Are you working or unemployed now during covid times?

[HI5]

6 hours ago, Mainly Mattias said:

certainly am seeing more of that at my workplace too. people are putting more hours in. i'm seeing more early/late night emails and chat messages. guess having the ceo mention that there are going to be workforce cuts starting this week contributes to that.

I get messages from my CTO at like 3:00am, everyone’s just grinding harder now and this includes management. 
 

We all have equity in the start up though so I guess that’s what’s motivating us more. 

[Mainly Mattias]

16 hours ago, HI5 said:

I get messages from my CTO at like 3:00am, everyone’s just grinding harder now and this includes management. 
 

We all have equity in the start up though so I guess that’s what’s motivating us more. 

3AM? And s/he's not on eastern time? stressful.. hopefully you're not awake to get them in realtime!

 

but yes, i can see management in my org definitely working harder too.

 

aside: people have now mentioned seeing unexplained deactivated accounts and unsolicited HR meetings. dun dun DUN

[CBH1926]

I have been very pleasantly surprised with how much unemployment pays.

First time collecting it.

[Wilbur]

It's the weekend and I'm digitsing content for my students...weeeeeeeeeeeee

[Guest]

Is anyone here unemployed or a student?  

Looking for advice or have questions?  Don't be shy to ask, chances are that some of us have gone through what you will go through and have advice, or even better yet can point you in the right direction/school program/company.  

[HI5]

On 4/25/2020 at 12:20 AM, Mainly Mattias said:

3AM? And s/he's not on eastern time? stressful.. hopefully you're not awake to get them in realtime!

 

but yes, i can see management in my org definitely working harder too.

 

aside: people have now mentioned seeing unexplained deactivated accounts and unsolicited HR meetings. dun dun DUN

Pacific standard time.

 

He’s just a workhorse, seems like he never sleeps and we have deadlines. I’m usually up early, so I’ll just check through the list of messages and get what I need done. 
 

He knows I ain’t waking up from sleeping to get something done. 
 

We’ve got a bit more on our plate now cause of this covid stuff. But I can’t complain, just happy I still have a job. 

[Violator]

Im working still and were still actively hiring for the current project and the next project is supposed to start in june which will have three times the people.

[AriGold2.0]

I’m a home inspector and am extremely busy. The average HI is around 60 years old and has stopped working due to the fact that a lot of them have a pre-existing condition. 
 

This is the most profitable I have been.

[aGENT]

And here's where things start to get interesting...

 

https://www.newwestrecord.ca/temporary-covid-19-layoffs-to-become-permanent-by-law-in-b-c-1.24155046

 

Temporary COVID-19 layoffs to become permanent by law in B.C.

Whether the employees or their employers like it or not

 

Any day now, workers who were temporarily laid off due to a state of emergency that shut businesses down will be deemed, by law, to be permanently laid off, whether they or their employers like it or not.

 

The B.C. government needs to amend the Employment Standards Act, and quickly, or it could put both employers and employees in an untenable position, says Ryan Anderson, a lawyer specializing in employment law at Matthews, Dinsdale and Clark LLP.

 

Anderson said a deadline is looming that will see employees who were temporarily laid off due to pandemic restrictions deemed, by statute, to be terminated.

 

That could force employers to pay large severance payouts that they can’t afford, even though they hope to eventually recall their employees back to work. But hefty group severances could bankrupt some businesses.

 

“Do the math,” Anderson writes in a legal brief. “For example, the termination of 101 employees earning $40,000 per year on average, at a single location within a two-month period, triggers a group termination liability of over $930,000. 

"There are few small- or medium-sized businesses that could survive that kind of hit – especially if their doors have been shut for 16 weeks.”

Under the BC Employment Standards Act, employees laid off for more than 13 weeks are automatically deemed to be terminated, and eligible for severance. The B.C. government extended that period to 16 weeks.

 

But many businesses, venues and tourist attractions have been shut down nearly that long already, so there may be a wave of statutory terminations on the way any day now. Larger employers that have had to shut down for more than 16 weeks might have to pay group termination severance.

 

“These liabilities are automatic,” Anderson said.  “So if I’m an employee who’s been laid off for 16 weeks, on the seventeenth week the statute says I am now terminated.

 

“The employer doesn’t have to issue a termination letter or take any action at all. The act says I am terminated and I am entitled to my individual pay in lieu of notice, and if I’m part of a group of more than 50 employees, I’m entitled to group termination.”

 

Under a group termination, a B.C. employer that dismisses 50 or more employees must pay each employee eight weeks of pay in severance, regardless of length of employment. An employer with more than 100 employees must pay 12 weeks.

 

“If you’ve got 101 employees earning $40,000 a year, it’s a $1 million severance liability for group termination,” Anderson said.

 

Section 65 of the Employment Standards Act allows for unforeseeable circumstances that may let employers off the hook in paying severance. And as Anderson points out, “if the pandemic is not an unforeseeable circumstance, what is?

 

“The ones that are under direct order to close, we hope that the branch will adjudicate these cases, applying section 65 and relieving them of that liability, but we don’t know,” Anderson said.

 

But what about businesses –  hotels, for example, or retailers  – that are allowed to reopen but have seen business cut in half?

 

If those employers are forced to continue to have some off employees laid off for more than 16 weeks, due to reduced business, they may have a harder time arguing that those layoffs are a direct consequence of the pandemic lockdown.

 

“What our government seems to be saying… is that if terminations occur as a direct result of COVID, then maybe you won’t be responsible for individual termination pay or group termination pay. But if it’s not a direct result, then maybe not.”

 

Even if an employer is successful in getting an exemption from having to pay severance, the employee is still deemed terminated, whether he or she wants to be or not.

 

“A strict adherence to the act results in these folks being terminated when they don’t want to be terminated,” Anderson said.

 

He cites hotels as an example. It may be months before they are back to normal occupancy levels. Many of their temporarily laid off employees will have been deemed statutorily terminated by then.

 

“They’re going to want those same employees back, if they’re available,” Anderson said. “They don’t want to terminate them.”

 

Those employees might get get a few weeks of severance, but when they are eventually rehired, their employer would be under no obligation to rehire them at their previous salaries or seniority levels.

 

All of these problems could be avoided, Anderson said, if B.C. were to follow Ontario’s lead. Ontario has suspended provisions in its employment act that automatically deems temporary layoffs permanent.

 

“They have said if you are temporarily laid off due to COVID, then it never becomes a termination as long as COVID continues,” Anderson said.

 

“Ontario has made it a job protection leave. It’s not just stripping employees of their right to be deemed terminated and collect severance – it has also created their leave as a protected job leave, just like parental leave. They maintain their seniority, they maintain their right to return to work to a same or similar position.”

 

Alternatively, Alberta has relieved employers of their group termination liability.

 

“What Alberta has said is that, if terminations occur as a result of COVID, the group termination provisions don’t apply,” Anderson said.

 

Employers in B.C. can try to argue that the terminations were the result of unforeseen circumstances, but as Anderson points out, they would have to make that argument with the Employment Standards Branch.

 

“They’ll have to duke it out with the Employment Standards Branch.  If I knew what my liability was, I might be able to make some rational decisions. If I fear that my liability might be $1 million, I might declare bankruptcy.”

 

Asked if B.C. would consider taking a similar approach as Ontario, the ministry of Labour told Business in Vancouver it's not necessary.

 

"There is no need to duplicate Ontario’s legislative change because British Columbia’s Employment Standards Act already allows for the employers to request a variance on the length of the temporary layoff under section 72," the ministry said.

 

However, that request for a variance requires a majority of laid off workers to support the extension and submit the request to the director of the Employment Standards Branch.

 

"Variance applications under section 72 of the Act is not the solution," Anderson said.

 

For one thing, in order to qualify under that section, an employer must have “definite plans to recall the employees by a specific date." But there is no specific date for some sectors -- nightclubs and sports venues, for example -- that are in the third and fourth phases of BC Restart plan.

 

And what if an employer can't get a majority of employees to agree to the variance? 

 

"Finally, does anyone really think that the branch has the resources to process hundreds, or thousands, of variance applications in a timely fashion?" Anderson said. " How long might that take?

 

"A complaint-driven solution – or one reliant on variance applications – whereby we all wait for the branch adjudication process and appeal procedures to eventually produce reliable precedents does not provide anything near the kind of certainty provided by legislation in Ontario, which automatically extends the permissible duration of temporary layoffs for as long as such layoffs remain necessary due to the COVID-19 crisis."

[Tre Mac]

Lucky I haven't missed an hour of work yet.  Also lucky that my boss has to do work sharing which means we usually knock off early on fridays.  I could easily change my spending habits and live off CERB for a few months but for the greater good I still come into work lol. 

 

Heard an interesting point on the radio today:  A lot of people rather collect CERB than work due to various reasons but what do you think will happen when CERB ends and everyone has to look for a job?  Going to be extremely hard to find work.  Also nothing sucks more than getting back into the grind after a hiatus.  

[24K PureCool]

I am still pissed that I and pretty much everyone in my team was dragged back to the office so early even when we can do 100%bof our work  from home and were perfectly fine and productive working from home. With the 2nd wave coming, this ain't fun. 

 

Thanks top level management. 

[Hosswolf]

Working from home full-time. Our office is calling for 15% to return to the office country-wide through the summer months, but I will probably be WAH since I don't need to be there. Love being at home and not wasting time commuting, spending money on food/gas, etc. 

[Tortorella's Rant]

2 hours ago, Mr. Self Destruct said:

Working from home full-time. Our office is calling for 15% to return to the office country-wide through the summer months, but I will probably be WAH since I don't need to be there. Love being at home and not wasting time commuting, spending money on food/gas, etc. 

And it's better for car insurance rates (should be with less idiots on the road dog piling on the number 1 every day), and obviously better for the environment. If we're serious about contributing to the reduction of emissions then a work at home policy should become the norm where applicable. My carbon foot print has gone to almost zero because of all this. 

[Violator]

3 hours ago, Mr. Self Destruct said:

Working from home full-time. Our office is calling for 15% to return to the office country-wide through the summer months, but I will probably be WAH since I don't need to be there. Love being at home and not wasting time commuting, spending money on food/gas, etc. 

Used to be if i didn't show up on site i didn't eat.

 

With cerb i can take two weeks of if i want and make more cash.

[Russ]

On 6/19/2020 at 9:29 AM, 24K PureCool said:

I am still pissed that I and pretty much everyone in my team was dragged back to the office so early even when we can do 100%bof our work  from home and were perfectly fine and productive working from home. With the 2nd wave coming, this ain't fun. 

 

Thanks top level management. 

Oh weird I was listening on the radio and they were saying how lots of companies are looking at more at home work and reducing office space to save money. Going to be interesting to see how many companies go that route to save on pricey offices. 

 

Well for me work doesn't stop and when we have slow downs I have just enough seniority to keep going,might just have to go afternoons or graveyards temp. Need the weather to get nice and we will be swamped with work, this rain is just killing us right now but good luck telling loggers to take time off work. 

[Chicken.]

8 hours ago, Violator said:

Used to be if i didn't show up on site i didn't eat.

 

With cerb i can take two weeks of if i want and make more cash.

And there is the negative of the cerb structure... No motivation to work full time when you can chill part time and collect an easy extra $2k 

[Boudrias]

2 hours ago, Russ said:

Oh weird I was listening on the radio and they were saying how lots of companies are looking at more at home work and reducing office space to save money. Going to be interesting to see how many companies go that route to save on pricey offices. 

 

Well for me work doesn't stop and when we have slow downs I have just enough seniority to keep going,might just have to go afternoons or graveyards temp. Need the weather to get nice and we will be swamped with work, this rain is just killing us right now but good luck telling loggers to take time off work. 

Depending on the industry working at home will have limited long term appeal IMHO. It likely worked well during the shutdown as projects were likely already identified and being developed. Zoom is a fabulous tool. IMO a lot of companies benefit from the unstructured interaction of co-workers. Apple and Google often call their monster facilities campuses. People will start to worry that they will be left out of the loop if they cannot maintain contacts. 

[aGENT]

9 hours ago, Violator said:

Used to be if i didn't show up on site i didn't eat.

 

With cerb i can take two weeks of if i want and make more cash.

 

47 minutes ago, Chicken. said:

And there is the negative of the cerb structure... No motivation to work full time when you can chill part time and collect an easy extra $2k 

If you haven't actually been laid off for lack of work due to covid, you shouldn't be collecting/will likely need to pay back anything you collect. You can't just 'take two weeks off'.

 

Seems there's a lot of people thinking it's a free payday with no conditions or consequences. Might take a few years for the government to find all of them... But they'll be getting there money back if you're working the system.

[Chicken.]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

 

If you haven't actually been laid off for lack of work due to covid, you shouldn't be collecting/will likely need to pay back anything you collect. You can't just 'take two weeks off'.

 

Seems there's a lot of people thinking it's a free payday with no conditions or consequences. Might take a few years for the government to find all of them... But they'll be getting there money back if you're working the system.

What if you were full time then got laid off due to covid and now hired back at a part time capacity ?  But yeah mostly the wording there of purposely taking 2 weeks off to collect cerb is what irritated me. Its an agreement im sure many employers are negotiating though.

[Russ]

20 hours ago, Boudrias said:

Depending on the industry working at home will have limited long term appeal IMHO. It likely worked well during the shutdown as projects were likely already identified and being developed. Zoom is a fabulous tool. IMO a lot of companies benefit from the unstructured interaction of co-workers. Apple and Google often call their monster facilities campuses. People will start to worry that they will be left out of the loop if they cannot maintain contacts. 

Read an interesting article of how Facebook may encourage people to work from home and adjust their salaries from there depending on where they live.  Like someone in vancouver will have a higher salary than someone in Abbotsford because the cost of living is higher in Vancouver, and someone in 100 mile will make even less based on the costs there, they were basing it off rental and home prices I believe.  Be interesting to see if that works.  They could shed a few bucks while allowing families to live in the country instead of cities, and not have to do long commutes, etc. If I had that opportunity to loose some money off my salary to not commute and work from home but still be competitive in the industry then I would jump on that myself.