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Canuck D After the TDL

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JamesB
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28 minutes ago, JamesB said:

Okay, the trade deadline has come and gone and the Canuck D has the same top 7 guys now as it has had pretty much all season, although not in exactly the same order. Here is my read on the situation.

 

1. I am very happy that the Canucks did nothing to the D at the TDL. It would, of course, always be great to add someone really good, but that is either impossible to do at the TDL or too expensive.

 

2. In this case, there was a lot of talk about trading Stecher and maybe adding Tyson Barrie. The rumored asking price for Barrie was a first round pick AND a prospect. That is of course a ridiculous price so it is no surprise he did not move. (Barrie would have been a pure rental.)

 

3. On to Stecher. I was pleased to hear Benning say in his post-TDL press conference that he had NOT been shopping Stecher. He said that the Canucks received calls on Stecher and listened, but did not initiate anything. He added that he likes Stecher and commented on his high level of commitment and effort and his contribution to team chemistry. Maybe Benning was shading things a bit but he sounded fairly credible to me and I liked what he said. 

 

4. Some people were saying that the Canucks might want to trade Stecher because he would cost too much to qualify as an RFA and they would risk losing him for nothing as they did with Hutton last year. That argument is ridiculous. Stecher will cost $2.3 million to qualify (less that Hutton would have cost last summer). He has being playing top 4 most of the season and doing a good job, including a long stretch when he and Edler were playing shutdown, although Hughes and Tanev have taken over that role. He has arbitration rights but loves being here and would probably sign at a reasonable cap hit. If you can get a solid top 4 D for 2.3 or even 3 million, that is a great deal and you take it. (Hutton would have cost 2.8 to qualilfy and Stecher is better offensively and defensively than Hutton). And if Stecher won't sign for a reasonable amount he would always be tradeable in the summer (unlike Hutton). Why weaken the defence now? Frankly, I would not trade Stecher as an RFA for Tyson Barrie as a rental straight up as Stecher is better defensively and that is the biggest concern on D right now.

 

5. Benning also talked about Hughes and indicated that he has been good all year but raised his game after the all-star break and just keeps getting better, surprising even Benning by how good he has become. One very important fact is that he and Tanev have taken over the primary shutdown pairing and, despite that, his +/- has improved and his scoring rate has improved. Last year EP had a great year but began to wear down about this point in the season (but still won the Calder easily). Hughes just keeps improving and is now clearly the Calder favorite.

 

6. There is a lot of concern today about Marky's injury. The concern is that the D has been allowing too many high quality chances and that Marky has bailed the team out. Unfortunately, there is a lot of validity to that concern. Here are some numbers. Right now, the Canucks are 12th in NHL in the winning percentage -- solidly in playoff position. They are 8th in goals for per 60 minutes and 13th in goals against per 60. But they are 21st in high danger chances against per 60. And, if we use expected goals against, which is probably the best available measure of defensive performance, it is even worse, as the Canucks are 28th in the league. So, yes, that is a problem.

 

7. Here are the numbers for expected goals against per 60 minutes on ice at 5-on-5 (from Natural Stat Trick). Keep in mind that low is good.

 

Hughes: 2.27

Tanev: 2.51

Stecher: 2.55

Edler: 2.57

Myers: 2.59

Fantenberg: 2.71

Benn: 2.9

 

Okay, Hughes is having a fantastic season DEFENSIVELY as well as offensively. These numbers should really be adjusted for quality of opposition. That would make Hughes look even better. Tanev (his partner) deserves some credit, but Tanev is having a good season in part because of Hughes. And note that Stecher is third. (In fairness, Tanev, Stecher, Edler and Myers are all similar.) If you take quality of opposition into account, Myers would drop a bit and Fantenberg and Benn would drop quite a bit. But Fantenberg is a lot better than Benn.

 

My point here is that by playing Fantenberg instead of Benn and by playing Hughes and Tanev as the shutdown pair, the D has improved. And the addition of Toffoli to the forwards won't hurt, although the EP line was already very good in not allowing many chances against. The Horvat line was also good. The bottom two forward lines have given up a lot of high danger chances per 60 minutes. 

 

8. In the presser, Benning said that Myers has been "excellent" and some of the talking heads said something similar. That is not true. Myers has been okay to pretty good, and was a significant upgrade as the third pairing RD. But the Stecher/Edler pairing has been better than the Myers/Edler pairing was. I would also add that on the PK, Stecher has the best expected goals against per 60 on the team and. in terms of actual goals against per 60 is second after Motte. I would give Stecher more PK minutes.

 

8. In the presser, Benning mentioned MacEwen a couple of times. In terms of expected goals against per 60 at 5-on-5, Big Mac is ahead of Virtanen, Roussel, Motte and Schaller (who is now gone). I think Big Mac should be in the line-up. His defensive play has come a long way and of course he contributes a lot to the physical game and can put a few points on the board as well. I assume that Eriksson will stay on the Horvat line for now, but I would seriously consider putting Big Mac in for Roussel, who has struggled this season since coming back from surgery.

 

9. Finally, Benning said that rather than add D from outside at the deadline, he would rather give some guys in Utica a look. That sounds good to me. Rafferty and Brisebois probably both deserve a look.

 

Bottom line: Yes, the D is a concern with Marky out. Hope he is not out long. But the general trend is positive.

I think staying pat on the defence was a good idea, if they had added I was hoping it wasn't a big name just some depth

I agree with JB the Depth should come from Utica

This is year 1 of a 7-10 year window

 

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2 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

1) your not a mod

2) this is posted hours after the TD and if you are on this forum you most likely already know what has happen on TD day

 

3) the first paragraph says nothing happen. So it took you 10 seconds to figure out what the post was about after that you could have left

 

Some people can’t help but to display how ridiculous they are never mind the “Center of attention” complex in perfect form....

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Best case scenario, for me, when the playoffs start:

 

Miller - Pettersson - Boeser

Pearson - Horvat - Toffoli

Virtanen - Sutter - Gaudette

Roussel - Beagle - Motte

Eriksson

 

Edler - Myers

Hughes - Tanev

Tryamkin - Stecher

Fantenberg

Benn

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

It's possible Boeser and Markstrom are back in time. I would actually like MacEwen in there as well, but only so many spots.

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8 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

understands he got one of the top available players for a song

This is a good point. Benning already got one of the best players before anyone else even started trading. When I think about Stecher vs Barrie, I think Stecher will negotiate a very reasonable deal, because he loves Vancouver and playing for his home team. Barrie would likely be gone in the off season. Stecher is also better defensively, and good defence wins championships. Good luck with that TOR. I can't wait for the Canucks to unleash Tryamkin heading into the playoffs. (well, I hope anyway) Myers and Tryamkin on the back end? Those are some big bodies gentlemen. 

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23 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

The simple fact that nothing was done at all shows that Benning read a bare market, saw the ask and prices; arguably understands he got one of the top available players for a song compared to other trades and stood pat.

 

Sometimes when you do things right, people won't be sure if you've done anything at all.

Nice one.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

loui.

 

 

 

 

 

 

no but seriously I like this statement Hip.

 

well said.

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1 hour ago, coastal.view said:

i am trying to avoid these sorts of threads

the title suggested that there was a change

there is not

 

this is a heavy trade day with a lot of breaking news

i'd appreciate a bit more honesty in the title banner for a thread on a day like today

 

but you do these boards how you wish

and i'll post my views when i feel misled or have some other response i wish to make known

 

 

 

I do not Know Coastal

The Title us the " Canuck D after the TDL". Pretty self explanatory 

 

As for our D after the TDL

With the addition of Tyler Toffoli, who is a driver, I see that totally benefiting our Defense, and making them better

so, although not about our Defense, the Defense should be better, IMO

 

As for moving or adding a Dman, I think Benning did well. It may indicate that Tryamkin is coming.

Don't think for a second, that Diamond and him are not talking term...…..and he may be our addition alter on

 

It will be interesting to me to see if either of these come to fruition/????

 

To be honest, I am interested to see how CDC thought this TDL went

 

I think it wen well

 

Loosing Markstrom for an extended period of time...well that is just another matter

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1 hour ago, coastal.view said:

i am trying to avoid these sorts of threads

the title suggested that there was a change

there is not

 

this is a heavy trade day with a lot of breaking news

i'd appreciate a bit more honesty in the title banner for a thread on a day like today

 

but you do these boards how you wish

and i'll post my views when i feel misled or have some other response i wish to make known

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Arrow 1983 said:

... if you are on this forum you most likely already know what has happened on TD day

 

3) the first paragraph says nothing happen. So it took you 10 seconds to figure out what the post was about after that you could have left

 

I am sorry if the title of this thread confused anyone. As @Arrow 1983 suggests, I was assuming that anyone currently on CDC would be aware that Benning decided to stand pat at the TDL. The idea of this thread is basically: "where are we now that the trade deadline has passed and we know how the D will look for the stretch run?" But that is kind of long for a title.  And, as Arrow also said, I stated in the first line of the post that there were no changes to the D, so anyone who was confused by the title would not have been confused for long. But, anyway, my apologies if anyone feels their time was wasted. 

 

With Marky out, I think the issues facing the D are real, which leads to the following post from Nucker67:

 

 

1 hour ago, NUCKER67 said:

Best case scenario, for me, when the playoffs start:

 

Miller - Pettersson - Boeser

Pearson - Horvat - Toffoli

Virtanen - Sutter - Gaudette

Roussel - Beagle - Motte

Eriksson

 

Edler - Myers

Hughes - Tanev

Tryamkin - Stecher

Fantenberg

Benn

 

Markstrom

Demko

 

It's possible Boeser and Markstrom are back in time. I would actually like MacEwen in there as well, but only so many spots.

Nucker suggests moving Sutter to 3C for the playoffs. I have been thinking about that. I would be inclined to try that now. I have never been a big Sutter fan, but he has been playing  pretty well since coming back from his latest injury. He is definitely better defensively than Gaudette. I know that Benning and Green see Gaudette as a center and want to develop him in that role. But it would not hurt to put him on the wing for the stretch drive. I think that would help team defence. Sutter is not a great playmaker, but those 3 guys (Sutter, Gaudette and Virtanen) should be able to generate reasonable secondary scoring. 

 

As for the 4th line, I would still be inclined to try MacEwen instead of Roussel, I think Eriksson will stay on the Horvat line until Boeser comes back. After that I would probably move Eriksson to the 4th line as he is good defensively and he is good on the PK, which makes it worth while to have him in the line-up.

 

Finally, yes it would be nice to slot Tryamkin in. Hope he comes back this season. Fantenberg has been pretty good, but Tryamkin gives a dimension that is hard to match in size and strength in addition to solid defensive play.  

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2 hours ago, the grinder said:

well of course we did nothing to fix the defense  , because we had to go a get a back up goalie  which cost us our last  trading chip that 3rd rounder , so  I hope big nikita comes back  soon

The trade was 1 for 1 - the Canucks still have their 3rd round pick. 

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