Team Defence

[Captain Canuck #12]

I found the Canucks' recent defensive stats, posted by the Flames' blogger Todd Cordell on HockeyBuzz, to be pretty startling:

 

Here are five things to watch when the Calgary Flames take on the Vancouver Canucks:

1. An exploitable defense

The Canucks have won six of their last 10 games, which is solid, but they are not playing well right now. Especially defensively. They rank 28th in attempts against, 30th in chances against, 31st in Grade A chances against, and 31st in expected goals against during that span. Alex Edler’s return to the lineup should help but these woes are much deeper than that. I think the Flames are a solid bet to take advantage, especially with the Canucks in the latter half of a back-to-back.

What's up with the Canucks' defensive play?  Going into the season, it looked like we were going to have a pretty solid D core.  Certainly much improved over last year.  Now it seems Markstrom is getting left to fend for himself most nights.  What the heck's going on?

[lmm]

[-DLC-]

Flames' blogger.  Why should I care again?  

[Crabcakes]

They seem to be concentrating on defending the so called home plate area and keeping the puck out of the middle.  They give away areas to the outside and the Kings for one, while they had plenty of good chances, I think their 51 shots were mostly from the outside.

 

Having said that, I'm not a big fan of defending that way.  They clearly get hemmed in a lot.  

[-DLC-]

4 minutes ago, Crabcakes said:

They give away areas to the outside and the Kings for one, while they had plenty of good chances, I think their 51 shots were mostly from the outside.

 

 

[Grape]

Hate on it all you want, what is said in the OP is mostly true. We’ve been relatively lucky to string along wins for the past 10 games, just like we were unlucky that we didn’t have a better record to start the season playing as well as we did.

 

Overall, our record is almost exactly indicative of our performance this season as things have balanced out. 

 

However, It’s no question that if we keep playing defensively the way we have that this is not sustainable. One would be delusional to think this type of defensive play is sustainable.

Edited December 29, 2019 by Grape

[Phil_314]

18 minutes ago, Grape said:

Hate on it all you want, what is said in the OP is mostly true. We’ve been relatively lucky to string along wins for the past 10 games, just like we were unlucky that we didn’t have a better record to start the season playing as well as we did.

 

Overall, our record is almost exactly indicative of our performance this season as things have balanced out. 

 

However, It’s no question that if we keep playing defensively the way we have that this is not sustainable. One would be delusional to think this type of defensive play is sustainable.

It's got me wondering, are we turnover prone up ice, awful in transition, not tight enough in our own zone, or a mix of all three?  Seeing how we're 3rd in draws as a team (52.8%), it means that we start off with the puck more often than not.  Are we just getting beat coming back (the Kings had that pretty often to start last night, Kempe had some so solo rushes in which they had easy carry-in's) and just unable to corral the puck and contain any chances?  Wonder if there's any stat or explanation for that.

 

Because as good as the offense has been (good enough at least to bail them out), it's still not a winning formula to be run and gun but unsteady in our own zone, especially if that amounts to getting out-shot 2:1.  We're also lucky that it was the Kings last night, if it was a better team they wouldn't need that many to bury us.    

[BrockBoester]

1 hour ago, Grape said:

 We’ve been relatively lucky to string along wins for the past 10 games, just like we were unlucky that we didn’t have a better record to start the season playing as well as we did.

Matt Murray? Is that you?

 

[luckylager]

I've been hating on Baumer for a couple of years now.

His system totally sucks, it's way too passive.

They give opponents too much time and space.

Usually play this passive box crap in the Dzone resulting in long stretches of being hemmed in.

They switch to man to man every once in a while but ever really pressure the puck.

Breakouts are awful. No puck support, Dman has two options - skate well or give it away.

 

Baumer has got to be the first to go and it needs to happen soon if we're hoping to grab that wild card.

 

The guy was an awful defenseman (by NHL standards) and is an equally bad NHL coach.

[coastal.view]

44 minutes ago, luckylager said:

I've been hating on Baumer for a couple of years now.

His system totally sucks, it's way too passive.

They give opponents too much time and space.

Usually play this passive box crap in the Dzone resulting in long stretches of being hemmed in.

They switch to man to man every once in a while but ever really pressure the puck.

Breakouts are awful. No puck support, Dman has two options - skate well or give it away.

 

Baumer has got to be the first to go and it needs to happen soon if we're hoping to grab that wild card.

 

The guy was an awful defenseman (by NHL standards) and is an equally bad NHL coach.

i have read multiples of your posts ragging on baum

so explain something a bit more globally about the team then

cuz i'm certain baum does not have sole say on overall team defence

i suspect green sets the overall team offense and defense systems

and baum implements the details as it pertains to the defence group

i have much bigger issues with how the overall team defence and slipped notably as the season has progressed

and i really am not sure how that is pinned on baum

 

but i'm confident you will explain this to me

as i suspect i'm missing something here

[luckylager]

27 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

i have read multiples of your posts ragging on baum

so explain something a bit more globally about the team then

cuz i'm certain baum does not have sole say on overall team defence

i suspect green sets the overall team offense and defense systems

and baum implements the details as it pertains to the defence group

i have much bigger issues with how the overall team defence and slipped notably as the season has progressed

and i really am not sure how that is pinned on baum

 

but i'm confident you will explain this to me

as i suspect i'm missing something here

I'm not absolving Green, however it needs to be noted than Green wasn't a Dman and therefore is leaning on his Asst to provide "assistance" in regards to set up, structure, breakout etc.

 

The biggest knock on the team is the D system. A new voice with a different view or experience may provide Green with more sound advice than the dud currently tugging on his ear.

 

But I guess you may know something I don't and the whole failing D structure is in Green.

[CptCanuck16]

Willie.....er.... I mean Travis Green thinks they're playing great defense.

 

Edited January 1, 2020 by CptCanuck16

[CptCanuck16]

On 12/29/2019 at 7:14 PM, luckylager said:

I'm not absolving Green, however it needs to be noted than Green wasn't a Dman and therefore is leaning on his Asst to provide "assistance" in regards to set up, structure, breakout etc.

 

The biggest knock on the team is the D system. A new voice with a different view or experience may provide Green with more sound advice than the dud currently tugging on his ear.

 

But I guess you may know something I don't and the whole failing D structure is in Green.

Obviously as fans on the outside looking in it is impossible to pinpoint exactly who is responsible for the teams poor systems (and its deeper than just the passive D, the breakout is horrendous too) but at the end of the day Travis Green is the person ultimately responsible for on ice operations. If something isn't working it's on him to address and resolve the issue.  

Edited January 1, 2020 by CptCanuck16

[Westcoasting]

26 minutes ago, CptCanuck16 said:

Obviously as fans on the outside looking in it is impossible to pinpoint exactly who is responsible for the teams poor systems (and its deeper than just the passive D, the breakout is horrendous too) but at the end of the day Travus Green is the person ultimately responsible for on ice operations. If something isn't working it's on him to address and resolve the issue.  

thank you! I'm amazed more people don't realize that the final product they see is the head coach's responsibility. Or the power play is the same thing according to most! But look at Toronto with the new head coach, power play is way different and producing.

[Timråfan]

On 12/29/2019 at 10:14 PM, debluvscanucks said:

Flames' blogger.  Why should I care again?  

I've heard others talk about how good Marky is a s a goalie when looking at the stats. He saves a lot of dangerous shots and has been for at least 2 seasons. 

Do you really want to depend on luck to win games? 

[Industrious1]

I think anyone that looked at the team we were icing this year would know we'd have defensive issues.  Edler and Tanev are pretty good but often injured, after that it's kind of just a free for all (thankfully, Hughes seems to be developing very quickly).

 

Next couple years is where the blueline needs to be shored up if the Canucks want a real crack at the Cup.

[LowerMainLander18]

Playing solid defensively does not all depend on the system. 

It also depends on players' ability to read off plays and make adjustments. 

Certainly it did not help having 5-6 regulars out of our lineup and expecting fillers to play perfect defence while still learning our system. 

 

2 years ago, at the end of Sedins era, it was evident that we would go through an arduous rebuild. I suspected a few years of rigorous rebuild as we lost two of our franchise leading point getters. 

Last year, it was evident that EP40 would shorten our rebuild by a large margin.

This year, we had like 1/3 of the roster being freshly introduced to the team. Considering that, I think our PP has progressed ok thus far. (altho some fans were going out of their minds over November)

And our D-zone coverage has been tolerable despite having lost Tanev then Edler... 

It is true we could improve in our own zone in both breakouts and coverage. But I am not panicking yet because I definitely have seen improvements. 

 

Man-to-man neutral zone coverage does not work well in today's NHL. 

In our D-zone, we need players to make use of both zone coverage as well as man-to-man depending on the situation. 

Just my two cents. 

Edited January 2, 2020 by LowerMainLander18

[coastal.view]

On 12/29/2019 at 7:14 PM, luckylager said:

I'm not absolving Green, however it needs to be noted than Green wasn't a Dman and therefore is leaning on his Asst to provide "assistance" in regards to set up, structure, breakout etc.

 

The biggest knock on the team is the D system. A new voice with a different view or experience may provide Green with more sound advice than the dud currently tugging on his ear.

 

But I guess you may know something I don't and the whole failing D structure is in Green.

i thought i was missing something

so i asked you

maybe we are the blind leading the blind

a common ailment on cdc i presume