[Proposal] You Won't Believe It... but...

[Alflives]

4 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

his bridge is farther east  he still thinks Kovy is taking Montreal to the cup. 

 

Seriously tho, I think NJ would jump at the chance for Demko. Demko is putting together a better season than Blackwood, so NJ can run with both next year and protect the better one, maybe even flip one to another team to recover a pick. Its a good risk for them imo. 

Oh, the Montreal bridges aren’t flooding, they are crumbling.  Not safe living under those fir sure.  

 

Demko is ready to be a starter, and would really right the ship of a team like Nashville, who’s goaltending is crippling them.  I could see the Devils loving Demko too, especially because of his age.  There are plenty of teams that would love Demko.  

Edited January 28, 2020 by Alflives

[JM_]

7 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Oh, the Montreal bridges aren’t flooding, they are crumbling.  Not safe living under those fir sure.  

 

Demko is ready to be a starter, and would really right the ship of a team like Nashville, who’s goaltending is crippling them.  I could see the Devils loving Demko too, especially because of his age.  There are plenty of teams that would love Demko.  

yeah Saros does seem to have had a regression. 

[Monty]

3 hours ago, BoKnows said:

This is the most fun proposal that I've read.  I would do this trade, not sure if the Preds would.

Correct, the Predators wouldn't. List of potential UFAs this off-season:

 

- Braden Holtby

- Robin Lehner

- Corey Crawford

- Jimmy Howard

- Anton Khudobin

- Jacob Markstrom

- Thomas Greiss

 

It's a buyers market right now for goalies, not a sellers market. Plus, perhaps the biggest goaltender that could be traded at this point is Isles prospect, and top goalie not in North America, Ilya Sorokin. He hasn't been signed by his KHL club to an extension, yet. Rumours are pointing towards him wanting his rights traded from the Islanders, as they already have their starter in Varlamov. I can definitely see the Preds shipping assets the Isles way and see what Sorokin can give them. If not that, then certainly they'll be a handful of UFA goaltenders to choose from. All of the above won't be available, but certainly some will. They don't need to give up a 1st round draft pick to land a goalie. Not at this time.

[Alflives]

15 minutes ago, Monty said:

Correct, the Predators wouldn't. List of potential UFAs this off-season:

 

- Braden Holtby

- Robin Lehner

- Corey Crawford

- Jimmy Howard

- Anton Khudobin

- Jacob Markstrom

- Thomas Greiss

 

It's a buyers market right now for goalies, not a sellers market. Plus, perhaps the biggest goaltender that could be traded at this point is Isles prospect, and top goalie not in North America, Ilya Sorokin. He hasn't been signed by his KHL club to an extension, yet. Rumours are pointing towards him wanting his rights traded from the Islanders, as they already have their starter in Varlamov. I can definitely see the Preds shipping assets the Isles way and see what Sorokin can give them. If not that, then certainly they'll be a handful of UFA goaltenders to choose from. All of the above won't be available, but certainly some will. They don't need to give up a 1st round draft pick to land a goalie. Not at this time.

Same was said when we got 9 OA for carrot top.  Getting a young top goalie, Demko, costs in trade.  UFAs cost big cap dollars and term.  

Edited January 28, 2020 by Alflives

[Monty]

Just now, Alflives said:

Same was said when we got 9 OA for carrot top.  Getting a young top goalie, Demko, costs in trade.  

Perhaps the same was said, I honestly can't remember. But what I do remember is that the market back then was far different than it is now for goalies. Not only are goalies more readily available at the moment this free agency, but their available in droves this year.

 

The second part to this is how much more valuable we've heard lately (ie: last 2-3 years) of 1st round picks and ELCs, especially in relation to building a competitor. In this case, meaning the Predators, if they can get a goaltender to provide even marginally better numbers than Rinne next year at a fraction of the cost, without giving up a 1st round pick and getting him in free agency, then that's the route they'll go. And, in Ilya Sorokin's case, he's a goaltender that only wants to come over if given a true shot/path to become a starter in the NHL. The Islanders, unfortunately, can't give him that guarantee anymore, due to Varlamov. 

 

Long story short, the Preds have a lot more options to find an average to above average goaltender via free agency first or through a prospect swap with the Islanders, before shipping off a mid/high first round pick. That will be their very last resort.

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Monty said:

Perhaps the same was said, I honestly can't remember. But what I do remember is that the market back then was far different than it is now for goalies. Not only are goalies more readily available at the moment this free agency, but their available in droves this year.

 

The second part to this is how much more valuable we've heard lately (ie: last 2-3 years) of 1st round picks and ELCs, especially in relation to building a competitor. In this case, meaning the Predators, if they can get a goaltender to provide even marginally better numbers than Rinne next year at a fraction of the cost, without giving up a 1st round pick and getting him in free agency, then that's the route they'll go. And, in Ilya Sorokin's case, he's a goaltender that only wants to come over if given a true shot/path to become a starter in the NHL. The Islanders, unfortunately, can't give him that guarantee anymore, due to Varlamov. 

 

Long story short, the Preds have a lot more options to find an average to above average goaltender via free agency first or through a prospect swap with the Islanders, before shipping off a mid/high first round pick. That will be their very last resort.

UFA goalies, good ones, cost a lot in cap and are older.  Demko is young, and costs a lot less in cap.  That combination of youth, and low cap equals a lot of value.  Add that Demko is really good, and improving too, and IMO he’s worth a first round pick.  

[Monty]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

UFA goalies, good ones, cost a lot in cap and are older.  Demko is young, and costs a lot less in cap.  That combination of youth, and low cap equals a lot of value.  Add that Demko is really good, and improving too, and IMO he’s worth a first round pick.  

I agree he’s worth that, but the Canucks won’t get offered that, especially a mid/high one from a non-playoff team. And especially with the Sorokin situation. And I’m sure Lehner will get quite a bit of attention from several teams, including the Preds. And he’ll cost more in term and less in AAV.

[coastal.view]

2 hours ago, Sedinery33 said:

Man, glass half empty? Why not bash on everyone because you are so much wiser... Demko could get the 9th OA if the team with the 9th OA values him as such...

 

We gave a 1st and 3rd for Miller because JB valued him, look how that's worked out. I bet you still don't like that we gave up a 1st?

you seem a bit bitter ??

 

schneids was an established goalie who netted the highest draft pick return for a goalie in history

demko is not there

not at all

he is not considered yet to be the best back up in the league

with the strongest upside to be an elite starter

he did not equal or better a legendary goalie like schneids did with luongo

 

not many gms trade like chiapet

but you seem to believe most are like him?

 

oh and btw

since you appear to need to get personal about my posting

maybe do a little easy research of my recent posts

i am a strong supporter of the miller trade and always have been

don't display your lazy thinking if you intend to go down the road of disparaging someone a bit more personally 

it could come back to bite you

 

and think about it a bit if you would (or can)

there is a built in problem with trade proposals

there really are 2 categories of these

which have been merged into one without this being expressly clear

i get it that some trade proposals are posted for reasons other then they are trying to be realistic

(people appear to wish to test the waters about how accurate their player assessment are)

and then there are the ones which are trying to be more serious

most are not serious and do not try to get close to being serious

i am not in the fantasy trade camp and have very little interest in that genre

so forgive me if this site is set up in a manner that requires some additional review of threads

i do get annoyed with this

and that does also get aggravated by most posts on here completely over valuing canuck assets

this does not happen infrequently

but in 80 to 90% of these sorts of posts

 

so go ahead

shoot the messenger

i do not think i'm really the problem here

 

go speak to a mod about fixing the proposal category to allow for fantasy and serious trade proposals

and call out the fan base that so significantly over values the canuck players in their proposals

 

Edited January 28, 2020 by coastal.view

[lmm]

39 minutes ago, Monty said:

Correct, the Predators wouldn't. List of potential UFAs this off-season:

 

- Braden Holtby

- Robin Lehner

- Corey Crawford

- Jimmy Howard

- Anton Khudobin

- Jacob Markstrom

- Thomas Greiss

 

It's a buyers market right now for goalies, not a sellers market. Plus, perhaps the biggest goaltender that could be traded at this point is Isles prospect, and top goalie not in North America, Ilya Sorokin. He hasn't been signed by his KHL club to an extension, yet. Rumours are pointing towards him wanting his rights traded from the Islanders, as they already have their starter in Varlamov. I can definitely see the Preds shipping assets the Isles way and see what Sorokin can give them. If not that, then certainly they'll be a handful of UFA goaltenders to choose from. All of the above won't be available, but certainly some will. They don't need to give up a 1st round draft pick to land a goalie. Not at this time.

That is not a list of problem solvers

Crawford and Howard are old- 35+ YO = stop gap at best

Khudobin and Griess are career back ups, or platoon guys at best- Khudobin- one 41 GP season, 34YO in May, Greiss one 51 GP season and one 43 GP season, 34 YO tomorrow

That leaves you with Holtby, Markstron and Lehner at 30 YO or younger. Only a gunslinger ties his boat to Lehner for the long haul so that leaves Holtby and Marky. Holtby  can pick the most Cup likely team, which isn't Nashville and Marky likely signs in Van before the Draft.

After Holby and Markstrom, I'd look seriously at Demko but probably shy away until he proves he can play a season or two without getting concussed.

[lmm]

14 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

you seem a bit bitter ??

 

schneids was an established goalie who netted the highest draft pick return for a goalie in history

demko is not there

not at all

he is not considered yet to be the best back up in the league

with the strongest upside to be an elite starter

he did not equal or better a legendary goalie like schneids did with luongo

 

not many gms trade like chiapet

but you seem to believe most are like him?

 

oh and btw

since you appear to need to get personal about my posting

maybe do a little easy research of my recent posts

i am a strong supporter of the miller trade and always have been

don't display your lazy thinking if you intend to go down the road of disparaging someone a bit more personally 

it could come back to bite you

 

and think about it a bit if you would (or can)

there is a built in problem with trade proposals

there really are 2 categories of these

which have been merged into one without this being expressly clear

i get it that some trade proposals are posted for reasons other then they are trying to be realistic

(people appear to wish to test the waters about how accurate their player assessment are)

and then there are the ones which are trying to be more serious

most are not serious and do not try to get close to being serious

i am not in the fantasy trade camp and have very little interest in that genre

so forgive me if this site is set up in a manner that requires some additional review of threads

i do get annoyed with this

and that does also get aggravated by most posts on here completely over valuing canuck assets

this does not happen infrequently

but in 80 to 90% of these sorts of posts

 

so go ahead

shoot the messenger

i do not think i'm really the problem here

 

go speak to a mod about fixing the proposal category to allow for fantasy and serious trade proposals

and call out the fan base that so significantly over values the canuck players in their proposals

 

that was way too long to keep my attention so I'll just ask one serious question without prejudice,

who are the top 4 back ups in your opinion?

[coastal.view]

6 minutes ago, lmm said:

that was way too long to keep my attention so I'll just ask one serious question without prejudice,

who are the top 4 back ups in your opinion?

does not matter

none of them will get the 9th overall or better draft pick

none of them is valued in the same category as schneids was

 

nj devils were looking to replace brodeur, arguably in the top 3 of best goalies in nhl history

and they had calculated that scheids could adequately fill this need

 

are you attempting to suggest there is presently another team out there

trying to fill a similar need?

 

please list the teams

(since you appear to like assigning homework?)

Edited January 28, 2020 by coastal.view

[Gurn]

2 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

OK.. so what value do you think he has then? 

 

If we offered Demko to NJ for their extra 1st rounder from Arizona they'd be silly not to take it, imo. 

I'd think NJ would be extremely reluctant to trade for another Canucks goalie, as the last one broke down quickly. I get the difference in ages and all, but I'd say they would be very, very careful.

[lmm]

7 minutes ago, coastal.view said:

does not matter

none of them will get the 9th overall or better draft pick

none of them is valued in the same category as schneids was

 

nj devils were looking to replace brodeur, arguably in the top 3 of best goalies in nhl history

and they had calculated that scheids could adequately fill this need

 

are you attempting to suggest there is presently another team out there

trying to fill a similar need?

 

please list the teams

(since you appear to like assigning homework?)

sorry man, I'm not going to throw sand with you.

if you don't want to answer questions we cannot have a conversation

bye

[-AJ-]

I personally think Demko's current value is somewhere between 15-25 in the first round. 

[Nuxfanabroad]

There are a million possible permutations. You might add another piece(if required) to land the right 1st rounder.

 

Or add an unwanted piece like Eriksson, in order to open cap. Something like:

 

Van: Demko & Loui(retain 1 mill perhaps?)

 

NJ: Coleman, & 2nd/3rd whatever?

 

If the kid keeps playing like last night, Jim's phone will be ringing.

[HKSR]

Some people argue Demko's value isn't high, but if GMJB announced tomorrow that Demko is available, how many teams do you think would be calling for a top tier young goalie that is only 23 years old with such a high ceiling in terms of potential?  I'm sure plenty of rebuilding teams would jump at an opportunity like this.  Young goalies of this caliber don't exactly become available very often.

 

To give you an idea of what kinda goaltender we're talking about, here is a list of goalies aged 25 or less playing a substantial role on their teams.  If any of these guys suddenly became available, don't you think MANY teams would be jumping at the opportunity?  Like I said, these types of goalies don't became available very often.  They're generally the ones groomed to take over as starter (if not there already).

 

Tristan Jarry

Ilya Samsonov

Alexander Georgiev

Mackenzie Blackwood

Carter Hart

Edited January 28, 2020 by HKSR

[JM_]

23 minutes ago, gurn said:

I'd think NJ would be extremely reluctant to trade for another Canucks goalie, as the last one broke down quickly. I get the difference in ages and all, but I'd say they would be very, very careful.

different GMs, you'd think we'd be allowed at least one goalie trade per decade with them 

 

I agree with AJ, I think somewhere in the 2nd 1/2 of the 1st round we could find a trade partner. Someone suggested the Leafs, which as gagifying as that is might make sense for them too, given they only have Andersson for 1 more year and they could protect Demko and work out a handshake free agency deal with Andersson ahead of time so Seattle wouldn't pick him. 

[BowtieCanuck]

I wouldn't be comfortable getting rid of a goalie who is still developing and on course to be an amazing goalie because we had a goalie on the last year of his contract have a career year. If Markstrom re-signs and can repeat this season upto the ASG next year and Demko still has trade value, for sure do it.

Edited January 28, 2020 by BowtieCanuck

[Rabbit]

This is an interest proposal, and good for Canucks.

If I am Benning, I will take it.

[Ghostsof1915]

And if Markstrom gets a serious injury we're stuck with DiPietro the rest of the season. I'm not comfortable with that. 

If we can get a solid goalie prospect that can eventually be a starter and a very competent backup I'm all for it.