qwijibo Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 Lol. Too funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 2 hours ago, qwijibo said: Lol. Too funny Great signing, they might even be able to trade him for a second at deadline and resign him again next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsAllOursBoys Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 On 1/3/2020 at 1:02 PM, theo5789 said: Perhaps they will bring back Markov as well. If their looking for speed, I hear Guy Lafleur can be had for league minimum as well..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, ItsAllOursBoys said: If their looking for speed, I hear Guy Lafleur can be had for league minimum as well..... hey they're a .500 team since signing Kovy. At this rate they'll miss the playoffs 3 weeks out instead of 4. #Bergevinin' Edited February 5, 2020 by Jimmy McGill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 On 2/4/2020 at 2:13 PM, oldnews said: Full disclosure: I have considered Bergevin to be one of the worst GM's in the business. But credit where it's due: Tatar, Suzuki, 2nd for Pacio has turned out very well Armia for taking on Mason = pretty solid move. Danault and a 2nd for Weise, Fleishman was a steal. Weber for Subban proving to be one of the more dramatically under-rated deals in recent years. Domi for Galchenyuk worked out better than probably could have hoped. 2nd for renting Plekanec to the Laffs. Byron off waivers. Chiarot, and Kovi signings... mix in some good depth deals - Thompson, Kulak, Weal....and getting assets back for Shaw... A lot to like in there - probably more than enough to make up for the Sergachev deal. when taken into the context of what Bergevin began with to what he's fielding today tho.... its pretty bad overall. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said: when taken into the context of what Bergevin began with to what he's fielding today tho.... its pretty bad overall. true - I think he made them unnecessarily worse - and not many indications that he could turn that around - which makes me think he's still technically the GM, but that the way they make decisions may have changed / or whom they lean on to inform them what to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsAllOursBoys Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 13 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: hey they're a .500 team since signing Kovy. At this rate they'll miss the playoffs 3 weeks out instead of 4. #Bergevinin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 (edited) 40 minutes ago, oldnews said: true - I think he made them unnecessarily worse - and not many indications that he could turn that around - which makes me think he's still technically the GM, but that the way they make decisions may have changed / or whom they lean on to inform them what to do? I’m no fan of Bergevin. But the roster he started with wasn’t any screaming hell. I wouldn’t say he took an amazing team and made them worse. Markov, Cole and Plekanec aged out. He got great value for Pacioretty. Weber /Subban looks like a Montreal win at this point. most of the moves he’s made that I initially hated turned out to favour Montreal. I think Montreal’s biggest flaw is the ridiculous notion that the GM and coach have to be French. Julian’s record is actually worse than Therrien’s was when he was fired. They need to abandon that philosophy and bring in the best people for the job. Regardless of cultural background. Oh, and Their drafting and player development left a lot to be desired but they now have one of the better prospect pools in the league. Edited February 6, 2020 by qwijibo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, oldnews said: true - I think he made them unnecessarily worse - and not many indications that he could turn that around - which makes me think he's still technically the GM, but that the way they make decisions may have changed / or whom they lean on to inform them what to do? I have to question the line about the rebuild there? (not by you, by others) I mean if thats the case you don't make the deal for Weber, you get a whole lot of futures for PK when he still had a lot of value. I just find it funny that people make excuses for the very mediocre at best job he's done. Edited February 6, 2020 by Jimmy McGill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 27 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said: I have to question the line about the rebuild there? (not by you, by others) I mean if thats the case you don't make the deal for Weber, you get a whole lot of futures for PK when he still had a lot of value. I just find it funny that people make excuses for the very mediocre at best job he's done. yeah - it wasn't a 'rething' as I recall - it was a pretty good team that Bergevin "fixed". If I recall the criticisms at the time (at least this is what mine were) - they more along the lines of - in spite a solid team overall / asset rich team - nevertheless being unable to identify or do anything about a key organizational need - top 6 centers. And not only that, but going out and dealing Sergachev + for a small, skiled, but over-rated winger....and then moving Galchenyuk, in a good enough deal in the end, but again, for a winger. Key assets spent - problems not addressed = wasted assets imo. Not a problem if you're rethinging, but when you're purporting to tweak a competitive team (they were 47-26 the year they fired Therien...) it is a serious blown window. Other bandaid moves - like adding a Steve Ott - to me was akin to the Leafs adding depth centers as rentals at repeat deadlines, while exposed/shallow on their blueline. Entirely valid argument to suggest that the moves to deal Subban etc were not rething moves - they were parallel (at best) window moves. I think Bergevin backed them into a 'rething' / retool - (and may have surrendered some autonomy in the process) - but whatever - he's made some good moves since, after having shown no ability to add what they needed when they needed it (reminded me of the Feaster era Flames in that sense). I have no qualms giving him some credit, but in context, he still 'fixed' what wasn't broken, and arguably may have broken it in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobayashi Maru Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 The rumoured 3rd or 4th rounder is more than worth it for what he brings. I wouldn’t bat an eye if we made the trade. Of course getting him for free would have been better but that ship has sailed. That is a highly skilled and currently motivated player at league min. No brainer in my mind. My trade deadline would involve getting Kovalchuk, getting a healthy Ferland back, signing Tryamkin and maybe moving Stecher if the return is decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 29 minutes ago, Kobayashi Maru said: The rumoured 3rd or 4th rounder is more than worth it for what he brings. I wouldn’t bat an eye if we made the trade. Of course getting him for free would have been better but that ship has sailed. That is a highly skilled and currently motivated player at league min. No brainer in my mind. My trade deadline would involve getting Kovalchuk, getting a healthy Ferland back, signing Tryamkin and maybe moving Stecher if the return is decent. The rumoured ask is a 2nd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobayashi Maru Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, qwijibo said: The rumoured ask is a 2nd https://www.tsn.ca/tradecentre-what-could-ilya-kovalchuk-fetch-for-the-montreal-canadiens-1.1438188 definitely a range but it will all depend on the overall demand. I’m guessing a third. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 3 minutes ago, Kobayashi Maru said: https://www.tsn.ca/tradecentre-what-could-ilya-kovalchuk-fetch-for-the-montreal-canadiens-1.1438188 definitely a range but it will all depend on the overall demand. I’m guessing a third. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 11 hours ago, oldnews said: yeah - it wasn't a 'rething' as I recall - it was a pretty good team that Bergevin "fixed". If I recall the criticisms at the time (at least this is what mine were) - they more along the lines of - in spite a solid team overall / asset rich team - nevertheless being unable to identify or do anything about a key organizational need - top 6 centers. And not only that, but going out and dealing Sergachev + for a small, skiled, but over-rated winger....and then moving Galchenyuk, in a good enough deal in the end, but again, for a winger. Key assets spent - problems not addressed = wasted assets imo. Not a problem if you're rethinging, but when you're purporting to tweak a competitive team (they were 47-26 the year they fired Therien...) it is a serious blown window. Other bandaid moves - like adding a Steve Ott - to me was akin to the Leafs adding depth centers as rentals at repeat deadlines, while exposed/shallow on their blueline. Entirely valid argument to suggest that the moves to deal Subban etc were not rething moves - they were parallel (at best) window moves. I think Bergevin backed them into a 'rething' / retool - (and may have surrendered some autonomy in the process) - but whatever - he's made some good moves since, after having shown no ability to add what they needed when they needed it (reminded me of the Feaster era Flames in that sense). I have no qualms giving him some credit, but in context, he still 'fixed' what wasn't broken, and arguably may have broken it in the process. I think the Feaster comparison is a very good one actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davathor Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 I think the extension/re-signing talks are pretty ridiculous. Kovy is a hired gun despite walking away from LA (who has no shot at playoffs), and at his age likely wants as much of a shot at a cup as possible. That's not going to be in Montreal. I predict he gets rented out at the deadline for a 3rd +. If Pittsburgh picked him up they would look scary as hell up front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 4 hours ago, Davathor said: I think the extension/re-signing talks are pretty ridiculous. Kovy is a hired gun despite walking away from LA (who has no shot at playoffs), and at his age likely wants as much of a shot at a cup as possible. That's not going to be in Montreal. I predict he gets rented out at the deadline for a 3rd +. If Pittsburgh picked him up they would look scary as hell up front. Despite your opinion there is a fair bit of speculation that they are looking to extend him and that he loves playing there. https://montrealgazette.com/sports/hockey/nhl/hockey-inside-out/stu-cowan-kovalchuk-shares-his-joy-and-tips-with-habs-teammates “ Would he like to have a future here beyond this season? “We’ll see,” Kovalchuk said. “I’m pretty sure we will have discussions with the GM and my agent will talk to them, so we’ll see what’s going to happen. But, like I’ve said a lot of times, I love everything here and we have a special group here. So it would be fun to stay.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davathor Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, qwijibo said: Despite your opinion there is a fair bit of speculation that they are looking to extend him and that he loves playing there. https://montrealgazette.com/sports/hockey/nhl/hockey-inside-out/stu-cowan-kovalchuk-shares-his-joy-and-tips-with-habs-teammates “ Would he like to have a future here beyond this season? “We’ll see,” Kovalchuk said. “I’m pretty sure we will have discussions with the GM and my agent will talk to them, so we’ll see what’s going to happen. But, like I’ve said a lot of times, I love everything here and we have a special group here. So it would be fun to stay.” Thanks I read it. "We'll see" isnt confirmation, and every player says they love where they currently are. He didnt stick around with NJ for a rebuild on a monster contract, why would he do it with Montreal? And why wouldnt Montreal want a free pick and try to sign him in offseason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Davathor said: Thanks I read it. "We'll see" isnt confirmation, and every player says they love where they currently are. He didnt stick around with NJ for a rebuild on a monster contract, why would he do it with Montreal? And why wouldnt Montreal want a free pick and try to sign him in offseason? I don’t know that he’ll want to stay. I don’t know that they’ll want to bring him back. But what has been obvious so far is that he’s brought a lot to the team. He’s taken the young guys under his wing, he’s jelled with the vets and he’s been producing. They may want the bird in the hand instead of a pick that translates to a long shot of getting an NHL player. They also already have 11 picks in the upcoming draft. Edited February 7, 2020 by qwijibo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobayashi Maru Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 21 hours ago, Davathor said: I think the extension/re-signing talks are pretty ridiculous. Kovy is a hired gun despite walking away from LA (who has no shot at playoffs), and at his age likely wants as much of a shot at a cup as possible. That's not going to be in Montreal. I predict he gets rented out at the deadline for a 3rd +. If Pittsburgh picked him up they would look scary as hell up front. Kovy paired with Malkin would certainly be fun to watch as long as it’s not against Vancouver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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