JM_ Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 17 hours ago, VegasCanuck said: To Vancouver: Laine 2021 3rd rounder To Winnipeg (still think this is a gameshow for pirates) Boeser Virtanen Woo 2021 2nd 2022 2nd Sign Duclair 2 year, 2.25 - 2.5 million cap hit, 25 years old, 23 goals last year on a bad team. Miller, Pettersson, Laine and Hughes on the same power play = SCARY thats a lot.... Boeser is equivalent to a top 10 pick, Jake maybe a 2nd.... so in value 2 1sts, 3 2nds.... I think I'd rather just put out a massive offer sheet for someone more dynamic. Not sure why people think something is "wrong" with Boeser. He was moved around this year to improve his defensive game, and he did make some improvements there and didn't whine about it like Laine has been. On a ppg level, these two are equivalent. Yes Laine score more goals, but not sure its worth the extra money and what that means to the roster like less money for the d group. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Robert Long said: thats a lot.... Boeser is equivalent to a top 10 pick, Jake maybe a 2nd.... so in value 2 1sts, 3 2nds.... I think I'd rather just put out a massive offer sheet for someone more dynamic. Not sure why people think something is "wrong" with Boeser. He was moved around this year to improve his defensive game, and he did make some improvements there and didn't whine about it like Laine has been. On a ppg level, these two are equivalent. Yes Laine score more goals, but not sure its worth the extra money and what that means to the roster like less money for the d group. Players like Laine at 22 years old, don't come on the market all that often. I think is worth pushing. What concerns me with Boeser is, he has yet to play a full season, he keeps running into injury issues. Laine has played full seasons and is 6'5" power forward with an even better shot than Boeser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireGillis Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 (edited) A pipe dream since he would cost too much and we can't afford his next contract, but he would score 50 with petey easy. The jets have mismanaged him so badly and I hope he gets traded to a team that treats him better. They got so lucky in that lottery draft and they just bungled the handling of Laine since. This is a different situation than trouba who wanted out for family reasons. Laine would have been content to stay in Winnipeg if they handled things like his ice time and giving him consistent top line minutes more. Winnipeg has no one to blame but themselves for this situation and isn't a situation of a player not wanting to play in Winnipeg. He wants out for legit hockey reasons. Edited October 17, 2020 by FireGillis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 Laine has a minus 24, Brock does not, thus Brock is a better player. Fun with stats. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BPA Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 Getting Laine would definitely cost us Boeser + 1st + top prospect (and maybe more). Not sure if it's worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, Robert Long said: thats a lot.... Boeser is equivalent to a top 10 pick, Jake maybe a 2nd.... so in value 2 1sts, 3 2nds.... I think I'd rather just put out a massive offer sheet for someone more dynamic. Not sure why people think something is "wrong" with Boeser. He was moved around this year to improve his defensive game, and he did make some improvements there and didn't whine about it like Laine has been. On a ppg level, these two are equivalent. Yes Laine score more goals, but not sure its worth the extra money and what that means to the roster like less money for the d group. Great points. Wpg is a small market team and (mainly) due to there great drafting they had been able to compete at a high level but the cap, will eventually catch up and they wont be able to keep everyone. Imo, they will be force to make a deal concerning Laine or keep a VERY talented (but one dimensional) player with rumoured motivation issue(s) eating up a huge part of there cap (unlike, EP who seems to be very self driven and actually tries to play a two way game). If I am GM, I would wait for his contract to end next year and make a good offer in FA cause he would cost alot of cap space regardless of how he is acquired - why help out the Jets with assets (unless a sign & trade deal is being talked about). He is signed for one more year and Cheveldayoff doesn't seemed very keen on signing and commiting longterm with a very talented but one dimensional player. Despite Boesers' (so called) issue(s) I would rather keep him cause (imo) they are both very similar but BB plays a better defensive game and his character matches well with the core. Personally, with all the uncertainties and during this part of the teams development curve, I would hope JB, stays away from acquiring Laine - at this time, unless it is in FA and he signs a contract that doesnt handcuff the teams future (high valued contract but includes more years to bring down the annual cap hit). Maybe in a few years, when the bad contracts are of the books, current prospect are no longer prospects and the team is a legit contender then perhaps circle back. Imo, at this point, Laine is not a good fit. I remeber when the Jets, lucked out in the draft to picked him (2nd OA) and we moved down to the fifth spot and drafted OJ - hindsight. Given the circumstances, OJ arriving this year seems like the best time cause his cap hit will be low (due to his lack of developement) during EP & QH first big contract and he gets an opportunity to grow with them while establishing his NHL career. Edited October 17, 2020 by ShawnAntoski 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 1 hour ago, VegasCanuck said: Players like Laine at 22 years old, don't come on the market all that often. I think is worth pushing. What concerns me with Boeser is, he has yet to play a full season, he keeps running into injury issues. Laine has played full seasons and is 6'5" power forward with an even better shot than Boeser. to be fair, he lost part of one season by being pushed into an open door at the bench. Laine no doubt has a better shot but is he 3 million per year better than Brock? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 57 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said: Great points. Wpg is a small market team and (mainly) due to there great drafting they had been able to compete at a high level but the cap, will eventually catch and they wont be able to keep everyone. Imo, they will be force to make a deal concerning Laine or keep a VERY talented (but one dimensional) player with rumoured motivation issue(s) eating up a huge part of there cap (unlike, EP who seems to be very self driven and actually tries to play a two way game). If I am GM, I would wait for his contract to end next year and make a good offer cause his cap hit would be a big chunk of the cap regardless of how he is acquired - why help out the Jets with assets (unless a sign & trade deal is being talked about). He is signed for one more year and Cheveldayoff doesn't seemed very keen on signing and commiting longterm with a very talented but one dimensional player. Despite Boesers' (so called) issue(s) I would rather keep him cause (imo) they are both very similar but BB plays a better defensive game and his character matches well with the core. Personally, with all the uncertainties and during this part of the teams development curve, I would hope JB, stays away from acquiring Laine, unless it is in FA and he signs a contract that doesnt handcuff the team (high valued contract but includes more years to bring down the annual cap hit). Maybe in a few years, when the bad contracts are of the books and current prospect are no longer prospects, perhaps circle back to acquiring him. I remeber when the Jets, lucked out in the draft to picked him (2nd OA) and we moved down to the fifth spot and drafted OJ - hindsight. Given the circumstances, OJ arriving this year seems like the best time cause his cap hit will be low (due to his lack of developement) during EP & QH first big contract and he gets an opportunity to grow with them while establishing his NHL career. both the player and club seem to want a change.... usually with star guys like this teams try to hang on to them. He's always seemed a little weird to me as well so maybe thats part of it? I just don't like the price. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, Robert Long said: to be fair, he lost part of one season by being pushed into an open door at the bench. Laine no doubt has a better shot but is he 3 million per year better than Brock? Ditto, very similar players but Laine will cost more in cap space to keep and assets to acquire if traded for. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnAntoski Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Robert Long said: both the player and club seem to want a change.... usually with star guys like this teams try to hang on to them. He's always seemed a little weird to me as well so maybe thats part of it? I just don't like the price. Yeah, the price in cap cost and assets is too much for very similar players. Also, agree that his relatioship with the Jets, seems very similar (to a small extent) to the situation with the Canucks and JV; perhaps 1 for 1 but pass for now !? Edited October 17, 2020 by ShawnAntoski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Provost Posted October 17, 2020 Share Posted October 17, 2020 A certain website is suggesting that a Laine for Barzal swap is possibly in the works. No way in a million years I trade Barzal for Laine. Barzal is better and a centre which is more valuable. You would also think Barzal isn't going to be any more expensive to sign that Laine is. If NYI wants to trade Barzal, I give them Boeser, Hoglander, AND something else... we use Barzal as our 1C and move Petterson back to left wing where he played in the SEL. Geez, add the Barzal speed and playmaking to that line and it is ridiculous. Miller can play either wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 8 hours ago, Robert Long said: to be fair, he lost part of one season by being pushed into an open door at the bench. Laine no doubt has a better shot but is he 3 million per year better than Brock? He's about 1 million more per season than Brock, who is also a great player, but Laine has a shot that is out of this world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deus.ex.makina Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 as much as i like Brock, i would swap him and add a little for Laine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 45 minutes ago, deus.ex.makina said: as much as i like Brock, i would swap him and add a little for Laine. Laine reminds me of Ovi before he “got it” I don’t know if Laine will ever get it though. Seems to me he’s not a team guy like Ovi. And I doubt he’ll evolve his game to the level you win cups with. Edited October 18, 2020 by DeNiro 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 The asking price is what scares me. we are going to have cap issues with Laine if we are able to acquire him. And would we be giving up too much for him? i would rather keep Boeser to be honest. His shot isn’t as lethal as Laine’s, but he would come cheaper. The only concern I have with Brock is his health. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWestNuck Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) The issue too is that you can only have so many star players on your team. Trying to pay Laine, Pettersson, and Hughes will undoubtedly weaken us everywhere else. You can’t just play 1 line all the time. Look at Toronto the past few years. We’re better off with Boeser, Podz, and whatever else it would cost us to snipe Laine from Winnipeg. We’re better off paying our two superstars and surrounding them with slightly cheaper contracts that are stil great players. Edited October 18, 2020 by NorthWestNuck 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 11 hours ago, VegasCanuck said: He's about 1 million more per season than Brock, who is also a great player, but Laine has a shot that is out of this world. I was thinking 3 mil gap on their next contracts. I can't see Brock demanding 10 mil but Laine would. For me, I'd rather keep Brock long term at around 7 and upgrade a defence position than have Laine for 10 or 11. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peaches5 Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 He has to be qualified at 7.5m next year. I doubt he has much value cause he is definitely not a 7.5m player especially with COVID. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 On 10/17/2020 at 7:57 AM, Robert Long said: thats a lot.... Boeser is equivalent to a top 10 pick, Jake maybe a 2nd.... so in value 2 1sts, 3 2nds.... I think I'd rather just put out a massive offer sheet for someone more dynamic. Not sure why people think something is "wrong" with Boeser. He was moved around this year to improve his defensive game, and he did make some improvements there and didn't whine about it like Laine has been. On a ppg level, these two are equivalent. Yes Laine score more goals, but not sure its worth the extra money and what that means to the roster like less money for the d group. His lethal shot that he had when he first broke in is no longer there. I don't see him as a "Sniper" anymore, a good smart player , yes, but his days of scoring at will are behind him. Maybe that tape he wears on his wrist has something to do with it I don't know. I believe he was moved around because he wasn't producing, which became worse when he was moved out of the top 6. His point production, and especially scoring, is trending in the wrong direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 18, 2020 Share Posted October 18, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, EdgarM said: His lethal shot that he had when he first broke in is no longer there. I don't see him as a "Sniper" anymore, a good smart player , yes, but his days of scoring at will are behind him. Maybe that tape he wears on his wrist has something to do with it I don't know. I believe he was moved around because he wasn't producing, which became worse when he was moved out of the top 6. His point production, and especially scoring, is trending in the wrong direction. there was an article last year showing how he's actually using his shot differently, but he's still putting up ppg at a very good rate. He's learning to adapt his game given the amount of attention he's getting now that teams know they have to plan. for him. I think what we saw last season was Brock learning to deal with the increased attention on him and also trying to become a more complete defensive player. If he can put all of this together he's going to be a scary weapon again. -- What has changed significantly, however, is Boeser’s number of wrist shots and snap shots per game. The two shot types have essentially flipped: Boeser is averaging a little more than half a shot less per game when it comes to wrist shots and nearly half a shot more when it comes to snap shots. One of the key differences between a wrist shot and a snap shot is the time it takes to release the shot. A wrist shot generally has a longer release, while players can get a snap shot off a lot more quickly. Perhaps this means that opposing teams are giving Boeser less time and space to shoot the puck, forcing him to take more snap shots than wrist shots. https://www.vancourier.com/pass-it-to-bulis/brock-boeser-is-taking-far-fewer-wrist-shots-in-2019-20-than-in-past-seasons-1.24046830 Edited October 18, 2020 by Robert Long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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