Nils Hoglander | #21 | LW

[Maddogy]

17 hours ago, Alflives said:

Hogs was is massive steal in the draft.  

Which is why I was not particularly intrigued with this year's draft. Hogs had a higher ceiling during his draft year than most of the forwards available at 9th overall. 

[Alflives]

On 8/12/2021 at 11:18 AM, Maddogy said:

Which is why I was not particularly intrigued with this year's draft. Hogs had a higher ceiling during his draft year than most of the forwards available at 9th overall. 

That’s a really good point.  Benning drafts better players with fewer picks than other teams do with more picks.  That allowed Benning to trade picks that turned into Miller, OEL, and Garland, while still bringing in elite rookies like:  Hogs, Pods, Bone etc.  

Edited August 14, 2021 by Alflives

[Pure961089]

On 8/9/2021 at 1:46 PM, Kootenay Gold said:

I disagree with that assumption but I guess we will just have to wait and see how training camp plays out and how Travis sets up the line combo's. One thing for sure; he has a lot more options than he had before. I just want to see 3 scoring lines for a change and I think the Canucks finally have the guys to do that.

I remember Botch saying "We need an ARMY"  Well, it looks like we finally have one.  We have only a few players left from that year.  Our entire Defense is different.  Only Petey, Pearson, Bo, Boeser and Mott remain form when he said those words.  So much younger and skilled.  Gone are the days of Gudbranson, Pouliot and Erickson.  New blood like Hughes, Hoglander and Podkolzin have taken their place. We have Miller and Garland now as well.  Compare that team to the team we have now.  It's shocking how much the team has improved since then. 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2021 by Pure961089
grammar

[KKnight]

On 8/12/2021 at 11:18 AM, Maddogy said:

Which is why I was not particularly intrigued with this year's draft. Hogs had a higher ceiling during his draft year than most of the forwards available at 9th overall. 

I really wasn't a fan of this draft and with it being such a crapshoot, being able to offload those contracts and snag OEL, Garland was great. That could turn out to be a turning point for this franchise into legitimacy again. 

[Canuck Surfer]

On 8/13/2021 at 4:18 AM, Maddogy said:

Which is why I was not particularly intrigued with this year's draft. Hogs had a higher ceiling during his draft year than most of the forwards available at 9th overall. 

There were forwards available at 9; who will very likely outproduce Hoglander.

 

If scoring is your defintion of upside?

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[taskicon]

2 hours ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

Great highlights! I forgot a lot of these. This has me pumped for this season. This kid has that right level of determination and snarl. 

[Dats hockey]

20 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

There were forwards available at 9; who will very likely outproduce Hoglander.

 

If scoring is your defintion of upside?

Well

There are going to be forward through the first 9 drafted that will not out score Hoglander but there are forward pick from 10-282 that will likely out produce him so what’s the point here?

[Canuck Surfer]

5 hours ago, Dats hockey said:

Well

There are going to be forward through the first 9 drafted that will not out score Hoglander but there are forward pick from 10-282 that will likely out produce him so what’s the point here?

When we trade players, CDC always heaps on. Suddenly because we traded our pick, the players available to be drafted now automatically suck. Right? I disagree, there were some great players available at #9.  There was nobody of interest according to the post I was responding to.

 

 

I am not down on Hoglander. I absolutely love this player. Not sure he has a super high ceiling? Which is, sort of, what was being discussed. His floor is ridiculoulsy high though! Busts chops every shift.  A Tasmanian devil. he gets on a puck battle like he's fighting for a kill. More aggressive, faster, powerful than almost anyone. A matchup teams cannot handle. I personally see many years of Hoglander & Podkolzin on our 2knd line. Can play on a first line. He will be a very valuable player! 

 

 

 

[kloubek]

5 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

I am not down on Hoglander. I absolutely love this player. Not sure he has a super high ceiling?

He's not likely a franchise player, no. But he is more skilled than some seem to be giving him credit for. Combined with that motor and passion, and I feel he's going to be a 1st line player for us. (Even if he plays on the 2nd. A la Horvat).

 

The way you feel about Hogs, I feel about Podz. In that case, I don't know what to expect from him. His motor says he'll at least be a 3rd liner who can score, but I'm very curious to see how he develops. Most on CDC figure he will be a top 6 guy - and he may well be. But I'd be happy enough if he just became like a Raffi Torres for us.... but as a winger, and minus the coke habit.

[Canuck Surfer]

Just now, kloubek said:

He's not likely a franchise player, no. But he is more skilled than some seem to be giving him credit for. Combined with that motor and passion, and I feel he's going to be a 1st line player for us. (Even if he plays on the 2nd. A la Horvat).

 

The way you feel about Hogs, I feel about Podz. In that case, I don't know what to expect from him. His motor says he'll at least be a 3rd liner who can score, but I'm very curious to see how he develops. Most on CDC figure he will be a top 6 guy - and he may well be. But I'd be happy enough if he just became like a Raffi Torres for us.... but as a winger, and minus the coke habit.

Good post.

 

Raffi Torres was a top 10 draft pick; 5th overall by memory as a not necessarily unrelated sidebar.  I vision Raffi as the floor for Podkolzin.

 

I also like your comparison to Podkolzin with Hoglander.  The difference being that Vasili is 6'2''.  6'4'' if he has been eating his spinach as reported. He also has size.

 

Neither has the upside of Petey or Hughes. Hoglander in particular is pretty slick, does have skills. See his lacrosse goals. Do not have the effortless puck control, deception & vision. Both Podz & Hogz are smart though. Fast enough to get to the right place, bury a puck.  As you say? Their motor, passion which really is brute athletecism!

 

Hoglander slid in the draft even though he was one of its 3 or 5 elite athletes. He was small? Podz less so because he was 6'2,'' also one of those 5... Something shared with Torres. A team with uber athletes can be built on puck pursuit, exhausting defenseman who's legs are rubber. When they still have an explosive step.      

 

 

[kloubek]

11 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

Good post.

 

Raffi Torres was a top 10 draft pick; 5th overall by memory as a not necessarily unrelated sidebar.  I vision Raffi as the floor for Podkolzin.

 

I also like your comparison to Podkolzin with Hoglander.  The difference being that Vasili is 6'2''.  6'4'' if he has been eating his spinach as reported. He also has size.

 

Neither has the upside of Petey or Hughes. Hoglander in particular is pretty slick, does have skills. See his lacrosse goals. Do not have the effortless puck control, deception & vision. Both Podz & Hogz are smart though. Fast enough to get to the right place, bury a puck.  As you say? Their motor, passion which really is brute athletecism!

 

Hoglander slid in the draft even though he was one of its 3 or 5 elite athletes. He was small? Podz less so because he was 6'2,'' also one of those 5... Something shared with Torres. A team with uber athletes can be built on puck pursuit, exhausting defenseman who's legs are rubber. When they still have an explosive step.      

 

 

I agree that Raffi is the floor for Podkolzin. Raffi mainly played on the 3rd line for us if I remember correctly, and while he didn't have the most ice time of our players, he played an important role. The question, as you and I know, is how far up the lineup Podz can elevate himself. Now that we are getting a stronger top 6, he may well play at a 2nd line level but still remain in a 3rd line role. A pretty good "problem" to have, if you ask me. And, as you mentioned, his size is certainly going to be useful one way or another.

 

And you're right... neither Hogs or Podz will likely reach Petey nor Hughes level in outright scoring ability. With that said, both bring that tenacity that our top 6 has been lacking for some time. If either can play a complimentary tenacious role beside a more skilled player, it brings an element to the top 6 lines that we've been missing, and I think will allow our most skilled players to make the most of their ice time. If they both progress to top 6 players (I'd argue that Hogs is almost there already and probably will be this coming season with an extra year of development under his belt) it gives us a lot of options if other top 6 players falter, like Pearson did last season. 

 

Overall, I have a really good feeling about the team that Benning has constructed. He's found a balance of skill, speed, youth, tenacity and personal character that I don't feel we've had since our cup run. I can see this as being a forward group that we can with a cup with - especially as they gain more experience. The D I think is still a bit of a work in progress, but despite some questions from us as a fans, Benning seems confident in his retool of the blueline. It remains to be seen, but if our forwards spend more time in the offensive zone, combined with the addition of Shaw, hopefully we won't be expecting Demko to stand on his head game in, game out in order to win games.

[-AJ-]

I had a dream last night that Hoglander scored a hat-trick in our season opener this year, though it was against the Senators for some reason. Nice dream though.

[Dats hockey]

23 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I had a dream last night that Hoglander scored a hat-trick in our season opener this year, though it was against the Senators for some reason. Nice dream though.

That means he’s on pace for 246 goals next season in my books

[Bure_Pavel]

22 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

When we trade players, CDC always heaps on. Suddenly because we traded our pick, the players available to be drafted now automatically suck. Right? I disagree, there were some great players available at #9.  There was nobody of interest according to the post I was responding to.

 

 

I am not down on Hoglander. I absolutely love this player. Not sure he has a super high ceiling? Which is, sort of, what was being discussed. His floor is ridiculoulsy high though! Busts chops every shift.  A Tasmanian devil. he gets on a puck battle like he's fighting for a kill. More aggressive, faster, powerful than almost anyone. A matchup teams cannot handle. I personally see many years of Hoglander & Podkolzin on our 2knd line. Can play on a first line. He will be a very valuable player! 

 

 

 

Curious on why you don't think his ceiling is high, is it due to his size? He has shown amazing work ethic in the past to get better and apparently is a rink rat. He also appears to have a high skill level and great agility. Either way he looked really good as a 20 year old in the NHL, which is no easy task. 

 

He had a better season last year than Kaapo Kakko to put his performance into perspective. 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Bure_Pavel

[Canuck Surfer]

56 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Curious on why you don't think his ceiling is high, is it due to his size?

No its not his size.  I am thankful for his size; which saw him left on the draft board for us.  Reality it's his brute athletecism, including the agility you speak of? That explosiveness IMO is worth more than size by a long shot. And he does have skills; a more gifted Horvat? I suppose that is not ''that'' low.  

 

I have two or three observations; he has his head down for a lot of his ''deft'' stickhandling maneuvres.  Nils is pure aggression. Prone quick attacking plays. Often in to traffic, through defenders. Athletic enough many cannot stop him. The truly sublime play makers? Just my opinion of course. Attack when they have strategic position. Curl, slice and meander when they cannot beat someone. Explode in to open space instead, not traffic. Maintain puck possession.

 

Create angles and routes. We see Nils do this sometimes? Hughes, Pettersson, Giroux, Draisaitl, Kucherov, Panarin show that intuition all the time... They have a sense for the opening, the gift of being able to translate touch or power, pass or shot seamlessly.   

 

This has also been Nils track record his whole career?  Exciting but not elite output; www.eliteprospects.com/player/311906/nils-hoglander 

 

Look at William Eklund for example? Very similar in other ways, athletic ability and only slighly larger.  Had 23 pts in 40 SHL games his draft year. Hoglander had 14 points in 50.  The difference is an extra knack for puck possession & play making.

 

 

1 hour ago, Bure_Pavel said:

He has shown amazing work ethic in the past to get better and apparently is a rink rat.

Absolutely I agree / believe ''gifted'' athletes are more prone to develop new skills.  Better motor skills is better motor skills. Especially tagged to such work ethic! 

 

I dont put it out of his possibilities.  But not everyone, Burrows was an example, learns vision & feel, intuition after their career has started.

 

 

[Elias Pettersson]

On 8/23/2021 at 2:58 PM, Canuck Surfer said:

There were forwards available at 9; who will very likely outproduce Hoglander.

 

If scoring is your defintion of upside?

Hoglander outscored his entire draft class last year except Jack Hughes, who was playing in his 2nd NHL season.  Hughes scored 4 more points than Hoglander while playing over 19 minutes a night versus 15 minutes for Hoglander.  

 

Hoglander is a legit top 15 pick in his draft class in a redo of the draft.  And he will be better than Dylan Guenther...

[Bure_Pavel]

15 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

No its not his size.  I am thankful for his size; which saw him left on the draft board for us.  Reality it's his brute athletecism, including the agility you speak of? That explosiveness IMO is worth more than size by a long shot. And he does have skills; a more gifted Horvat? I suppose that is not ''that'' low.  

 

I have two or three observations; he has his head down for a lot of his ''deft'' stickhandling maneuvres.  Nils is pure aggression. Prone quick attacking plays. Often in to traffic, through defenders. Athletic enough many cannot stop him. The truly sublime play makers? Just my opinion of course. Attack when they have strategic position. Curl, slice and meander when they cannot beat someone. Explode in to open space instead, not traffic. Maintain puck possession.

 

Create angles and routes. We see Nils do this sometimes? Hughes, Pettersson, Giroux, Draisaitl, Kucherov, Panarin show that intuition all the time... They have a sense for the opening, the gift of being able to translate touch or power, pass or shot seamlessly.   

 

This has also been Nils track record his whole career?  Exciting but not elite output; www.eliteprospects.com/player/311906/nils-hoglander 

 

Look at William Eklund for example? Very similar in other ways, athletic ability and only slighly larger.  Had 23 pts in 40 SHL games his draft year. Hoglander had 14 points in 50.  The difference is an extra knack for puck possession & play making.

 

 

Absolutely I agree / believe ''gifted'' athletes are more prone to develop new skills.  Better motor skills is better motor skills. Especially tagged to such work ethic! 

 

I dont put it out of his possibilities.  But not everyone, Burrows was an example, learns vision & feel, intuition after their career has started.

 

 

I wonder if some of the stuff regarding finding the open spaces can be teached, as I do believe he has a really good hockey IQ. Eklund did put up a top 5 ever performance by a draft eligible player in the SHL, 14 points in 50 is still really good. I really like Hoglander's wide set of tools which is exemplified by the quotes below, his determination, and his work ethic which I honestly believe is among the top of our team. For these reasons I believe is ceiling is a bit higher than most and could see him become a 60 point winger that gives everything every shift.   

 

"There isn’t a more elusive player in this year’s class than Rögle BK forward Nils Höglander, EPrinkside.com 2019

 

"Hoglander is a dynamic winger who contains a high-octane motor. His pucks-skills are up there with the best in this class, Hockeyprospect.com 2019

 

"His playmaking abilities stand out as he finds his teammates with hard and accurate passes, both from short and long range, Future Considerations 2019

 

"Despite his lack of size, he likes to lay the body out on opponents and has been pretty effective in the physical game, McKeen's Hockey 2019

 

 

 

 

[Putgolzin]

17 hours ago, Canuck Surfer said:

No its not his size.  I am thankful for his size; which saw him left on the draft board for us.  Reality it's his brute athletecism, including the agility you speak of? That explosiveness IMO is worth more than size by a long shot. And he does have skills; a more gifted Horvat? I suppose that is not ''that'' low.  

 

I have two or three observations; he has his head down for a lot of his ''deft'' stickhandling maneuvres.  Nils is pure aggression. Prone quick attacking plays. Often in to traffic, through defenders. Athletic enough many cannot stop him. The truly sublime play makers? Just my opinion of course. Attack when they have strategic position. Curl, slice and meander when they cannot beat someone. Explode in to open space instead, not traffic. Maintain puck possession.

 

Create angles and routes. We see Nils do this sometimes? Hughes, Pettersson, Giroux, Draisaitl, Kucherov, Panarin show that intuition all the time... They have a sense for the opening, the gift of being able to translate touch or power, pass or shot seamlessly.   

 

This has also been Nils track record his whole career?  Exciting but not elite output; www.eliteprospects.com/player/311906/nils-hoglander 

 

Look at William Eklund for example? Very similar in other ways, athletic ability and only slighly larger.  Had 23 pts in 40 SHL games his draft year. Hoglander had 14 points in 50.  The difference is an extra knack for puck possession & play making.

 

 

Absolutely I agree / believe ''gifted'' athletes are more prone to develop new skills.  Better motor skills is better motor skills. Especially tagged to such work ethic! 

 

I dont put it out of his possibilities.  But not everyone, Burrows was an example, learns vision & feel, intuition after their career has started.

 

 

So in trying to understand your "ceiling" - are you simply predicting that he can be a very good Top 6 player, but probably not an elite first line player?

Like almost as good as Boeser, and even better in some aspects, but overall not quite as good?
Cause I'm totally cool with that.

 

[kloubek]

11 minutes ago, nzan said:

So in trying to understand your "ceiling" - are you simply predicting that he can be a very good Top 6 player, but probably not an elite first line player?

Like almost as good as Boeser, and even better in some aspects, but overall not quite as good?
Cause I'm totally cool with that.

 

I know you didn't ask me, but this is exactly where I see Nils settle. I believe he has a lot of skill which should allow him to be an offensive threat regularly, but I don't see *enough* of an overall game to see him as a scoring leader in the NHL. (Happy to be proven wrong). Still, combine that skill with his attitude and work ethic, and I feel he will solidify his place in our top 6 for slightly different reasons than, say, a Pettersson. As much as I want to see him play with Petey, even if he's capable of producing there, I wonder if his style ends up being a better fit for Bo's line given his playing style. Alternatively, maybe Petey's line could use a guy who is so relentless like that....

Regardless, not so bad for a 2nd round pick.