Kevin Biestra Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said: What about that cam Neely guy.....drafted a Canuck...... Well, I might have him in a top 70 or 80 Canucks list. He did have a 20 goal season for us, and two other decent seasons. But no, if you don't do much as a Canuck and then go on to do good to great things later (Rick Vaive, Dirk Graham, Murray Bannerman, Bill Derlago, Michael Grabner, etc.) then you belong on a "best Maple Leafs" or "best Blackhawks" list. We've had some very good players that never get brought up around here like Pit Martin, Charlie Hodge, Blair MacDonald, Peter McNab, Mel Bridgman, Eric Weinrich and Esa Tikkanen that also accomplished most of their feats elsewhere. And that's where they deserve to be recognized. Edited March 22, 2020 by Kevin Biestra 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyCanuck Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 1 minute ago, Kevin Biestra said: Well, I might have him in a top 70 or 80 Canucks list. He did have a 20 goal season for us, and two other decent seasons. But no, if you don't do much as a Canuck and then go on to do good to great things later (Rick Vaive, Dirk Graham, Murray Bannerman, Bill Derlago, Michael Grabner, etc.) then you belong on a "best Maple Leafs" or "best Blackhawks" list. We've had some very good players that never get brought up around here like Pit Martin, Charlie Hodge, Blair MacDonald, Peter McNab, Mel Bridgman, Eric Weinrich and Esa Tikkanen that also accomplished most of their feats elsewhere. And that's where they deserve to be recognized. I'm to young to remember those guys so my bad....... but I've watched the seasons of cam neely on vhs cause my uncle loved him ha. That was a long time ago though. To me Captain Kirk is above Lou cause Kirk didn't have the team Lou had.... so on.... also no one remembers second place right....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Biestra Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 6 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said: I'm to young to remember those guys so my bad....... but I've watched the seasons of cam neely on vhs cause my uncle loved him ha. That was a long time ago though. To me Captain Kirk is above Lou cause Kirk didn't have the team Lou had.... so on.... also no one remembers second place right....... Kirk was not unlike Lu in that he was the second best goalie in the league for a stretch. And he was unlike Lu in that he was a very consistent and stabilizing force in the net. Larscheid called him "McCool" and that was a more captain-like demeanor than Lu, the goalie who actually became team captain. As to Kirk not having the team Lu had... No presidents' trophy, but a top team in the league for a while. That 91-92 to 93-94 lineup was very impressive. And then in the next few years, the lineup was great on paper but a turd in practice. But anyway, yeah Neely was great in his post-Vancouver years. They came up with the term "power forward" partly because of him. And I believe Kirk McLean deserves whatever honor Luongo gets and vice versa. I have Lu as a ROH guy myself, but if they ever retired #1 for Lu, they should take Kirk out of the Ring and put him in the rafters too. As to the other guys I mentioned that were before your time, Esa Tikkanen was part of the Oilers dynasty and a hell of a two-way forward. Nobody could understand him during interviews between periods, so they called it "Tikkanese." Mel Bridgman was a rather Horvat-like player who would have been a possible jersey retirement if he had spent his career in one place instead of getting bounced around. Which is the case for a lot of good players that don't have the "good luck" of a Stan Smyl to stay in one spot. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaku Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 This has got to be Bure. From a pure skill perspective he's got to be the choice. Nominating Kes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Kevin Biestra said: Well, I might have him in a top 70 or 80 Canucks list. He did have a 20 goal season for us, and two other decent seasons. But no, if you don't do much as a Canuck and then go on to do good to great things later (Rick Vaive, Dirk Graham, Murray Bannerman, Bill Derlago, Michael Grabner, etc.) then you belong on a "best Maple Leafs" or "best Blackhawks" list. We've had some very good players that never get brought up around here like Pit Martin, Charlie Hodge, Blair MacDonald, Peter McNab, Mel Bridgman, Eric Weinrich and Esa Tikkanen that also accomplished most of their feats elsewhere. And that's where they deserve to be recognized. All of this is absolutely valid. Potvin and Irbe and Essensaa were all part of our goalie graveyard days - but all did good-great things on different teams and make the top 100 all-time NHL goalies list (as do McLean, Broduer and of course Luongo). THN did a top fifty by franchise three years ago...so far we are exactly the same for one and two - one thing they consider is how long they played for the franchise - how good they were - and nothing at all that they might have done somewhere else. Messier did not make the list. McDavid made the Oilers though - even though there was only two seasons of sample size / EP and BB might make ours too given who's better five or so years of say Mommesso (who made the list) or three years of BB? Also said for number one and two it was splitting hairs - went with Daniel as the goal scorer but I'd have it the other way. Then Bure, Naslund, Linden, Ohlund, Luongo, Smyl, Bertuzzi, and Kelser rounding out the top ten...your fave Brouduer 18, between Gradin and Tanti. Have a little blurb for each of the top 25, and their stats. Not a bad job of course we all have a different opinion....like why the heck is Babych down at 31, one spot below Mogilny - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Biestra Posted March 22, 2020 Share Posted March 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, IBatch said: All of this is absolutely valid. Potvin and Irbe and Essensaa were all part of our goalie graveyard days - but all did good-great things on different teams and make the top 100 all-time NHL goalies list (as do McLean, Broduer and of course Luongo). THN did a top fifty by franchise three years ago...so far we are exactly the same for one and two - one thing they consider is how long they played for the franchise - how good they were - and nothing at all that they might have done somewhere else. Messier did not make the list. McDavid made the Oilers though - even though there was only two seasons of sample size / EP and BB might make ours too given who's better five or so years of say Mommesso (who made the list) or three years of BB? Also said for number one and two it was splitting hairs - went with Daniel as the goal scorer but I'd have it the other way. Then Bure, Naslund, Linden, Ohlund, Luongo, Smyl, Bertuzzi, and Kelser rounding out the top ten...your fave Brouduer 18, between Gradin and Tanti. Have a little blurb for each of the top 25, and their stats. Not a bad job of course we all have a different opinion....like why the heck is Babych down at 31, one spot below Mogilny - Don't forget Sean Burke and (technically) John Vanbiesbrouck. This team was a goalie killer. As to the McDavid issue, I'd have him in the top 50. I think I had Boeser, EP and Hughes in my top 50 when I did it the other day, though low down the list based on short sample size. Heh, glad King Richard was at least in the top 20. You know if you count his WHA stats, he's pretty high up on the all time pro lists (with a WHA Stanley Cup)... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 2 hours ago, Kevin Biestra said: Don't forget Sean Burke and (technically) John Vanbiesbrouck. This team was a goalie killer. As to the McDavid issue, I'd have him in the top 50. I think I had Boeser, EP and Hughes in my top 50 when I did it the other day, though low down the list based on short sample size. Heh, glad King Richard was at least in the top 20. You know if you count his WHA stats, he's pretty high up on the all time pro lists (with a WHA Stanley Cup)... Think you'd be happy to hear who they had around him (great Canucks for sure)...to add to that he was only a few spots below McLean at 14. Id have to go find it - but think Broduer ranked in the 70's all-time top hundred list- that's definitely impressive given the 100 plus years of history and the thousands of goalies that have played. If you count WHA and when the original six was around AHL games (or next best league) Johnny Bower is second on the all-times wins list with over 600 wins collectively - the only guy other then the other Broduer to have that many pro wins - and he did it in a time where ties were ties. Another former great that by all accounts should definitely rank ahead of Luongo (and did by 7-8 spots) .... and on that front I will add Luongo's one of my all-time favourites and if the question was instead if you could have any former player play his entire career here - and start a franchise around him ranking system picking Luongo makes a lot of sense (Messier is exempt in this scenario of course). Then Bure or Mogilny, then the Sedins, then Linden, then Naslund and so forth. Imagine what our all-team team would look like? Pretty awesome. Ps.! I loved Luongo for a couple years before we traded for him - considered him the next great goalie on the rise - what he did in Florida was every game was phenomenal- reminded me of highlight saves by Furh (who also had a flair for the dramatic- crazy good glove hand...) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aladeen Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 Voted TL nominating KB3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Biestra Posted March 23, 2020 Share Posted March 23, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, IBatch said: Ps.! I loved Luongo for a couple years before we traded for him - considered him the next great goalie on the rise - what he did in Florida was every game was phenomenal- reminded me of highlight saves by Furh (who also had a flair for the dramatic- crazy good glove hand...) Same here, I did a double take when I heard we had acquired him, especially for a diminished Bertuzzi. I honestly was surprised even way back when the Islanders gave up on him after drafting him 4th overall and went high again with DiPietro at 1st overall a few years later. But yeah he was the best goalie on the worst team in Florida. And even though I saw big things for Luongo early on, my record isn't perfect. I thought Fred Brathwaite was going to win a Vezina Trophy. Edited March 23, 2020 by Kevin Biestra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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