[PGT] Montreal Canadiens at Vancouver Canucks | Dec. 17, 2019

[IBatch]

49 minutes ago, Rick_theRyper said:

Idk I think the end game stats and Markys play have made us look more evenly matched through these last two months when in truth we are drastically out played during whole periods and manage to come back to make it a close game isn’t really playing well. We’re very very lucky to have two good goalies or we’d be loosing by a lot more than a goal or two in most of these games. Lots I believe would be over during our slow 1st period starts. How many times have we heard Shorthouse say “ Canucks haven’t had a shot on net since... in the (blank) period” that’s becoming a trend the last two months, can’t reall say the games are that close when Marky is the only reason it is close at all. Zero shots in ten mins of hockey isn’t acceptable. Sooner or later you gotta demand better than that 

These are for the most part close games where either team could win.   Other goalies (the other team) have more then equalized Markstroms play - and a few we've lost because he was average or worse (which under the circumstances is more then understandable) same goes for Demko.   I don't buy that goaltending has been a difference maker for us - it's been mediocre - middle of the road what you hope to get from your number one most nights.   Not elite.  We definitely out changed SJ as well as outplayed them - last night it could have gone either way but the better goalie prevailed.

 

Do we need a coaching change?  I'm not sure (yet).   Maybe later if we keep playing "the right way" and no dividends or results.

 

Markstrom has won us a few games for sure - and he's also lost us a few games for sure - id call it a wash.   Keumper on the other hand is the main reason ARI is doing so well.   As far as no shots .... well in the end it usually works itself out - and a lot of other teams have to same in game issues including ones with better records.   Let me ask you this - do your think we are a better team then last year?  I definitely do.   Some games we score five some we score one - almost every game it's a one goal game before the goalie is pulled either way.   This team is better and very close to turning the corner - if we are healthy enough that would work - same as just a little bit better overall.  

[Nucker 67]

3 minutes ago, apollo said:

I'm pretty sure Edler is this teams most valuable player. 

They're definitely worse without him. Ferland as well, they're a better team with him in the lineup. Maybe they play with more confidence?  I think they're leaning on Hughes too much, just enough that he doesn't break, but that's not fair. What the he** is Stecher good for? Sure he tries real hard, but this isn't a trying league. Isn't he su[pposed to be an offensive Dman? How many goals does he have this year? Only 2. In fact, 8 NHL goals total in his career (3.5 years). Unacceptable.    

[Ballisticsports.]

1 hour ago, Rick_theRyper said:

Glad that the play of the Canucks is no longer being seen as a bad game or two. It’s creeping on a bad two months. Either way something needs to change, with Green here or not. The player we have can do better than this and I for one would hate to see nothing change and let it slide till April. Write off another year? Terrible idea, as that would create a very poor loosing environment for our young up and coming. Can’t have change when they’re achievements are acceptable so for this I glad it’s hit a point where something might happen. Although can’t keep hitting rock bottom and not change coaching staff at all. Last kick at the can for sure for someone behind the bench. Let’s just hope there is a change in attitudes in the coach and players enough “ we played good..but” that’s just not true anymore. Maybe 5 good games in the last 20 isn’t playing well. If I’m JB and FA I call for a change in attitude at least and now! Before I start chopping heads.

JB and TG must have convinced FA that he needed to extend the coaches contracts instead of seeing how the season played out

How and when is FA going to respond to extending these contracts and spending big money on expensive bottom liners or AHL'ers and getting the same results each year?

A lot of fans patience being tried, what about the man cutting the cheques?

[appleboy]

7 hours ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

Canucks record after 35 games:

 

2017-18: 15-16-4
2018-19: 15-16-4
2019-20: 16-15-4

This says it all. 

I however think the club is getting better each year. It is not showing in the standings at this moment and may not see a big turnaround this year.  The ship is going in the right direction and we will see the results in time .  Maybe another good draft this year.

 

Hughes is going to be a star.

[Toyotasfan]

37 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

I don't get why they can't beat the Habs, it's not like they're great or anything. I wonder if it's just in their psyche, that it's the storied Montreal Canadiens in town, half the building is chanting Go Habs Go, and the Canucks have apparently lost like 8 or 9 in a row against the Canadiens. 

 

Playoffs?! How 'bout they win a game? 

Montreal was running a pick all night on our forecheck. We did our dump in while one of their defenceman angled our forecheck to the sideboards their other defenceman had lots of time to make a play. It never got called even though it is interference. It really neutralized our dump and chase. They must’ve watched a video.

[Trebreh]

Green interview coming right now on 650. 

[Roger Neilsons Towel]

8 hours ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

Canucks record after 35 games:

 

2017-18: 15-16-4
2018-19: 15-16-4
2019-20: 16-15-4

Well... at least we’re consistent... 

[riffraff]

4 hours ago, DIBdaQUIB said:

You have to  be a team that is fast and heaby on the forecheck,  that wins most of the puck battles to play dump and chase effectively.  That does not describe the canucks.

This.

 

unless you’re belt like the kings the year they won it all, dump and chase has no place at the nhl level.

[riffraff]

1 hour ago, RUPERTKBD said:

I think it comes down to what people believe constitutes a "strategy". The example that was posted about Miller talking to Brock and Petey about the dump and chase really comes down to more of a "don't do anything stupid" suggestion. It doesn't take a Scotty Bowman to realize that keeping the puck in your possession is always going to be preferable when entering the offensive zone. However, doing so when there is a high risk of losing possession is a poor "strategy".

 

In the end, it's all about making the smart play at the time. Sometimes the smart play is "dump it in".

Describe what is high risk of losing possession upon ozone entry.  If there is high risk of losing possession upon crossing the line then QH needs more help.

 

 

[-DLC-]

At work, had to answer the phone but the gist of Travis Green's interview (most will hate it...I love it...bits and pieces because I AM working boss):

 

Tough stretch, losing more than winning since Oct. ... do you feel like there could be bounces coming your way:   Yes, I do...important that you're honest with the group...have had a few good meetings, talked about Vegas game, we weren't good at all.  In October we'd probably win those past few games that were lost.  

 

Can't make wholesale changes.

 

Confidence important - team has a good grasp of things...Petey played well against Vegas.  Important to talk about individual game as well as team game to keep confidence up.

 

Montreal game - didn't want to give up too many chances...had 39 shots.  

 

When we're winning our game it's a territorial game - in their zone, more shots, people around the net, giving up less chances.

 

Injuries - guys who've been out and are trying to find their game...takes time.  Missing Edler - asking others to fill in for him is a lot.

 

"Grind time of year" is how they refer to this stretch - young players might not be used to the grind (tomorrow 5 games in 8 days)...talked to Quinn...hasn't played this much hockey and he's being asked to do a lot.  Have to live with the moments where he's not as sharp..make sure his confidence is intact.

 

Gaudette:  can't help but like him...works hard, takes in information and applies it to his game.  Scratched and clawed and it's hard to take him out of the line up.

 

Some bright spots so far:  Quinn and where he'll be down the road.  Petey, Bo, Boes..Jake's finding his game and progressing.

 

Surprised by constant temperature check in Canadian market?  Internal pressure?  - Not really.  You want to be in the Cdn market....passion people have.  Better than being in a place where they don't care.

 

Goal:  want to make playoffs this year.  Future is so bright and the city feels it...buzz in the town.   Losing obviously hurts.

 

What is the reality versus expectations of this team? - Likes where we're at.  13th in goals for.  14th goals against.  Wanted to score more and get scored on less and it's heading that way.  Could've easily won 2 or 3 recent losses. 

 

You played almost a thousand games on different levels of teams...what do you use from that to impart as knowledge?:  Played on teams that weren't very good...had to play at 90% to win....in Toronto, didn't have to play so well but still could win.  JT talks about that.   

 

Is the difference at times confidence...hesitancy?  The group is still fairly confident.  Some nights the ice isn't so good and it looks like they're not confident.  Petey's still feeling good and is playing well.  Quinn too. 

 

Love the way we played the last two periods - and there's another team at the other end of the rink that also factors in.

 

Jim is always working the phones...with difficulty in recruiting help, does it have to come from within?  (had to answer the phone, dammit)  Don't have to make a trade but in constant communication.....didn't say team isn't good enough to win.  Keep working with them....this group is capable of winning.

 

Optimistic...he isn't panicking and seems focused on making sure the guys are still confident and understand to keep at it..."close".

 

 

[canuck2288]

9 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

At work, had to answer the phone but the gist of Travis Green's interview (most will hate it...I love it...bits and pieces because I AM working boss):

 

Tough stretch, losing more than winning since Oct. ... do you feel like there could be bounces coming your way:   Yes, I do...important that you're honest with the group...have had a few good meetings, talked about Vegas game, we weren't good at all.  In October we'd probably win those past few games that were lost.  

 

Can't make wholesale changes.

 

Confidence important - team has a good grasp of things...Petey played well against Vegas.  Important to talk about individual game as well as team game to keep confidence up.

 

Montreal game - didn't want to give up too many chances...had 39 shots.  

 

When we're winning our game it's a territorial game - in their zone, more shots, people around the net, giving up less chances.

 

Injuries - guys who've been out and are trying to find their game...takes time.  Missing Edler - asking others to fill in for him is a lot.

 

"Grind time of year" is how they refer to this stretch - young players might not be used to the grind (tomorrow 5 games in 8 days)...talked to Quinn...hasn't played this much hockey and he's being asked to do a lot.  Have to live with the moments where he's not as sharp..make sure his confidence is intact.

 

Gaudette:  can't help but like him...works hard, takes in information and applies it to his game.  Scratched and clawed and it's hard to take him out of the line up.

 

Some bright spots so far:  Quinn and where he'll be down the road.  Petey, Bo, Boes..Jake's finding his game and progressing.

 

Surprised by constant temperature check in Canadian market?  Internal pressure?  - Not really.  You want to be in the Cdn market....passion people have.  Better than being in a place where they don't care.

 

Goal:  want to make playoffs this year.  Future is so bright and the city feels it...buzz in the town.   Losing obviously hurts.

 

What is the reality versus expectations of this team? - Likes where we're at.  13th in goals for.  14th goals against.  Wanted to score more and get scored on less and it's heading that way.  Could've easily won 2 or 3 recent losses. 

 

You played almost a thousand games on different levels of teams...what do you use from that to impart as knowledge?:  Played on teams that weren't very good...had to play at 90% to win....in Toronto, didn't have to play so well but still could win.  JT talks about that.   

 

Is the difference at times confidence...hesitancy?  The group is still fairly confident.  Some nights the ice isn't so good and it looks like they're not confident.  Petey's still feeling good and is playing well.  Quinn too. 

 

Love the way we played the last two periods - and there's another team at the other end of the rink that also factors in.

 

Jim is always working the phones...with difficulty in recruiting help, does it have to come from within?  (had to answer the phone, dammit)  Don't have to make a trade but in constant communication.....didn't say team isn't good enough to win.  Keep working with them....this group is capable of winning.

 

Optimistic...he isn't panicking and seems focused on making sure the guys are still confident and understand to keep at is..."close".

 

 

Was a ridiculous interview imo. To chalk games up to puck luck is laughable.

 

he credits Gaudette yet plasters his butt to bench with his net empty and he plays Leivo

 

green takes zero personal responsibility for his pathetic coaching and his putrid special teams 

 

why didn’t he address the fact he plays with zero o system and resorts to minor league unsuccessful dump and chase plays 

 

the defensive zone play is a complete gong show 

 

but let’s stay “optimistic” translation.... don’t fire me 

 

we will just go out and do more of the same and hopefully the hockey gods will turn things around for us - green 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dumb Nuck]

1 hour ago, appleboy said:

This says it all. 

I however think the club is getting better each year. It is not showing in the standings at this moment and may not see a big turnaround this year.  The ship is going in the right direction and we will see the results in time .  Maybe another good draft this year.

 

Hughes is going to be a star.

I think we have some great talent but I don’t feel it’s a team, they just seem off, I believe we have potential, the whole should be greater than the sum of the parts, we just need someone that can build a team.

[canuck2288]

1 hour ago, appleboy said:

This says it all. 

I however think the club is getting better each year. It is not showing in the standings at this moment and may not see a big turnaround this year.  The ship is going in the right direction and we will see the results in time .  Maybe another good draft this year.

 

Hughes is going to be a star.

And that’s with a stronger roster and maturing younger guys 

 

so in reality, the team is regressing under Green 

 

its a complete lie to say the team is better and under Green 

 

its a results business and he dies not have the results 

 

fire Green 

 

hire DeBoer

[Cali Canuck]

This question was from the GDT - I can't reply there because the thread is locked:

 

Is it true that crown royal is best in class?  Just asking.

 

For Canadian Whisky, to me it's probably the best.   They make a special blend/whisky called "Northern Harvest" Rye whiskey.  It won world's best Whisky 3 or 4 years ago.  Northern Harvest is more of a "Rye" whisky than regular Crown Royal.  I bought a bottle it was good.  However to me I prefer regular Crown Royal.  I've been drinking it for over 20 years so I'm probably used to it.  If you drink it neat it might be a little harsh.  On the rocks takes a little of the edge off, I prefer it on the rocks.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Cali Canuck
typos

[Trebreh]

honestly, i didn't like the questions asked and nobody brought up if the system we are playing is a problem. 

[mll]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

 

I guess most people need the coaches or managers to explain more but what Benning left to the obvious was that barring an opportunity to skate the puck in the zone easily or make a simple passing play we want to dump the puck in and attack with speed and pressure. 

 

Now our execution may be off some nights but you never see the Canucks just dump it in for no reason. Mainly they are pigeon holed by the opposition without many other options. Possession through the middle requires skill. These guys are still learning how to transition through the neutral zone effectively. Sure coaching is factor but a whole lot is on the players themselves, reading, reacting, and making the right decisions. 

 

Some coaches like Trotz go for selective carry ins/dump&chase but it's not necessarily the strategy for every team.  Not every team can successfully play dump and chase or are built for it and some encourage possession even if there is no easy entry.

 

Chicago tried limiting their turnovers by dumping the puck in more to start the season but it's not a game for them.  They are a skilled team so they reverted to carrying the puck in despite quite high turnover rates per Kelly using SportlogIQ's video tracking software. 

 

Treliving said he fired Hartley in part because there was not enough focus on puck possession and they were playing too much of a dump and chase game given the skills on their roster.  Bergevin moved Subban because he wanted to carry the puck in and they felt they were more effective by dumping the puck in - Bergevin was explaining that the puck will always travel faster than a skater.  Poile on the other hand talked of how they wanted to enter the zone with possession and felt that a 1st pass was not enough. 

 

Fenton traded out Coyle, Granlund in part because he believes it's becoming a rush league and wanted guys who have the skills to carry the puck in and felt they were dumping the puck in too much.  Minnesota was 3rd in dump in rates behind Vancouver and NYI last season by mid-February.   It led initially to quite some disconnect between Fiala who refuses to dump the puck in and his linemates.

 

Not everyone has the skills to make passing plays in full flight or know how/when to criss-cross or even skate with the puck with speed.  

 

 

[Cali Canuck]

20 hours ago, Herberts Vasiljevs said:

DeBoer is one of my favourite coaches in the league. I love Green but I wouldn't be opposed.

So JB has already had to fire one of his hand picked coaches (Willie D) if he fires TG & things don't improve  JB & the new coach might both be gone at the end of the season.

[J.I.A.H.N]

23 minutes ago, canuck2288 said:

Was a ridiculous interview imo. To chalk games up to puck luck is laughable.

 

he credits Gaudette yet plasters his butt to bench with his net empty and he plays Leivo

 

green takes zero personal responsibility for his pathetic coaching and his putrid special teams 

 

why didn’t he address the fact he plays with zero o system and resorts to minor league unsuccessful dump and chase plays 

 

the defensive zone play is a complete gong show 

 

but let’s stay “optimistic” translation.... don’t fire me 

 

we will just go out and do more of the same and hopefully the hockey gods will turn things around for us - green 

 

 

 

 

 

Man I hate comments like that...….have you coached at a professional level

 

Do you have a BA in Analytics? Exactly what makes you so sure of yourself?

 

About Dump ins......read this....if you want to know the answer 

 

https://www.thepointhockey.com/dump-ins-a-trend-on-the-rise/

[Kanukfanatic]

11 hours ago, vinny_in_vancouver said:

Not sure if you've only started watching this year, but he was productive the other years as a creative, finesse and skilled player playing in a top 6 role. Now that the team has playoffs aspirations, Benning wants us to be a more physical team like St. Louis or Boston and yes, they want to grind the other team to submission - hence, the endless dump and chase (and they're also supposed to hit a lot). A good portion of our goals this year are off rebounds or tip-ins or lucky bounces off somebody's equipment. As to goals from nice 5-on-5 passing plays, they've now become a scarcity for this team. The plays of each forward line is pretty monotonous (and easy to shut down) - other than Petey, I now need to watch the numbers just to see who's playing. To play that grinding style, the wingers Benning has brought in have size and toughness - Miller and Ferland. Unfortunately, Baertschi no longer fits that profile. The problem is there's not much creativity in Bo's line anymore. They're pretty easy to shut down.

Haha no need to be an online dick....I have watched the Canucks since the 80s there champ.

 

Baer is too soft for the NHL.....as is evident by 30 NHL gms not picking him up for free.

[Kanukfanatic]

9 hours ago, riffraff said:

I think that statement is pushing it now.

You dont think Edler is a top 4 D?

 

Ok....enough said about your ability to judge talent.