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2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I like what I see in the 'yutes these days. I don't think companies like you tube have a future screwing them over. 

They're already interfering with and manipulating elections/political process. In my world, that = 'too far'.

Edited by aGENT
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54 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Given the track records of corporations/wall street putting profit margins ahead of long term economic stability and bilking tax payers to pay for their gambling and profit schemes (2008 says hi), not to mention government complacency (and complicity) in all of it... forgive me for my lack of faith on their ability to promptly or properly prepare for this impending disaster.

 

Just look at how that establishment is fighting those very things with the Democratic candidates.

 

There's some very rich people who don't give two $&!#s that countries will tear themselves to shreds if it means they 'win' their game of profits over people. 

 

Here's hoping leveler heads prevail....

I have  a couple of companies in my business life and yes I was very concerned about profits and profit margins. They were what kept the company in the black. At no time did I think I was screwing my customers. I kept +20 workers employed for many years. I am sure there are some real a holes out there but the vast majority are good people.  The market is supposed to punish those companies who make mistakes or make ill advised ‘gambles’. That didn’t happen in ‘08 because governments stepped in. They stepped in because the potential job losses. Disruption is a bitch. 

 

You are blaming greedy corporations and greedy rich guys. Some of that is true but how about adding governments who continue to print money and reduce the buying power of the public. If you think taxation of the rich will solve this crisis then let’s do it and commit to doing it within a balanced budget. Anything less is just more BS and a ploy to move more of the economy to government ownership. To me the income disparity is not in the future but right now. Balanced budgets are not embraced by any major parties because they cannot deal with the fallout. For that matter most people can’t deal with it either. Most people don’t write up budgets for their own households. They are played by every politician they vote for. 

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1 minute ago, Boudrias said:

I have  a couple of companies in my business life and yes I was very concerned about profits and profit margins. They were what kept the company in the black. At no time did I think I was screwing my customers. I kept +20 workers employed for many years. I am sure there are some real a holes out there but the vast majority are good people.  The market is supposed to punish those companies who make mistakes or make ill advised ‘gambles’. That didn’t happen in ‘08 because governments stepped in. They stepped in because the potential job losses. Disruption is a bitch. 

 

You are blaming greedy corporations and greedy rich guys. Some of that is true but how about adding governments who continue to print money and reduce the buying power of the public. If you think taxation of the rich will solve this crisis then let’s do it and commit to doing it within a balanced budget. Anything less is just more BS and a ploy to move more of the economy to government ownership. To me the income disparity is not in the future but right now. Balanced budgets are not embraced by any major parties because they cannot deal with the fallout. For that matter most people can’t deal with it either. Most people don’t write up budgets for their own households. They are played by every politician they vote for. 

No offense, but we're not talking about you and you 20 person corporation. You're (private, small businesses) not the problem I'm referring to.

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1 hour ago, aGENT said:

I'm not especially concerned about 'communism' per se. I'm concerned about the extreme left wing nonsense, ideology, identity groups etc and tactics emanating out of our post secondary schools that is attacking freedom of speech in particular and increasingly infecting corporations and society at large.

 

Have you been keeping up with the upcoming 'terms of service' changes on Youtube for example? We'll see what happens but it sure looks an awful lot like they plan on banning and deleting any uploads they don't agree with or happen to like. Including retroactively anything that was previously 'fine' under the existing TOS agreement. That's some shady-ass BS.

 

And this is after Google blocking Tulsi Gabbard a few months ago with no reason or explanation. They're increasingly trying to control the information and 'message' you and I get and silencing anyone they don't happen to agree with including interfering with elections. 

 

People should be VERY concerned.

Not enough ability to plus this more.

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1 hour ago, aGENT said:

They're already interfering with and manipulating elections/political process. In my world, that = 'too far'.

oh yeah? show me an election where the media hasn't been too involved.

 

“There was a deep sense of danger and peril at the time,” says Terri Halperin, author of The Alien and Sedition Acts of 1798. The Federalists, Adams among them, were concerned that immigrants with radical politics from France, Ireland, as well as England and Scotland, working in the printing business would spread seeds of discord that would upset the stability of the union.

“[The French] didn’t just attack and invade countries, they also tried to start a collapse from within by befriending and tricking others who would separate the people from their government,” says Halperin. “That’s where the danger from the newspapers come from.”

The influential Federalist paper Porcupine's Gazette, edited by William Cobbett, urged the government to "regenerate" the press. "Unless opposition newspapers were dealt with immediately," Cobbett wrote, according to historian James Morton Smith, "a set of villainous Republican editors, 'most unquestionably in the pay of France,' would continue to distribute their corroding poison throughout the Union.”


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/age-old-problem-fake-news-180968945/

 

 

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50 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

oh yeah? show me an election where the media hasn't been too involved.

 

“There was a deep sense of danger and peril at the time,” says Terri Halperin, author of The Alien and Sedition Acts of 1798. The Federalists, Adams among them, were concerned that immigrants with radical politics from France, Ireland, as well as England and Scotland, working in the printing business would spread seeds of discord that would upset the stability of the union.

“[The French] didn’t just attack and invade countries, they also tried to start a collapse from within by befriending and tricking others who would separate the people from their government,” says Halperin. “That’s where the danger from the newspapers come from.”

The influential Federalist paper Porcupine's Gazette, edited by William Cobbett, urged the government to "regenerate" the press. "Unless opposition newspapers were dealt with immediately," Cobbett wrote, according to historian James Morton Smith, "a set of villainous Republican editors, 'most unquestionably in the pay of France,' would continue to distribute their corroding poison throughout the Union.”


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/age-old-problem-fake-news-180968945/

 

 

I never said media has never been an issue. That's entirely missing the point and frankly I expect better from you Jimmy than: 'Well, they've done it before'. That doesn't make it right. They also weren't actively shutting down free speech and censoring people. They were in fact participating in it.

 

And I think it's safe to say that Google and Youtube have a touch more power and influence than a French newspaper.

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19 minutes ago, aGENT said:

I never said media has never been an issue. That's entirely missing the point and frankly I expect better from you Jimmy than: 'Well, they've done it before'. That doesn't make it right. They also weren't actively shutting down free speech and censoring people. They were in fact participating in it.

 

And I think it's safe to say that Google and Youtube have a touch more power and influence than a French newspaper.

I just don't think meddling is anything new. I also think young people are smart and can see through it. Its the boomers that I worry about, they seem to fall for it harder. 

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3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I just don't think meddling is anything new. I also think young people are smart and can see through it. Its the boomers that I worry about, they seem to fall for it harder. 

Meddling at this scale is entirely new.

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22 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Meddling at this scale is entirely new.

i dont worry about the bs or meddling part, its not new. What is a bit new is the amount of people who know its bs and still vote in a guy like Trump anyway. We're in a post-truth world at the moment, at least for voters over 40. That part scares me a lot more than attempts at meddling. 

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17 hours ago, aGENT said:

No offense, but we're not talking about you and you 20 person corporation. You're (private, small businesses) not the problem I'm referring to.

Whether my small business or a Corp with 1 million employees if you do not tax within a balanced budget you are fundamentally misleading citizens. Taxation has a major impact on the economy. Balanced budgets force hard decisions. Realistic decisions. Politicians love deficits because it allows them to string a line of BS that lacks accountability. All political stripes do this. People have to realize that unbalanced budgets and money printing destroys their buying power. Companies have to reflect costs, including taxation, in their pricing. They cannot exist otherwise. 

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On 12/11/2019 at 9:07 AM, aGENT said:

Something's got to happen. And frankly governments are not doing nearly enough to bridge us over that transition IMO. 

Government is always 3 steps behind, you can't bet or hope on them to fix or help you until its the brink of the end.

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1 hour ago, Boudrias said:

Whether my small business or a Corp with 1 million employees if you do not tax within a balanced budget you are fundamentally misleading citizens. Taxation has a major impact on the economy. Balanced budgets force hard decisions. Realistic decisions. Politicians love deficits because it allows them to string a line of BS that lacks accountability. All political stripes do this. People have to realize that unbalanced budgets and money printing destroys their buying power. Companies have to reflect costs, including taxation, in their pricing. They cannot exist otherwise. 

Sure... But nobody is arguing that. You're having an argument with nobody.

 

And FYI, the large corporations we're talking about being the problem, don't buy in large, pay taxes.

 

That's part of the problem.

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13 minutes ago, Russ said:

Government is always 3 steps behind, you can't bet or hope on them to fix or help you until its the brink of the end.

Governments do what an educated and informed populace tell them to do, or they don't get votes.

 

It's voters that are three steps behind.

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18 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

i dont worry about the bs or meddling part, its not new. What is a bit new is the amount of people who know its bs and still vote in a guy like Trump anyway. We're in a post-truth world at the moment, at least for voters over 40. That part scares me a lot more than attempts at meddling. 

Are you at all concerned about the millions of people over 40 who voted for Hillary?  :shock:

 

Sorry, I can't let this BS comment go unchallenged.

 

Post-truth world for voters over 40... what a load of crap.  It is so precious how the lies that help the Dems are consistently overlooked, but everything that Trump says is put under the microscope.

 

The reason you aren't worried about the meddling is because you support the message, and you are perfectly happy to have young people brought up not to question that message.  If you were really concerned about the truth, and the wrongdoings of our leaders, you would take the political bias out of the equation.  But nope.  The media doesn't care about Hillary's and Biden's corruption, but hot damn we gotta try and nail Trump on the thinnest of evidence.  If Trump's wrongdoings were so clearly illegal, the charges would have been solid from the get-go.  Yet the message kept changing.  I sure hope Trump doesn't have any unpaid library fines from his school days... more ammunition!!!

 

At least people over 40 can choose between Fox News and CNN, even check out both, and make their own decisions.  Those yutes who get their fine, unbiased political news from influencers on Youtube, John Oliver and Jimmy Kimmel are just so well informed! :rolleyes:

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9 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Are you at all concerned about the millions of people over 40 who voted for Hillary?  :shock:

 

Sorry, I can't let this BS comment go unchallenged.

 

Post-truth world for voters over 40... what a load of crap.  It is so precious how the lies that help the Dems are consistently overlooked, but everything that Trump says is put under the microscope.

 

The reason you aren't worried about the meddling is because you support the message, and you are perfectly happy to have young people brought up not to question that message.  If you were really concerned about the truth, and the wrongdoings of our leaders, you would take the political bias out of the equation.  But nope.  The media doesn't care about Hillary's and Biden's corruption, but hot damn we gotta try and nail Trump on the thinnest of evidence.  If Trump's wrongdoings were so clearly illegal, the charges would have been solid from the get-go.  Yet the message kept changing.  I sure hope Trump doesn't have any unpaid library fines from his school days... more ammunition!!!

 

At least people over 40 can choose between Fox News and CNN, even check out both, and make their own decisions.  Those yutes who get their fine, unbiased political news from influencers on Youtube, John Oliver and Jimmy Kimmel are just so well informed! :rolleyes:

nice freak out. Oh and please tell me more about what I'm perfectly happy to see happen, that stuff is gold. 

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13 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

nice freak out. Oh and please tell me more about what I'm perfectly happy to see happen, that stuff is gold. 

Sorry, I was influenced by your earlier conjecture and gave one of my own... that was wrong. 

 

Guess I'll be left to wondering whether you cared about those who willingly overlooked Hillary's wrongdoings and hypocrisy.  Maybe the real crime is how it harmed her candidacy.

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10 minutes ago, Kragar said:

Sorry, I was influenced by your earlier conjecture and gave one of my own... that was wrong. 

 

Guess I'll be left to wondering whether you cared about those who willingly overlooked Hillary's wrongdoings and hypocrisy.  Maybe the real crime is how it harmed her candidacy.

On the idea of kids being influenced - young voters like Bernie, a big part of his appeal to them is the fact that he's been fighting his fight his entire life, he didn't try to put on an act just to please them, like Clinton tried to do, which was met with a lot of criticism by young voters. Thats why I don't worry about them, the saw right through Clintons bs.

 

No one overlooked Clintons hypocrisy. She was just a better choice for most voters given how much of a buffoon and creep Trump is. The US needs a 3rd party choice, otherwise its just going to be more hold your nose type choices going forward. 

 

For the record, I personally think Biden is a terrible choice. 

 

And yes imo the over 40 crowd is much more in the post-truth line of thinking and far more tribal than millennial voters. 

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