GREEN DOES NOT MEAN GO

[knucklehead91]

 Sure at a traffic stop, green means go. However when it comes to Head Coach Travis Green, it does not mean go.

Why the demand to fire Travis Green??? The amount of hate and criticism for a coach with only a few years under his belt is absolutely ludicrous. Especially when it comes to the previous two seasons of not having much to work with.  This team has gone from bottom 10 in the NHL last year, to competing for a playoff spot. Yes we have gone through our stretches of struggling to win, score or close out games, but this is still a very young and inexperienced team which is learning game by game and contributes to the losses. We did add some NHL experience in the off-season as well as grabbing Toffoli, but this team lacks experience. Which we will inevitably gain more and more as the season goes on and into the following year. 

There are a number of players who are having career years under Travis Greens system and as painful as Newell Browns PP may seem at times, we have one of the best PPs in the league and have the 2nd most PP goals in the NHL.

Players having career years/flourishing under Current coaching systems

JT Miller 69GP 27g 45a 72pts         Previous best 82GP 22g 34a 56pts

Pettersson 68GP 27g 39a 66pts     Previous best 71GP 28g 38a 66pts - Matched his rookie season in fewer games with 13GR

Pearson 69GP 21g 24a 45pts         Previous best 80GP 24g 20a 44pts - Surpassed his career best in 11 fewer games with 13GR

Virtanen 69GP 18g 18a 36pts         Previous best 70GP 15g 10a 25pts - Surpassed his career best in 1 fewer game with 13GR

*Gaudette 59GP 12g 21a 33pts      Previous best 56GP 5g 7a - 12pts - DESTROYED his previous year. Has as many goals as he did points

*Hughes 68GP 8g 45a 53pts          Rookie season

*Leivo 36GP 7g 12a 19pts              Previous best 49GP 10g 8a 18pts - Surpassed his career best in 13 fewer games

*Tanev 69GP 2g 18a 20pts             Previous best 70GP 2g 18A  20pts - matched his career best in 1 fewer game with 13GR

*Boeser 57GP 16g 29a 45pts         Previous best 62GP 26g 30a 56pts - Was on pace for 65pts

*Horvat 69GP 22g 31a 53pts          Previous best 82GP 27g 34a 61pts - On pace for 63 pts

 

So there are 5 players who have already beaten their career highs this season. Miller, Pearson, Virtanen, Gaudette and Leivo. Two who have matched their career highs with games remaining, Tanev and Pettersson. To add to that we have Boeser who was on pace prior to injury to surpass his career high on a "down year". Horvat has been heavily relied upon defensively this year and is on pace for 63pts which will be a new career high. Then we have Hughes in his rookie season who has been better than expected and under our current systems has been lights out in his debut, he is reaching milestones that have him in the record books both NHL and franchise milestones. Every player listed above has been on track to hit or surpass career highs under Green, Baumer and Browns systems. To boot, Tanev has remained healthy for a consistent 69 games up until last night, where he sustained an LBI and is listed week to week. He should see a career high in games and points. Previous years he has been in and out sporadically due to injury, this year he has lasted 69 games.

A TOTAL OF 9 PLAYERS MOST OF WHICH ARE IN THE TOP 6 ON PACE TO HIT NEW CAREER HIGHS OR HAVE ALREADY DONE SO. Under Coach Green and co.

 

Not only have the players hit personal highs, but the team as a whole over the past 4 years under Green have hit better numbers.

Currently as it stands we are sporting a record of

19-20  20th  36-27-6  ROW:31               GF: 228        GA: 217           PP: 3rd @ 24.1%       PPG: 57          PK: 16th @ 80.5%

18-19  23rd 35-36-11 ROW:29               GF: 219        GA: 248           PP: 22nd @17.1%     PPG: 43          PK: 11th @ 81.1%

17-18  26th 31-40-11 ROW: 31              GF: 218        GA: 259           PP: 9th  @21.5%       PPG: 53          PK: 21st @ 78.3%

16-17  29th 30-43-9  ROW: 26              GF: 178         GA: 241           PP: 29th @14.1%      PPG: 32          PK: 28th @76.7%

 

Players are achieving more personally, the team is winning more, scoring more, being scored against less and the PP is working. ALL OF WHICH IS IN 13 FEWER GAMES

Have faith in the Coaching staff, the players such as Boeser who are "struggling" and remain patient. We have 13 games of anticipation of playoffs, rather than 13 more games of "DAMNIT WE NEED TO LOSE FOR THE LOTTO"

 

GO CANUCKS GO

 

 

[DownUndaCanuck]

I agree that he has done admirably with these young players and plays a fast-tempo, exciting, aggressive style. This is why our offensive numbers are flourishing.

 

My only problem with Green is that he hasn't adapted to loss of Markstrom and personel changes, and has not been very good at defending. Whether that's Green's fault or Baumgartner, this team needs better structure in defence, not just from the 6 guys on the blueline but from forwards too.

 

I don't think we need to fire Green (unless he miraculously bows us out of the playoffs, then it's worth considering) but he needs to learn that we should not be "going" for it all the time, and that a 2-man forecheck and having a high center is a risky way to play the game. Now with Marky and Tanev out, arguably our two best defenders so to speak, I hope he learns his lesson from some disgraceful losses and learns when to "go" and when to not.

 

As young as these players are, Green is learning in the NHL as well and this being his first playoff drive, he's learning what it takes to win but sadly not changing his style of play very much. He's sticking to his guns, and rightly so at times, but let's see if it makes the playoffs or not. I'd be ecstatic if this style brings us more victories and we make the playoffs, but if we don't Green is going to be closely scrutinized for not adjusting his gameplay when we needed to.

[Nucker 67]

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

 

Edit - and Miller

Edited March 12, 2020 by NUCKER67

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

We are one of the worst teams defending the rush.  Green has employed a system of forecheck that gets our forwards (too often) trapped in the ozone.  We are obviously as a result vulnerable to the rush.  It’s a stupid system at the NHL level.  Yes, it creates the odd turnover, but mostly it gets us heavily outshot, vastly out possessed of the puck, and chasing the game in our own zone.  Green and his systems must go.  

[Tre Mac]

5 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

I thank both of them.

[EdgarM]

39 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

 

Edit - and Miller

I would add Marky to that list. If he didn't stand on his head, a few times , we would have been in trouble. Without those 3 though, we would be in bad shape.

[Hairy Kneel]

52 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

 

Edit - and Miller

And EP who takes the tough checking away from the others.

[knucklehead91]

46 minutes ago, Alflives said:

We are one of the worst teams defending the rush.  Green has employed a system of forecheck that gets our forwards (too often) trapped in the ozone.  We are obviously as a result vulnerable to the rush.  It’s a stupid system at the NHL level.  Yes, it creates the odd turnover, but mostly it gets us heavily outshot, vastly out possessed of the puck, and chasing the game in our own zone.  Green and his systems must go.  

For the first half if not more, we were outshooting teams by a large margin.

We are still a young team who misses defensive zone assignments and get caught getting too fancy.

 

Not only is this a fairly inexperienced team, but its also almost an entirely new team with the amount of players we have added and injected into the lineup. It could use a bit more chemistry to read off each others tendencies in our own zone.

We have also allowed the fewest goals against when they opposing team pulls their goalie in an attempt to tie the game. 
It took us up til late December or January I think it was, to allow a goal against when the opposition pulls the goalie.

[Curmudgeon]

If the season is cancelled, nothing changes. Green will be back. Deal with it. If the season is suspended and the playoffs are held, I don’t know who makes it, but if the Canucks are outside, Green still stays.  Deal with it.

[coastal.view]

no coach will be fired

this season is going to be interrupted

new priorities surge to the forefront

 

i wish green, the nucks organization, and all of us

perseverance in taking all necessary personal and other steps

to protect ourselves and others from the virus

so we all make it safely to the other side of this health crisis

then we can again debate the less important life issue

of green's performance as a coach in a game

that is only a small aspect of the game of life

Edited March 12, 2020 by coastal.view

[Alflives]

30 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

For the first half if not more, we were outshooting teams by a large margin.

We are still a young team who misses defensive zone assignments and get caught getting too fancy.

 

Not only is this a fairly inexperienced team, but its also almost an entirely new team with the amount of players we have added and injected into the lineup. It could use a bit more chemistry to read off each others tendencies in our own zone.

We have also allowed the fewest goals against when they opposing team pulls their goalie in an attempt to tie the game. 
It took us up til late December or January I think it was, to allow a goal against when the opposition pulls the goalie.

We are actually an older team.  The forecheck is designed to have puck pressure on the D, even if he has puck on stick and his head is up.  That’s okay, but Green adds taking away the partner pass.  That opens up the longer pass to fast moving forwards.  Now we are stuck defending three on three.  Given the skill and speed of NHL players, or D are forced to back in.  The other team now has tonnes of space above our face off dots for cross ice plays (which are the most dangerous in the NHL).  Add to that we have several old and slow forwards who are too often beat up the ice by the other teams’ D, and we are totally open to a D man coming late.  It’s just a stupid system st the NHL level.  It’s doomed to failure, especially as the intensity of games Ramps up.  

[khay]

2 hours ago, knucklehead91 said:

 Sure at a traffic stop, green means go. However when it comes to Head Coach Travis Green, it does not mean go.

Why the demand to fire Travis Green??? The amount of hate and criticism for a coach with only a few years under his belt is absolutely ludicrous. Especially when it comes to the previous two seasons of not having much to work with.  This team has gone from bottom 10 in the NHL last year, to competing for a playoff spot. Yes we have gone through our stretches of struggling to win, score or close out games, but this is still a very young and inexperienced team which is learning game by game and contributes to the losses. We did add some NHL experience in the off-season as well as grabbing Toffoli, but this team lacks experience. Which we will inevitably gain more and more as the season goes on and into the following year. 

There are a number of players who are having career years under Travis Greens system and as painful as Newell Browns PP may seem at times, we have one of the best PPs in the league and have the 2nd most PP goals in the NHL.

Players having career years/flourishing under Current coaching systems

JT Miller 69GP 27g 45a 72pts         Previous best 82GP 22g 34a 56pts

Pettersson 68GP 27g 39a 66pts     Previous best 71GP 28g 38a 66pts - Matched his rookie season in fewer games with 13GR

Pearson 69GP 21g 24a 45pts         Previous best 80GP 24g 20a 44pts - Surpassed his career best in 11 fewer games with 13GR

Virtanen 69GP 18g 18a 36pts         Previous best 70GP 15g 10a 25pts - Surpassed his career best in 1 fewer game with 13GR

*Gaudette 59GP 12g 21a 33pts      Previous best 56GP 5g 7a - 12pts - DESTROYED his previous year. Has as many goals as he did points

*Hughes 68GP 8g 45a 53pts          Rookie season

*Leivo 36GP 7g 12a 19pts              Previous best 49GP 10g 8a 18pts - Surpassed his career best in 13 fewer games

*Tanev 69GP 2g 18a 20pts             Previous best 70GP 2g 18A  20pts - matched his career best in 1 fewer game with 13GR

*Boeser 57GP 16g 29a 45pts         Previous best 62GP 26g 30a 56pts - Was on pace for 65pts

*Horvat 69GP 22g 31a 53pts          Previous best 82GP 27g 34a 61pts - On pace for 63 pts

 

So there are 5 players who have already beaten their career highs this season. Miller, Pearson, Virtanen, Gaudette and Leivo. Two who have matched their career highs with games remaining, Tanev and Pettersson. To add to that we have Boeser who was on pace prior to injury to surpass his career high on a "down year". Horvat has been heavily relied upon defensively this year and is on pace for 63pts which will be a new career high. Then we have Hughes in his rookie season who has been better than expected and under our current systems has been lights out in his debut, he is reaching milestones that have him in the record books both NHL and franchise milestones. Every player listed above has been on track to hit or surpass career highs under Green, Baumer and Browns systems. To boot, Tanev has remained healthy for a consistent 69 games up until last night, where he sustained an LBI and is listed week to week. He should see a career high in games and points. Previous years he has been in and out sporadically due to injury, this year he has lasted 69 games.

A TOTAL OF 9 PLAYERS MOST OF WHICH ARE IN THE TOP 6 ON PACE TO HIT NEW CAREER HIGHS OR HAVE ALREADY DONE SO. Under Coach Green and co.

 

Not only have the players hit personal highs, but the team as a whole over the past 4 years under Green have hit better numbers.

Currently as it stands we are sporting a record of

19-20  20th  36-27-6  ROW:31               GF: 228        GA: 217           PP: 3rd @ 24.1%       PPG: 57          PK: 16th @ 80.5%

18-19  23rd 35-36-11 ROW:29               GF: 219        GA: 248           PP: 22nd @17.1%     PPG: 43          PK: 11th @ 81.1%

17-18  26th 31-40-11 ROW: 31              GF: 218        GA: 259           PP: 9th  @21.5%       PPG: 53          PK: 21st @ 78.3%

16-17  29th 30-43-9  ROW: 26              GF: 178         GA: 241           PP: 29th @14.1%      PPG: 32          PK: 28th @76.7%

 

Players are achieving more personally, the team is winning more, scoring more, being scored against less and the PP is working. ALL OF WHICH IS IN 13 FEWER GAMES

Have faith in the Coaching staff, the players such as Boeser who are "struggling" and remain patient. We have 13 games of anticipation of playoffs, rather than 13 more games of "DAMNIT WE NEED TO LOSE FOR THE LOTTO"

 

GO CANUCKS GO

 

 

Offence is not the problem with Green. In fact, the forechecking style that he implemented is really good when it works. The thing is in the NHL, other teams adjust very fast so your system always needs tweaking depending on who you are playing against.

 

And it seems like most people that aren't convinced about him are concerned about his defensive system and I think the breakouts. If we didn't have Hughes and Miller, I think our inefficient breakout plan would have been further magnified.

 

I don't think we should fire him now but if we miss the playoffs, he needs to be evaluated. If the management feels that Green should be given one more year even if we miss the playoffs, I'm OK with that. This is the first year he actually was given a good roster, the previous two, he wasn't given much to work with.

 

[Warhippy]

So we're clear.  We have how many players having career seasons currently?

 

But we're still out fo the playoffs.

 

Let that sink in.

 

Meanwhile allow me to only play Hughes for 15 seconds in the last ten minutes and seat Petterson in the final 2:30 of the game in place of Roussel and let's pretend coaching isn't an issue

[Devron]

I like the thread but it doesn’t matter. Season is most likely done. Green will be back. If things don’t go well he will be gone and we can blame the next guy.
 

Playoffs are an absolute must next year  so JB won’t be just letting it play out. If theres uncertainties he will be gone. Unlike some I will be cheering for him to be successful and see how it goes 

[coastal.view]

20 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

So we're clear.  We have how many players having career seasons currently?

 

But we're still out fo the playoffs.

 

Let that sink in.

 

Meanwhile allow me to only play Hughes for 15 seconds in the last ten minutes and seat Petterson in the final 2:30 of the game in place of Roussel and let's pretend coaching isn't an issue

don't be stupid

hughes was dealing with an injury

we are all aware of that now

you are not though ???

 

maybe ep40 was in a similar situation?

 

i get wishing to criticize green

but let's not use alternate facts to do so

 

[JeremyCuddles]

Career years from like 5-10 guys and we are barely holding onto a wild card spot in arguably one of the weaker divisions. Yet everything is fine. The defensive structure is a mess, the PP is wildly inconsistent, the PK setup is atrocious to the point other team's commentators practically laugh at the space their stars get, the amount of breakaways/oddman breaks is way too high. His game management is so bad he had Roussel and Gaudette on the ice in the final minute of a game with the net empty. 

 

Cool, a lot of forwards are having good scoring years. Barzal's scoring numbers went down under Trotz but the team setup he uses leads to winning more than Green's. Looking at the Isles on paper you'd very much take our roster over there's yet they are having a better season in a tougher division. 

[Rob_Zepp]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

We are actually an older team.  

?  4th youngest forward group and 13th youngest D group in NHL.    Canucks are one of the NHL's younger teams and if LE was not on roster, they are 3rd overall youngest.   

[CRAZY_4_NAZZY]

3 hours ago, NUCKER67 said:

They can thank Quinn Hughes for the improvement, not Green.

 

Edit - and Miller

In a grand scope of things, many factors have panned out well for us to be where we are at.  Like it or not Management, Coaching staff, players, trainers....freaking even Loui Eriksson has contributed to our success up to this point.

 

Some might be more attributed than others but we cannot deny that all these factors have played into effect.

[Alflives]

12 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

?  4th youngest forward group and 13th youngest D group in NHL.    Canucks are one of the NHL's younger teams and if LE was not on roster, they are 3rd overall youngest.   

We have too many soft, old, overpaid guys.  We are not young.  We have Petey and Hughes who make our average age lower, that’s all.  

[mll]

1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said:

?  4th youngest forward group and 13th youngest D group in NHL.    Canucks are one of the NHL's younger teams and if LE was not on roster, they are 3rd overall youngest.   

 

Actually 16th to start the season.  Mirtle runs the data of every team on the 1st weekend of the season.   Canucks' average age was 27.5 while the league average was 27.3