Free Public Transit in Vancouver

[canuckistani]

Just now, goalie13 said:

It could ultimately save all taxpayers money.

 

Of course in the short-term both would need to be funded while mindsets are changed, but I think there is value in the big picture idea.

change the mindset for more freedom/control over your own transportation ?? Never, ever gonna happen, mate. I am a parent to minors, see crap ton of minors every week. Not a single one of them considers personal vehicle to be 'bad', nor would we convince them of such an absurdity, either. 

[canuckistani]

2 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

Me too.  I think Vancouver can be a real world leader in transit as the citizens in Vancouver seem to ready to shift to Green Energy / reduced carbon footprint.

Plus the high costs of housing / poor parking access etc...  would make free transit even more attractive...

 

Ever been to London, UK ? Or Tokyo ? if transit was hockey, forget being the Stanley cup champions, Vancouver is a middle rung AHL city, mate. There are dozens upon dozens of cities in Europe and Asia that are way, way, way more transit-friendly than Vancouver. And they didn't get there by killing cars or scamming car-riders either. 

 

High cost of housing is going to make DRIVING feel more attractive. Because the high cost of housing is directly linked to the spots that are closer to transit. Metrotown costs way more than capitol hill for the same reason. Cambie corridor is way more expensive than main street corridor. high cost of living = move out to the valley = more need to drive. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by canuckistani

[kingofsurrey]

4 minutes ago, goalie13 said:

It could ultimately save all taxpayers money.

 

Of course in the short-term both would need to be funded while mindsets are changed, but I think there is value in the big picture idea.

https://qz.com/1442882/free-public-transit-is-gaining-popularity-in-european-cities/

 

Free public transit, once impossibly radical, is gaining popularity. Dunkirk joins roughly two dozen French cities that have gone fare free. Aubagne, for example, made transit free on 11 bus routes serving 100,000 residents in 2009. Over the next three years, bus ridership rose 142% and car trips decreased 10%, according to a 2013 article in Metropolitiques.

 

In Châteauroux, eliminating fares in the early 2000s revitalized the town’s ailing transit system and catapulted its mayor to immense popularity.

Earlier this year, five German cities said they would try free public transit, though they’ve since decided to dramatically reduce fares rather than waive them entirely.

One month in, Dunkirk mayor Patrice Vergriete told the Guardian the project is a huge success, with ridership up 50-85% on certain routes and the city expanding its bus fleet to 140 from 100 vehicles. Vergriete said fares previously raised only 10% (€47 million) of the system’s annual operating costs, a difference the city has made up by raising the versement transport, a public transport tax on companies with more than 11 employees.

[kingofsurrey]

1 minute ago, canuckistani said:

 

Ever been to London, UK ? Or Tokyo ? if transit was hockey, forget being the Stanley cup champions, Vancouver is a middle rung AHL city, mate. There are dozens upon dozens of cities in Europe and Asia that are way, way, way more transit-friendly than Vancouver. And they didn't get there by killing cars or scamming car-riders either. 

Of course they did....  Have you ever been to LONDON ?

 

The owners of older, polluting cars will now have to pay $28 just to enter central London.

The capital city has introduced a new £10 ($13) emission charge that affects the most polluting vehicles. That's on top of an existing £11.50 ($15) congestion charge collected from drivers in the city cent

 

https://money.cnn.com/2017/10/23/news/london-old-cars-pollution-charge/index.html

[canuckistani]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

Of course they did....  Have you ever been to LONDON ?

 

Learn to read, please. Show me where they BUILT THE TRANSIT by charging car riders only. London charges old cars due to smog reasons, not to fund its transit system. 

[goalie13]

Just now, canuckistani said:

change the mindset for more freedom/control over your own transportation ?? Never, ever gonna happen, mate. I am a parent to minors, see crap ton of minors every week. Not a single one of them considers personal vehicle to be 'bad', nor would we convince them of such an absurdity, either. 

Not saying the vehicle itself is necessarily bad, but the insistence that we need to drive it for an hour so that we can park it for 8 hours and then drive it home for another hour is a mindset that can be changed.

 

Considering where the price of gas is going, if you make it easy to get around without a vehicle, people will gradually change how they get around.

 

I have family in Europe.  Many of them do not even have a vehicle because they consider them unnecessary.  Or of they do have one, they just use it for special trips out of town.  They would never dream of driving to work, or into town, or out for an errand.  They walk, or bike, or take the train.

[kingofsurrey]

3 minutes ago, canuckistani said:

Learn to read, please. Show me where they BUILT THE TRANSIT by charging car riders only. London charges old cars due to smog reasons, not to fund its transit system. 

 

All cars pay to go into London Mate .... haha .   Have you ever been there ?

[canuckistani]

Just now, goalie13 said:

Not saying the vehicle itself is necessarily bad, but the insistence that we need to drive it for an hour so that we can park it for 8 hours and then drive it home for another hour is a mindset that can be changed.

Only if you can give me an alternative to driving for an hour, that is ALSO within the hour/hour-15 mark. I know people who drive in to work into Vancouver from Poco, Maple Ridge etc, because they don't live close to the west coast express and their commute driving is way shorter than driving + WCE, plus they like the freedom of working late/hanging out if they wish and not rush home in 3-4 trains after work. 

Just now, goalie13 said:

 

Considering where the price of gas is going, if you make it easy to get around without a vehicle, people will gradually change how they get around.

 

I have family in Europe.  Many of them do not even have a vehicle because they consider them unnecessary.  Or of they do have one, they just use it for special trips out of town.  They would never dream of driving to work, or into town, or out for an errand.  They walk, or bike, or take the train.

Sure, but for that to happen, transit in vancouver needs to get 10x better than it is. Not to mention, the price of housing needs to come down too. Right now cars are a big deal here for families because we can't really afford to live in transit-friendly areas. 

[kingofsurrey]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

 

I have family in Europe.  Many of them do not even have a vehicle because they consider them unnecessary.  Or of they do have one, they just use it for special trips out of town.  They would never dream of driving to work, or into town, or out for an errand.  They walk, or bike, or take the train.

Yah such a better way to live.  Rent a car for the one weekend you need it....  or for  the evening you want to drive out to big box stores like superstore or IKEA.

 

Such a smart way for society to move towards... 

 

I really think Vancouver citizens are tech saving... Green at heart and ready to live in a different way than others.....

Such a great city ...

[canuckistani]

1 minute ago, kingofsurrey said:

 

All cars pay to go into London Mate .... haha .   Have you ever been there ?

yes, been there plenty of times. They pay to go there for the last 30 years for SMOG. Not to build their transit. And Vancouver is nothing compared to London's transit, nevermind Surrey. Surrey transit is on par with English village transit system.

[canuckistani]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

Yah such a better way to live.  Rent a car for the one weekend you need it....  or for  the evening you want to drive out to big box stores like superstore or IKEA.

 

Such a smart way for society to move towards... 

 

I really think Vancouver citizens are tech saving... Green at heart and ready to live in a different way than others.....

Such a great city ...

North America will never be a Europe or Asia in transit, because north american real estate culture sucks. People here consider home = house on a chunk of land, not apartments. People who buy apartment/duplexes do it out of financial reasons or as 'starter properties' or because they wanna be child-less. In Europe or Asia, we don't bat an eyelid living in a 4-5 bedroom apartment in the middle of the city on the 7th floor. Vancouverities and all of North America go 'ew ew ew' to such density planning, which is what you need in the first place to make such transit systems functional.

 

[kingofsurrey]

1 minute ago, canuckistani said:

yes, been there plenty of times. They pay to go there for the last 30 years for SMOG. Not to build their transit. And Vancouver is nothing compared to London's transit, nevermind Surrey. Surrey transit is on par with English village transit system.

Surprised then you didn't completely  understand their London car charges.....  Congestion charge, T charge, Low E charge etc..

 

 

 

 

[canuckistani]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

Surprised then you didn't completely  understand their London car charges.....  Congestion charge, T charge, Low E charge etc..

 

 

 

 

The congestion charge or low E charge were done to DETER drivers, not to PAY for their transit. London transit system has been more or less the same for the past 20 years, especially in the inner city core where these surcharges apply. 

[goalie13]

1 minute ago, canuckistani said:

Sure, but for that to happen, transit in vancouver needs to get 10x better than it is. Not to mention, the price of housing needs to come down too. Right now cars are a big deal here for families because we can't really afford to live in transit-friendly areas. 

I agree with you there.  We have planned our cities badly.  But that doesn't mean that we're doomed to stay this way.

[kingofsurrey]

Just now, goalie13 said:

I agree with you there.  We have planned our cities badly.  But that doesn't mean that we're doomed to stay this way.

Vancouver is actually one of the cites for population density in North America.

We are going in the right direction with our city.    We are not doomed to follow other NA cities...

 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/3953592/vancouvers-density-lags-comparable-wealthy-cities-fraser-institute/

[canuckistani]

1 minute ago, goalie13 said:

I agree with you there.  We have planned our cities badly.  But that doesn't mean that we're doomed to stay this way.

the way we plan our cities come from our culture towards property. Go to Europe or Asia, any 30 story tall apartment building has at least a dozen 4-5 bedroom units. Many 3 bedroom units, almost all of the rest are 2 bedroom units and hardly any 1 bedroom or bachelor units. How many such exist in North America ?

 

You won't solve your city's transit or driving issues if you keep wishing for a chunk of land and a backyard. 

[kingofsurrey]

4 minutes ago, canuckistani said:

The congestion charge or low E charge were done to DETER drivers, not to PAY for their transit. London transit system has been more or less the same for the past 20 years, especially in the inner city core where these surcharges apply. 

Does the city take the revenue from car drivers and burn the currency ... or do they just bury it in a big hole somewhere outside the city ?

[kingofsurrey]

Just now, canuckistani said:

the way we plan our cities come from our culture towards property. Go to Europe or Asia, any 30 story tall apartment building has at least a dozen 4-5 bedroom units. Many 3 bedroom units, almost all of the rest are 2 bedroom units and hardly any 1 bedroom or bachelor units. How many such exist in North America ?

 

You won't solve your city's transit or driving issues if you keep wishing for a chunk of land and a backyard. 

Vancouver is moving towards backfilling and increasing density throughout the entire city..  Sub Dividing and addling lane houses etc.....   I thought you said you lived there.....

[canuckistani]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

Does the city take the revenue from car drivers and burn the currency ... or do they just bury it in a big hole somewhere outside the city ?

They didn't take it to build the transit system. Most of those surcharges into inner city london came AFTER inner city london constructed their transit systems. Therefore, london didn't finance their transit via vicitimising the car drivers. How hard is it to follow basic logic for you ?

[canuckistani]

Just now, kingofsurrey said:

Vancouver is moving towards backfilling and increasing density throughout the entire city..  Sub Dividing and addling lane houses etc.....   I thought you said you lived there.....

Until it makes 3-4 bedroom apartments where FAMILIES can live in, it means diddly squat. Build as many 1 or 2 bedroom skyscrapers you wish, its all for childless people or people who are into 'starter properties'.