Disturbing Lack Of Under 21's In The Development System

[ItTakesAnArmy]

I was listening tot he game on Center Ice and the commentators were saying the LA has the #2 ranked prospect pool in the league.

I was curious as to how this could happen as they have consistently finished ahead of the Canucks and picked later.

The Canucks have had 7 drafts with Benning and have less than half the prospects in the system that LA does.

 

At this time CapFriendly is showing only 8 Canuck draft picks out of 19 skaters and only one 18 or 19 year old on the Utica roster.

 

LA is showing more than 14 draft picks in the minors and 9 under 20, if under 21 is counted then there are 13 of those. That is quite a difference.

The other item is that there are a lot more undrafted players on the Canuck Utica roster and considering how poorly the Utica team did last year maybe that is one reason the team is suffering, a lower quality of skill in the system.

 

Take away Woo, DiPietro and Gaudette and there is nothing really standing out, at least not a draft pick.

 

Maybe that is another reason for poor performance, all these prospects are being taught different systems. It is when a player acts instead of thinking he starts performing better and this comes from playing the same way over and over again.

 

Why are there not more draft picks in the system?

Edited September 22, 2019 by ItTakesAnArmy

[brownky]

3 minutes ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

one 18 or 19 year old on the Utica roster.

Junior players are not permitted to play in the AHL, even post draft, if they've played.

 

Other top-shelf draft picks of ours are playing overseas. Or go the NCAA route and lose their scholarship if they play pro, so they stay in college.

 

If a team drafts a bucked of foreign players who were not playing in Junior in Canada, they 'can' play in the AHL. Some teams have many foreign picks.

 

Others not so much.

[logic]

Jasek, brisebois, Lind, all looking promising... throw in signings like macewen, rafferty, Teves and the farm looks quite good this year. Pretty cherry picked statistics 

[canuktravella]

3 minutes ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

I was listening tot he game on Center Ice and the commentators were saying the LA has the #2 ranked prospect pool in the league.

I was curious as to how this could happen as they have consistently finished ahead of the Canucks and picked later.

The Canucks have had 7 drafts with Benning and have less than half the prospects in the system that LA does.

 

At this time CapFriendly is showing only 8 Canuck draft picks out of 19 skaters and only one 18 or 19 year old on the Utica roster.

 

LA is showing more than 14 in the minors. That is quite a difference.

The other item is that there are a lot more undrafted players on the Canuck Utica roster and considering how poorly the Utica team did last year maybe that is one reason the team is suffering, a lower quality of skill in the system.

 

Take away Woo, DiPietro and Gaudette and there is nothing really standing out, at least not a draft pick.

 

Maybe that is another reason for poor performance, all these prospects are being taught different systems. It is when a player acts instead of thinking he starts performing better and this comes from playing the same way over and over again.

 

Why are there not more draft picks in the system?

maybe your clueless but  18-19 yr olds we draft are playing in ohl whl college and i  europe  then  come up to utica or nhl so rathbone madden lockwood  utonen hoglander podzolkin keppen dipietro  focht manukan woo  thats 11  decent prospects not on utica yet 

[xereau]

Benning's changing the meta, in spreading out from where the team gains assets.

Who is to say that drafting 18 year olds, with both bodies and minds which are not even close to finished developing, is the best way?

 

A mix of sources, seems a far better plan to me, from the outside looking in.

 

Benning has focussed on signing older and more mature players who can jump into a new core, fabricated from the draft, btw.

 

And this makes it appear we have fewer prospects, if you put an age cap on it.

This is a biased analysis, for the purpose of smearing. Nice try, though.

Edited September 22, 2019 by xereau

[RetroCanuck]

Podkolzin

Hoglander

Juolevi

Woo

DiPietro

Madden

Rathbone

Utunen

 

Are just some of the high quality prospects we will see continue to grow in our system over the next couple years. Quality over quantity

[JM_]

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/canucks/reserve-list

 

 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2019 by Jimmy McGill

[Elias Pettersson]

That stat is very misleading .  First off we literally have two high end elite players under 21 on the roster already in Pettersson and Hughes.  Woo is in junior, Madden and Rathbone are in the NCAA and Utunen is playing overseas.  Podkolzin and Hoglander just got drafted last year and are also both overseas.  Lind, Gadjovich and DiPietro are in Utica.  That's 11 guys right there.  

[ItTakesAnArmy]

8 minutes ago, canuktravella said:

maybe your clueless but  18-19 yr olds we draft are playing in ohl whl college and i  europe  then  come up to utica or nhl so rathbone madden lockwood  utonen hoglander podzolkin keppen dipietro  focht manukan woo  thats 11  decent prospects not on utica yet 

You mean NOT in the system yet. Learning the system that the Canucks play now.

So essentially the team has 8 "prospects" learning 8 different systems.

 

This does not address why are LA's prospects considered so much better and why their system putting so much more into the their team?

 

So far, Utica has produced ? players for the team, 3 over 6 years?

[10pavelbure96]

3 minutes ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

You mean NOT in the system yet. Learning the system that the Canucks play now.

So essentially the team has 8 "prospects" learning 8 different systems.

 

This does not address why are LA's prospects considered so much better and why their system putting so much more into the their team?

 

So far, Utica has produced ? players for the team, 3 over 6 years?

Because players want to stay at their university until they turn pro. Or they aren't AHL eligible so they stay overseas. Or they have a khl contract. 

 

Your reading way too much into it. That centre ice feed was the kings feed. Of course they are going to spew kings kool aid. They finished last in the west last year and they have a hard time getting fans to the arena at best.

[ItTakesAnArmy]

3 minutes ago, xereau said:

Benning's changing the meta, in spreading out from where the team gains assets.

Who is to say that drafting 18 year olds, with both bodies and minds which are not even close to finished developing, is the best way?

 

A mix of sources, seems a far better plan to me, from the outside looking in.

 

Benning has focussed on signing older and more mature players who can jump into a new core, fabricated from the draft, btw.

 

And this makes it appear we have fewer prospects, if you put an age cap on it.

This is a biased analysis, for the purpose of smearing. Nice try, though.

If proof is in the pudding, well this team has not been out performing too many other teams and the only consistency is not something to be awarded.

 

Vancouver fans are great, so apologetic and accepting.

 

Is there not concern that the team NEEDS to trade away draft picks for support players, 2nds, 3rds and now a first overall?

 

What happens IF this team doesn't perform well, where will the players come from that it might need? How long?

 

As far as age goes, there are many teams the Canucks are looking up to that have more youth already as key players, the Canucks have 2 maybe 3 out of 6 drafts?

 

This is only a preseason thread to chat about but if the team feels desperation then who or how many draft picks get dealt, there just is not much depth in Utica.

[Ghostsof1915]

Maybe because we're not having to resort to 18-19 year olds on our team, and they are developing.

 

Besides EP40 is 20. Hughes will be 20 next month. 

 

Lind and Gads, and DiPietro are 20. Silovs and Woo are 19. 

 

As mentioned earlier most of our 18's went back to Europe or Junior. We're going to have to wait 2 more years for Podz contract end. 

 

Is this from the same LA idiots that think Salt Lake City is in Los Angeles? 

 

 

[xereau]

Just now, Ghostsof1915 said:

Maybe because we're not having to resort to 18-19 year olds on our team, and they are developing.

 

Besides EP40 is 20. Hughes will be 20 next month. 

 

Lind and Gads, and DiPietro are 20. Silovs and Woo are 19. 

 

As mentioned earlier most of our 18's went back to Europe or Junior. We're going to have to wait 2 more years for Podz contract end. 

 

Is this from the same LA idiots that think Salt Lake City is in Los Angeles? 

 

 

Its an arbitrary metric, that when applied lets the Benning haters air their agenda.

[MikeBossy]

Perhaps they were quoting this article....

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-farm-system-rankings/

 

LA ranks 2nd but we rank 4th. 

 

I for one am quite happy where we sit.

Edited September 22, 2019 by MikeBossy

[Ghostsof1915]

How about the disturbing over 30 players? 

I mean Eriksson, Beiga, Bachman, I mean only Edler and Jordie Benn are decent!

 

[Elias Pettersson]

10 minutes ago, MikeBossy said:

Perhaps they were quoting this article....

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-farm-system-rankings/

 

LA ranks 2nd but we rank 4th. 

 

I for one am quite happy where we sit.

That article literally says we have one of the top prospects pool in the entire NHL.  SO not sure what the OP is harping about...

 

Despite the graduation of Elias Pettersson, the Vancouver Canucks have one of the best prospect pools in the league. Padded by a solid draft, the Canucks could very well be on the verge of something great. And it is going to be fun to watch.

Quinn Hughes is arguably the best defensive prospect in the NHL (we’ll get to his main challenger shortly). He displayed his elite skill at the end of the season, exciting British Columbia in the process. He’s an elite skater who is an offensive threat with his creativity, shot, and ability to pass.

Hughes is the obvious top prospect right now, but forward Vasili Podkolzin might be right there with him. He has two years left in Russia, but the prospect has elite talent in his game. He’ll run you over and score while doing it.

[canuktravella]

43 minutes ago, ItTakesAnArmy said:

You mean NOT in the system yet. Learning the system that the Canucks play now.

So essentially the team has 8 "prospects" learning 8 different systems.

 

This does not address why are LA's prospects considered so much better and why their system putting so much more into the their team?

 

So far, Utica has produced ? players for the team, 3 over 6 years?

 chl players arent allowed to play in ahl  until they are 20 read the rules its either nhl or chl  so yes  they will learn canuck systems in next two yrs or at prospect camps and training camps   hoglander will sign in van after a yr in swedish elite league this yr. Meanwhile we have a bunch of players developing in utica jasek gad lind 

[Phat Fingers]

1 hour ago, Elias Pettersson said:

That stat is very misleading .  First off we literally have two high end elite players under 21 on the roster already in Pettersson and Hughes.  Woo is in junior, Madden and Rathbone are in the NCAA and Utunen is playing overseas.  Podkolzin and Hoglander just got drafted last year and are also both overseas.  Lind, Gadjovich and DiPietro are in Utica.  That's 11 guys right there.  

Exactly.  

 

Looking at our NHL club, lots of guys under 25 playing significant roles on the nucks vs LA.  

 

Think we are doing fine and have a highly rated prospect pool.  

 

[VancouverHabitant]

@ItTakesAnArmy When they do prospect pools, they don't count guys like Elias who's only 20, and then you have tons of good players on our roster who are 23 and 24 in Bo, Jake and Brock.  

 

I wouldn't worry about the Canucks not being #1, the important thing is to be in the top 10 for a few years in a row.  Players that count for the prospect pool list come and go within 2 years, so it's very transitional.  

 

If our overseas players keep improving... Woo, Madden, Rathbone and Lockwood have another strong year... then we'll be in the top 10 again next year, and we don't even need to hit on all those previous points. 

 

Sidenote: LA Kings were ranked 24th last year on their prospect pool.  So you'll probably see the Kings really suck for another year or two before their young players make their way up.  

[WeneedLumme]

Whining because most of the Canucks best young prospects are playing in Europe, the NCAA or have already made the Canucks roster, rather than all playing in Utica, seems to be unreasonable to the point of being dishonest.