Cap information, misconceptions, Rosters makeup, things you really should know before you post

[spook007]

Just now, Bubble Man said:

Lol, why do people use the Oilers as this grande warning of what happens if you don’t do what Jim Benning is doing. The Oilers have had some terrible management. What’s funny though is Benning is actually following the oilers model closer than you realize. We are in a cap crunch despite being the worst team in the league the last 4 seasons. That’s the GM walk of shame right there. A lottery Cap team. #inbenningwetrust. 

For the same reason you use Penguins or Blackhawks...

Most likely, we are somewhere in the middle, just like the 27 other teams not mentioned.

[Bubble Man]

18 minutes ago, spook007 said:

For the same reason you use Penguins or Blackhawks...

Most likely, we are somewhere in the middle, just like the 27 other teams not mentioned.

I don’t use the penguins or hawks either. I believe the best teams ever built we the 1990-2000’s Devils and Wings. The Devils had a cap before anyone else. They had a brand. They drafted and developed replacements for players that became too expensive. They were a factory always moulding the next waive.  Certain players could only be devils, and thats who they drafted. They had a recipe for chemistry that lasted longer than any team in my lifetime. The wings obviously had no cap but they also built a brand. It didn’t matter who won the cup with what type of team or system the wings stuck with their model and drafted, acquired players that made great Red Wings. The only other team that has consistently had a plan compared to those teams is the preds. They draft and develop defensemen like no other. It hasn’t resulted in a Cup but their model will keep giving them chances. They always hold an abundance of the most valuable currency. 

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, Bubble Man said:

Lol, why do people use the Oilers as this grande warning of what happens if you don’t do what Jim Benning is doing. The Oilers have had some terrible management. What’s funny though is Benning is actually following the oilers model closer than you realize. We are in a cap crunch despite being the worst team in the league the last 4 seasons. That’s the GM walk of shame right there. A lottery Cap team. #inbenningwetrust. 

Leafs, ARI, CAR. Buffalo ...OTT.  Two decades, one decade, one decade and who knows yet,  and decent odds at a quick turn around. 

 

Edit:  the Oilers model is hung up as a warning in every rebuilding GMs office as  the flip side of tanking.....or tanking hard far  left or whatever or at least it should be.  

Edited July 6, 2019 by IBatch

[IBatch]

16 minutes ago, Bubble Man said:

I don’t use the penguins or hawks either. I believe the best teams ever built we the 1990-2000’s Devils and Wings. The Devils had a cap before anyone else. They had a brand. They drafted and developed replacements for players that became too expensive. They were a factory always moulding the next waive.  Certain players could only be devils, and thats who they drafted. They had a recipe for chemistry that lasted longer than any team in my lifetime. The wings obviously had no cap but they also built a brand. It didn’t matter who won the cup with what type of team or system the wings stuck with their model and drafted, acquired players that made great Red Wings. The only other team that has consistently had a plan compared to those teams is the preds. They draft and develop defensemen like no other. It hasn’t resulted in a Cup but their model will keep giving them chances. They always hold an abundance of the most valuable currency. 

Did you mean Trap before anyone else?  Yes they were pretty good but Detroit bought one of their cups and if argue COL was every bit as if not better then Detroit given they beat them more often in the playoffs and Roy beat NJ head to head .... but other then that they were great PRE- CAP teams.   

[aGENT]

20 hours ago, Arrow 1983 said:

4) Boeser could be signed on the first day the season starts. On the first day of the season, The Canucks could have 23 player roster with Roussel on it re-shuffle their whole lineup place Roussel on LTIR and then sign Boeser to fill Roussel spot on the roster. This could be very tricky to do so but it can be done. There is no rule that the injured player has to be replaced by a currently signed player. It will be very interesting to see where Baertschi is at the beginning of training camp with his concussion issue. Roussel and Baer cap hits total, $6.367 million this would make the start of the season signing much easier and then time would determine if trades or other roster movements would have to be made when Roussel comes back or if other injuries could be placed on LTIR. 

 

As this would not allow Boeser to participate in camp/preseason, I'd wager it has a pretty low likelihood of happening FWIW.

 

20 hours ago, vinny_in_vancouver said:

I just usually go with https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/canucks. They are saying that we currently have $5.5M. If Roussel goes on LTIR, we should be able to add $3M more, no? A potential trade of Tanev and Sutter (without getting much salary back) would do wonders to our cap space and allow us to look at remaining FAs such as Ferland and Dzingel.

Bruh, it's right in the OP:

 

1) Roster Max is 23, this is important to note when you are looking at Capfriendly and you post, "we only have $5.5mill in cap space available to sign Boeser, a trade is imminent, (Eriksson, Sutter and Tanev seem to be your guys favorite example) this is not true, Capfriendly is showing currently a 27 man roster they are not predicting which player is making the team.

 

16 hours ago, Cargo said:

So, we’re essentially up cap $&!# creek, hanging on to the paddle by a fingernail. We have a possibility of a convoluted method of getting Boeser signed without losing anyone ahead of time. But eventually we’ll have to clear space, and we’ll have a hell of a time losing the guys we need to lose, (Loui and Sutter.)

See above. We have +/- $4m more in cap space than what Capfriendly is currenty showing.

 

We have cap, even after signing Boeser. Not loads of it, but some. And I can all but guarantee there'll be further moves between now and the TDL moving more cap out.

Edited July 6, 2019 by aGENT

[Googlie]

4 hours ago, Bubble Man said:

I don’t use the penguins or hawks either. I believe the best teams ever built we the 1990-2000’s Devils and Wings. The Devils had a cap before anyone else. They had a brand. They drafted and developed replacements for players that became too expensive. They were a factory always moulding the next waive.  Certain players could only be devils, and thats who they drafted. They had a recipe for chemistry that lasted longer than any team in my lifetime. The wings obviously had no cap but they also built a brand. It didn’t matter who won the cup with what type of team or system the wings stuck with their model and drafted, acquired players that made great Red Wings. The only other team that has consistently had a plan compared to those teams is the preds. They draft and develop defensemen like no other. It hasn’t resulted in a Cup but their model will keep giving them chances. They always hold an abundance of the most valuable currency. 

But they missed out on the most obvious, and best, player who could ever be a Devil ..........

 

Miroslav Satan

[Googlie]

Great sequence of posts, though, Arrow.  Helps us to understand why Management isn't panicking like some of us are !!

[VIC_CITY]

Props to @Arrow 1983. Don't let the children get to you. You're a welcome addition to CDC. Thanks for the thread.

[spur1]

23 minutes ago, Googlie said:

Great sequence of posts, though, Arrow.  Helps us to understand why Management isn't panicking like some of us are !!

I agree. It doesn’t help with the Vancouver press spewing the same crap. I was watching global sports last night and Squire was saying that the Canucks only had 5.5 mil left in cap with Brock yet to sign. 

Lost a lot of respect for Squire. 

[HockeyHarry]

 

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

As this would not allow Boeser to participate in camp/preseason, I'd wager it has a pretty low likelihood of happening FWIW.

 

Bruh, it's right in the OP:

 

1) Roster Max is 23, this is important to note when you are looking at Capfriendly and you post, "we only have $5.5mill in cap space available to sign Boeser, a trade is imminent, (Eriksson, Sutter and Tanev seem to be your guys favorite example) this is not true, Capfriendly is showing currently a 27 man roster they are not predicting which player is making the team.

 

See above. We have +/- $4m more in cap space than what Capfriendly is currenty showing.

 

We have cap, even after signing Boeser. Not loads of it, but some. And I can all but guarantee there'll be further moves between now and the TDL moving more cap out.

Don’t forget teams have an allowance to go over the cap too during the off season, I believe it’s ten percent.   And as per the penalty for going over the cap it means during actual games that the team has to ice whatever that amount is less people.  Worse case is it’s usually one person short.  In the past teams have managed by moving guys that won’t likely get picked up on waivers up and down.   Sometimes losing a guy to waivers is actually a good thing for a deep team looking to remove a roster spot too...

[J.I.A.H.N]

7 hours ago, Bubble Man said:

It’s the truthful ones that hurt the most. If you’re ugly and someone calls you ugly. It hurts a lot more because you know you’re ugly. 

Dear Bubble Man

 

I do not mind you questioning Benning

 

But I wish you would back up your arguments with fact and not insults

 

For example......

 

If you are questioning Beagle a #4 centerman

 

Then show us those UFA's that were available the year that Beagle was signed

show what they signed for (No re-signings that gave team discounts)

then show us where they played aka 3 or 4 line, and for how much

Then compare their production on a team basis, meaning playing on a

good team will produce better results

 

Show us that without the insults...….that would be meaningful, and we would 

appreciate your POV

But try not to fall into the same rabbit hole

when people disagree with you

 

IMPOV you will gain credit with most by doing so

Edited July 6, 2019 by janisahockeynut

[mll]

46 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Don’t forget teams have an allowance to go over the cap too during the off season, I believe it’s ten percent.   And as per the penalty for going over the cap it means during actual games that the team has to ice whatever that amount is less people.  Worse case is it’s usually one person short.  In the past teams have managed by moving guys that won’t likely get picked up on waivers up and down.   Sometimes losing a guy to waivers is actually a good thing for a deep team looking to remove a roster spot too...

 

It's 10% but it's a bit more complex than just adding the cap hits.  In the off-season everyone under contract is back on the main roster - players in the AHL, juniors, abroad etc.  

 

For players on two-way contracts their cap hit is counted pro-rata to the number of days the player was on the NHL roster.  Someone like Hughes is not counted at his full cap hit as he signed only at the end of the season.  Gaudette is also not at his full cap hit as he spent some time in the AHL.  Idem for Demko, Brisebois, Sautner etc.  

 

It doesn't look like CapFriendly shows off-season cap hit it on their website.  They just follow the roster as it was at end of the season and add in new signings.  

 

This off-season cap hit has close to nothing to do with the cap hit for next season.   When calculating cap compliance at the start of the season everyone will be at their full cap hit.  Yet in the off-season someone like Hughes is around some 130K - per CapFriendly he spent 26 days on the roster.  

 

Edited July 6, 2019 by mll

[JeremyCuddles]

22 hours ago, Arrow 1983 said:

Had you written 

 

OP you made a mistake in the line up and showed me where you would come off less like a jerk.

Or just be less sensitive. 

[Bubble Man]

1 hour ago, janisahockeynut said:

Dear Bubble Man

 

I do not mind you questioning Benning

 

But I wish you would back up your arguments with fact and not insults

 

For example......

 

If you are questioning Beagle a #4 centerman

 

Then show us those UFA's that were available the year that Beagle was signed

show what they signed for (No re-signings that gave team discounts)

then show us where they played aka 3 or 4 line, and for how much

Then compare their production on a team basis, meaning playing on a

good team will produce better results

 

Show us that without the insults...….that would be meaningful, and we would 

appreciate your POV

But try not to fall into the same rabbit hole

when people disagree with you

 

IMPOV you will gain credit with most by doing so

Zzzzzzzz

[BlastPast]

10 hours ago, Bubble Man said:

Imagine if Jimtard slept through July first and didn’t overrate his own acquisitions

 

 

 

Oh look, somebody is caught in a money illusion. Probably wonders why you can't buy a candy bar for a quarter anymore.  Loui's deal sucks; Sutter and Baertschi are fine if they're healthy; Gagner isn't on the team anymore and there is a 1 mil. buyout in his place; everybody else is fine considering it's 2019 and the cap is 81.5 and not 2009 with a 57 mil. cap.  

[Bubble Man]

6 hours ago, IBatch said:

Leafs, ARI, CAR. Buffalo ...OTT.  Two decades, one decade, one decade and who knows yet,  and decent odds at a quick turn around. 

 

Edit:  the Oilers model is hung up as a warning in every rebuilding GMs office as  the flip side of tanking.....or tanking hard far  left or whatever or at least it should be.  

The Burke leafs attempted the rebuild on the fly then crashed and burned. I have no idea why OTT was added to that list. They were just in the conference finals and haven’t picked consistently high in the draft since the 90’s

 

it doesn’t matter how you do it. As long as you have a plan and clue. 

[IBatch]

25 minutes ago, Bubble Man said:

The Burke leafs attempted the rebuild on the fly then crashed and burned. I have no idea why OTT was added to that list. They were just in the conference finals and haven’t picked consistently high in the draft since the 90’s

 

it doesn’t matter how you do it. As long as you have a plan and clue. 

Go back and read it again.   Two teams rebuilding for decades etc etc and one having decent odds at a quick rebuild, that being OTT.  When you have something like 100 picks coming your way it helps a lot. 

 

Edit:  I agree it takes a plan and a clue,  OTT somehow landed on their feet after one of the strangest years I’ve ever seen an Org go through.   Duchene could have been Hughes, Byram is still a tough pill to swallow, but CLB got past the first round and they got a first back albeit not as good.   They are also one of the better drafting teams in the league and have been for quite some time...Gems like Stone and hitting a lot better average then us past the second round the past ten years.   If that continues I think they might end up one of the better teams in the East, despite losing EK, Stone, Duchene, Hoffman etc...

Edited July 6, 2019 by IBatch

[Bubble Man]

27 minutes ago, BlastPast said:

Oh look, somebody is caught in a money illusion. Probably wonders why you can't buy a candy bar for a quarter anymore.  Loui's deal sucks; Sutter and Baertschi are fine if they're healthy; Gagner isn't on the team anymore and there is a 1 mil. buyout in his place; everybody else is fine considering it's 2019 and the cap is 81.5 and not 2009 with a 57 mil. cap.  

Am I caught in a money illusion? Or is the guy who handles these contracts? 

[Bubble Man]

3 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Go back and read it again.   Two teams rebuilding for decades etc etc and one having decent odds at a quick rebuild, that being OTT.  When you have something like 100 picks coming your way it helps a lot.  

I’d take 100 picks over Benning’s Free agent frenzies and tradezies