[Discussion] How is Eriksson Not Waived?

[VegasCanuck]

16 minutes ago, Provost said:

You don’t have to play him down there.  Just make him practice and ride the busses until he quits.

 

As for what damage he is doing sitting in the press box up here...

 

I would argue he is doing damage by being here.

 

1.  It puts a lie to the “if you earn a spot we will make room for you”.  He hasn’t earned his spot and other players have.

 

2.  Motivation for our young guys in Utica.  All those guys care about is a shot to be in the Bigs, waiting for a call up.  There are a handful of guys that should have that short term call up as a carrot for performance... Goldobin, Boucher, Lind, MacEwan, Gaudette, Graovac, Baertschi, Perron, Jasek, Bailey, etc.  Even if it is just a few days to practice with the big club and get a taste.  Eriksson is a block to that.

 

 

 

Not discounting your position by the way, I don't necessarily disagree with you, its just a fine line.

 

Some of thosse guys that you mentioned, Jasek, Bailey, Lind etc, need more time playing big minutes at the AHL level.

[189lb enforcers?]

Optics and politics?

 

That’s all I can think of. 

 

Why is Sven still here? 

 

 

Also, here comes the IR parade. I’m shocked they have had good health for this long already. 

Sutter, Tanev, Edler, Beagle and most likely one of Brock or EP, judging by how often they are being checked. 

 

[Tystick]

My view of the situation is this is more of long term issue.

- We can't buy him out, there's very little cap relief.

- We can send him down, but that's 5mil in Utica.

 

Next year, his contract requires him to submit a 15 team 'no trade list', since his NTC changes to a modified-NTC.

 

Benning wants to trade him, so he needs to get games at some point and build some sort of value.

Unfortunately, we will probably have to package the guy with a prospect just to dump his contract.

Probably Benning's worst FA signing, but it's not like anyone could have predicted such a immediate, drastic decline.

Is what it is, we need to cut our losses since the cap relief is more valuable at this point.

[King Heffy]

36 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

I agree that he shouldn't be playing.

 

I don't necessarily agree that Utica is the best place for him. He ties up a roster spot down there, and we can work around our cap issues with him up here.

 

If you send him to Utica, the argument is, that you're playing him, at times in place of a young player that you want getting good, valuable ice time.

 

Sitting in the Vancouver press box, he's not really hurting us, one way or another, outside of salary.

 

Best solution to him I've heard yet, is to make a deal with Los Angeles for a trade of bad contracts. Eriksson for Kovalchuk. If we could do something like that, although I think Kovalchuk would take over Loui's place in the penalty box, he has one less year left on his contract.

Just because he's in Utica doesn't mean we have to let him play.

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Optics and politics?

Honestly doubt it has little/anything to do with it. We've seen the Canucks waive salary. We've seen other teams waive salary (as recently as Ladd/Schneider). 

 

He's simply a warm, NHL capable body while we had A- early season lineup questions B- injuries.

 

As those two things resolve, I have little doubt he gets demoted barring further injuries allowing him to stay up. There's simply no room with Gaudette forcing his way on the team and a couple of Roussel, Motte, Ferland or Sutter returning.

 

All this fretting = much ado about nothing.

Edited November 22, 2019 by aGENT

[189lb enforcers?]

15 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Honestly doubt it has little/anything to do with it. We've seen the Canucks waive salary. We've seen other teams waive salary (as recently as Ladd/Schneider). 

 

He's simply a warm, NHL capable body while we had A- early season lineup questions B- injuries.

 

As those two things resolve, I have little doubt he gets demoted barring further injuries allowing him to stay up. There's simply no room with Gaudette forcing his way on the team and a couple of Roussel, Motte, Ferland or Sutter returning.

Sure, I get this, but it’s a hypothetical as well. 

 

The Canucks could pull off AHL trades to solve for depth issues for NHL recall duty. 

Warm bodies don’t have to be expensive ones. LE has long been a dud.

 

IMO, politics is more likely the reason LE isn’t in the A right now.

 

As Zack showed last night, there other better options for checking duty, than LE, not that Zack was all that great out of his opening shift, mind you. 

 

All season, Ive assumed that LE was being dressed and fattened up for optics of trade value. As a serviceable NHLer, he’s worth something, but as a middling AHLer, he’s not worth anything. 

 

Then there’s the aspect of UFA scarecrow optics and the politics behind the scenes. Benning has been even more of a loyalist to ‘his’ guys than Quinn was. Jake and the LE signing are quick examples, but others have said more on this than you or I will. 

 

I don’t disagree with you as much as I sense that LE was a failed asset recovery program this season. Why he’s still travelling with the Canucks has as much or more to do with politics of his contract than it does with anything else. He’s not even a fit in Utica, I mean.

 

LE is in no man’s land and that’s on the GM to remedy. Doing nothing might be Benning’s best move, we won’t ever really know one way or another, so I don’t pretend to know. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by 189lb enforcers?

[Quantum]

Rumor has it that Aquaman was very unhappy when the Canucks waived Gagner last year. He didn't like having so much money sitting around in Utica. And with the amount Eriksson is still owed, one more year as the extra forward may be what its store. Do I like it? No. Will it happen? Most likely.

 

That said, with guys like Corey Schneider, Andrew Ladd, and Karl Alzner now in the AHL with big contracts, there is precedent to send guys down. Loui also doesn't have his NMC anymore so he can't veto the move if it's pushed upon him.

 

Loui probably gets send down starting next year, realistically. He's still a good 13th forward (despite his pay cheque) and still plays a strong defensive game. I'd rather have him riding the pine in Vancouver over a guy like Zach MacEwen or Adam Gaudette, those guys need to play. Until there's too many guys pushing for full time spots, Loui likely spends his days as a member of the Canucks over the Comets.

 

Also... when Loui does get sent down, I suspect he'll be loaned to either the San Antonio Rampage or Texas Stars to be closer to his family who are apparently living in Texas. Not sure where in Texas but apparently, they're in Texas.

 

But yeah, now there's NHL precedent to send this contracts down to the AHL so it's probably a matter of time now...

[Alflives]

30 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said:

Even for a super-homer, you have quite the fantasy life for the Canucks...

 

It didn't happen this season like you thought it would and it won't happen next season either.  4 million dollars is a lot of money.

Could very well be, but why is LE not in Utica already?  

[JM_]

1 hour ago, -AJ- said:

I probably suspect that Green still sees more value in him that most fans and wants him around as a 13th forward for now. However, if we ever get a completely healthy forward group, I'd say he's in big danger of finally being waived since Gaudette is now playing far too well to go back to Utica.

^ this. Its not rocket surgery.

 

We haven't been healthy enough yet to waive Loui, and they didn't want to rush AG, which was smart imo. Now we know, AGs a spark plug and Roussel is set to come back any day now. 

 

 

[iceman64]

1 hour ago, Provost said:

I fully expected to see Eriksson on waivers today and sent to the farm.

 

I am not sure honestly what any argument against it could be at this point.

 

He isn’t penalty killing, he isn’t good defensively, he isn’t doing “the little things” right, he isn’t putting in the effort, he isn’t an option to fill in the top six during injuries, he no longer has the trust of his coach (look at his minutes when he is in the lineup).

 

When you are outplayed by a fringe guy like Graovac... you are done.

Maybe he retires rather than reporting to Utica, maybe not... but it should be tried.  It is startling how different the success of the entire team hinges on all four lines pushing the pace.  When we have lost that from our 4th line, suddenly the top two lines start faltering as well... maybe because they are focussed on more.

 

Sorry for a bit of a rant, but to me it is really inconceivable that the team hasn’t played hardball yet with this player.

 

Does anyone have an argument FOR Eriksson remaining now?  Mentoring Petterson doesn’t fly for me to keep a valuable roster spot... especially with the impending return of Roussel 

 

Pretty sure he got given another shot to shine and maybe his stock will interest someone but I hope TG has finally realized that's not going to happen, especially after a player gets sent down and usually comes back with a spark but not him.. he's sooooo done if he can't do that and he didn't so TG needs to move people around on lines and shuffle in Big Mac.. I'm ok with Mr Gray but rather see Big Mac instead.. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by iceman64

[VegasCanuck]

17 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Just because he's in Utica doesn't mean we have to let him play.

That is also true

[SabreFan1]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Could very well be, but why is LE not in Utica already?  

Salary, development, and injury considerations.

 

If and when injuries subside and Benning decides that the players in development are ready to be promoted, they'll relocate LE to either Utica or any other AHL/overseas club that will take him on loan.  Until then he's a stopgap extra forward who is wildly overpaid.

 

If Okposo didn't provide badly needed locker room leadership in Buffalo, he'd be in the same boat as LE.

[iceman64]

31 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Optics and politics?

 

That’s all I can think of. 

 

Why is Sven still here? 

 

 

Also, here comes the IR parade. I’m shocked they have had good health for this long already. 

Sutter, Tanev, Edler, Beagle and most likely one of Brock or EP, judging by how often they are being checked. 

 

Did you see Petey's goal fed by stetcher? A guy tried to knock Petey down and just bounced off him instead, I watched the vid about 3 times in disbelief but his weight gain and training sure worked.. 

Edited November 22, 2019 by iceman64

[Nucker 67]

Ferland is skating, Roussel is recovering and practicing. If they send Gaudette down to fit Loui in up here, I will just shake my head in confusion. Baertschi also needs to go back to Utica, he isn't very effective.  

[Alflives]

Just now, SabreFan1 said:

Salary, development, and injury considerations.

 

If and when injuries subside and Benning decides that the players in development are ready to be promoted, they'll relocate LE to either Utica or any other AHL/overseas club that will take him on loan.  Until then he's a stopgap extra forward who is wildly overpaid.

 

If Okposo didn't provide badly needed locker room leadership in Buffalo, he'd be in the same boat as LE.

If LE is sent to Utica this season, then I'm wrong with my assumption.  However, it LE continues with the big club, then I'm expecting a formal retirement announcement after his July 2020 bonus.  

[Alflives]

Just now, NUCKER67 said:

Ferland is skating, Roussel is recovering and practicing. If they send Gaudette down to fit Loui in up here, I will just shake my head in confusion. Baertschi also needs to go back to Utica, he isn't very effective.  

The longer LE stays with the Big club, the more likely my suggestion of the gentleman's agreement suggested earlier is in place.  

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Sure, I get this, but it’s a hypothetical as well. 

 

The Canucks could pull off AHL trades to solve for depth issues for NHL recall duty. 

Warm bodies don’t have to be expensive ones. LE has long been a dud.

 

IMO, politics is more likely the reason LE isn’t in the A right now.

 

As Zack showed last night, there other better options for checking duty, than LE, not that Zack was all that great out of his opening shift, mind you. 

 

All season, Ive assumed that LE was being dressed and flattened up for optics of trade value. As a serviceable NHLer, he’s worth something, but as a middling AHLer, he’s not worth anything. 

 

Then there’s the aspect of UFA scarecrow optics and the politics behind the scenes. Benning has been even more of a loyalist to ‘his’ guys than Quinn was. Jake and the LE signing are quick examples, but others have said more on this than you or I will. 

 

I don’t disagree with you as much as I sense that LE was a failed asset recovery program this season. Why he’s still travelling with the Canucks has as much or more to do with politics of his contract than it does with anything else. He’s not even a fit in Utica, I mean.

 

LE is in no man’s land and that’s on the JM to remedy. Doing nothing might be Benning’s best move, we won’t ever really know one way or another, so I don’t pretend to know. 

I don't think there's any mystery to other NHL teams of exactly what Eriksson 'is' at this point. AHL, NHL, sitting at home etc...don't think any of it particularly matters.

 

You're right, there was probably some hope that with those early season lineup questions and injuries, he might play himself in to SOME sort of trade value with spot duty, but at this point, all we're going to get back for him (without adding major assets) ...is another 'Eriksson'.

 

I think Benning would jump at that if he could get another player with a more bottom 6 friendly skill set and/or a guy with even a year (or two) less term (without adding too much). But I think it's pretty clear that's a bit like looking for a pin sized unicorn in a haystack.

 

At this point, he's warm body with injuries, that we can waive without any fear that's just 'there' sucking up cap space, and will likely continue to until at LEAST his bonus next summer (if not until his contract terminates). 

 

[SabreFan1]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

If LE is sent to Utica this season, then I'm wrong with my assumption.  However, it LE continues with the big club, then I'm expecting a formal retirement announcement after his July 2020 bonus.  

If he finishes the year in Vancouver it's because either Green has a strange love for him or injuries will have kept him up.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

If LE is sent to Utica this season, then I'm wrong with my assumption.  However, it LE continues with the big club, then I'm expecting a formal retirement announcement after his July 2020 bonus.  

dont do this to yourself Alf. 

[JM_]

12 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

LE is in no man’s land and that’s on the GM to remedy. Doing nothing might be Benning’s best move, we won’t ever really know one way or another, so I don’t pretend to know. 

I guess one small bit of this might be once he's waived then he's of no value to anyone. We don't know if Jim has an offer on the table for say Loui+a good prospect that Jim hasn't wanted to pull the trigger on quite yet until he see's how some of the other kids are developing. If we can move a prospect from an area of excess strength then maybe thats what Jim is waiting for. Slim chance but maybe.

 

I doubt the team spends nearly as much time as we all do thinking about it. If Roussel, Sutter and Ferland are all in game shape Loui's not gong to be with the club, particularly if the team has created a bit of separation in the standings and the seats at Rogers stay full.