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I Just Dont Get It With Canuck Fans

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On 2/18/2020 at 10:21 AM, WalkWithElias40 said:

Hello,

 

Ive been a long time canucks fan all my life, and still dont get what those canuck Fans want from JIM BENNING smh. Of course we want our 1st cup in franchise history, but reading thru CDC there are fans who are actual mad about the TOFFOLI trade, like really ? Cmon ppl!
 

JB trading for Miller was money ! He hit a home run on that trade, and paying that high of a price for Toffoli means JB believes he can re-sign him.


I actually love the trade, this team needs the players surrounding the young core who has won cups and have experience in playoffs, I see in JBs plan that this trade does actually fill in that need for the young cores development. They need that playoff experience. In no way i think canucks are cup contenders but I do think this team has what it takes to make the playoffs. 
 

Yall complain about lack of movement JB is doing, and once he does something those canuck fans complain, “OH MY GOD HE TRADED OUR FUTURE MADDEN NOOO FIRE JIMBO!” , “JIMBO TRADED WAY TO MUCH FOR A RENTAL OH MY GOD THAT EFFIN IDIOT !” 

 

LOOK stop complaining, do you guys want to see our young players develop or not ? Like WTH is wrong you guys? this is the next step in the future of our young core.. how many prospects we need ? We have so many great prospects up and coming and they will not have a spot on the main roster when ready, which will take 2-3 years more.

 

Madden is going to a team where he will have a chance to play his game, he did not have room to play on the canucks and we dont know his potential in the NHL.

 

We still have the one of the best prospect pools in the NHL and im ok with letting Madden go.

 

Horvat, Petey, Gaudette will be our 3 top centers going forward.

 

so you see canuck fans, we have been rebuilding for too long, 5 years now, its time to stop being a hater in JB and believe what hes doing, he wants this team to succeed and by doing that he will add assets around the core to help them develop that winning culture on the team, we cant be rebuilding forever , we have all the pieces to be a dynasty team.

So you started a thread to complain about complainers?

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5 hours ago, WalkWithElias40 said:

Soo to those canuck fans  who hate JB, how you feelin now...:bigblush:

 

still sour about TOFFOLI trade or what ? :lol:

There are still Canucks fans that hate JB? Wow, after stocking the cupboards in a short time so much so that he could trade a few top picks and Madden without it effecting the future too much. He brought in Pettersson, Hughes, Demko, Miller, Boeser, Stecher, Virtanen, Toffoli (bet he resigns with us), Pearson, Fantenberg, Myers, Gaudette, MacEwen and Motte. All of whom are having arguably their best NHL seasons other than Boeser because of injury. He brought in some solid veterans in Rousell, Beagle and Benn.He resigned Edler and Tanev as well as Horvat to a bargain contract. He made a few errors early but that's just a learning curve of a new GM. Who cares about Madden, what's funny is i thought he was kind of smug when interviewed by Dan Murphy in Boston. Probably wouldn't have signed with us and we'd get nothing for him anyway. If we did sign him he wouldn't make our roster unless you think he'd outplay Gaudette, not bloody likely. Your value for him is at a high because he's bound to have injury issues at a 150 pounds. He'd get buried in the minors and might get a few games here and there. Thats why i think he'd sign elsewhere, on a team that has room for him. The Canucks are in a playoff position and by acquiring Toffoli, they also get the inside track in signing him. He will like playing for a contender and JB has from now till July to negotiate a new deal. In my opinion the odds are in our favour he resigns, he gets to play with Petey and Miller. That line has the potential to be one of the best in the league if it isn't already. Madden who? Who cares, we have Podz, Hogs, Lind, Rafferty, Juolevi, DiPietro and Gadjovich. We do need Centers for Utica but it's possible Focht makes that squad next year. Also he will just sign a couple free agents like Graovc and Bailey. Whats not to like. JB is one of the most under-rated and under-appreciated GM's in the league.  

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11 hours ago, Timbermen said:

There are still Canucks fans that hate JB? Wow, after stocking the cupboards in a short time so much so that he could trade a few top picks and Madden without it effecting the future too much. He brought in Pettersson, Hughes, Demko, Miller, Boeser, Stecher, Virtanen, Toffoli (bet he resigns with us), Pearson, Fantenberg, Myers, Gaudette, MacEwen and Motte. All of whom are having arguably their best NHL seasons other than Boeser because of injury. He brought in some solid veterans in Rousell, Beagle and Benn.He resigned Edler and Tanev as well as Horvat to a bargain contract. He made a few errors early but that's just a learning curve of a new GM. Who cares about Madden, what's funny is i thought he was kind of smug when interviewed by Dan Murphy in Boston. Probably wouldn't have signed with us and we'd get nothing for him anyway. If we did sign him he wouldn't make our roster unless you think he'd outplay Gaudette, not bloody likely. Your value for him is at a high because he's bound to have injury issues at a 150 pounds. He'd get buried in the minors and might get a few games here and there. Thats why i think he'd sign elsewhere, on a team that has room for him. The Canucks are in a playoff position and by acquiring Toffoli, they also get the inside track in signing him. He will like playing for a contender and JB has from now till July to negotiate a new deal. In my opinion the odds are in our favour he resigns, he gets to play with Petey and Miller. That line has the potential to be one of the best in the league if it isn't already. Madden who? Who cares, we have Podz, Hogs, Lind, Rafferty, Juolevi, DiPietro and Gadjovich. We do need Centers for Utica but it's possible Focht makes that squad next year. Also he will just sign a couple free agents like Graovc and Bailey. Whats not to like. JB is one of the most under-rated and under-appreciated GM's in the league.  

 A severe lack of appreciation for sure.

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

I get tired of those fans that prop up Benning's 6 years and 7 drafts here with a list of players and the same prospects year after year rather than team's accomplishments.

 

Over that 6+ years period of time every team has added as many players and in most cases, a lot more drafted players. Just look at what Ottawa has done in Benning's time here, Conference final, sold out most the teams prospects to get there, then blew it up and traded away all the team's star players, then starts a rebuild with a internal budget, now has an extremely young team and 13 draft picks in THIS year's draft, a good chance they pick up 3 star players that can walk right onto the team. In just two years of rebuilding.

So Ottawa emptied the cupboard, restocked and then reloaded for the best draft in two decades, they have 13 picks in the first two rounds, estimated this draft goes 40 players deep. 1 to 20 are exceptional, 20-40 a normal draft rating.

 

I get it, it is your team and you want it to be better and a good team but ignoring other teams or blaming what every team endures every season is avoiding realities. To most of those is just plain luck, the bad kind that the team isn't a power house yearly. There is always something out of control of anyone to blame and if that fails then attack the message and messenger as being disloyal, a troll or just tell them to cheer some other team.

 

They will blindly cheer and support anyone in charge today and crucify and blame those people when they are removed and replaced and blindly cheer and support the new hire. Not being part of the herd is to be shunned.

 

Have any posters noted that the "negative" posters often repeat the similar stuff? They aren't coming down on every player, trade, game, because all this has happened before, there isn't a lot that will change, the cap was big, then came capfriendly and other cap programs and web sites, scouting reports were internal and therefore a mystery to ordinary fans, "they must know what they are doing" and then access to 20+ scouting reports became public knowledge, the terms of players contracts were hard to find and the NHLPA publicized them, access to the owners was an unknown, now there is the social media, don't have to wear a bag over your head at a game to get the message across, player bio history is available, maybe not specific all the time but there, hockey still keeps a player's personal problems pretty tight lipped but that is more the nature of the sport, those are "he has baggage", and then came analytics, IMO an over complication of, goals and assist, time vs shots and plus minus without counting PP or PK, those are separate, but still accurate and the standings, the ultimate stat of how good is the team in the league. The league because there are more than 8 teams to compete against.

 

All this is at the finger tips of every fan and takes only minutes to look up this info. But then it isn't emotional information except betting which is almost always emotional to an ordinary person, betting with the heart.

 

 

 

It's called a rebuild!  You expect them to win during a rebuild?  If you had to choose between Ottawa and Vancouver, I'd be choosing Vancouver as the team I would rather be right now. 

 

Now the rebuild is over.  Time to actually judge how well his past years at drafting/ and acquiring the new players actually come to fruition.

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1 minute ago, Viper007 said:

It's called a rebuild!  You expect them to win during a rebuild?  If you had to choose between Ottawa and Vancouver, I'd be choosing Vancouver as the team I would rather be right now. 

 

Now the rebuild is over.  Time to actually judge how well his past years at drafting/ and acquiring the new players actually come to fruition.

I changed my mind, this is not the right place to make those comments.

 

The rebuild should not be over, IMO if done too soon the team will be doing it again in two years.

 

As it is now I think the team is going to be middle of the road, they are not a playoff team yet and seem to be one injury away all the time.

 

Markstrom covered up a lot of problems yet to be addressed, too many 40+ shot game he won or pushed to OT. This month will be the tell.

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6 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

I changed my mind, this is not the right place to make those comments.

 

The rebuild should not be over, IMO if done too soon the team will be doing it again in two years.

 

As it is now I think the team is going to be middle of the road, they are not a playoff team yet and seem to be one injury away all the time.

 

Markstrom covered up a lot of problems yet to be addressed, too many 40+ shot game he won or pushed to OT. This month will be the tell.

Of course they're not a playoff team yet.  They haven't made the playoffs.  I have faith that they will though.  I think you have rebuild and contender confused.  The rebuild is over.  Are we a contender?  Not yet.  We have to have experience in the playoffs first.  But the rebuilding is done.  We have our core players that are needed.  Everybody else is just support players that will add to the main core guys.

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2 hours ago, Viper007 said:

Of course they're not a playoff team yet.  They haven't made the playoffs.  I have faith that they will though.  I think you have rebuild and contender confused.  The rebuild is over.  Are we a contender?  Not yet.  We have to have experience in the playoffs first.  But the rebuilding is done.  We have our core players that are needed.  Everybody else is just support players that will add to the main core guys.

Maybe our definition of rebuild is different.

 

Draft until there are enough players playing to fill in at least half the roster. Rebuild through the draft.

Done this way so most of the core are all within 3 years of age with each other, one or two exceptions. IMO with the number of over 30's and clause contracts on the team there is not enough high end players under 24 on the team. This is the same thing Benning said when he first started and he was referring to the Sedins as well.

With 7 first round picks there should be more than 3 on the team under 24 that have core potential.

 

It seems what you mean is the team is building with a couple of young players on it, but to me it seems the team will be doing that for ever never gaining much familiarity. Adding players every year is okay for the bottom six roles but the top six, IMO should be together up to 6 years.It is also something established team do to stay at the top.

 

As far as contender, I mean not just make the playoffs and hope. The team has to target to be amongst the best in the league, top 4 to 6, for that.

 

This team, I do think Benning has put together a good enough bottom six to have some success in the playoffs, as good as any team but they are old and fairly fragile, nearly every one of them has suffered injuries during their time here.

 

IMO I don't think the team will trade for the superstar class and I do harbor some disquiet as to what will happen in the playoffs. Just not enough depth quality. I do not want to hear about a injury derailing the effort f an entire season's worth of supporting them, all teams have injuries.

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34 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

I changed my mind, this is not the right place to make those comments.

 

The rebuild should not be over, IMO if done too soon the team will be doing it again in two years.

 

As it is now I think the team is going to be middle of the road, they are not a playoff team yet and seem to be one injury away all the time.

 

Markstrom covered up a lot of problems yet to be addressed, too many 40+ shot game he won or pushed to OT. This month will be the tell.

 

Jim did a lot of things wrong at first.  But luck or smarts, or a combination, in the draft, has saved his bacon.  As well, the Miller trade worked out about as good as it could.

 

Linden, if rumours are correct, wanted a more methodical, patient, build through the draft approach.  The reason, is the risk as you point out, that if you don't create a structure, on a rebuilding team, to protect future drafts and young prospects, even find ways to acquire more, and think you are ready to compete before you are, or think your older core only needs a couple more vets other teams don't want, to get back to the dance one more time, and you are shedding draft picks, and prospects to promote this, you may be facing yet another rebuild in a couple of years on,... a perpetual rebuild.

 

I'm guessing, but for Linden, it was too much of a risk. I mean, if you did this kind of retool on the fly, and had good vets > rookies, if you didn't make the playoffs as was the goal, or even got there but went out early, you'd probably be in mid pack, without a very high pick.  And so with that lower pick, you'd have to get very lucky to find new viable prospects.  This kind of "retool" could set a team in a rut for years. 

 

But what happened was whatever risk percentage, somehow Jim beat the incredible odds.  Started with his half measure retool failing miserably, our 'foundational' players did not take us into the playoffs, resulting in us having higher picks.  Still, Linden would have thought, we'd have to like make three Calder Trophy contender picks in a row despite our traditional bad luck in the lottery.  What are the odds of that happening? .....oh wait.

 

So IMO Trevor was not technically wrong, by most every traditional experience.  It was a huge risk to rely on luck/smarts at the draft.  A draft where you've traded away more than you've acquired. But somehow, some way,  JB beat those odds by drafting this new young core.

 

So right now, we look good. As long as Markstrom and Boeser can come back and get back in mid season form for playoffs. That we make the playoffs.  As long as we don't look ahead two years, as far as cap room, and how many new viable prospects we need to be on ELCs to afford our core. Or how easy it will be to find and afford, and squeeze under our topped up cap, those players like a younger Simmonds or another Ferland,  (I think he's done) , replacements for minute eaters on D like Edler and Tanev. when we really need them as Petey, Hughes, and Boeser reach mid career form.

 

I don't mind giving up Madden for Toffoli. Especially with Boeser out now. If it was more, like another top prospect or Gaudette, for an aging rental, that would be too far IMO. But we might as well go for it now that we've already traded a #1 for Miller.  Its impossible to really evaluate deals involving draft picks until 3 or more years.  In fact its not even possible.  Too many variables, it also depends on where the team is as far as contention when a player rounds into form. ie..in three years time, in the last year of Miller's contract, that missing #1 pick may be ready to complete in the NHL, starting a long career, just at a time when Miller's contract is ending, and he's slowed down, not producing the same rate.  We may not have actually won the Cup yet! This might be a time when Petey and Hughes are at the peak of their careers and could use that new talented rookie more than a declining veteran. Plus be able to sign another newer version of Miller with that #1 rookie on an ELC.  Which is all to say again, JB has beat the odds by a combination of great luck/smarts at the draft lately, plus trading away part of our future talent to go all in now. Setting himself (or the next GM most likely) up with things to deal with to sustain our improvement as a team in the future.

 

But I can be two faced.  No problem. The team is all in this season, and so am I.   This team has pushed some problems to figure out in the future, fine.  If I have to put on a pair of blue and green blinders I'll do it.  Try and bite my tongue and enjoy the ride this season.  I can still walk down Robson in anticipation, and chew gum nervously at the same time.  Go Canucks Go!

 

man-with-blinders.jpg?w=676

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

Maybe our definition of rebuild is different.

 

Draft until there are enough players playing to fill in at least half the roster. Rebuild through the draft.

Done this way so most of the core are all within 3 years of age with each other, one or two exceptions. IMO with the number of over 30's and clause contracts on the team there is not enough high end players under 24 on the team. This is the same thing Benning said when he first started and he was referring to the Sedins as well.

With 7 first round picks there should be more than 3 on the team under 24 that have core potential.

 

It seems what you mean is the team is building with a couple of young players on it, but to me it seems the team will be doing that for ever never gaining much familiarity. Adding players every year is okay for the bottom six roles but the top six, IMO should be together up to 6 years.It is also something established team do to stay at the top.

 

As far as contender, I mean not just make the playoffs and hope. The team has to target to be amongst the best in the league, top 4 to 6, for that.

 

This team, I do think Benning has put together a good enough bottom six to have some success in the playoffs, as good as any team but they are old and fairly fragile, nearly every one of them has suffered injuries during their time here.

 

IMO I don't think the team will trade for the superstar class and I do harbor some disquiet as to what will happen in the playoffs. Just not enough depth quality. I do not want to hear about a injury derailing the effort f an entire season's worth of supporting them, all teams have injuries.

Name me a team who has half the team filled with drafted players.

Name me a team who has more than 3 players drafted within the last 7 drafts that are core players.

Name me a team who has more high end under 24 players on the team who are still rebuilding.

 

Your idea of a rebuild is flawed.  No team is built just on draft picks.  You need a mix of veterans and young players to make a team.  Not all players are gonna be drafted.  Some will be free agents.  

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57 minutes ago, Viper007 said:

Name me a team who has half the team filled with drafted players.

Name me a team who has more than 3 players drafted within the last 7 drafts that are core players.

Name me a team who has more high end under 24 players on the team who are still rebuilding.

 

Your idea of a rebuild is flawed.  No team is built just on draft picks.  You need a mix of veterans and young players to make a team.  Not all players are gonna be drafted.  Some will be free agents.  

Pittsburg, Chicago, Tampa just without looking, they all tanked

Last 7 drafts? That makes quite a list TO, Edm, Cal, Ariz, Col, Colum, Flo, Car, NJD, NYI, Win,

 

Agree not just draft picks, once established the picks are for polishing off the needs of the that is why teams that have been successful trade away picks to get specific needs.

But picks now are gold because of the cap, there are young players that can do the same a Roussel, Beagle or Sutter for a lot less money The very best players rarely get traded, how else to get McD, Eichel, Sequin, Kane, Crosby, Malkin or Ovy, they came through the draft and not in the 2nd round or even half way through the first.

 

58 minutes ago, kilgore said:

 

Jim did a lot of things wrong at first.  But luck or smarts, or a combination, in the draft, has saved his bacon.  As well, the Miller trade worked out about as good as it could.

 

Linden, if rumours are correct, wanted a more methodical, patient, build through the draft approach.  The reason, is the risk as you point out, that if you don't create a structure, on a rebuilding team, to protect future drafts and young prospects, even find ways to acquire more, and think you are ready to compete before you are, or think your older core only needs a couple more vets other teams don't want, to get back to the dance one more time, and you are shedding draft picks, and prospects to promote this, you may be facing yet another rebuild in a couple of years on,... a perpetual rebuild.

 

I'm guessing, but for Linden, it was too much of a risk. I mean, if you did this kind of retool on the fly, and had good vets > rookies, if you didn't make the playoffs as was the goal, or even got there but went out early, you'd probably be in mid pack, without a very high pick.  And so with that lower pick, you'd have to get very lucky to find new viable prospects.  This kind of "retool" could set a team in a rut for years. 

 

But what happened was whatever risk percentage, somehow Jim beat the incredible odds.  Started with his half measure retool failing miserably, our 'foundational' players did not take us into the playoffs, resulting in us having higher picks.  Still, Linden would have thought, we'd have to like make three Calder Trophy contender picks in a row despite our traditional bad luck in the lottery.  What are the odds of that happening? .....oh wait.

 

So IMO Trevor was not technically wrong, by most every traditional experience.  It was a huge risk to rely on luck/smarts at the draft.  A draft where you've traded away more than you've acquired. But somehow, some way,  JB beat those odds by drafting this new young core.

 

So right now, we look good. As long as Markstrom and Boeser can come back and get back in mid season form for playoffs. That we make the playoffs.  As long as we don't look ahead two years, as far as cap room, and how many new viable prospects we need to be on ELCs to afford our core. Or how easy it will be to find and afford, and squeeze under our topped up cap, those players like a younger Simmonds or another Ferland,  (I think he's done) , replacements for minute eaters on D like Edler and Tanev. when we really need them as Petey, Hughes, and Boeser reach mid career form.

 

I don't mind giving up Madden for Toffoli. Especially with Boeser out now. If it was more, like another top prospect or Gaudette, for an aging rental, that would be too far IMO. But we might as well go for it now that we've already traded a #1 for Miller.  Its impossible to really evaluate deals involving draft picks until 3 or more years.  In fact its not even possible.  Too many variables, it also depends on where the team is as far as contention when a player rounds into form. ie..in three years time, in the last year of Miller's contract, that missing #1 pick may be ready to complete in the NHL, starting a long career, just at a time when Miller's contract is ending, and he's slowed down, not producing the same rate.  We may not have actually won the Cup yet! This might be a time when Petey and Hughes are at the peak of their careers and could use that new talented rookie more than a declining veteran. Plus be able to sign another newer version of Miller with that #1 rookie on an ELC.  Which is all to say again, JB has beat the odds by a combination of great luck/smarts at the draft lately, plus trading away part of our future talent to go all in now. Setting himself (or the next GM most likely) up with things to deal with to sustain our improvement as a team in the future.

 

But I can be two faced.  No problem. The team is all in this season, and so am I.   This team has pushed some problems to figure out in the future, fine.  If I have to put on a pair of blue and green blinders I'll do it.  Try and bite my tongue and enjoy the ride this season.  I can still walk down Robson in anticipation, and chew gum nervously at the same time.  Go Canucks Go!

 

man-with-blinders.jpg?w=676

 

 

 

 

I think I see this rebuild as a re-tool after reading your post. That makes a lot more sense but still premature and I hope the team does well too because

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1 hour ago, kilgore said:

 

Jim did a lot of things wrong at first.  But luck or smarts, or a combination, in the draft, has saved his bacon.  As well, the Miller trade worked out about as good as it could.

 

Linden, if rumours are correct, wanted a more methodical, patient, build through the draft approach.  The reason, is the risk as you point out, that if you don't create a structure, on a rebuilding team, to protect future drafts and young prospects, even find ways to acquire more, and think you are ready to compete before you are, or think your older core only needs a couple more vets other teams don't want, to get back to the dance one more time, and you are shedding draft picks, and prospects to promote this, you may be facing yet another rebuild in a couple of years on,... a perpetual rebuild.

 

I'm guessing, but for Linden, it was too much of a risk. I mean, if you did this kind of retool on the fly, and had good vets > rookies, if you didn't make the playoffs as was the goal, or even got there but went out early, you'd probably be in mid pack, without a very high pick.  And so with that lower pick, you'd have to get very lucky to find new viable prospects.  This kind of "retool" could set a team in a rut for years. 

 

But what happened was whatever risk percentage, somehow Jim beat the incredible odds.  Started with his half measure retool failing miserably, our 'foundational' players did not take us into the playoffs, resulting in us having higher picks.  Still, Linden would have thought, we'd have to like make three Calder Trophy contender picks in a row despite our traditional bad luck in the lottery.  What are the odds of that happening? .....oh wait.

 

So IMO Trevor was not technically wrong, by most every traditional experience.  It was a huge risk to rely on luck/smarts at the draft.  A draft where you've traded away more than you've acquired. But somehow, some way,  JB beat those odds by drafting this new young core.

 

So right now, we look good. As long as Markstrom and Boeser can come back and get back in mid season form for playoffs. That we make the playoffs.  As long as we don't look ahead two years, as far as cap room, and how many new viable prospects we need to be on ELCs to afford our core. Or how easy it will be to find and afford, and squeeze under our topped up cap, those players like a younger Simmonds or another Ferland,  (I think he's done) , replacements for minute eaters on D like Edler and Tanev. when we really need them as Petey, Hughes, and Boeser reach mid career form.

 

I don't mind giving up Madden for Toffoli. Especially with Boeser out now. If it was more, like another top prospect or Gaudette, for an aging rental, that would be too far IMO. But we might as well go for it now that we've already traded a #1 for Miller.  Its impossible to really evaluate deals involving draft picks until 3 or more years.  In fact its not even possible.  Too many variables, it also depends on where the team is as far as contention when a player rounds into form. ie..in three years time, in the last year of Miller's contract, that missing #1 pick may be ready to complete in the NHL, starting a long career, just at a time when Miller's contract is ending, and he's slowed down, not producing the same rate.  We may not have actually won the Cup yet! This might be a time when Petey and Hughes are at the peak of their careers and could use that new talented rookie more than a declining veteran. Plus be able to sign another newer version of Miller with that #1 rookie on an ELC.  Which is all to say again, JB has beat the odds by a combination of great luck/smarts at the draft lately, plus trading away part of our future talent to go all in now. Setting himself (or the next GM most likely) up with things to deal with to sustain our improvement as a team in the future.

 

But I can be two faced.  No problem. The team is all in this season, and so am I.   This team has pushed some problems to figure out in the future, fine.  If I have to put on a pair of blue and green blinders I'll do it.  Try and bite my tongue and enjoy the ride this season.  I can still walk down Robson in anticipation, and chew gum nervously at the same time.  Go Canucks Go!

 

man-with-blinders.jpg?w=676

 

 

 

 

You forgot to mention that the purported Linden approach is risky as well. It does not guarantee that franchise level talents would for sure be drafted. Ottawa and Montreal have a lot of prospects but none of them are franchise level yet. You also forgot to mention that long rebuilds introduce a losing culture into a young locker room. Moreover, a long rebuild means that by the time your rebuild is done your earlier prospects are now approaching 30. What has Colorado, Edmonton, Arizona, Buffalo and Florida won so far?

 

My interpretation of the past events is that J.B. introduced a lot of veterans on longer term contracts because he DID NOT expect the rebuild to have gone so well so soon. Having Pettersson and Hughes kind of derailed his own timeline for the rebuild. I think he expected Pettersson to take at least another 1 or 2 seasons to be ready. They were not even sure Pettersson was ready to play as a centre.

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59 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

Pittsburg, Chicago, Tampa just without looking, they all tanked

Last 7 drafts? That makes quite a list TO, Edm, Cal, Ariz, Col, Colum, Flo, Car, NJD, NYI, Win,

 

Agree not just draft picks, once established the picks are for polishing off the needs of the that is why teams that have been successful trade away picks to get specific needs.

But picks now are gold because of the cap, there are young players that can do the same a Roussel, Beagle or Sutter for a lot less money The very best players rarely get traded, how else to get McD, Eichel, Sequin, Kane, Crosby, Malkin or Ovy, they came through the draft and not in the 2nd round or even half way through the first.

 

I think I see this rebuild as a re-tool after reading your post. That makes a lot more sense but still premature and I hope the team does well too because

Pittsburgh - 8 players drafted currently on team; Chicago - 9 players drafted currently on team; TB - 9 players drafted currently on team.   Those are not half the roster. Try again.

 

TO - 4 Core players (I'll give you this one); EDM - Maybe 3; CAL - 2 Core players; Ariz - 1 Core player; COL - 3 Core players; CLB - 2 Core players FLO - 2 Core players

Only Toronto has more than 3 players drafted (and that's if you count NYLANDER as a core player) in the first round in the last 7 drafts as core players.  Please try again.

Edited by Viper007
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57 minutes ago, Maddogy said:

 

You forgot to mention that the purported Linden approach is risky as well. It does not guarantee that franchise level talents would for sure be drafted. Ottawa and Montreal have a lot of prospects but none of them are franchise level yet. You also forgot to mention that long rebuilds introduce a losing culture into a young locker room. Moreover, a long rebuild means that by the time your rebuild is done your earlier prospects are now approaching 30. What has Colorado, Edmonton, Arizona, Buffalo and Florida won so far?

 

My interpretation of the past events is that J.B. introduced a lot of veterans on longer term contracts because he DID NOT expect the rebuild to have gone so well so soon. Having Pettersson and Hughes kind of derailed his own timeline for the rebuild. I think he expected Pettersson to take at least another 1 or 2 seasons to be ready. They were not even sure Pettersson was ready to play as a centre.

Fair points.

I'm not saying Linden would have been successful if he would have won out, just saying I do understand his reasoning.  Doesn't always work, but again, its playing the odds. I think, in general, teams that build through the draft, develop mostly their own core, end up with a more sustained winning culture for a longer period of time. Doesn't mean they win a Cup. Nothing is guaranteed.  Benning beat those odds back somewhat with those three drafts. And by all expectations, Podkolzin is also a keeper.  Heck, if JB keeps it up, he may escape his troubles by landing more 3rd or 4th round gems he can flip in the next few years for pieces when we need then.  That's why I can't get too negative, things change. Can't always get a clear view of even a couple of years ahead, through present day lenses. But some things will have to fall in place our way.

 

But as far as Jim not expecting the new blood in his accidental rebuild to have developed so well, so fast,  he actually thought we didn't need any rebuild at least for the first years. Or really ever. He never actually did strip the team down. All we needed was a couple of pieces, like Eriksson, Gagner, Vey, Larsen, Vrbata, Sutter, Schaller, Beagle, Rousell, as well as a host of more minor signings. Adding more cap chewing FAs every Summer.  The word "rebuild" was not even allowed to be uttered. So I think JB thought (every September) he'd built a team with a good enough veteran base to take us into the playoffs. You're right, he wasn't counting on picks being able to be the leaders on the team so soon. But I also think he was counting on "foundational" pieces to perform better too.  

 

Its going to be very interesting to see just how he can keep our important pieces here. And also be able to add quality toughness.

 

 

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