[Discussion] Getting Domi

[qwijibo]

34 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

Intangibles. Horvat is our team leader and inspires our guys. 

You don’t think Domi has i tangibles to Montreal. The guy is an absolute warrior who never takes a shift off. You don’t think he inspires his teammates?  The point is the value between the two players is very close. And if you wouldn’t move Horvat for a collection of lesser players and project prospects, you shouldnt expect Montreal to move Domi for such a package. 

[-AJ-]

5 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

You don’t think Domi has i tangibles to Montreal. The guy is an absolute warrior who never takes a shift off. You don’t think he inspires his teammates?  The point is the value between the two players is very close. And if you wouldn’t move Horvat for a collection of lesser players and project prospects, you shouldnt expect Montreal to move Domi for such a package. 

I still believe Horvat's intangibles are more valuable, but of course, that becomes more subjective.

 

Regardless, through reading both yours and the posts of @shiznak and @48MPHSlapShot, I've become convinced that my proposal was probably still a bit too short to be fair for Montreal.

[48MPHSlapShot]

31 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I still believe Horvat's intangibles are more valuable, but of course, that becomes more subjective.

 

Regardless, through reading both yours and the posts of @shiznak and @48MPHSlapShot, I've become convinced that my proposal was probably still a bit too short to be fair for Montreal.

I don't actually think that something like Pearson/Virtanen + a 1st rd pick is all that far off the mark value-wise, but I think you also have to look at what a particular player means to the team they play for as well. Domi is the only player under 26 in Montreal's top 6 point leaders. Contrast that with us, where we only have 2 players over 24 in our top 8 point leaders, and I think you get a pretty good indication of why it would probably take an overpayment to pry Domi away from the Habs. 

[shiznak]

If I were Bergy, I would want a young roster player, a top 3 prospect in your organization, and a conditional 1st for Domi.

 

So, something along the lines of Gaudette (although I doubt he wants another small forward), Juolevi, and a conditional pick.

 

[qwijibo]

1 minute ago, shiznak said:

If I were Bergy, I would want a young roster player, a top 3 prospect in your organization, and a conditional 1st for Domi.

 

So, something along the lines of Gaudette (although I doubt he wants another small forward), Juolevi, and a conditional pick.

 

Gaudette would be redundant in Montreal. They have Poehling who will be filling the same role in a year or 2 (3C)

Juolevi is too big a risk with his ongoing injury issues.  
 

I don’t see that as a package they’d be interested in 

[shiznak]

5 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

Gaudette would be redundant in Montreal. They have Poehling who will be filling the same role in a year or 2 (3C)

Juolevi is too big a risk with his ongoing injury issues.  
 

I don’t see that as a package they’d be interested in 

Gaudette wouldn’t be redundant, because he’d be somewhat replacing the points loss by Domi at a cheaper cost (both play C/W). Gaudette is already on pace for 40 points this season.
 

Montreal is also kind of shallow in the defensive department. I would say their best defensive prospect is Cale Fleury, who probably doesn’t have the highest ceiling. After that, there’s really not much to be desire on defense. Juolevi stock has drop considerably, but he’s still currently better than anyone in the Montreal organization. 

[qwijibo]

10 minutes ago, shiznak said:

Gaudette wouldn’t be redundant, because he’d be somewhat replacing the points loss by Domi at a cheaper cost (both play C/W). Gaudette is already on pace for 40 points this season.
 

Montreal is also kind of shallow in the defensive department. I would say their best defensive prospect is Cale Fleury, who probably doesn’t have the highest ceiling. After that, there’s really not much to be desire on defense. Juolevi stock has drop considerably, but he’s still currently better than anyone in the Montreal organization. 

You understand there’s a huge difference between a 40 point player and a 70 point player right?  Gaudette would be a bottom 6 guy  in Mo freak. Just like he is in Vancouver

 

 Montreal’s best D prospect is far and away Romanov. There’s talk that he’s top 4 NHL ready right now. They’re going to do everything they can to bring him over from the KHL next season 

 

Romanov is a much more highly touted prospect that Juolevi. Button has him as #5 of top NHL affiliated prospects. He doesn’t even have Juolevi in Vancouvers top 5. 

Edited January 22, 2020 by qwijibo

[shiznak]

4 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

You understand there’s a huge difference between a 40 point player and a 70 point player right?  Gaudette would be a bottom 6 guy  in Mo freak. Just like he is in Vancouver

 

 Montreal’s best D prospect is far and away Romanov. There’s talk that he’s top 4 NHL ready right now. They’re going to do everything they can to bring him over from the KHL next season 

And you understand that Domi scores 70 points once, in his 5th year in the league, playing top 6 minutes. While Gaudette is in his 2nd year, on pace for 40 points, playing bottom 6 minutes. This year, Gaudette has 8 goals in 39 games, while Domi has 12 goals in 50.
 

Gaudette wouldn’t be playing bottom 6 minutes on the Habs. Montreal has far less competition in the top 6, for him to be playing bottom 6 minutes. You can’t say Armia, Suzuki, Lehkonen, and Poehling are a far better option than Gaudette.

 

[qwijibo]

Just now, shiznak said:

And you understand that Domi scores 70 points once, in his 5th year in the league, playing top 6 minutes. While Gaudette is in his 2nd year, on pace for 40 points, playing bottom 6 minutes. This year, Gaudette has 8 goals in 39 games, while Domi has 12 goals in 50.
 

Gaudette wouldn’t be playing bottom 6 minutes on the Habs. Montreal has far less competition in the top 6, for him to be playing bottom 6 minutes. You can’t say Armia, Suzuki, Lehkonen, and Poehling are a far better option than Gaudette.

 

Do you know anything about Suzuki???

[shiznak]

1 minute ago, qwijibo said:

Do you know anything about Suzuki???

He’s manning Montreal’s second line, atm .... but can you say he’s a far better option than Gaudette? 
 

Production wise, they’re nearing identical. 

 

[qwijibo]

4 minutes ago, shiznak said:

He’s manning Montreal’s second line, atm .... but can you say he’s a far better option than Gaudette? 
 

Production wise, they’re nearing identical. 

 

Suzuki is a 20 year old rookie playing C and running 5th in rookie scoring. He also kills penalties and is trusted in all situations. Yes. I can say he’s a far better option than Gaudette 

[shiznak]

6 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

Suzuki is a 20 year old rookie playing C and running 5th in rookie scoring. He also kills penalties and is trusted in all situations. Yes. I can say he’s a far better option than Gaudette 

I wouldn’t say he kills penalties, considering he only has a whooping 18 minutes of PK time. I could say, Horvat kills penalties, but in reality he doesn’t.

[qwijibo]

2 minutes ago, shiznak said:

I wouldn’t say he kills penalties, considering he only has a whooping 18 minutes of PK time. I could say, Horvat kills penalties, but in reality he doesn’t.

He’s been on the pk since Gallagher went down 

[shiznak]

1 minute ago, qwijibo said:

He’s been on the pk since Gallagher went down 

Gallagher doesn’t play on the PK anymore, ever since they got Armia. So, that doesn’t really make a difference.

[qwijibo]

It’s clear you don’t know much about the Montreal organization. Can we just leave it at they’re not going to move a 24 year old top 6 player who loves Montreal and never takes a shift off short of a massive overpay. There’s literally no reason to move him and as I said a number of times.  If you wouldn’t move Horvat for an equivalent offer, don’t expect Montreal to move Domi for that offer 

[qwijibo]

Just now, shiznak said:

Gallagher doesn’t play on the PK anymore, ever since they got Armia. So, that doesn’t really make a difference.

Armia has been out for a few weeks too. Montreal was missing Gallagher, Drouin , Armia, and Byron all at the same time. A lot of players had to step up. Hence the 8 game skid 

Edited January 22, 2020 by qwijibo

[shiznak]

3 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

It’s clear you don’t know much about the Montreal organization. Can we just leave it at they’re not going to move a 24 year old top 6 player who loves Montreal and never takes a shift off short of a massive overpay. There’s literally no reason to move him and as I said a number of times.  If you wouldn’t move Horvat for an equivalent offer, don’t expect Montreal to move Domi for that offer 

While I agree it’s not likely they’re going to move Domi. I just think you’re undervaluing Gaudette here. 

[Gaudette Celly]

Motte and Stecher fit their tiny mold, then add in BreezeBah as the francophonie pièce de résistance.  Ça marche!

[qwijibo]

10 minutes ago, Gaudette Celly said:

Motte and Stecher fit their tiny mold, then add in BreezeBah as the francophonie pièce de résistance.  Ça marche!

Weber 6’4”

Chairot 6’3”

Scandalla 6’3”

Danault 6’1”

Petry 6’3”

Armia 6’4”

Thompson 6’1”

Kovalchuk 6’3”

Kotkaniemi 6’2”

Kulak 6’2”

Weise 6’2”

Poehling 6’2”

Fleury 6’1”

yeah. They have some small players. But they’re not the undersized team of the past. 

[Dixon Ward]

We don't need Domi.  We have enough grit.  We have enough shooters.  If anything we could use a playmaker to help set up all of our shooters.  I love trades, they are exciting, but I do not want trades that mess with the team's great depth and balanced scoring.