[Discussion] Arizona/OEL

[ShawnAntoski]

9 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

There needs to be serious improvement with the coaching, no question about it. The defense - whoever is on the roster come next season - needs a proper defensive structure. And that extends to the forwards being a lot better supporting both in the defensive zone and on the breakout.

 

If I never see Quinn Hughes have to double or triple pump an outlet pass only to give it away because the forwards arent giving him options it will mean our team will be more dangerous at both ends. In a good way, not this past few years bad way. 

Been saying that it would probably be prudent to get a system in place first before any roster tweaking cause besides the unanswered questions on the roster there are also a few with the coaching  staff - hopefully Shaw can make a difference (?).

[Violator]

Feels like this OEL talk has been going on for almost a decade.

[wallstreetamigo]

On 7/9/2021 at 9:39 PM, DeNiro said:

Ahh CDC, where a prospect who has played 8 NHL games is already a bonafide top four 30 point defenseman.

 

Never change.

Also CDC, where random people who probably never actually watch a guy on another team play ignore the underlying stats, the fact that Arizona wants to get rid of him because Chychrun has taken his role as top left side D, the eye test of his play the last 3 years, and his albatross contract, preferring instead to think he is what Vancouver needs because he was a top dman 4 years ago.

 

If the Canucks take on OEL at that cap hit (or even at 6 mil per) it will end up another Loui Eriksson deal and will cost the team a core player eventually.

[N4ZZY]

4 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Also CDC, where random people who probably never actually watch a guy on another team play ignore the underlying stats, the fact that Arizona wants to get rid of him because Chychrun has taken his role as top left side D, the eye test of his play the last 3 years, and his albatross contract, preferring instead to think he is what Vancouver needs because he was a top dman 4 years ago.

 

If the Canucks take on OEL at that cap hit (or even at 6 mil per) it will end up another Loui Eriksson deal and will cost the team a core player eventually.

I think for the Canucks to take OEL, Arizona’s gotta eat some of that cap hit. 8 million dollars for another 6 years? That contract’s worse than Ericksson’s, for more money, and for equal the years. No thanks to that. 

If Arizona eats half that cap? Hell yeah, for 4 million over 6 years? I’d take OEL every day of the &^@#ing week. 

 

[wallstreetamigo]

Just now, N4ZZY said:

I think for the Canucks to take OEL, Arizona’s gotta eat some of that cap hit. 8 million dollars for another 6 years? That contract’s worse than Ericksson’s, for more money, and for equal the years. No thanks to that. 

If Arizona eats half that cap? Hell yeah, for 4 million over 6 years? I’d take OEL every day of the &^@#ing week. 

 

I dont think there is any chance Arizona will be willing to retain much and if they do it likely wont be the full 6 years. 50% retained even for 1 year is probably as likely as Brad Marchand becoming beloved in Vancouver.

[Chickenspear]

3 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

I dont think there is any chance Arizona will be willing to retain much and if they do it likely wont be the full 6 years. 50% retained even for 1 year is probably as likely as Brad Marchand becoming beloved in Vancouver.

They can't retain salary for just one year of the contract.

[Ilya Mikheyev]

On 7/9/2021 at 12:55 PM, Smashian Kassian said:

Boy Arizona really blew it last year.

 

They had an opportunity to unload his full contract, and also receive some kind of minor asset in the process. 

 

Now I have to imagine they either have to retain money or give a good asset to move him.

 

Pretty much this.

 

Which could make him more interesting to the Canucks. If they retained 25-50 percent of his salary and take on some dead weight (aka Roussel or Eriksson) I could see the Canucks re-visiting the trade.

 

This was Scott Burnside's analysis on his trade worth:

 

Quote

Burnside: Boston was interested as they’d like a top-four left-hand shot defender and may remain so assuming Arizona eats as much as half of the outstanding monies owed...This isn’t an assets trade. The Coyotes recently hired highly regarded junior and international coach Andre Tourigny as their new head coach, signaling a trend to a more youthful Coyotes roster. So, whatever cap space is created by moving Ekman-Larsson is the key here. Even if Arizona has to take on another unhealthy contract or toss in a late-round pick or mid-range prospect this is all about short-term pain for long-term gain as GM Bill Armstrong tries to chart a course back to respectability for the beleaguered franchise.

- https://theathletic.com/2690216/2021/07/07/is-this-the-nhls-summer-of-the-blockbuster-here-are-5-stars-who-could-be-traded/

 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, Teemu Selänne said:

 

Pretty much this.

 

Which could make him more interesting to the Canucks. If they retained 25-50 percent of his salary and take on some dead weight (aka Roussel or Eriksson) I could see the Canucks re-visiting the trade.

 

This was Scott Burnside's analysis on his trade worth:

 

- https://theathletic.com/2690216/2021/07/07/is-this-the-nhls-summer-of-the-blockbuster-here-are-5-stars-who-could-be-traded/

 

the thing about retaining 50% for 6 years is, you might as well buy him out then after 2 more years. 

 

If they retain 50% they are going to want some cost controlled prospects to balance that out, and he's not worth that anymore.

 

If they retained 30% and we get him for ~5.7 that works for us for the next few years if they take Schmidt back. Thats really the only formula that works for us imo. 

 

But then they might as well keep OEL.

 

So the comments that "this is not a thing" from the Canucks side makes a lot of sense. 

 

 

Edited July 11, 2021 by Jimmy McGill

[Ilya Mikheyev]

37 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

the thing about retaining 50% for 6 years is, you might as well buy him out then after 2 more years. 

 

If they retain 50% they are going to want some cost controlled prospects to balance that out, and he's not worth that anymore.

 

If they retained 30% and we get him for ~5.7 that works for us for the next few years if they take Schmidt back. Thats really the only formula that works for us imo. 

 

But then they might as well keep OEL.

 

So the comments that "this is not a thing" from the Canucks side makes a lot of sense. 

 

 

Yea, I think Schmidt would have to be moved in a separate deal, just as he was for VGK when they signed AP, as Arizona would mainly want the cap space for other areas.

[JM_]

2 hours ago, Teemu Selänne said:

Yea, I think Schmidt would have to be moved in a separate deal, just as he was for VGK when they signed AP, as Arizona would mainly want the cap space for other areas.

that's why it won't work for us anymore. Arizona blew it, they could have sent OEL to us if they weren't being greedy and asking for Demko. 

[Nucker 67]

Could Schmidt end up in WPG? They need better D and they might lose Lowry to SEA anyway.

 

to WPG - Schmidt and 6th

to VAN -  Lowry and DeMelo

 

Hearing the OEL rumours makes me nervous and I hope Benning doesn't lock the Canucks long term with him. There must be better options.

[86Viking]

13 minutes ago, NUCKER67 said:

Could Schmidt end up in WPG? They need better D and they might lose Lowry to SEA anyway.

 

to WPG - Schmidt and 6th

to VAN -  Lowry and DeMelo

 

Hearing the OEL rumours makes me nervous and I hope Benning doesn't lock the Canucks long term with him. There must be better options.

Lowry just re upped with the Peg with term, pretty sure he will be protected and they lose Appleton or Copp instead. Either of those guys we should be looking to acquire for cheap tho possibly. I agree we should try to trade Schmidt there or to anyone if he indeeds wants out, was a poor GM move to acquire him anyway after letting Tanev/TT go and use more cap to get him 

[ShawnAntoski]

Baffling that this thread has 211 pages - his contract is toxic waste but the side discussions are somewhat entertaining.

Edited July 12, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[coryberg]

6 hours ago, Canuckster86 said:

Lowry just re upped with the Peg with term, pretty sure he will be protected and they lose Appleton or Copp instead. Either of those guys we should be looking to acquire for cheap tho possibly. I agree we should try to trade Schmidt there or to anyone if he indeeds wants out, was a poor GM move to acquire him anyway after letting Tanev/TT go and use more cap to get him 

Lowery will be protected for sure

[Devron]

Guys, he’s not coming here lmao 

[grandmaster]

58 minutes ago, Devron44 said:

Guys, he’s not coming here lmao 

How can you tell we are bored Canuck fans?

[BPA]

Ugh.   I can see JB being aggressive...

 

OEL for 1st 2021 (9th) + 2nd 2022 + LE + Ferland + young prospect. 

 

LE + Ferland to make the cap work. 

[Gollumpus]

23 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

the thing about retaining 50% for 6 years is, you might as well buy him out then after 2 more years. 

 

If they retain 50% they are going to want some cost controlled prospects to balance that out, and he's not worth that anymore.

 

If they retained 30% and we get him for ~5.7 that works for us for the next few years if they take Schmidt back. Thats really the only formula that works for us imo. 

 

But then they might as well keep OEL.

 

So the comments that "this is not a thing" from the Canucks side makes a lot of sense. 

But would that deal work for Arizona?

 

Wouldn't taking on Schmidt's contract, while retaining 30% of Ekman-Larson's deal leave Arizona in a worse position than they are currently in? For the next four years of Ekman-Larson's deal, they would be taking on an additional $200,000 in cap until 2025 (end of Schmidt's deal) which kind of defeats the (short term) purpose of the proposed trade... unless unloading cap for relief in those last two years is the goal

 

                                                             regards,  G.

[babalu]

1 minute ago, BPA said:

Ugh.   I can see JB being aggressive...

 

OEL for 1st 2021 (9th) + 2nd 2022 + LE + Ferland + young prospect. 

 

LE + Ferland to make the cap work. 

OEL is a cap dump. Why would we give up a first and second.

He's a declining asset on a bad contract.

Unless we are unloading every bad contract and not giving up anything of value we should stay away.

[BPA]

2 minutes ago, babalu said:

OEL is a cap dump. Why would we give up a first and second.

He's a declining asset on a bad contract.

Unless we are unloading every bad contract and not giving up anything of value we should stay away.

Not disagreeing with you, hence the Ugh...

 

But if rumors are true that VAN is still interested in OEL, I can see JB making a trade of some sort.  He made a "hockey trade" for Miller.  I would expect something similar if he's really wanting OEL.