularly tight and physical games, he's far less 'visible' except for his defensive deficiencies on an average night. How many nights did you see a goal against because Brock wasn't on his man, or lost a battle on the wall? You can't be like that in the playoffs. He did look better towards the end of the year, but during the early/middle of the campaign it wasn't very pretty at all. If he wasn't scoring, it was a liability.

 

Pettersson is a wildcard. He reminds me of Datsuyk in so many ways, so his sheer talent/intelligence and drive to win will probably make him a playoff performer, linemates be damned.

 

I'm also not saying "Get a full team of Dustin Browns" either - that's unbalanced, and wouldn't work.

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I would prefer that the Canucks build a team through draft and trades with players in the 19-25 year range first and foremost

 

Once they have established they can make the playoff and in their prime then I would be on board with Going after that big name free agent. Which I believe this core will be in its prime in 2 years once Juolevi and Tryamkin get their feet in the NHL

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3 hours ago, Lancaster said:

I'd rather the Canucks make a pitch for EK instead of Panarin.  

EK can literally turn a franchise around.

I havn't seen him do that in SJ, EK is not the right big D FA we need. If we did not have Hughs I may think differently but with Stetcher & Hughs Thats enough small offensive minded D-Man

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  • -SN- changed the title to [Discussion] Would you be fine with Panarin or nothing this free agency?

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