Boudrias Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 48 minutes ago, nuckin_futz said: Bourdria, stop fighting and just sit back and enjoy as they reinflate the bubble to even more glorious levels. Soon enough the virus will disipate and interest rates will be near zero everywhere and the cheap money will flow like wine. Oh yeah, no one is allowed to go bankrupt either........... Bailout nation takes flight Tue 10 Mar 2020 17:58:48 GMT The White House is already talking about bailing out oil companies The Washington Post reports that White House officials are alarmed at the prospect of deeply-indebted shale companies going out of business. They are considering a bailout that includes low-interest government loans with lines of credit to major financial institutions. I joked about this early today and it's already happening. Banks and oil companies are already getting a bailout. The grand total on this is going to be insane. Take the over: The US was running a $1 trillion deficit before the virus hit and earlier today Trump was already talking about bailing out the cruise ship industry. The record deficit in the financial crisis was $1.413 trillion. The cost of the payroll tax holiday that's being floated is $300 billion. ********************* Why would you bailout the cruise ship industry? Airlines I can see. That's an essential service but cruise lines? GTFO Here's another good headline .......... "Trump tells GOP he wants the payroll tax waived through the election" <-------------- hahahahahah It is in my nature to be nervous. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BPA Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 A 'nuclear-sized event' for Alberta The oil market has seen arguments like this before. In 2014, OPEC held off production cuts in order to hold onto market share in the face of a resurgent U.S. oil industry. That led oil to tumble from over $100 US a barrel to below $40 by 2015. But experts say this drop is much more dramatic. "This is a really big move. I was an energy trader for 15 years. I don't have all the daily moves in my head, but this would definitely be one of the biggest ones I've seen," Shaffer said. Martin Pelletier, a portfolio manager with Trivest Wealth Council in Calgary, said this is a "nuclear-sized event" for an already-hurting Alberta, and if not contained, the economic malaise could spread to the rest of the country. "This could be the knock-out punch for Alberta, unfortunately," Pelletier said, adding that some companies might not survive the hit. "We're going to really need to see some leadership coming out of Ottawa, and I mean both the Bank of Canada and [Prime Minister Justin] Trudeau and the government … This is a crisis; this is a very serious event." Pelletier said he'd like to see both a large fiscal spending program tailored to impacted provinces and an emergency rate cut. Richard Masson, the chair of the World Petroleum Council, said some Canadian companies are in a better spot than their U.S. counterparts because of a pipeline crunch that has forced them to contain growth, pay down debts and look for efficiencies. Still, he too thinks the federal government needs to get involved to prevent a crisis, as financing continues to dry up. "We're going to need some support, or we're going to lose a lot of our native companies, and we won't be able to bounce back when prices recover," said Masson. "One of the things they're probably going to have to look at is can they provide loans to companies to get them through?" The Alberta government's recent spring budget forecasts WTI will average $58 US a barrel in the coming year, and Shaffer said this is bad news both for the economy as a whole and for the province's royalty revenues. "Roughly every dollar [per barrel] is about $350 million to the government … We're talking about a $7 billion decline in revenue expectations," he said, adding that about $2 billion is made up from the improved differential and the Canadian dollar, so the net hit would be about $5 billion. Some experts are predicting even lower numbers could be on the way. Ali Khedery, a former Exxon adviser and now CEO of strategy firm Dragoman Ventures, tweeted "$20 oil in 2020 is coming" after news broke of Saudi Arabia's plans to hike production. Shaffer said seeing such a wide difference in price forecasts after the province's budget dropped just weeks ago makes a strong case for the government to change how royalty revenues are budgeted and push for further economic diversification. "If this is prolonged, you'll see continued job layoffs and effects on families. One of the really important things I'll stress is having an economy that isn't dependent on the outcome of a price war between the Saudis and the Russians …. I hope it's yet another wake-up call in terms of the efforts to diversify our economy," he said. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 1 hour ago, nuckin_futz said: I don't recall anything in Iceland regarding a foreign housing project. Been a long time since I read up on it though. Basically the whole issue was Iceland tried to re-invent itself as a European banking capital and when a bunch of fishermen do that the end result kinda has to be pretty bad. The wave of bad debt in 07-08 swamped them and that was all she wrote. There is an excellent article on the whole situation that you might enjoy. It's written by Michael Lewis (The Big Short, Moneyball, The Blind Side) so it's endlessly entertaining. I highly recommend it. Might reread it myself. One of my favorite lines from that story ......... "You have to understand,” he told me, “Iceland is no longer a country . It is a hedge fund.” https://delong.typepad.com/lewis-2009-wall-street-on-the-tundra.pdf Regarding defaults. Lebanon just defaulted. But everyone kind of saw that coming and Lebanon is tiny. You're not wrong. They had allowed their banks to wildly over extend themselves including opening branches in the UK. It was one small domino effect that started with the smallest piece falling away. The over leveraged banks just couldn't keep up to the run when it occurred. Having the largest loan holders also sitting on the board of directors didn't help either. There was so much shady crap going on but in the end it was one small defaulted issue that lead to the overall cascade 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancaster Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 4 hours ago, RowdyCanuck said: Putin isn't crazy enough to blow one of those tankers up I hope ha..... smart play though dropping the USA name ha im kinda surprised they are going to the states since trump is best friend with Putin , oops I mean rumoured friends ha Easy.... just say the tankers are carrying the corona virus. Or.... just start egging on the Iranians to close the Straight of Hormuz. Maybe even having a few dozen rockets strike the refineries and stuff in Saudi Arabia "from Yemen". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyCanuck Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 2 hours ago, Lancaster said: Easy.... just say the tankers are carrying the corona virus. Or.... just start egging on the Iranians to close the Straight of Hormuz. Maybe even having a few dozen rockets strike the refineries and stuff in Saudi Arabia "from Yemen". Ha that sounds right up trumps ally ha fake news lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Markets down again. Oil started low and is bouncing like a yoyo. Gas prices nationally in Canada expected to drop on average 7 cents a litre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 Saudi Aramco receives directive to increase maximum sustainable capacity to 13 mil bpd Wed 11 Mar 2020 06:58:29 GMT That is up from 12 mil bpd before this The firm says they are to raise production capacity to 13 mil bpd and will exert 'maximum efforts' to implement the directive from the Ministry of Energy as soon as possible. Oil has already eased from earlier gains above $36 to $34.50 currently and the latest developments here won't provide much added comfort on the day. .................... US crude oil inventories show a build of 7.664M vs 1.7M estimate Inventories get reported every Wednesday so this isn't a real big deal. But it is kinda sad that before the market gets flooded with oil, it's already flooded with oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancaster Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 One major winner in all this: China One major loser in all this: Venezuela China lent lots of money to Venezuela and the repayment is with oil. Now that oil prices has tanked even more.... expect the oil rich nation to suffer further gas/oil shortage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, Lancaster said: One major winner in all this: China One major loser in all this: Venezuela China lent lots of money to Venezuela and the repayment is with oil. Now that oil prices has tanked even more.... expect the oil rich nation to suffer further gas/oil shortage. India is probably loving this too as they are a large importer of oil. Venezuela has the largest proven oil reserves on the planet, even larger than Saudi Arabia. Such unbelievable mismanagement there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Strome Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 1 hour ago, Lancaster said: One major winner in all this: China One major loser in all this: Venezuela China lent lots of money to Venezuela and the repayment is with oil. Now that oil prices has tanked even more.... expect the oil rich nation to suffer further gas/oil shortage. They will likely be absolutely bankrupt. 1 hour ago, nuckin_futz said: India is probably loving this too as they are a large importer of oil. Venezuela has the largest proven oil reserves on the planet, even larger than Saudi Arabia. Such unbelievable mismanagement there. Hmm I wonder what the reasoning could be.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 3 hours ago, nuckin_futz said: Saudi Aramco receives directive to increase maximum sustainable capacity to 13 mil bpd Wed 11 Mar 2020 06:58:29 GMT That is up from 12 mil bpd before this The firm says they are to raise production capacity to 13 mil bpd and will exert 'maximum efforts' to implement the directive from the Ministry of Energy as soon as possible. Oil has already eased from earlier gains above $36 to $34.50 currently and the latest developments here won't provide much added comfort on the day. .................... US crude oil inventories show a build of 7.664M vs 1.7M estimate Inventories get reported every Wednesday so this isn't a real big deal. But it is kinda sad that before the market gets flooded with oil, it's already flooded with oil. Not sure if they have the capacity for 13 million. More important what does this do to countries so dependent on oil revenue? Iran, Iraq, Venezuela, Nigeria, could go on, Libya. Extreme instability. Throw the virus on top. Iran has already blamed the virus on the USA and the Saudis. Another missle attack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishopshodan Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 I could see Russia asking their sidekick Iran to cause some trouble in the ME as a wag of the finger at SA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 15 minutes ago, Boudrias said: Not sure if they have the capacity for 13 million. More important what does this do to countries so dependent on oil revenue? Iran, Iraq, Venezuela, Nigeria, could go on, Libya. Extreme instability. Throw the virus on top. Iran has already blamed the virus on the USA and the Saudis. Another missle attack? Ask and ye shall receive. 10 rockets fall inside base housing US personnel Wed 11 Mar 2020 17:38:51 GMT Let's toss a war onto this bonfire The Iraqi army says 10 katyusha rockets struck Camp Taji. It's located 27km north of Baghdad. It houses US forces and members of the Iraqi Army and Iraqi National Guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 4 hours ago, nuckin_futz said: Ask and ye shall receive. 10 rockets fall inside base housing US personnel Wed 11 Mar 2020 17:38:51 GMT Let's toss a war onto this bonfire The Iraqi army says 10 katyusha rockets struck Camp Taji. It's located 27km north of Baghdad. It houses US forces and members of the Iraqi Army and Iraqi National Guard. Jebus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shift-4 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Jerk 1: I'm getting bored Jerk 2: Me too Jerk 1: This coronavirus will get stale soon Jerk 2: I got an idea. Let's really &^@# with the world and tank oil! Jerk 1: Hell's yeah! Footage of discussion Spoiler 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Welcome to 2020 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuckin_futz Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 19 minutes ago, aGENT said: Jebus More on the rocket attack in Iraq - death toll Wed 11 Mar 2020 20:39:23 GMT Updating on the rocket attack - two US and one UK service members said to be dead approximately 12 others injured Info via Reuters, citing two unnamed US officials: speaking on the condition of anonymity stressed that this was initial information and could change. 15 small rockets hit Iraq's Taji military camp north of Baghdad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldoescobar Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 10 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Welcome to 2020 ...and behold a pale horse, and he that sat on him was death, and hell followed with him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedestroyerofworlds Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 16 hours ago, Ronaldoescobar said: ...and behold a pale horse, and he that sat on him was death, and hell followed with him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 the WTI down over $2 today alone. It's starting to get even uglier too with reports coming out of India Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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